APS - First Career Center Concept

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:So now according to rumors and that email from Gutshall it appears that the Arlington County Board and APS are trying to opt out of building the parking garage at the Career Center? Any ideas what this would do to the existing CTE courses? What about the viability of Arlington Tech, let alone whatever new option school they want to put there?

I saw in another post that a very large number of Arlington Tech students have already dropped out for a variety of unrelated reasons. But the more this school is built without the kinds of things that draw students to it and the more that it is perceived as a second rate school Arlington doesn't care about, the worse its going to get.

It kind of seems like Arlington is putting alot of money into what will be a failing school no one wants to teach at or attend. Maybe they should revisit even bothering with expanding there until they can establish a program people want to attend or can at least afford to build something desirable.

Can you post this email? If the garage gets dropped, hopefully, that area gets permit parking or there's a satellite lot.

The county is trying to force TDM on the site. They want to build no parking for staff, and won’t allow the neighborhood to zone. So basically, staff and nearby residents either battle it out for street parking, or maybe they can rent spaces in buildings somewhat nearby, including commercial buildings that have 0 incentive to give up the parking that’s keeping them afloat, because ain’t nobody riding the 16 to go out to dinner.

Anyway, everyone should know that the CC Principal and a student rep were on the team that designed the plaza concept. The county shill’s team put forward a concept that put CTE classroom space in a separate building from the main one and underground, against the wishes of instructional leaders, all under the future field, to block parking from ever being able to be built. It’s insane. This person is playing really fast and loose with her “memory” of events and conversations and even the what the architects have presented to the group or what items most everyone else agrees upon.

Good. I think the county should force TDM. I also think they should allow the neighborhood to have permits, pay for teacher parking nearby and force students to use others means as much as possible. Arlington is urban. We need to accept that. These aren't elementary students. I think they can get to school via public transit. Obviously, some will need to drive, but most won't. We should do TDM and get permits.

You think dozens of students can get to and from the CC to other schools, homes and places of work at various times during the weekday? You obviously don’t ride public transit yourself, at least not in that area. We may be “urban” but we don’t have the public transit to match.

So let's build a huge garage? Or... we could increase pubic transit.

So let’s do both. Build an underground garage that is metered.

Just so we’re clear, rich kids at Yorktown get free parking, but SA students can pay $4 a day to wait up to an hour for an ART bus every day. What am I missing?

What? The CC is expanding for county-wide option programs. The additional kids that will go there will be from Yorktown and WL and Wakefield.

Also, I love when people who’ve clearly never actually ridden an ART bus chime in on things like the wait times. An hour?? Sure.

Art buses come on the half hour, or are supposed to. People ride the bus twice a day. I’m being charitable. Anyone who rides at rush hour knows that they usually come 15 mins late, especially the 77 that serves the CC. You’re talking to a local.

I’m a local too. I ride the 41, which also serves this area. It comes every 10-15 minutes. I frequently have to wait just a few minutes.

Sounds convenient. Too bad the 41 doesn’t go south of the pike and the bus that does has twice the wait. As I said, were urban, but don’t have the transit to match.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You guys know the WMATA website gives you transit times right? Its about 60 minutes to get from Yorktown to the CC via public trans during the middle of the day. 30 minutes from W&L to the Career Center and 40 minutes from Wakefield.

Maybe thats workable for students, maybe not. I do know if I'm a teacher I'm not sacrificing 1 to 2 extra hours a day commuting there via public trans so that Arlington can save a few bucks on a parking garage. I'd take a pay cut to teach somewhere more convenient.

It's not even a pay cut anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys know the WMATA website gives you transit times right? Its about 60 minutes to get from Yorktown to the CC via public trans during the middle of the day. 30 minutes from W&L to the Career Center and 40 minutes from Wakefield.

Maybe thats workable for students, maybe not. I do know if I'm a teacher I'm not sacrificing 1 to 2 extra hours a day commuting there via public trans so that Arlington can save a few bucks on a parking garage. I'd take a pay cut to teach somewhere more convenient.

To the extent this conversation is about students, it’s absurd. Students get a bus to option schools. And students who go during the day for programs likewise get a bus or shuttle. No student at this school will have to take public transportation in order to attend.

It's not even about students (or at least most students). This is about adequate parking for staff, teachers, and substitutes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys know the WMATA website gives you transit times right? Its about 60 minutes to get from Yorktown to the CC via public trans during the middle of the day. 30 minutes from W&L to the Career Center and 40 minutes from Wakefield.

