Teach Your Children

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting comment about belief becoming identity and I actually believe that’s true for believers AND for non-believers.
My Christian faith is 100% my identity.
I am unapologetically a child of God and a follower of Jesus first and foremost.

I don’t think it’s true that I feel particularly threatened by someone else’s UNbelief, as in it doesn’t shake my own faith to have someone insist that there is no God. But given that a cornerstone of Christian faith is in recognizing that we are called to share his message and love with others in some form or another, I can understand why prior posters are trying to articulate why it would be UNkind (from a Christian friend’s perspective) to make the decision to never share their faith with a friend whom they know has not accepted Christ. It’s like—if you believe that your friend will suffer a terrible death without you sharing a key piece of information that could save them from it—would t you be a truly terrible friend if you chose not to tell them just because it was considered impolite?
I realize that many of you think that’s ridiculous and a fairy tale. But that’s not the point. The point is—if you know your friend is a believer and does not think this is a fairy tale and they really do believe you will not go to heaven unless you are saved, then why aren’t you offended if that Christian friend chooses politeness over what THEY believe is your path to salvation?
I’m just perplexed by that.
If I were a non-Christian and I understood that Christians believe you can only experience salvation through knowing Christ and yet none of my Christian “friends” ever tried even once to share their testimony with me, I would feel hurt. Not because I believed it, but because I knew THEY did but didn’t care enough about me to bother.

Addressing this:

The point is—if you know your friend is a believer and does not think this is a fairy tale and they really do believe you will not go to heaven unless you are saved, then why aren’t you offended if that Christian friend chooses politeness over what THEY believe is your path to salvation?
I’m just perplexed by that.

Because that person has no respect for you or what you believe.

I'm just perplexed you don't get that.

But since you don't, you should not be offended when I tell you, to your face and in a social setting, that your bronze age myth worship is fake and a tremendous waste of your time and resources and you should stop. Right? I only tell you because I care and I know the answer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting comment about belief becoming identity and I actually believe that’s true for believers AND for non-believers.
My Christian faith is 100% my identity.
I am unapologetically a child of God and a follower of Jesus first and foremost.

I don’t think it’s true that I feel particularly threatened by someone else’s UNbelief, as in it doesn’t shake my own faith to have someone insist that there is no God. But given that a cornerstone of Christian faith is in recognizing that we are called to share his message and love with others in some form or another, I can understand why prior posters are trying to articulate why it would be UNkind (from a Christian friend’s perspective) to make the decision to never share their faith with a friend whom they know has not accepted Christ. It’s like—if you believe that your friend will suffer a terrible death without you sharing a key piece of information that could save them from it—would t you be a truly terrible friend if you chose not to tell them just because it was considered impolite?
I realize that many of you think that’s ridiculous and a fairy tale. But that’s not the point. The point is—if you know your friend is a believer and does not think this is a fairy tale and they really do believe you will not go to heaven unless you are saved, then why aren’t you offended if that Christian friend chooses politeness over what THEY believe is your path to salvation?
I’m just perplexed by that.
If I were a non-Christian and I understood that Christians believe you can only experience salvation through knowing Christ and yet none of my Christian “friends” ever tried even once to share their testimony with me, I would feel hurt. Not because I believed it, but because I knew THEY did but didn’t care enough about me to bother.

Addressing this:

The point is—if you know your friend is a believer and does not think this is a fairy tale and they really do believe you will not go to heaven unless you are saved, then why aren’t you offended if that Christian friend chooses politeness over what THEY believe is your path to salvation?
I’m just perplexed by that.

Because that person has no respect for you or what you believe.

I'm just perplexed you don't get that.

But since you don't, you should not be offended when I tell you, to your face and in a social setting, that your bronze age myth worship is fake and a tremendous waste of your time and resources and you should stop. Right? I only tell you because I care and I know the answer.

Excellent response -- this should happen more often. And if I'm ever approached this way, I will definitely do it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
that it’s rude to talk about religion. No, little Johnny, it is not “bad” that my son doesn’t believe in Jesus. Isn’t it interesting, though, that in our atheist household I teach my children that all religions as well as lack of them are equally fine and that we all choose our own motivations to be good and kind, yet Johnny’s parents/pastors/whoever teach him to shame those that don’t walk their walk? Which one of us is being kind to our neighbor? Interesting how it works… Thanks for making my child cry and feel less than. Maybe it’s time for you to have a talk as a family about the freedom to believe or NOT believe anything in this country (constitutional by the way) and what it actually means to be kind. Or at least let them know it’s simply rude to talk about religion. Would be much appreciated. P.S. Religious bullying is bullying.

