Niece just finished her freshman year at University of Chicago. She hates it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:UChicago may be a good fit for some but when we researched it recently, there was no separate engineering school, it seemed very intense, the surrounding neighborhood was iffy, and Chicago was going down the tubes

Iffy is putting it mildly. Maybe Obama's library park thing will help but I doubt it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes this happens when you choose a college based solely on it being your highest US News ranked option.

She is really well traveled with best friends and an older brother at Ivies, UVA, Vanderbilt, Boston College, and Duke. Her senior year of high school and over the last year she has spent weekends or longer at like a dozen universities. She has a good handle on what she believes is lacking at Chicago.

Yes, weekend visits are the best way to discover how universities are run.

During her dozen of university weekend visits did she sit in many classes to see if the professors were checked out?

DP, but this is a thing, it's just really hard to know what is and isn't a good fit until you're there and have your experience. I went to Chicago and had a great time. None of what's described by some here is familiar to me at all, my social circle was down to earth and friendly, my professors were great (and all English speakers), but that's my experience. I had no way of knowing what experience I would have until I had it, really.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m the OP of this post:

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1067220.page

And the bratty, whiny niece in question is a prime example of what I’m talking about. Kids these days lack so much resilience — no grit, no perseverance, no ability to withstand hard times — that they ultimately explode in college or fail to launch. And that would happen regardless of whether the kid in question is at a “pressure-cooker” school (whatever the hell that means) like UChicago or UMD.

OP, your niece absolutely NEEDS to stay at UChicago. She NEEDS to show future employers and grad school admissions committees that she can survive and thrive in high-pressure environments. Your niece absolutely needs to develop grit and resilience, and that means that she needs to pick an employable major and get into a prestigious grad school program or work at the variety of finance or consulting firms that prefer Chicago grads.

And yes, prestige matters in the workplace. No question about that. A Chicago grad will have MUCH better employment opportunities than a UMD grad, full stop!

Citation on this? Chicago's outcomes are pretty atrocious. And a Chicago freshman with great grades could easily transfer into Georgetown or Penn, if they wanted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes this happens when you choose a college based solely on it being your highest US News ranked option.

She is really well traveled with best friends and an older brother at Ivies, UVA, Vanderbilt, Boston College, and Duke. Her senior year of high school and over the last year she has spent weekends or longer at like a dozen universities. She has a good handle on what she believes is lacking at Chicago.

Yes, weekend visits are the best way to discover how universities are run.

During her dozen of university weekend visits did she sit in many classes to see if the professors were checked out?

DP, but this is a thing, it's just really hard to know what is and isn't a good fit until you're there and have your experience. I went to Chicago and had a great time. None of what's described by some here is familiar to me at all, my social circle was down to earth and friendly, my professors were great (and all English speakers), but that's my experience. I had no way of knowing what experience I would have until I had it, really.

Maybe socially, but the rant about weekend visits to other schools means the niece knows that U Chicago is pooy run by comparison is ridiculous. The weekend visits were for socializing or partying-not to investigate the skills of the administration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She earned very high marks and she does not wish to return. And not just for known reasons like violent crime, weather, and its isolated location in the Midwest, and more specifically, on the deep south side of Chicago. We had a long lunch and here are her words in quotes: Her classmates are "repulsively obnoxious" and "insufferable," her professors were "checked out" or "barely spoke English," the university seems "unprofessional" and in "disarray," and most of the staff she encountered were "useless" and "incompetent." "It looks like a serious university but it does not operate like a serious university."

It was not her first choice but she was so excited when we met for lunch late last summer. It is sad to see her so unhappy after a year.

You realize it is hard to take you seriously when you lead with “the violent crime” and the “isolated location”.

First, the area around the school has crime, but the school itself is fine.

2nd… a city of 5 million people is hardly an isolated location.

Why even mention those two points…doesn’t sound like they had anything to do with your niece liking or not liking the school.

The location, weather, and crime is why the campus ethos is lacking, from faculty and administrators to low-level staff. If you were a high-flying researcher or administrator, would you prefer the coasts, the warm Sun Belt — or south side Chicago crime and cold weather? If you were a nurse or a random service worker, would you want to work downtown or the wealthy north and western suburbs of Chicago (for more pay!) — or commute down to the dangerous and isolated south side Chicago island the campus is in?

Some students may care a lot about lounging at the pool in the sun, but "high-flying researchers or administrators" would take Hyde Park over backwards, cultural wastelands like Tuscaloosa, Baton Rouge, etc. any day.

California (UCLA, Stanford, UCSD, USC, UCSB) is in the Sun Belt. As are research powerhouses including UT-Austin, Florida, Emory, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Vanderbilt, Duke and UNC. The booming South is a "wasteland" and talented people who can work anywhere in the nation love the idea of high crime, high taxes, terrible weather, and being on an isolated crime-ridden island in the Midwest. So what's that leave? You overpay for some rock stars but have to scrape the bottom of the talent pool to fill the rest of the roster, which impacts the ethos, vibe and professionalism of your campus. Why would a random talented staffer or service worker commute to the south side when they can make more working downtown or on the north shore? Draw a 5 mile radius around UChicago's campus and that's the bleak local talent pool.

Many people commute 5 miles to work. Moot point.

