NY Times editorial: "Universities Like Yale Need a Reckoning"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Endowment hording" is leveled at universities so wealthy they can't be punished or controlled by the public purse strings.

I agree to some degree with other bullet points. But the people who want to knock these schools off of their high horse's should drop the sour grapes arguments.

Is there a proposed solution to endowment hoarding? Big endowments will be confiscated and distributed to all other colleges in the name of equity?

I think this point is less about schools with larger vs smaller/no endowments and more that schools with substantial endowments should have higher withdrawal rates and use the money productively to address the identified problems (admit more students, reach people outside of the university, etc).

If they admit more students they cannot keep the overwhelmingly small seminar-style classes. It is a much different experience to learn in an environment where you get to know peers and the professors.
Elite is elite for a reason, the huge endowments keep it functioning as a high-opportunity learning experience, and many of us are quite content to pay the full price. These schools happen to be the most generous with need based aid: they are doing far more than state schools to get net costs down for true middle class families: most who make in the low $100k range pay ZERO at these elite schools, yet would pay $10-15k for their in state public.

[Anonymous]

Not a subscriber, but The Atlantic is also running a "hate on the Ivies" piece today.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/12/meritocracy-college-admissions-social-economic-segregation/680392/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand how most Americans don't go to college. I really don't. This country has so much opportunity if you are someone who values education and strives for a better life. I think of the fact that public schools encourage reading, that may sound trivial but public schools in the Arab world absolutely do not. And libraries are not commonly used. Just by reading a low income or low middle class child can develop skills to have a better understanding of the world. And through scholarships can get into good schools. Again with the Arab world comparison because that is what I know best--do you think a bright low income kid over there can get into a good school? Very very hard.

Americans don't realize how good they have it. And the American culture of contempt toward educated elites is part of the reason someone like Trump was able to win. I remember reading a Vance interview where he said McDonald's should hire young American men through better wages and I just rolled my eyes. Yeah sure, these hordes of young unemployed white men are dying to work at McDonald's if only they could get 15 bucks an hour. No, they want high-paying jobs being a foreman at a factory or something. And they are angry at their lawyer cousin who was smart to get out of Oklahoma or whatever and make a good life for themselves in DC or NY.

Because they are not getting low paying McDonald's jobs. They are making $100K+/year without college.

Also, even a state school will run you $120K for 4 years and most poeple can't afford that, actually most can't afford to not work for 4 years.

They may expect to make 100k, but the percentage of people without degrees making 100k is very low.

What is that %? and what is the % of college educated people making 100K?

DP but was curious so I asked chatGPT.

“The percentage of people making more than $100,000 per year varies significantly depending on educational attainment. Generally:

1. With a college degree: Studies have shown that individuals with at least a bachelor’s degree are far more likely to earn $100,000 or more annually. Recent data indicates that around 30-40% of people with a bachelor’s degree or higher earn over $100,000. This percentage increases for those with advanced degrees, such as a master’s or professional degree.

2. Without a college degree: The percentage of people without a college degree making over $100,000 is considerably lower. For those with only a high school diploma, typically 5-10% reach this income level. However, factors like industry, years of experience, and geographic location can also play significant roles in earnings at this level.

These percentages can vary somewhat year by year and by geographic region. The gap reflects both the earning potential associated with higher education and the career paths accessible to those with and without degrees.”

Exactly so 70% of people go to college spend >$100K and don't even make $100K a year. That's proof enough college is not a great return on investment.

I'm in the 70% that earns less than 100K. I'm wondering if you think as a nurse, I'm underpaid or I should have been able to get the job without any schooling?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Emory has already started moving its endowment into Bitcoin. These people are not dumb. They plan decades into the future.

harvest invested big in timberland and it was a debacle.

I think Yale's endowment grew 4% last year - far below a low fee index fund.

Not for the returns, Dumbo. For the portability! So they can teleport their money into a time and space where it can't be taxed or confiscated. And please if you want to have this conversation go and learn up on the ABCs of Bitcoin beforehand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not a subscriber, but The Atlantic is also running a "hate on the Ivies" piece today.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/12/meritocracy-college-admissions-social-economic-segregation/680392/

I read it. The hate on the ivies is misplaced. These schools provide a lot of aid for people up to 200k in some cases, and are often free under 100k income. These schools have over 50% on aid, have much more diversity than the private schools and most UMC suburban publics. Smart conservative families who have kids who can get in still send their kids to ivies/elite: the three most conservative families from our top private have students at Dartmouth, Penn, WashU,Georgetown. They’d be at ivies if all had gotten in. Parents of these students went to a mix of Duke, UVA , Cambridge, WashU. Other than the dip Harvard had last year, other ivies remain more in demand than ever, with apps increasing. There’s no movement away from Ivy/+ any time in the foreseeable future regardless of what these articles try to spin

[Anonymous]

The reality is most Democrats don't care about the Ivy League Schools.