The bolded is literally not true, unless you honestly believe that, say, Episcopalianism is no different from the Apostolic United Brethren, in which case...you need some serious help.

Stop. You know what OP was saying. She was encouraging compassion and tolerance and wishing the mini-zealot had learned the same from his religious community.

And personally, I have no idea what the difference is between the two groups you mentioned. Nor am I interested in finding out. I am a cultural Catholic and know there are fundamentalist factions in every religion. I prefer to generally wish everyone well in their faith of choicei, or non-faith. I entirely support OP's point of view.

Now see, to me, as a fellow believer, this reads as selfish on your part, PP. You know the Truth and yet you want to keep it to yourself and for yourself because it’s more important for you to be seen as tolerant than it is for you to have a hand in bringing hearts to Christ and sharing in His kingdom.
I can understand why OP feels this way as a NON-believer, but I have zero understanding of how a believer can justify guy hiding their light and just “wishing everyone the best” when your faith and convictions tell you unequivocally that “the best” is not a possible outcome for a NON-believer

yeah but that only applies in a world where noone has heard of Jesus/allah (the only 2 truly evangelical faiths ) Your job is to live/witness god in the world and you dont need to say His name to do that. if someone is so impressed by your life they can come ask you about Jesus. Its not like they dont know and you are suddenly telling them what they dont know. Its not news anymore- if someone wants to know more they can ask you b/c TRUST- they have already heard the good news, you arent breaking it to them.

telling peopl about jesus is NOT bringing them to christ b/c they already know about Jesus- its too late in the game for that easy win. You need to actually be a living embodiment which means being kinder, more put together, more attractive, better in every way and have that special light around you that attracts people to you and through you to christ. you are doing the easy & useless thing, she is actually being a good person which will pique someones curiosity and bring them more than spouting the obvious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
that it’s rude to talk about religion. No, little Johnny, it is not “bad” that my son doesn’t believe in Jesus. Isn’t it interesting, though, that in our atheist household I teach my children that all religions as well as lack of them are equally fine and that we all choose our own motivations to be good and kind, yet Johnny’s parents/pastors/whoever teach him to shame those that don’t walk their walk? Which one of us is being kind to our neighbor? Interesting how it works… Thanks for making my child cry and feel less than. Maybe it’s time for you to have a talk as a family about the freedom to believe or NOT believe anything in this country (constitutional by the way) and what it actually means to be kind. Or at least let them know it’s simply rude to talk about religion. Would be much appreciated. P.S. Religious bullying is bullying.

The bolded is literally not true, unless you honestly believe that, say, Episcopalianism is no different from the Apostolic United Brethren, in which case...you need some serious help.

Stop. You know what OP was saying. She was encouraging compassion and tolerance and wishing the mini-zealot had learned the same from his religious community.

And personally, I have no idea what the difference is between the two groups you mentioned. Nor am I interested in finding out. I am a cultural Catholic and know there are fundamentalist factions in every religion. I prefer to generally wish everyone well in their faith of choicei, or non-faith. I entirely support OP's point of view.

Now see, to me, as a fellow believer, this reads as selfish on your part, PP. You know the Truth and yet you want to keep it to yourself and for yourself because it’s more important for you to be seen as tolerant than it is for you to have a hand in bringing hearts to Christ and sharing in His kingdom.
I can understand why OP feels this way as a NON-believer, but I have zero understanding of how a believer can justify guy hiding their light and just “wishing everyone the best” when your faith and convictions tell you unequivocally that “the best” is not a possible outcome for a NON-believer

yeah but that only applies in a world where noone has heard of Jesus/allah (the only 2 truly evangelical faiths ) Your job is to live/witness god in the world and you dont need to say His name to do that. if someone is so impressed by your life they can come ask you about Jesus. Its not like they dont know and you are suddenly telling them what they dont know. Its not news anymore- if someone wants to know more they can ask you b/c TRUST- they have already heard the good news, you arent breaking it to them.

telling peopl about jesus is NOT bringing them to christ b/c they already know about Jesus- its too late in the game for that easy win. You need to actually be a living embodiment which means being kinder, more put together, more attractive, better in every way and have that special light around you that attracts people to you and through you to christ. you are doing the easy & useless thing, she is actually being a good person which will pique someones curiosity and bring them more than spouting the obvious.

