TJ Decisions are Out

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I’m in Loudoun. My child and all his friends were admitted to TJ. Some of these kids were waitlisted on Loudoun’s Academy of Loudoun (AOL). It seems TJ was easier to get in than AOL, at least for them. I was actually very surprised. Quite a few kids from Loudoun will decline due to the long commute.

Congratulations. The new admission system guarantee the top1.5% students from each middle school to be admitted. So as long as the kids are the top 1.5% of their school, they will get a seat.

In the past, given TJ is STEM school, it is strictly testing score plus other academic achievements, such as math count , science Olympia etc. the strong schools who provide better academic education win big, such as Carson and Longfellow, and schools outside Fairfax and FCPS middle schools without AAP centers don’t have too much chances due to weaker STEM and math education.

For those admitted students from non traditional TJ middle schools, the major factor to be considered is whether the kids can advance very fast and undergo high pressure environments. Regardless how TJ is admitting students, inside TJ, it is still test score based student performance system. In the past two years, more students admitted from non traditional TJ middle schools due to diversity objective, however they performed mediocre or poorly at TJ compared to traditional TJ middle schools. This makes it easier for students from strong middle schools to stand out with the new admission system. Before admission rule changes, Carson + Longfellow often have 150-200 students get admitted to TJ, now they probably decrease to 50-80

So instead of taking the top performers across the county they take it from each school, even if the school has dumber students?

The good news is no school has dumber students just students who may lack the advantages of weather areas.

Oh come on. It’s not that a school has dumber students but it’s accurate to say that 100% under this new quote policy, it becomes, in part, not about obtaining the best of the best but obtaining the best of those who apply from each school. Higher performing kids from places like Cooper will be booted out while very possibly lower performing kids from a lower SES school will be admitted. That’s bc of the quota system. It is NOT about the best kids in the area.

Except for 1 PP who keeps trying to argue otherwise, most people understand this. It’s just a difference of opinion about whether that change is a good thing or not. On my view I think it is so a small handful of MSs aren’t getting the overwhelming share of seats still.

You mean the 1 poster who pushes this elitist narrative by sock puppets their own posts? Most of us are aware that intelligence isn't limited to the wealthiest schools but the privilege is...

DP. I think a lot of us realize that you constantly push a very one-sided narrative for political reasons that have little to do with which students have the most STEM aptitude. It’s all clowns like Scott Surovell, Ricardy Anderson, and Karen Corbett Sanders have ever brought to the table - they do nothing to improve the other schools in their districts, but they’re great at stoking class-based resentment and anti-Asian bias.

Even more of us realize you've been constantly pushing this narrative to stoke grievances based on false assumptions. Believing that the best and brightest are only at the most affluent schools is nonsense. If left to you, advantaged students would gain outsized access to these programs because money matters more than merit.

The record shows that School Board members openly talked about “redefining merit” to get the results they felt would best serve their political agendas.

They talked about redefining merit because the existing definition of merit, in Northern Virginia, tracked too closely with wealth and privilege.

There is this pernicious idea out there that standardized exams somehow measure merit on a completely race and demographic-blind basis, and they simply don't.

The new admissions process has a long way to go to get right - starting with eliminating the scored rubric in favor of an ACTUAL holistic evaluation and the reintroduction of teacher recommendations as a part of the process - but it is absolutely a step in the right direction based on the slowly improving climate of the school.

The goal is to continue down this path of “redefining merit” until TJ is in essence a typical FCPS high school but can still be called a magnet because kids come from a wider area.

At some point, though, on that road to convergence, TJ may still be a good deal if your alternative is Lewis but no longer worth it if your base school is Langley or Oakton. You’ll have part of the county looking at TJ as aspirational and another looking at it with growing indifference.

This framing deeply underestimates the huge difference between TJ and the top-rated public high schools in the area. There isn't even a comparison in terms of the educational opportunities and connections available.

Sounds a little like sour grapes to me.

I liked it better when merit was defined as those who could afford to buy the test answers too.

Some of the top math and science students in the state are being rejected in favor of kids who are taking algebra 1 in 8th grade, going to the same school as these top students.

LOL those aren't the top students you just need to put down the pipe

Yes, they are, and no amount of declaration will make it otherwise.

[Anonymous]

My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

I strongly believe that those kids from underrepresented schools who are able to prevail will likely be more successful in life. Is it worth to sacrifice some more qualified kids who lost their opportunities due to the admission process change? I am not sure. I wish TJ can share some honest data about those kids so we can have an objective evaluation on that. Overall I still believe that the solution should be on making advanced resources more available to all the middle schools. It’s a shame that the VA attorney general attacked the special tutoring program for URMs. The solution should be such programs for all middle schools and a fair merit based admission process. I don’t think the Asian families really mind this special programs for URM groups as long as a fair merit based admission process is in place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

I strongly believe that those kids from underrepresented schools who are able to prevail will likely be more successful in life. Is it worth to sacrifice some more qualified kids who lost their opportunities due to the admission process change? I am not sure. I wish TJ can share some honest data about those kids so we can have an objective evaluation on that. Overall I still believe that the solution should be on making advanced resources more available to all the middle schools. It’s a shame that the VA attorney general attacked the special tutoring program for URMs. The solution should be such programs for all middle schools and a fair merit based admission process. I don’t think the Asian families really mind this special programs for URM groups as long as a fair merit based admission process is in place.