Where did this notion that democrats care about elite ivy educations?

Most democrats just want their kids to get a good, healthy educations... which generally is not Ivy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand how most Americans don't go to college. I really don't. This country has so much opportunity if you are someone who values education and strives for a better life. I think of the fact that public schools encourage reading, that may sound trivial but public schools in the Arab world absolutely do not. And libraries are not commonly used. Just by reading a low income or low middle class child can develop skills to have a better understanding of the world. And through scholarships can get into good schools. Again with the Arab world comparison because that is what I know best--do you think a bright low income kid over there can get into a good school? Very very hard.

Americans don't realize how good they have it. And the American culture of contempt toward educated elites is part of the reason someone like Trump was able to win. I remember reading a Vance interview where he said McDonald's should hire young American men through better wages and I just rolled my eyes. Yeah sure, these hordes of young unemployed white men are dying to work at McDonald's if only they could get 15 bucks an hour. No, they want high-paying jobs being a foreman at a factory or something. And they are angry at their lawyer cousin who was smart to get out of Oklahoma or whatever and make a good life for themselves in DC or NY.

Because they are not getting low paying McDonald's jobs. They are making $100K+/year without college.

Also, even a state school will run you $120K for 4 years and most poeple can't afford that, actually most can't afford to not work for 4 years.

They may expect to make 100k, but the percentage of people without degrees making 100k is very low.

What is that %? and what is the % of college educated people making 100K?

DP but was curious so I asked chatGPT.

“The percentage of people making more than $100,000 per year varies significantly depending on educational attainment. Generally:

1. With a college degree: Studies have shown that individuals with at least a bachelor’s degree are far more likely to earn $100,000 or more annually. Recent data indicates that around 30-40% of people with a bachelor’s degree or higher earn over $100,000. This percentage increases for those with advanced degrees, such as a master’s or professional degree.

2. Without a college degree: The percentage of people without a college degree making over $100,000 is considerably lower. For those with only a high school diploma, typically 5-10% reach this income level. However, factors like industry, years of experience, and geographic location can also play significant roles in earnings at this level.

These percentages can vary somewhat year by year and by geographic region. The gap reflects both the earning potential associated with higher education and the career paths accessible to those with and without degrees.”

Exactly so 70% of people go to college spend >$100K and don't even make $100K a year. That's proof enough college is not a great return on investment.

I'm in the 70% that earns less than 100K. I'm wondering if you think as a nurse, I'm underpaid or I should have been able to get the job without any schooling?

I think you are underpaid and depending what type of nurse I think you could have skipped the Core classes universities require like basket weaving and the art of fabric and still become a nurse.

I think universities should have a required set of classes that are needed for a nurse and you should take those to become a nurse.

[Anonymous]

Did a conservative write the article? He sounds scared that a university can do what they want and think how they want.

A university is a business. They get to control their profit. If you want to look at “endowment hoarding,” look at billionaires like Bezos or Musk and not an Ivy.

Those two are among the true hoarders of money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand how most Americans don't go to college. I really don't. This country has so much opportunity if you are someone who values education and strives for a better life. I think of the fact that public schools encourage reading, that may sound trivial but public schools in the Arab world absolutely do not. And libraries are not commonly used. Just by reading a low income or low middle class child can develop skills to have a better understanding of the world. And through scholarships can get into good schools. Again with the Arab world comparison because that is what I know best--do you think a bright low income kid over there can get into a good school? Very very hard.

Americans don't realize how good they have it. And the American culture of contempt toward educated elites is part of the reason someone like Trump was able to win. I remember reading a Vance interview where he said McDonald's should hire young American men through better wages and I just rolled my eyes. Yeah sure, these hordes of young unemployed white men are dying to work at McDonald's if only they could get 15 bucks an hour. No, they want high-paying jobs being a foreman at a factory or something. And they are angry at their lawyer cousin who was smart to get out of Oklahoma or whatever and make a good life for themselves in DC or NY.

Because they are not getting low paying McDonald's jobs. They are making $100K+/year without college.

Also, even a state school will run you $120K for 4 years and most poeple can't afford that, actually most can't afford to not work for 4 years.

They may expect to make 100k, but the percentage of people without degrees making 100k is very low.

What is that %? and what is the % of college educated people making 100K?