You're right - the word is out about Jesus. Everyone knows. Too bad for the evangelizers who think they're telling people something new.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Religious posters. Just stop. You're peddling nothing more than a giant pile of horsesh*t.

The OP's child dealt with your intolerant lot and emotionally upset that child.

Which is causing more harm - making a kid cry by bullying them for not believing in bronze age myths, your lame BS about wanting to save their non-existent soul? What if the kid identified as Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, or Hindu?

Would the kid have had the same right to bully the other kid?

As has been repeated ad naseum in this forum, if you want to believe, be the moron that you are, but for those that don't, leave them the f*ck alone.

seriously- im muslim and i know for a fact that these same people get ticked off if our kids point out that their parents are "santa' and santa is a story. they get SOOO mad that we ruined the 'magic' and TBH, i tell my kids not to bust the santa myth b/c its rude and to let people have their fairytales.

if your religion tells you to have bad manners, maybe rethink your religion. everyone knows what good manners and etiquette are and any coda that pushes you to break those norms is not coming from a place of good intentions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
that it’s rude to talk about religion. No, little Johnny, it is not “bad” that my son doesn’t believe in Jesus. Isn’t it interesting, though, that in our atheist household I teach my children that all religions as well as lack of them are equally fine and that we all choose our own motivations to be good and kind, yet Johnny’s parents/pastors/whoever teach him to shame those that don’t walk their walk? Which one of us is being kind to our neighbor? Interesting how it works… Thanks for making my child cry and feel less than. Maybe it’s time for you to have a talk as a family about the freedom to believe or NOT believe anything in this country (constitutional by the way) and what it actually means to be kind. Or at least let them know it’s simply rude to talk about religion. Would be much appreciated. P.S. Religious bullying is bullying.

The bolded is literally not true, unless you honestly believe that, say, Episcopalianism is no different from the Apostolic United Brethren, in which case...you need some serious help.

Stop. You know what OP was saying. She was encouraging compassion and tolerance and wishing the mini-zealot had learned the same from his religious community.

And personally, I have no idea what the difference is between the two groups you mentioned. Nor am I interested in finding out. I am a cultural Catholic and know there are fundamentalist factions in every religion. I prefer to generally wish everyone well in their faith of choicei, or non-faith. I entirely support OP's point of view.

Now see, to me, as a fellow believer, this reads as selfish on your part, PP. You know the Truth and yet you want to keep it to yourself and for yourself because it’s more important for you to be seen as tolerant than it is for you to have a hand in bringing hearts to Christ and sharing in His kingdom.
I can understand why OP feels this way as a NON-believer, but I have zero understanding of how a believer can justify guy hiding their light and just “wishing everyone the best” when your faith and convictions tell you unequivocally that “the best” is not a possible outcome for a NON-believer

yeah but that only applies in a world where noone has heard of Jesus/allah (the only 2 truly evangelical faiths ) Your job is to live/witness god in the world and you dont need to say His name to do that. if someone is so impressed by your life they can come ask you about Jesus. Its not like they dont know and you are suddenly telling them what they dont know. Its not news anymore- if someone wants to know more they can ask you b/c TRUST- they have already heard the good news, you arent breaking it to them.

telling peopl about jesus is NOT bringing them to christ b/c they already know about Jesus- its too late in the game for that easy win. You need to actually be a living embodiment which means being kinder, more put together, more attractive, better in every way and have that special light around you that attracts people to you and through you to christ. you are doing the easy & useless thing, she is actually being a good person which will pique someones curiosity and bring them more than spouting the obvious.

Maybe it's more selfishness on the part of the evangelizers. That is, maybe rather than actually trying to bring people to Christ, they want to tell people that they themselves are on the path to eternal life in Heaven. They're saying, Look at me - I'm special!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting comment about belief becoming identity and I actually believe that’s true for believers AND for non-believers.
My Christian faith is 100% my identity.
I am unapologetically a child of God and a follower of Jesus first and foremost.