Maybe thats workable for students, maybe not. I do know if I'm a teacher I'm not sacrificing 1 to 2 extra hours a day commuting there via public trans so that Arlington can save a few bucks on a parking garage. I'd take a pay cut to teach somewhere more convenient.

To the extent this conversation is about students, it’s absurd. Students get a bus to option schools. And students who go during the day for programs likewise get a bus or shuttle. No student at this school will have to take public transportation in order to attend.

People aren’t asking for any and all students to have parking. It’s an underground garage for staff, and a limited number of surface spaces for ADA and parent/student short-term visitors. That’s it. TDM doesn’t work when you just make all street parking free. If we want TDM, for real, everyone has to pay for parking by zoning everything and then people who want to, whether it’s residents who want to park in front of their house, or visitors to Arlington, or people coming here to work, can pay for the privilege. But that’s not what is happening here. No, they’re keeping their zones where they live and telling the rest of us plebes to deal with it. And only making the teachers have to deal with the inconvenience of teaching at certain sites.

The issue is taking investment away from the Pike to send it north. You already screwed us with canceling the Streetcar. Metro isn’t coming to the Pike for 25 years, if ever. The teachers deserve a garage. And if they don’t build one, you’re not taking the money for other things. GFYs.

[Anonymous]

Especially the Key parent who wants to take the parking garage money and use it for "other educational opportunities" meaning immersion I'm sure.

[Anonymous]

For the poster who asked about the Reed school, the parking seems okay. The library lot will be expanded and shared with staff, and the lot on 18th/McKinley will be expanded a bit too. There is plenty of parking in the neighborhood and it's not zoned. I followed Reed closely and was surprised by the assumption that staff would all drive. Reed is a short bus/bike ride from EFC (ahem, my experience is 12 minute headways during rush hour on ART), but staff consensus was very few would use use transport.

[Anonymous]

Here is just a little thought experiment. Suppose APS decides they do not want to build a below grade garage. That leaves $30 million for some other APS venture. Why don't they just buy the Highland Holdings property south of 9th St and north of Columbia Pike? That economic unit includes 3045 Columbia Pike and 901 S Highland St shown in red below.

Of course they have to make a good offer but looking at the recent tax assessment of that economic unit (https://propertysearch.arlingtonva.us/Home/Assessments?lrsn=42094&sequence=2) it is approximately $8 million. Suppose that assessment is off and APS pays $13 million for everything. That gives us what appears to be ~240 parking deck spots and lots of room for future school expansion. (I guessed the number of parking spots by counting the ones visible on the top and multiplying by 3.) The cost for one level of below grade parking is $15.5-16.9 million (see slide 18 of https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/191203-BLPCPFRC-Meeting_6_Final.pdf) so if APS decides in the future to put in parking under the field, they at least "saved" some money for it. Or maybe they could build on top of the existing garage for possibly half as much money?

This is not a unique idea as it was presented during the Career Center Working Group (see slides 18-25 of https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Long-term-Site-Optimization.pdf). Of course this all hinges on the business owners wanting to sell, but at least the Ethiopian Community Development Council has already signaled an interest in selling to the county (https://www.arlnow.com/2018/09/11/working-group-to-aps-career-center-should-open-as-an-option-school/).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here is just a little thought experiment. Suppose APS decides they do not want to build a below grade garage. That leaves $30 million for some other APS venture. Why don't they just buy the Highland Holdings property south of 9th St and north of Columbia Pike? That economic unit includes 3045 Columbia Pike and 901 S Highland St shown in red below.

Of course they have to make a good offer but looking at the recent tax assessment of that economic unit (https://propertysearch.arlingtonva.us/Home/Assessments?lrsn=42094&sequence=2) it is approximately $8 million. Suppose that assessment is off and APS pays $13 million for everything. That gives us what appears to be ~240 parking deck spots and lots of room for future school expansion. (I guessed the number of parking spots by counting the ones visible on the top and multiplying by 3.) The cost for one level of below grade parking is $15.5-16.9 million (see slide 18 of https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/191203-BLPCPFRC-Meeting_6_Final.pdf) so if APS decides in the future to put in parking under the field, they at least "saved" some money for it. Or maybe they could build on top of the existing garage for possibly half as much money?

This is not a unique idea as it was presented during the Career Center Working Group (see slides 18-25 of https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Long-term-Site-Optimization.pdf). Of course this all hinges on the business owners wanting to sell, but at least the Ethiopian Community Development Council has already signaled an interest in selling to the county (https://www.arlnow.com/2018/09/11/working-group-to-aps-career-center-should-open-as-an-option-school/).

