Marion Barry has passed away

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another hosanna for Marion:
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2014/nov/23/marion-barry-washington-dc-mayor-jail-drugs-dies-78

Barry’s third term was marred by open talk of his womanising, drinking and drug abuse and he became a punchline for comedians and a target of disdain for the media. Several of his top aides were convicted of corruption. Barry responded to criticism with denials and claims that he was the victim of a racist media.

awwww

Since you are apparently on a one-person crusade, I think it is important that our readers know that it is one-person and that DCUM is not full of classless haters. I'm going to call out everyone of your posts. So, keep posting. Let's see just how big of an asshole you are.

I am on a one person campaign and the media Wikipedia and other news outlets are all in it with me. And I am an "asshole" You use that mouth for what?

I use my mouth accurately. What type of person wakes up Monday morning and immediately begins posting message after message bashing a dead man? There are probably a lot of other things that you can accurately be called. But, I'd probably have to look them up in a medical dictionary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just watching the news, and I had no idea that Marion Berry was enrolled in doctoral chemistry studies at the University of Tennessee and was the only black student in his class. There were many sides to this interesting man that should be remembered also.

He was a very smart man, intellectually. I think some people missed that because he was "down with the people" and never turned his back on his roots and the downtrodden. He could have succeeded on Wall Street but chose the path of a public servant. And, for that alone, he should be commended. RIP.

[Anonymous]

Is the "love-fest" for Barry over yet? Or is criticism still censored?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is the "love-fest" for Barry over yet? Or is criticism still censored?

This is really boring, PP. Really...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:Let me give a few of my own thoughts on the passing of Marion Barry. When I was a student at Georgetown University, Barry introduced Ronald Reagan who had come to the University to launch its bicentennial celebration. It was a beautiful day with lots of sun and a moderate temperature. Noting the weather, Barry asked, "will you give me credit for the sun? I know you all blame me for the snow." That was in reference to DC being buried under nearly 2 ft. of snow while Barry was in southern California attending the Super Bowl.

Barry was correct that his critics often focused on the negative while seeing the positive as natural or inevitable. He was quickly blamed for anything that went wrong, but credit for successes was frequently placed elsewhere. At the same time, to both Barry and his defenders, his successes were of such a magnitude that they excused any failures. Barry knew that those in the crowd at Georgetown did not blame him for the snow. We blamed him for his administration's failure to remove the snow. We saw Barry as a source of incompetence and corruption. Politics, especially local politics, is very much a situation of "what have you done for me lately?" and, lately, Barry hadn't done much good for us at all.

But, for others, Barry had done a lot. He had done life-changing things. However, there was no way that someone like me -- a young university student in only my second year of living in DC -- could understand the importance of those things. Frankly, I didn't even know about them. I would learn later that Barry had started a summer job program for youth. In the environment in which I grew up, youth had no problem finding summer employment. I couldn't understand why such a program was important. Then, I would start hearing a phrase that would become almost synonymous with "native Washingtonian" and that was "Marion Barry got me my first job". I think it is very important -- especially after decades of black people being associated with welfare -- that Barry was a proponent of work. He didn't ask for handouts, he asked for -- demanded, in fact -- jobs. Barry didn't create Washington, DC's middle class. But, he sure as hell helped create it and his efforts were -- as I said -- life-changing for many people. When someone has changed your life for the better, it is natural and understandable that you will forgive them their faults. Not surprisingly, therefore, there is another phrase I've heard frequently over the past few years, "That's our Barry". Warts and all, Barry made the kind of positive impact on others of which few can ever dream.

A lot more can be said about Barry, both good and bad. But, on this day, I am glad that I came to understand that a first job and a better lot in life is a much more important than a few days of snowed-in streets. So, on this day, Mr. Mayor, I am giving you credit for the sun.

As with so many things about Barry's life, the jobs he created are a complicated issue. First off, Jeff, you're conflating the summer jobs program with the integration of DC municipal jobs and the creation of the black middle class. The summer jobs program, which I believe still exists today, didn't create anything - it was a payoff to give teenagers something to do in the summer time, and a way to buy their parents' (and the teen' future) votes. Calling it a jobs program is even a bit of a stretch, since not a lot of work got done. That didn't create any middle class.

As for the municipal jobs that did create the black middle class, he deserves a huge amount of credit for making those jobs available to all. But he then turned the DC government into a jobs program (that, coincidently, also served as a campaign tool). While that may have helped some people in the short term (and secured his reelection, and mayor for life status) it wasn't a sustainable long-term goal.

Barry was an extraordinary civil rights figure who saw the ways in which the existing power structure oppressed poor minorities, and decided to use the same tactics to further his cause (and his career). But, he overreached, and became that which he was fighting against. It is sad that he will be remembered for his personal shortcomings rather than his (complicated, and not unblemished) political career.