I don’t think it’s true that I feel particularly threatened by someone else’s UNbelief, as in it doesn’t shake my own faith to have someone insist that there is no God. But given that a cornerstone of Christian faith is in recognizing that we are called to share his message and love with others in some form or another, I can understand why prior posters are trying to articulate why it would be UNkind (from a Christian friend’s perspective) to make the decision to never share their faith with a friend whom they know has not accepted Christ. It’s like—if you believe that your friend will suffer a terrible death without you sharing a key piece of information that could save them from it—would t you be a truly terrible friend if you chose not to tell them just because it was considered impolite?
I realize that many of you think that’s ridiculous and a fairy tale. But that’s not the point. The point is—if you know your friend is a believer and does not think this is a fairy tale and they really do believe you will not go to heaven unless you are saved, then why aren’t you offended if that Christian friend chooses politeness over what THEY believe is your path to salvation?
I’m just perplexed by that.
If I were a non-Christian and I understood that Christians believe you can only experience salvation through knowing Christ and yet none of my Christian “friends” ever tried even once to share their testimony with me, I would feel hurt. Not because I believed it, but because I knew THEY did but didn’t care enough about me to bother.

Ok, I think you need to take a step back. The fact that you are told sharing the “good news” is a cornerstone of your faith is not to save the souls of others, but to save your OWN. As in, eliminate any possibility the people around you might undermine your faith by convincing them to share in the delusion.

And there is also the expectation that people are going to laugh in your face and tell you to bug off. It’s baked in - a feature not a bug. The ridicule of others is going to make you feel even more entrenched in your beliefs, and cement the feeling that you are part of a special, victimized minority that must stick together and stay steadfast. You will venerate the people who went too far, insulted the wrong people in the wrong place, and paid the price. You will call them saints and martyrs.

What you are doing is selfish and insulting to people. I don’t have my child try to educate yours that he could have 10% more money, more time to play, and a 90% less likely risk of being molested or spiritually abused if he stayed away from church. I wish I could share these things because I hate to see people being scammed, but I learned a long time ago that when people want to believe - whether it’s a religion or an MLM or that a silver spoon millionaire who has stiffed every contractor he came across personally cares about their wellbeing - you just have to let them have it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: It’s like—if you believe that your friend will suffer a terrible death without you sharing a key piece of information that could save them from it—would t you be a truly terrible friend if you chose not to tell them just because it was considered impolite?

Terrible example. If it were true that your friend would suffer a terrible death, then by all means, work to save them. However, what you believe is not real. It is not true. Therefore, all you are doing is imposing your will on someone else's. What happened to the whole "free will" argument?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: It’s like—if you believe that your friend will suffer a terrible death without you sharing a key piece of information that could save them from it—would t you be a truly terrible friend if you chose not to tell them just because it was considered impolite?

Terrible example. If it were true that your friend would suffer a terrible death, then by all means, work to save them. However, what you believe is not real. It is not true. Therefore, all you are doing is imposing your will on someone else's. What happened to the whole "free will" argument?

Even if it were true, you'd still be imposing your will on them. Instead, you could at least ask them if it would be OK to tell them about your religious beliefs. Then they'd have the opportunity to say No.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting comment about belief becoming identity and I actually believe that’s true for believers AND for non-believers.
My Christian faith is 100% my identity.
I am unapologetically a child of God and a follower of Jesus first and foremost.

I don’t think it’s true that I feel particularly threatened by someone else’s UNbelief, as in it doesn’t shake my own faith to have someone insist that there is no God. But given that a cornerstone of Christian faith is in recognizing that we are called to share his message and love with others in some form or another, I can understand why prior posters are trying to articulate why it would be UNkind (from a Christian friend’s perspective) to make the decision to never share their faith with a friend whom they know has not accepted Christ. It’s like—if you believe that your friend will suffer a terrible death without you sharing a key piece of information that could save them from it—would t you be a truly terrible friend if you chose not to tell them just because it was considered impolite?
I realize that many of you think that’s ridiculous and a fairy tale. But that’s not the point. The point is—if you know your friend is a believer and does not think this is a fairy tale and they really do believe you will not go to heaven unless you are saved, then why aren’t you offended if that Christian friend chooses politeness over what THEY believe is your path to salvation?
I’m just perplexed by that.
If I were a non-Christian and I understood that Christians believe you can only experience salvation through knowing Christ and yet none of my Christian “friends” ever tried even once to share their testimony with me, I would feel hurt. Not because I believed it, but because I knew THEY did but didn’t care enough about me to bother.