Look at what is around five miles of UChicago. Some of the most horrific slums in the U.S. That is their local workforce or they need to recruit talented people from further away ex. downtown, but why would folks further away want to waste their life commuting an hour each way to the dangerous and isolated campus on the south side for work, when they can make equal or more money working in the much safer and less depressing downtown Chicago or in a nice western or northern suburb? It's illogical, right? Universities have thousands of employees, so when a large percentage are scraping the bottom of the barrel, and they struggle with retention, and fail to fill positions, the entire campus ethos does not feel like a premium product to students paying $85,000 annually. UChicago college students are not enjoying a polished Ivy League or Stanford caliber ethos. They're probably not even getting a Georgetown ethos.

That is absurd, as someone employed by a CHicago nonprofit where no one makes much. Many of our employees commute 1+ hours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m the OP of this post:

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1067220.page

And the bratty, whiny niece in question is a prime example of what I’m talking about. Kids these days lack so much resilience — no grit, no perseverance, no ability to withstand hard times — that they ultimately explode in college or fail to launch. And that would happen regardless of whether the kid in question is at a “pressure-cooker” school (whatever the hell that means) like UChicago or UMD.

OP, your niece absolutely NEEDS to stay at UChicago. She NEEDS to show future employers and grad school admissions committees that she can survive and thrive in high-pressure environments. Your niece absolutely needs to develop grit and resilience, and that means that she needs to pick an employable major and get into a prestigious grad school program or work at the variety of finance or consulting firms that prefer Chicago grads.

And yes, prestige matters in the workplace. No question about that. A Chicago grad will have MUCH better employment opportunities than a UMD grad, full stop!

Citation on this? Chicago's outcomes are pretty atrocious. And a Chicago freshman with great grades could easily transfer into Georgetown or Penn, if they wanted.

Citation on this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:UChicago undergrad is clusterf***. A podunk poorly managed college spending tens of millions on marketing to masquerade as an elite, so status-obsessed strivers apply. None of the rich kids want to be there, it was a backup plan for every single one of them.[/quote]

This is so true. It's the backup of every Big 3 grad who didn't get into an Ivy. It's super fun to hear the parents try to convince themselves "it's just as good, if not better."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:are you foreign?

No American would say “marks”

Or “Deep South side”

I’m not a fan of UC Hicago but it has better faculty than most t10s

If this isn’t a troll,

What she’s really complaining/ missing is boys - she’s wants the type that’s easier to find at Dartmouth, vandy or duke

Interesting comments. But missed the fact “was not her first pick”. Hmmmm

Being from a status conscious family, she probably settled for the next highest rank school among her acceptances.

Too bad she (and her family?) did not get the memo that FIT is what you should be looking for, in addition to quality of education.

Kids don't have the luxury of choosing fit. With these acceptance rates and the admissions trickery, you are lucky to get into 1 top 30 college. And if you need any financial aid, it is pretty hit or miss once you are outside of the top 15 or so.

You are missing the point entirely. FIT can trump being at a top 30 school. It is very important.

People like you are blinded by rank. My kid got into 7 schools, chose the lowest ranked of those, and soared in college and beyond. People can absolutely thrive in the right environment.

[Anonymous]

Is this a joke ???
So many prestigious schools in USA are located not in the best neighborhoods.
So what ????
This is the 4 years of any kid’s life that meant for them to explore different city, community, friends and learn different subjects.
To become an adult!
I don’t care if it is u Chicago or any other schools in the country, if you are that weak and a complainer just stay home and go to community college and transfer to a state school afterwards.
That’s a great option too and a lot cheaper.
When I came to USA 30 years ago, I went to Hopkins. I was so excited, over the moon!
I did not care about the neighborhood and I am still thankful for all the opportunities that I was given in this country and learn to love every moment of my experience .
Just try to learn and enjoy and embrace all the opportunities presented to you, not everyone is as fortunate!

[Anonymous]

Penn or Cornell would take her I think.

[Anonymous]

I'm starting to think that anywhere near Chicago or St. Louis may be a mistake.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes this happens when you choose a college based solely on it being your highest US News ranked option.

She is really well traveled with best friends and an older brother at Ivies, UVA, Vanderbilt, Boston College, and Duke. Her senior year of high school and over the last year she has spent weekends or longer at like a dozen universities. She has a good handle on what she believes is lacking at Chicago.

Yes, weekend visits are the best way to discover how universities are run.

During her dozen of university weekend visits did she sit in many classes to see if the professors were checked out?

DP, but this is a thing, it's just really hard to know what is and isn't a good fit until you're there and have your experience. I went to Chicago and had a great time. None of what's described by some here is familiar to me at all, my social circle was down to earth and friendly, my professors were great (and all English speakers), but that's my experience. I had no way of knowing what experience I would have until I had it, really.

Maybe socially, but the rant about weekend visits to other schools means the niece knows that U Chicago is pooy run by comparison is ridiculous. The weekend visits were for socializing or partying-not to investigate the skills of the administration.

A teen spending several days socializing with current students on campus is the best way to learn about a school. It makes her far more knowledgeable than 99.9% of applicants, who maybe do a brief tour in the summer, if that. And far more informed than most message board boomer know it alls who act like they have a handle of all 25 of the top 25 US News list. Or if they attended even one of them (big if!) it was likely decades ago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:are you foreign?

No American would say “marks”

Or “Deep South side”

I’m not a fan of UC Hicago but it has better faculty than most t10s

If this isn’t a troll,

What she’s really complaining/ missing is boys - she’s wants the type that’s easier to find at Dartmouth, vandy or duke

Nothing wrong with wanting your college to be a good academic setting AND a place to meet a spouse. Especially at $85,000 per year.

[Anonymous]

I'd guess most people in American would rather live in Chicago than DC.

[Anonymous]

Seriously who do you think cares? She transfers or not !
So stupid