India had affirmative action before America, and has many direct quotas for education in India, including by caste, religion, sex, language.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Langley and Chantilly now have an academically stronger student body than TJ. Sad.

If true, this only bothers the people that prized TJ for bragging rights vs the unique nature of what it offers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

So your child who is in 10th grade and never attended TJ before COVID or before the new system believes all the blah blah blah blah above. And you think that means anything?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

So your child who is in 10th grade and never attended TJ before COVID or before the new system believes all the blah blah blah blah above. And you think that means anything?

You’re a little chippy where the truth is concerned, eh? How dare anyone stand in the way of the propaganda machine!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

DC was in the class of 2022 and said it did happen even more in the old system. A lot of the kids who only got in because of prep and test buying weren't up for the rigor. They were average kids who were barely able to parrot back the answers they had memorized. At least now TJ gets the very best students from each school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

I strongly believe that those kids from underrepresented schools who are able to prevail will likely be more successful in life. Is it worth to sacrifice some more qualified kids who lost their opportunities due to the admission process change? I am not sure. I wish TJ can share some honest data about those kids so we can have an objective evaluation on that. Overall I still believe that the solution should be on making advanced resources more available to all the middle schools. It’s a shame that the VA attorney general attacked the special tutoring program for URMs. The solution should be such programs for all middle schools and a fair merit based admission process. I don’t think the Asian families really mind this special programs for URM groups as long as a fair merit based admission process is in place.

A lot of this centers on what is fair and merit-based. The old system was easily gamed. The new one is less able to identify top students because things like grade inflation make that difficult.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

DC was in the class of 2022 and said it did happen even more in the old system. A lot of the kids who only got in because of prep and test buying weren't up for the rigor. They were average kids who were barely able to parrot back the answers they had memorized. At least now TJ gets the very best students from each school.

No. It wouldn't surprise me if some kids who were not good were getting in before, but the very best students are not getting in now. Instead they accepted kids worse than the preppers accepted under the old system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Langley and Chantilly now have an academically stronger student body than TJ. Sad.

Totally laughable that someone would assert this - even more laughable if anyone believes it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

A lot of people severely underestimate the extent to which students struggled to stay afloat at TJ prior to the admissions changes. One of the big differences is that previously, the parents of these students had enough money to invest in huge amounts of remediation for their kids so that they could keep their heads above water, at the cost of any sort of extracurricular participation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

I strongly believe that those kids from underrepresented schools who are able to prevail will likely be more successful in life. Is it worth to sacrifice some more qualified kids who lost their opportunities due to the admission process change? I am not sure. I wish TJ can share some honest data about those kids so we can have an objective evaluation on that. Overall I still believe that the solution should be on making advanced resources more available to all the middle schools. It’s a shame that the VA attorney general attacked the special tutoring program for URMs. The solution should be such programs for all middle schools and a fair merit based admission process. I don’t think the Asian families really mind this special programs for URM groups as long as a fair merit based admission process is in place.

A lot of this centers on what is fair and merit-based. The old system was easily gamed. The new one is less able to identify top students because things like grade inflation make that difficult.

To me, this is why teacher recommendations are the answer. If you combine a really solid teacher rec system that is designed to compare students to one another with the 1.5% allocation and an actual holistic evaluation system (meaning scrapping the points system and, therefore, the "experience factors"), you'd get at both merit AND diversity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

DC was in the class of 2022 and said it did happen even more in the old system. A lot of the kids who only got in because of prep and test buying weren't up for the rigor. They were average kids who were barely able to parrot back the answers they had memorized. At least now TJ gets the very best students from each school.

No. It wouldn't surprise me if some kids who were not good were getting in before, but the very best students are not getting in now. Instead they accepted kids worse than the preppers accepted under the old system.

A lot of the very best kids didn't get in before either. Indeed, a lot of them didn't even apply to TJ because no one ever went from their middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is in class of 2025 (first under new system) Says there are definitely kids at TJ in their class who are struggling academically a great deal. Attributes some of that to not putting in the effort. Other classmates try and work hard but still are struggling. They are repeating math classes (like taking math 4 again in second semester because didn’t do well enough first semester to progress to math 5). I don’t think that happened much, if at all, for classes admitted under the old system. Child believes there are more than a handful of kids that would not have gotten in under the old system. It is one thing if the kids admitted under the new system at historically underrepresented schools can thrive and are thriving at TJ. But it is very concerning and problematic when there are a lot more kids now struggling and find TJ extremely challenging. Hate to say it. But they probably should not be at TJ.

DC was in the class of 2022 and said it did happen even more in the old system. A lot of the kids who only got in because of prep and test buying weren't up for the rigor. They were average kids who were barely able to parrot back the answers they had memorized. At least now TJ gets the very best students from each school.

No. It wouldn't surprise me if some kids who were not good were getting in before, but the very best students are not getting in now. Instead they accepted kids worse than the preppers accepted under the old system.

A lot of the very best kids didn't get in before either. Indeed, a lot of them didn't even apply to TJ because no one ever went from their middle school.

Do you have any data to support this view or just making it up?