A rational suggestion but I think the goal here is not about what’s best with regard to parking. We’re arguing over the balance of parking to public transit, but the essential goal here to take money from the CC to spend elsewhere. Parking is just the means. It’s just the first thing to go when SA’s betters need more flow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here is just a little thought experiment. Suppose APS decides they do not want to build a below grade garage. That leaves $30 million for some other APS venture. Why don't they just buy the Highland Holdings property south of 9th St and north of Columbia Pike? That economic unit includes 3045 Columbia Pike and 901 S Highland St shown in red below.

Of course they have to make a good offer but looking at the recent tax assessment of that economic unit (https://propertysearch.arlingtonva.us/Home/Assessments?lrsn=42094&sequence=2) it is approximately $8 million. Suppose that assessment is off and APS pays $13 million for everything. That gives us what appears to be ~240 parking deck spots and lots of room for future school expansion. (I guessed the number of parking spots by counting the ones visible on the top and multiplying by 3.) The cost for one level of below grade parking is $15.5-16.9 million (see slide 18 of https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/191203-BLPCPFRC-Meeting_6_Final.pdf) so if APS decides in the future to put in parking under the field, they at least "saved" some money for it. Or maybe they could build on top of the existing garage for possibly half as much money?

This is not a unique idea as it was presented during the Career Center Working Group (see slides 18-25 of https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Long-term-Site-Optimization.pdf). Of course this all hinges on the business owners wanting to sell, but at least the Ethiopian Community Development Council has already signaled an interest in selling to the county (https://www.arlnow.com/2018/09/11/working-group-to-aps-career-center-should-open-as-an-option-school/).

This is, in fact, a wonderful idea. What's more, Strayer University used to be in one of those buildings, which means classrooms that can be used as swing space. 2 problems, though:

1) The current BLPC priced out a 250-car underground lot at ~$15 million. So if they just pitch it as shifting the parking resources to land acquisition, the margins will be tighter.
2) Those buildings are not new, and they are not built-to-purpose. So once Arlington acquires them, presumably there would be plans for them that will require refurbishment or reconstruction. That's more money going towards Columbia Pike when the current County disposition seems to be a desire to funnel funds away from it.

[Anonymous]

Well, why should the county funnel into the Pike? It doesn’t have the wealth to support much development.

[Anonymous]

By all means, I wish they would buy that property and that garage. That makes a ton of sense. I think they had the chance and passed on it because we are so close to our debt ceiling. That would be a nice use of the Amazon money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, why should the county funnel into the Pike? It doesn’t have the wealth to support much development.

You mean, it’s been packed with AH and underserved by transit to the point where it’s not wealthy? Do tell.

[Anonymous]

Too bad all that Amazon money is Earmarked to be spent on AfFord able Housing along the Pike. It’s cute how you NAs folks are trying to solve the Pike’s problems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:By all means, I wish they would buy that property and that garage. That makes a ton of sense. I think they had the chance and passed on it because we are so close to our debt ceiling. That would be a nice use of the Amazon money.

All amazon money now and for the foreseeable future will be 100 percent going to affordable housing. It’s the county’s number one industry and it makes Bezos look charitable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here is just a little thought experiment. Suppose APS decides they do not want to build a below grade garage. That leaves $30 million for some other APS venture. Why don't they just buy the Highland Holdings property south of 9th St and north of Columbia Pike? That economic unit includes 3045 Columbia Pike and 901 S Highland St shown in red below.

Of course they have to make a good offer but looking at the recent tax assessment of that economic unit (https://propertysearch.arlingtonva.us/Home/Assessments?lrsn=42094&sequence=2) it is approximately $8 million. Suppose that assessment is off and APS pays $13 million for everything. That gives us what appears to be ~240 parking deck spots and lots of room for future school expansion. (I guessed the number of parking spots by counting the ones visible on the top and multiplying by 3.) The cost for one level of below grade parking is $15.5-16.9 million (see slide 18 of https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/191203-BLPCPFRC-Meeting_6_Final.pdf) so if APS decides in the future to put in parking under the field, they at least "saved" some money for it. Or maybe they could build on top of the existing garage for possibly half as much money?

This is not a unique idea as it was presented during the Career Center Working Group (see slides 18-25 of https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Long-term-Site-Optimization.pdf). Of course this all hinges on the business owners wanting to sell, but at least the Ethiopian Community Development Council has already signaled an interest in selling to the county (https://www.arlnow.com/2018/09/11/working-group-to-aps-career-center-should-open-as-an-option-school/).

He does want to sell. Arlington County simply doesn’t want to buy it. Doesn’t matter how much those of us close to the project ask for reason. End of story.