Addressing this:

The point is—if you know your friend is a believer and does not think this is a fairy tale and they really do believe you will not go to heaven unless you are saved, then why aren’t you offended if that Christian friend chooses politeness over what THEY believe is your path to salvation?
I’m just perplexed by that.

Because that person has no respect for you or what you believe.

I'm just perplexed you don't get that.

But since you don't, you should not be offended when I tell you, to your face and in a social setting, that your bronze age myth worship is fake and a tremendous waste of your time and resources and you should stop. Right? I only tell you because I care and I know the answer.

Excellent response -- this should happen more often. And if I'm ever approached this way, I will definitely do it.

Agreed. I love the response too. I just want to be left alone about what anyone believes. If you think I’m going to hell because of your book then that’s your problem

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting comment about belief becoming identity and I actually believe that’s true for believers AND for non-believers.
My Christian faith is 100% my identity.
I am unapologetically a child of God and a follower of Jesus first and foremost.

I don’t think it’s true that I feel particularly threatened by someone else’s UNbelief, as in it doesn’t shake my own faith to have someone insist that there is no God. But given that a cornerstone of Christian faith is in recognizing that we are called to share his message and love with others in some form or another, I can understand why prior posters are trying to articulate why it would be UNkind (from a Christian friend’s perspective) to make the decision to never share their faith with a friend whom they know has not accepted Christ. It’s like—if you believe that your friend will suffer a terrible death without you sharing a key piece of information that could save them from it—would t you be a truly terrible friend if you chose not to tell them just because it was considered impolite?
I realize that many of you think that’s ridiculous and a fairy tale. But that’s not the point. The point is—if you know your friend is a believer and does not think this is a fairy tale and they really do believe you will not go to heaven unless you are saved, then why aren’t you offended if that Christian friend chooses politeness over what THEY believe is your path to salvation?
I’m just perplexed by that.
If I were a non-Christian and I understood that Christians believe you can only experience salvation through knowing Christ and yet none of my Christian “friends” ever tried even once to share their testimony with me, I would feel hurt. Not because I believed it, but because I knew THEY did but didn’t care enough about me to bother.

Ok, I think you need to take a step back. The fact that you are told sharing the “good news” is a cornerstone of your faith is not to save the souls of others, but to save your OWN. As in, eliminate any possibility the people around you might undermine your faith by convincing them to share in the delusion.

And there is also the expectation that people are going to laugh in your face and tell you to bug off. It’s baked in - a feature not a bug. The ridicule of others is going to make you feel even more entrenched in your beliefs, and cement the feeling that you are part of a special, victimized minority that must stick together and stay steadfast. You will venerate the people who went too far, insulted the wrong people in the wrong place, and paid the price. You will call them saints and martyrs.

What you are doing is selfish and insulting to people. I don’t have my child try to educate yours that he could have 10% more money, more time to play, and a 90% less likely risk of being molested or spiritually abused if he stayed away from church. I wish I could share these things because I hate to see people being scammed, but I learned a long time ago that when people want to believe - whether it’s a religion or an MLM or that a silver spoon millionaire who has stiffed every contractor he came across personally cares about their wellbeing - you just have to let them have it.

+ 1 million. Especially the part about reinforcing their specialness. It’s all about the psychology. Ironically enough, the neuroscience (studied by humans about our being human and denied by so many religious folks), explains it ALL. Even the belief in the first place lol.

[Anonymous]

We will proclaim Jesus around here!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We will proclaim Jesus around here!

Proclaim him to be what, exactly?

Then I am in - I proclaim him to be a scam artist!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We will proclaim Jesus around here!

Proclaim him to be what, exactly?

Then I am in - I proclaim him to be a scam artist!

me too – Jesus is a scam artist!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We will proclaim Jesus around here!

Proclaim him to be what, exactly?

Then I am in - I proclaim him to be a scam artist!

me too – Jesus is a scam artist!

With good PR team!