I really beg to differ that the summer jobs program didn't help folks get into the middle class. I personally know of several people for whom that was their first job - who otherwise would not have had an employment experience that helped them go on to have successful track records in the workforce. These are men and women who may not have had the type of DCUM upbringing with two working parents. The program at some point was called the Marion Barry Youth Leadership program - and the program was a throwback to when Barry was a community organizer. You're conflating the SYEP program of today with the past. As someone who witnessed it's impact - it did work and helped save many lives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is the "love-fest" for Barry over yet? Or is criticism still censored?

This is really boring, PP. Really...

What is boring is the bizzare nature of a thread celebrating the life of a bigot and xenophobe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is the "love-fest" for Barry over yet? Or is criticism still censored?

This is really boring, PP. Really...

What is boring is the bizzare nature of a thread celebrating the life of a bigot and xenophobe.

Even the Washington Examiner showed class in his obituary. Your comments sound petty, and making them so close to his death makes you look impotent.

[Anonymous]

I don't know much about Barry so I'm not going to vilify or glorify his life, but I do think that this attitude that we must never speak ill of the dead is damaging and irresponsible. Of course, it should be constructive and not name calling, but people don't get a pass on any harm they caused simply because they're dead. We should not be so quick to forget the past lest we repeat it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know much about Barry so I'm not going to vilify or glorify his life, but I do think that this attitude that we must never speak ill of the dead is damaging and irresponsible. Of course, it should be constructive and not name calling, but people don't get a pass on any harm they caused simply because they're dead. We should not be so quick to forget the past lest we repeat it.

If you read the many obituaries on him, none shied away from his failures. But they weren't dancing on his grave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know much about Barry so I'm not going to vilify or glorify his life, but I do think that this attitude that we must never speak ill of the dead is damaging and irresponsible. Of course, it should be constructive and not name calling, but people don't get a pass on any harm they caused simply because they're dead. We should not be so quick to forget the past lest we repeat it.

I agree. But in the case of this thread, it went far beyond an "attitude" towards what one should or shouldn't do.

All criticism was censored. Hopefully, freedom of expression has been restored.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know much about Barry so I'm not going to vilify or glorify his life, but I do think that this attitude that we must never speak ill of the dead is damaging and irresponsible. Of course, it should be constructive and not name calling, but people don't get a pass on any harm they caused simply because they're dead. We should not be so quick to forget the past lest we repeat it.

I agree. But in the case of this thread, it went far beyond an "attitude" towards what one should or shouldn't do.

All criticism was censored. Hopefully, freedom of expression has been restored.

Stop acting like this is violating your constitutional rights. This is Jeff's site and he has every right to remove every thread that's not about BMWs if he so chooses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:Let me give a few of my own thoughts on the passing of Marion Barry. When I was a student at Georgetown University, Barry introduced Ronald Reagan who had come to the University to launch its bicentennial celebration. It was a beautiful day with lots of sun and a moderate temperature. Noting the weather, Barry asked, "will you give me credit for the sun? I know you all blame me for the snow." That was in reference to DC being buried under nearly 2 ft. of snow while Barry was in southern California attending the Super Bowl.

Barry was correct that his critics often focused on the negative while seeing the positive as natural or inevitable. He was quickly blamed for anything that went wrong, but credit for successes was frequently placed elsewhere. At the same time, to both Barry and his defenders, his successes were of such a magnitude that they excused any failures. Barry knew that those in the crowd at Georgetown did not blame him for the snow. We blamed him for his administration's failure to remove the snow. We saw Barry as a source of incompetence and corruption. Politics, especially local politics, is very much a situation of "what have you done for me lately?" and, lately, Barry hadn't done much good for us at all.

But, for others, Barry had done a lot. He had done life-changing things. However, there was no way that someone like me -- a young university student in only my second year of living in DC -- could understand the importance of those things. Frankly, I didn't even know about them. I would learn later that Barry had started a summer job program for youth. In the environment in which I grew up, youth had no problem finding summer employment. I couldn't understand why such a program was important. Then, I would start hearing a phrase that would become almost synonymous with "native Washingtonian" and that was "Marion Barry got me my first job". I think it is very important -- especially after decades of black people being associated with welfare -- that Barry was a proponent of work. He didn't ask for handouts, he asked for -- demanded, in fact -- jobs. Barry didn't create Washington, DC's middle class. But, he sure as hell helped create it and his efforts were -- as I said -- life-changing for many people. When someone has changed your life for the better, it is natural and understandable that you will forgive them their faults. Not surprisingly, therefore, there is another phrase I've heard frequently over the past few years, "That's our Barry". Warts and all, Barry made the kind of positive impact on others of which few can ever dream.

