Downtown Bethesda: Where did it all go wrong?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bethesda is nicer than any similar place in Arlington or Fairfax. It’s never going to be “hip” or “trendy,” but it’s good for what it is. Go spend some time in Crystal City or Clarendon and I think you’ll appreciate Bethesda more for what it is. It’s a good mix of mom and pop restaurants and local chains in Woodmont and national chains in Bethesda Row. I don’t see how you could complain about a place with Phillz, Fish Taco, and Spanish Diner on the same side of one block.

It’s only going to get more restaurants with all the new development coming in. When the Purple Line comes in there will be dozens more options as well.

Yeah right. I'd take Reston, Vienna, Ballston and several other areas before I'd plan a night out in Bethesda.

Bethesda row and Rosslyn-Clarendon-Ballston share more things in common than there are differences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At vamoose bus today the Starbucks and a few stores on East West highway by Wisconsin are boarded up. A ghost town

Huh? That whole block on both sides is being redeveloped with tall buildings - office and residential with retail. Starbucks is still open and another one is opening as well. There are two new restaurants coming next to the new Starbucks. You're passing through on a Vamoose bus and didn't see any of the construction???!

DP, but which block are you referring to? The Starbucks on East West Highway just before Wisconsin Avenue is indeed closed (I went to B-CC and loved that Starbucks, so when I saw it boarded up I actually checked the website to see if it was gone - it is). The one on Wisconsin Avenue is still open though. Where is the new Starbucks?

The starbucks on bethesda ave and wisconsin (near the men's clothing store) is supposed to move across the street (to the other side of the intersection...i think it is moving from the south side to the north side)? the starbucks on east west near BCC/the parking garage is now boarded up, sniff sniff. that was the one close to my office and good for a little break.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The architecture is horrible. No sense of planning. Too expensive. Too many people with too little taste.

I agree this is the main/biggest problem. It is a really unattractive "downtown." Doesn't matter what you put in there - you are still stuck with the ugly 70-80s architecture/glorified strip mall look.

+1 -- We live within walking distance of "downtown" Bethesda and, yes, there are some restaurants that we quite like, but the whole area is visually unappealing and not conducive to just taking a stroll of an evening. But thanks for this thread, OP. I'm definitely going to check out Frederick!

Agreed, it is too hard to walk around. Way too many cars and terrible drivers - it makes even crossing the street risky.

The cars are not the reason, and thanks for constantly interjecting into anything - it’s not appreciated.

The reason it’s not appealing for walking is because you have to walk among these bland, hulking buildings. If the entire area was built up like a European village with 4-5 stories, it would be much enjoyable. There are only a couple blocks that have any interest for an enjoyable stroll.

Montgomery County has a long history of letting developers take liberties to the long-term detriment of any area and Bethesda is no exception and it’s only gotten worse. At this stage, they are trying to retcon what was once an interesting and vibrant commercial district into a simulacra of Pike and Rose.

+1 yes it is the scale of the huge buildings that undermine a capacity to feel you can take a leisurely, enjoyable stroll.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The architecture is horrible. No sense of planning. Too expensive. Too many people with too little taste.

I agree this is the main/biggest problem. It is a really unattractive "downtown." Doesn't matter what you put in there - you are still stuck with the ugly 70-80s architecture/glorified strip mall look.

+1 -- We live within walking distance of "downtown" Bethesda and, yes, there are some restaurants that we quite like, but the whole area is visually unappealing and not conducive to just taking a stroll of an evening. But thanks for this thread, OP. I'm definitely going to check out Frederick!

I live walking distance too. I also don’t find the stores and restaurants that are there now particularly appealing. I guess it’s useful to have an Apple Store nearby for the once in every 3 year moment that I have to go to the Genius Bar. Other than that, nothing really appealing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If only they would build more condos...

LOL. You can buy condos in downtown Bethesda right now for under $200k.

where are these mythical condos???

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If only they would build more condos...

LOL. You can buy condos in downtown Bethesda right now for under $200k.

where are these mythical condos???

You could just look on Redfin yourself, but here is one that is even less than $100k
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Bethesda/4242-E-W-Hwy-20815/unit-903/home/10688619

[Anonymous]

Frederick is a historic city (heck, major civil war battles took place nearby) so of course the roads and buildings are small and charming. You're not going to end up with skyscrapers there because you can't build that in a historic district.

Downtown Bethesda was built up starting from the 1960s onwards (before that it was just a small waystation more or less) so that's why you see the street styles and buildings it has. Then add in Metro, and the push for transit-oriented development, and it's no wonder there are tall condo buildings.

[Anonymous]

I agree the retail is not particularly appealing but honestly I struggle to think what retail would appeal. I just can’t think of any stores that I would particularly want to peruse. Maybe like an artisans collective or an antique store would be fun to poke around in, but then I probably wouldn’t want to buy very often. Maybe a book store.
The toy store was cute but toy stores are just a losing proposition now. The dog store is cute.
I do like having the paint your own pottery place—some more fun activity places like that might work well for the demographic. Bethesda is mostly families so the people that want a night life are, I think, just not recognizing the realities of the demographics. It’s not going to support a lot of bars and clubs. I’ve never been to that supper club place but that at least seemed like a viable concept for the demographic, especially if they expanded the types of music and made it a bit more like the Rams Head in Annapolis that gets a variety of music in.