DP but was curious so I asked chatGPT.

“The percentage of people making more than $100,000 per year varies significantly depending on educational attainment. Generally:

1. With a college degree: Studies have shown that individuals with at least a bachelor’s degree are far more likely to earn $100,000 or more annually. Recent data indicates that around 30-40% of people with a bachelor’s degree or higher earn over $100,000. This percentage increases for those with advanced degrees, such as a master’s or professional degree.

2. Without a college degree: The percentage of people without a college degree making over $100,000 is considerably lower. For those with only a high school diploma, typically 5-10% reach this income level. However, factors like industry, years of experience, and geographic location can also play significant roles in earnings at this level.

These percentages can vary somewhat year by year and by geographic region. The gap reflects both the earning potential associated with higher education and the career paths accessible to those with and without degrees.”

Exactly so 70% of people go to college spend >$100K and don't even make $100K a year. That's proof enough college is not a great return on investment.

I'm in the 70% that earns less than 100K. I'm wondering if you think as a nurse, I'm underpaid or I should have been able to get the job without any schooling?

I think you are underpaid and depending what type of nurse I think you could have skipped the Core classes universities require like basket weaving and the art of fabric and still become a nurse.

I think universities should have a required set of classes that are needed for a nurse and you should take those to become a nurse.

I'm also assuming you have more than 5 years experience. I think 80K to start and 5% increase per year would be a good salary for nurses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Did a conservative write the article? He sounds scared that a university can do what they want and think how they want.

A university is a business. They get to control their profit. If you want to look at “endowment hoarding,” look at billionaires like Bezos or Musk and not an Ivy.

Those two are among the true hoarders of money.

and churches

What happen to capitalism? Do we now tell people how to spend their money?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Endowment hording" is leveled at universities so wealthy they can't be punished or controlled by the public purse strings.

I agree to some degree with other bullet points. But the people who want to knock these schools off of their high horse's should drop the sour grapes arguments.

Is there a proposed solution to endowment hoarding? Big endowments will be confiscated and distributed to all other colleges in the name of equity?

I think this point is less about schools with larger vs smaller/no endowments and more that schools with substantial endowments should have higher withdrawal rates and use the money productively to address the identified problems (admit more students, reach people outside of the university, etc).

If they admit more students they cannot keep the overwhelmingly small seminar-style classes. It is a much different experience to learn in an environment where you get to know peers and the professors.
Elite is elite for a reason, the huge endowments keep it functioning as a high-opportunity learning experience, and many of us are quite content to pay the full price. These schools happen to be the most generous with need based aid: they are doing far more than state schools to get net costs down for true middle class families: most who make in the low $100k range pay ZERO at these elite schools, yet would pay $10-15k for their in state public.

I mostly agree with you yet those paying zero are a very small number compared to the overall number of college students. In other words, most of us don’t care and don’t benefit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The reality is most Democrats don't care about the Ivy League Schools.

Where did this notion that democrats care about elite ivy educations?

Most democrats just want their kids to get a good, healthy educations... which generally is not Ivy.

It's just another Republican ploy.

Republicans are elite AF, their candidates both have degrees from Ivy League schools, and yet they push anti-education propaganda and their base just sucks it all up.

As always, they are completely full of sht.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Did a conservative write the article? He sounds scared that a university can do what they want and think how they want.

A university is a business. They get to control their profit. If you want to look at “endowment hoarding,” look at billionaires like Bezos or Musk and not an Ivy.

Those two are among the true hoarders of money.

Universities are not just “businesses”. They get significant direct and indirect support from the taxpayers. They are not allowed to “do whatever they want” when it comes to how they treat minorities or women, so the argument that they can and should just do whatever they want is simply dishonest and false.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did a conservative write the article? He sounds scared that a university can do what they want and think how they want.

A university is a business. They get to control their profit. If you want to look at “endowment hoarding,” look at billionaires like Bezos or Musk and not an Ivy.

Those two are among the true hoarders of money.

and churches

What happen to capitalism? Do we now tell people how to spend their money?

Yes we absolutely do tell people how to spend their money, every day in countless different ways.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Emory has already started moving its endowment into Bitcoin. These people are not dumb. They plan decades into the future.

harvest invested big in timberland and it was a debacle.

I think Yale's endowment grew 4% last year - far below a low fee index fund.

Not for the returns, Dumbo. For the portability! So they can teleport their money into a time and space where it can't be taxed or confiscated. And please if you want to have this conversation go and learn up on the ABCs of Bitcoin beforehand.

timberland is tax protected. and I dont think colleges are worried about things being confiscated.