A lot more can be said about Barry, both good and bad. But, on this day, I am glad that I came to understand that a first job and a better lot in life is a much more important than a few days of snowed-in streets. So, on this day, Mr. Mayor, I am giving you credit for the sun.

As with so many things about Barry's life, the jobs he created are a complicated issue. First off, Jeff, you're conflating the summer jobs program with the integration of DC municipal jobs and the creation of the black middle class. The summer jobs program, which I believe still exists today, didn't create anything - it was a payoff to give teenagers something to do in the summer time, and a way to buy their parents' (and the teen' future) votes. Calling it a jobs program is even a bit of a stretch, since not a lot of work got done. That didn't create any middle class.

As for the municipal jobs that did create the black middle class, he deserves a huge amount of credit for making those jobs available to all. But he then turned the DC government into a jobs program (that, coincidently, also served as a campaign tool). While that may have helped some people in the short term (and secured his reelection, and mayor for life status) it wasn't a sustainable long-term goal.

Barry was an extraordinary civil rights figure who saw the ways in which the existing power structure oppressed poor minorities, and decided to use the same tactics to further his cause (and his career). But, he overreached, and became that which he was fighting against. It is sad that he will be remembered for his personal shortcomings rather than his (complicated, and not unblemished) political career.

I really beg to differ that the summer jobs program didn't help folks get into the middle class. I personally know of several people for whom that was their first job - who otherwise would not have had an employment experience that helped them go on to have successful track records in the workforce. These are men and women who may not have had the type of DCUM upbringing with two working parents. The program at some point was called the Marion Barry Youth Leadership program - and the program was a throwback to when Barry was a community organizer. You're conflating the SYEP program of today with the past. As someone who witnessed it's impact - it did work and helped save many lives.

Isn't it the same program, just with a different name? But, in any event, you raise a valid point about the benefits of the program with respect to individuals, and I don't dispute that, and I don't dispute that the program helped people get into the middle class. However, I'm not sure it had a true systemic impact. Those middle class jobs WERE going to be integrated - which is good. That led to the true creation of the black middle class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know much about Barry so I'm not going to vilify or glorify his life, but I do think that this attitude that we must never speak ill of the dead is damaging and irresponsible. Of course, it should be constructive and not name calling, but people don't get a pass on any harm they caused simply because they're dead. We should not be so quick to forget the past lest we repeat it.

I agree. But in the case of this thread, it went far beyond an "attitude" towards what one should or shouldn't do.

All criticism was censored. Hopefully, freedom of expression has been restored.

Stop acting like this is violating your constitutional rights. This is Jeff's site and he has every right to remove every thread that's not about BMWs if he so chooses.

I'm the original PP and I wasn't specifically referring to this forum. I think people who protect the dead and the media who gloss over history are dangerous. Of course Jeff can do what he likes, but I suspect if there's too much censoring going on then his business will take a hit.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm the original PP and I wasn't specifically referring to this forum. I think people who protect the dead and the media who gloss over history are dangerous. Of course Jeff can do what he likes, but I suspect if there's too much censoring going on then his business will take a hit.

Just to be clear, if I have to choose between what I think is right and what is financially beneficial, my family better get used to rice and beans. More to the point, there is plenty of criticism of Barry in this thread. While there is no need to lionize the dead, there is even less reason to demonize them. It is entirely appropriate to demand respect for a period of grieving. Barry was a larger than life local figure. For many, "Marion Barry" and "Washington" are inseparable concepts. This is an emotional time and DCUM shouldn't be used to fuel the worst of those emotions.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm the original PP and I wasn't specifically referring to this forum. I think people who protect the dead and the media who gloss over history are dangerous. Of course Jeff can do what he likes, but I suspect if there's too much censoring going on then his business will take a hit.

Just to be clear, if I have to choose between what I think is right and what is financially beneficial, my family better get used to rice and beans. More to the point, there is plenty of criticism of Barry in this thread. While there is no need to lionize the dead, there is even less reason to demonize them. It is entirely appropriate to demand respect for a period of grieving. Barry was a larger than life local figure. For many, "Marion Barry" and "Washington" are inseparable concepts. This is an emotional time and DCUM shouldn't be used to fuel the worst of those emotions.

I would like to point out that I have been having a perfectly respectful debate with Jeff regarding the merits of some of Barry's programs and his legacy. If your comments have been "censored" perhaps you should think about what those comments were. If they amount to nothing more than "he was a felon" and the like, they don't contribute anything to the discussion. (DO you really think anyone doesn't realize that? Seriously?) If you feel hurt that your right to make snarky, unhelpful comments has been infringed, I (and I suspect, others) can handle your disappointment with a great deal of equanimity.