Mount Vernon?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is interesting that, with respect to Lee, all you see on this thread is people talking about why they shouldn't go there and how they get out of going there. If you canvass people at Falls Church and Stuart from the Saratoga-equivalents (Camelot and Fairhill areas in Falls Church district, Sleepy Hollow/Lake Barcroft in the Stuart district), you'd find people who are involved with the schools and trying to make them better. The Mason District Parents page on Facebook is one example.

It just sounds like people are checked out when it comes to Mount Vernon and Lee these days.

It is a little comical though that one would buy a house that is $50-100K cheaper than the neighboring districts, knowing when you bought the cheaper price is because of the high school, then start complaining that your kids are zoned for the high school that made your home so much cheaper and trying to get your kids moved into the neighboring district that you didn't want to pay for (or sacrifice house size or quality for).

The Saratoga zoning issue is NOT an issue of poor people being trapped or minority/esl families being shuttled off to one place.

That neighborhood is generally the exact same SES status as the WSHS feeders, mostly feds and military level incomes that could afford WSHS neighborhoods if they wanted to. Tuey just made a diffeeent choice of more house for the money, knowing their school assignment. They chose a trade off and others chose a more expensive/smaller house for more money to get zoned for WSHS.

They should focus on trying to improve their zoned school (Lee) that they chose.

We are not talking about the families that feed into Garfield Elementary. We are talking about upper middle class families that made a choice.

This. Just not a lot of sympathy.

[Anonymous]

Well, I doubt anyone living in Saratoga cares if you have any sympathy. You can't fault people for advocating for their interests, and you'd probably be doing the same if you were in their shoes. Personally, I agree with the sentiment of trying to improve Lee rather figuring out how to flee - I think this AP/IB transfer nonsense should stop. But, I can also understand the perspective of some people that it's a lost cause and better to petition for change of some sort.

[Anonymous]

So was Saratoga always zoned for Lee?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, I doubt anyone living in Saratoga cares if you have any sympathy. You can't fault people for advocating for their interests, and you'd probably be doing the same if you were in their shoes. Personally, I agree with the sentiment of trying to improve Lee rather figuring out how to flee - I think this AP/IB transfer nonsense should stop. But, I can also understand the perspective of some people that it's a lost cause and better to petition for change of some sort.

They picked their school zone when they bought their house.

I could see tye argument of moving Garfield Elementary (very high ESL/title 1) to another higher performing pyramid but to use the "concentration of poverty/esl) argument and try to apply it to Saratoga is completely wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is interesting that, with respect to Lee, all you see on this thread is people talking about why they shouldn't go there and how they get out of going there. If you canvass people at Falls Church and Stuart from the Saratoga-equivalents (Camelot and Fairhill areas in Falls Church district, Sleepy Hollow/Lake Barcroft in the Stuart district), you'd find people who are involved with the schools and trying to make them better. The Mason District Parents page on Facebook is one example.

It just sounds like people are checked out when it comes to Mount Vernon and Lee these days.

It is a little comical though that one would buy a house that is $50-100K cheaper than the neighboring districts, knowing when you bought the cheaper price is because of the high school, then start complaining that your kids are zoned for the high school that made your home so much cheaper and trying to get your kids moved into the neighboring district that you didn't want to pay for (or sacrifice house size or quality for).

The Saratoga zoning issue is NOT an issue of poor people being trapped or minority/esl families being shuttled off to one place.

That neighborhood is generally the exact same SES status as the WSHS feeders, mostly feds and military level incomes that could afford WSHS neighborhoods if they wanted to. Tuey just made a diffeeent choice of more house for the money, knowing their school assignment. They chose a trade off and others chose a more expensive/smaller house for more money to get zoned for WSHS.

They should focus on trying to improve their zoned school (Lee) that they chose.

We are not talking about the families that feed into Garfield Elementary. We are talking about upper middle class families that made a choice.

This. Just not a lot of sympathy.

I agree.

However, just for the hell of it, I tried to think of a way to move Saratoga out of Lee without screwing Lee over. Here's what I came up with: (1) move Gunston ES out of South County to under-enrolled Mount Vernon; (2) move Saratoga ES out of Lee to South County; (3) move North Springfield ES out of Annandale to Lee; and (4) move Wakefield Forest ES out of over-crowded Woodson back to Annandale.

Have at it, Saratogans. You'd have one happy group at Saratoga, one group that would probably go along grudgingly at North Springfield, and two groups that would be very unhappy at Gunston and Wakefield Forest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I doubt anyone living in Saratoga cares if you have any sympathy. You can't fault people for advocating for their interests, and you'd probably be doing the same if you were in their shoes. Personally, I agree with the sentiment of trying to improve Lee rather figuring out how to flee - I think this AP/IB transfer nonsense should stop. But, I can also understand the perspective of some people that it's a lost cause and better to petition for change of some sort.

They picked their school zone when they bought their house.

As does everyone who buys a home. Doesn't mean you can't advocate for change if you're unhappy with the schools. You can only find out so much about schools before you actually use them and things can change as well. We are all taxpayers and have elected leaders we can petition.

[Anonymous]

FWIW, even though I have no problem with Saratoga petitioning for change, I agree, it's unlikely to happen. One reason I'm not volunteering for the little committee the community has put together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I doubt anyone living in Saratoga cares if you have any sympathy. You can't fault people for advocating for their interests, and you'd probably be doing the same if you were in their shoes. Personally, I agree with the sentiment of trying to improve Lee rather figuring out how to flee - I think this AP/IB transfer nonsense should stop. But, I can also understand the perspective of some people that it's a lost cause and better to petition for change of some sort.