[Anonymous]

It's the larger, high rise buildings. I really hate them. It looks like Bethesda and downtown Silver Spring used to be fun to walk in.

One thing I love about DC is the human scale of the architecture.

[Anonymous]

In Frederick, that was probably the original downtown of the city.

In contrast, Bethesda is a suburb. I have pasted below a comment from a thread on this forum about growing up in Bethesda.

I grew up in Bethesda in t 80s and when I was a kid there was a cement factory in the middle of it:
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/310326230550984681/
Maloney Concrete in Bethesda -- corner of Bethesda Avenue and Arlington Road.

So downtown Bethesda is better than most suburban areas, in my opinion. And Bethesda is a nice place to live - lots of educated people who take care of their homes and are good neighbors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I agree the retail is not particularly appealing but honestly I struggle to think what retail would appeal. I just can’t think of any stores that I would particularly want to peruse. Maybe like an artisans collective or an antique store would be fun to poke around in, but then I probably wouldn’t want to buy very often. Maybe a book store.
The toy store was cute but toy stores are just a losing proposition now. The dog store is cute.
I do like having the paint your own pottery place—some more fun activity places like that might work well for the demographic. Bethesda is mostly families so the people that want a night life are, I think, just not recognizing the realities of the demographics. It’s not going to support a lot of bars and clubs. I’ve never been to that supper club place but that at least seemed like a viable concept for the demographic, especially if they expanded the types of music and made it a bit more like the Rams Head in Annapolis that gets a variety of music in.

It is not without a lack of trying. There was a store that specialized in olive oil. And a store that specialized in Tuscan goods imported from Italy. And Cork and Fork. And Capitol Teas. And... they all eventually go out of business due to the high commercial rents and that is only in New Bethesda. Back in Old Bethesda, we all know that every shop that is somewhat unique is on borrowed time. The Army-Navy surplus store was awesome, it's now gone. I would not be surprised if one of Hinata, Creative Youth, or the clock repair shop do not survive covid.

We also just need to contend with the fact that not every building needs ground floor retail.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree the retail is not particularly appealing but honestly I struggle to think what retail would appeal. I just can’t think of any stores that I would particularly want to peruse. Maybe like an artisans collective or an antique store would be fun to poke around in, but then I probably wouldn’t want to buy very often. Maybe a book store.
The toy store was cute but toy stores are just a losing proposition now. The dog store is cute.
I do like having the paint your own pottery place—some more fun activity places like that might work well for the demographic. Bethesda is mostly families so the people that want a night life are, I think, just not recognizing the realities of the demographics. It’s not going to support a lot of bars and clubs. I’ve never been to that supper club place but that at least seemed like a viable concept for the demographic, especially if they expanded the types of music and made it a bit more like the Rams Head in Annapolis that gets a variety of music in.

It is not without a lack of trying. There was a store that specialized in olive oil. And a store that specialized in Tuscan goods imported from Italy. And Cork and Fork. And Capitol Teas. And... they all eventually go out of business due to the high commercial rents and that is only in New Bethesda. Back in Old Bethesda, we all know that every shop that is somewhat unique is on borrowed time. The Army-Navy surplus store was awesome, it's now gone. I would not be surprised if one of Hinata, Creative Youth, or the clock repair shop do not survive covid.

We also just need to contend with the fact that not every building needs ground floor retail.

Well yes, the decline of main Street and downtown shops has been happening for years right and it is sad. At the same time, how many of us now would regularly frequent them, particularly during the week, rather than use Amazon? It's a problem. Frederick is special in that it is a rarity in now maintaining a thriving downtown, that is the appeal but it has its struggles too and years that were slower than others. Currently things are thriving. But there are always issues and there is always some regular turnover.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If only they would build more condos...

LOL. You can buy condos in downtown Bethesda right now for under $200k.

where are these mythical condos???

You could just look on Redfin yourself, but here is one that is even less than $100k
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Bethesda/4242-E-W-Hwy-20815/unit-903/home/10688619

261 sq ft? It is seriously tiny.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If only they would build more condos...

LOL. You can buy condos in downtown Bethesda right now for under $200k.

where are these mythical condos???

You could just look on Redfin yourself, but here is one that is even less than $100k
https://www.redfin.com/MD/Bethesda/4242-E-W-Hwy-20815/unit-903/home/10688619

261 sq ft? It is seriously tiny.

Wow. I’ve lived in some seriously small apartments but that takes the cake.

[Anonymous]

The county is allowing big buildings to be built because it needs the tax revenues to fund an increasingly poor county. I’m a dyed in the wool Dem and and a proud MoCo resident but this policy tests my Liberalism.