I could see tye argument of moving Garfield Elementary (very high ESL/title 1) to another higher performing pyramid but to use the "concentration of poverty/esl) argument and try to apply it to Saratoga is completely wrong.

I would also note that Saratoga was actually made a Title 1 school this year, has about a 25% ESL rate, and a 45% FARMs rate.

[Anonymous]

Saratoga ES isn't all that great either.

But I think that's what's so different about Lee/Mount Vernon versus Stuart/Falls Church and even Edison and Annandale. Lee and Mount Vernon do not have much community investment which is a shame b/c that can go a long long way. I think Fairfax should more evenly distribute demographics at schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Saratoga ES isn't all that great either.

But I think that's what's so different about Lee/Mount Vernon versus Stuart/Falls Church and even Edison and Annandale. Lee and Mount Vernon do not have much community investment which is a shame b/c that can go a long long way. I think Fairfax should more evenly distribute demographics at schools.

You can do it in some limited circumstances, but it's hard to pull that off when people can vote with their feet. You just end up with people moving to another county or sending their kids to privates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I doubt anyone living in Saratoga cares if you have any sympathy. You can't fault people for advocating for their interests, and you'd probably be doing the same if you were in their shoes. Personally, I agree with the sentiment of trying to improve Lee rather figuring out how to flee - I think this AP/IB transfer nonsense should stop. But, I can also understand the perspective of some people that it's a lost cause and better to petition for change of some sort.

They picked their school zone when they bought their house.

I could see tye argument of moving Garfield Elementary (very high ESL/title 1) to another higher performing pyramid but to use the "concentration of poverty/esl) argument and try to apply it to Saratoga is completely wrong.

Saratoga Elementary is also a Title 1 school, FYI. The effort to change district is not about high SES parents wanting to flee. It's about wanting geographic boundaries and political representation that makes sense for residents. Sure Saratoga Elementary includes the single-family "Saratoga" neighborhood, but it also includes a lot of townhouses and rental apartments, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I doubt anyone living in Saratoga cares if you have any sympathy. You can't fault people for advocating for their interests, and you'd probably be doing the same if you were in their shoes. Personally, I agree with the sentiment of trying to improve Lee rather figuring out how to flee - I think this AP/IB transfer nonsense should stop. But, I can also understand the perspective of some people that it's a lost cause and better to petition for change of some sort.

They picked their school zone when they bought their house.

I could see tye argument of moving Garfield Elementary (very high ESL/title 1) to another higher performing pyramid but to use the "concentration of poverty/esl) argument and try to apply it to Saratoga is completely wrong.

Saratoga Elementary is also a Title 1 school, FYI. The effort to change district is not about high SES parents wanting to flee. It's about wanting geographic boundaries and political representation that makes sense for residents. Sure Saratoga Elementary includes the single-family "Saratoga" neighborhood, but it also includes a lot of townhouses and rental apartments, too.

Sure it is.

[Anonymous]

I'm all for improving low performing schools like Mt. Vernon and Lee, but throwing money at the problem hasn't worked. Test scores still lag far behind other county schools.

I can see why folks at schools like Saratoga want out. If the county won't improve poorer high schools by redistricting to add other higher performing feeder schools, why should parents stay?

On another note, if high schools in the
eastern part of the county (Lee, Mt. Vernon, Edison?, Hayfield?) are under capacity, why doesn't the county consider consolidating and closing one or more. That would save $.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I doubt anyone living in Saratoga cares if you have any sympathy. You can't fault people for advocating for their interests, and you'd probably be doing the same if you were in their shoes. Personally, I agree with the sentiment of trying to improve Lee rather figuring out how to flee - I think this AP/IB transfer nonsense should stop. But, I can also understand the perspective of some people that it's a lost cause and better to petition for change of some sort.

They picked their school zone when they bought their house.

I could see tye argument of moving Garfield Elementary (very high ESL/title 1) to another higher performing pyramid but to use the "concentration of poverty/esl) argument and try to apply it to Saratoga is completely wrong.

Saratoga Elementary is also a Title 1 school, FYI. The effort to change district is not about high SES parents wanting to flee. It's about wanting geographic boundaries and political representation that makes sense for residents. Sure Saratoga Elementary includes the single-family "Saratoga" neighborhood, but it also includes a lot of townhouses and rental apartments, too.

Has Saratoga always been zoned Lee or is it due to a boundary change?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm all for improving low performing schools like Mt. Vernon and Lee, but throwing money at the problem hasn't worked. Test scores still lag far behind other county schools.

I can see why folks at schools like Saratoga want out. If the county won't improve poorer high schools by redistricting to add other higher performing feeder schools, why should parents stay?

On another note, if high schools in the
eastern part of the county (Lee, Mt. Vernon, Edison?, Hayfield?) are under capacity, why doesn't the county consider consolidating and closing one or more. That would save $.

They don't have enough capacity to close Lee and accommodate the students at the other schools. They'd need to build sizable additions at one or two of them. In addition, they are projecting West Potomac to be significantly over-capacity, which may eventually use up any extra space at Mount Vernon, Edison and/or Hayfield,