How do you find God if you don't believe?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Postscript: I am a big fan of humility. I cannot prove my side, and you cannot prove your side.

If G-d wanted His existence to be provable, He could easily make it so, as in the Bible. Why doesn't He?

I have a number of theories on the topic, but mainly it boils down to me being a mortal humans who will never have all the answers in life.

As for how being religious makes you happy, if you read my piece about travel with family being an atonement for sin, it's a meaningful reframe of life that often comes along with a sense of community.

God proved his existence to us in so many ways. Some people just chose to ignore the evidence.

Where is this evidence?

I see evidence God exists in the world He created.

Do you have evidence I don’t see God in the world He created? If you do, well, that’s news to me. You could not be more wrong.

Oh, I don’t doubt you believe you see it

I also don’t doubt that you don’t see the presupposition of what you typed. That’s not how evidence works. What couldn’t be given credit for the origin of the universe with that logic? I see the evidence of the Loch Ness monster in the world, the Loch Ness monster created. See?

We’ve had this conversation how many times?

Evidence is not needed nor could any evidence prove or disprove God.

We don’t have tests, measurements, tools, or scientific knowledge to measure God.

You are asking repeatedly for evidence, and I give the same answer consistently correct answer, over and over again.

Sorry you can’t come to terms with reality.

You didn’t answer the question. And you never do. Wonder why that is?

Science doesn't have the processes to prove or disprove the existence of God. Science studies and attempts to explain only the natural world.

Scientists don't try to prove or disprove God's existence because they know there isn't an experiment that can ever detect God. And if you believe in God, it doesn't matter what scientists discover about the Universe.

Why would belief in God require that science give a specific answer to this question, that we don’t know the answer to, and probably will never know?

Science is an amazing, wonderful undertaking: it teaches us about life, the world and the universe. But it has not revealed to us why the universe came into existence nor what preceded its birth in the Big Bang. Biological evolution has not brought us the slightest understanding of how the first living organisms emerged from inanimate matter on this planet and how the advanced eukaryotic cells—the highly structured building blocks of advanced life forms—ever emerged from simpler organisms. Neither does it explain one of the greatest mysteries of science: how did consciousness arise in living things? Where do symbolic thinking and self-awareness come from? What is it that allows humans to understand the mysteries of biology, physics, mathematics, engineering and medicine? And what enables us to create great works of art, music, architecture and literature? Science is nowhere near to explaining these deep mysteries.

Science does Not yet know why the universe came into existence - but it's working on it. Pp is really into "God of the Gaps" stuff.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am asking this question after reading a previous post about people being depressed because they don't have religion in their lives. I am an atheist in my 40s, although I considered myself Christian until my early 20's. However with life and experience I find it impossible to believe in a 'God' and especially anything written in the Bible. It all seems totally unbelievable to me and I hate the way it has given people reasons to discriminate against LGBTQ communities.

I struggle on and off with depression and sometimes I wished I did have a faith to comfort me. It is very easy for people to say you should turn to Jesus etc, but to me it is like believing in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

OP, have you ever found anything in your life?

I went to a Catholic boarding school and was one of the few non catholic students (although baptized Christian). I was judged by some very uptight religious teachers and overheard them gossip about my 'unorthodox'family. I tried to make them like me more by attending all the optional evening prayer services and tried to talk to God but never felt heard. In my late teens and early 20's I struggled really badly with OCD and depression and pleaded to God to help me but I felt no comfort only suicidal. The only thing that helped me in the end was antidepressants and therapy. I stopped believing in God after this bout of depression and it all seems a lot of hateful made up nonsense to me now. But I do often think it would be nice to believe, some of my good friends do, I just can't seem to make that stretch. Whatever happens I know Catholic Church is not for me or any religion who thinks that being in a same sex relationship is a sin.

Sorry I have not been

Your family wasn’t Catholic, but your parents sent you away to Catholic boarding school? Why did they do that? Did you tell your parents you were unhappy at a boarding school that wasn’t the religion your family embraced?

What were your parents doing, making you miserable and isolated? Were they wanting to make you Catholic, even if they themselves weren’t?

I wanted to be a boarder as most of my friends were. I could have attended as a day student. My parents sent me there as I had learning differences and was counseled out of another secular private school. In those days if you had learning differences in public school you were put with all the troublemakers and not expected to achieve anything. The catholic school was the only private school in the area at the time that has learning specialists. I enjoyed some aspects of school as I loved my friends there. Not all the teachers were judgmental. I never told my parents I was unhappy about the religious aspect I kept it to myself.I even thought about converting to Catholicism. It is only as an adult I can see the impact it had on me.

So you chose this school.

Is “counseling out” mean you were kicked out, for a lack of better terminology? The secular private school made you leave?

So the Catholics took you in, provided you with actual learning opportunities, you loved your friends at the Catholic school, and you admit all the teachers weren’t judgemental…but you are still depressed because of it?

Op, we all have a right to feel our feelings, but you seem to be looking for reasons to focus on the negative, ignore the positive, and stay mired in the past?

How many years have you been graduated from high school? Did you attend college? Do you have a career/job?

Sorry I have not been clear. School was not the reason for my depression. It came about after struggling with OCD from my late teens onwards. Another pp asked if I had experience with God so I explained my background on Catholic school. ence with depression. I just wanted to give some context to my religious journey and struggle to believe.

ok, I am OCD also, and adhd. I had a terrible educational experience.

Do you think God made you OCD? Are you mad He won’t take your OCD away?

As I don't believe in God I don't think he made me OCD. I just realized in my worst suicidal days where I looked to him for comfort (when I did still believe) - there was none, it all felt very hollow and lonely. My OCD has improved as I've got older and had a lot of therapy, but it is still there in the background.

Or you can look at it different way: he was there for you when you had your worst suicidal days and that is why you are still here and typing this. He knew you are worthy and he gave you another chance to live and to find him.

Right, people who believe in God can always find excuses for "his" actions, or lack thereof.

Why do you always comment the same comments on people’s threads? Do you think you are helping op at all, talking about the Loch Ness monster?

I think it’s insensitive to do so: make your own thread!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am asking this question after reading a previous post about people being depressed because they don't have religion in their lives. I am an atheist in my 40s, although I considered myself Christian until my early 20's. However with life and experience I find it impossible to believe in a 'God' and especially anything written in the Bible. It all seems totally unbelievable to me and I hate the way it has given people reasons to discriminate against LGBTQ communities.

I struggle on and off with depression and sometimes I wished I did have a faith to comfort me. It is very easy for people to say you should turn to Jesus etc, but to me it is like believing in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

OP, have you ever found anything in your life?

I went to a Catholic boarding school and was one of the few non catholic students (although baptized Christian). I was judged by some very uptight religious teachers and overheard them gossip about my 'unorthodox'family. I tried to make them like me more by attending all the optional evening prayer services and tried to talk to God but never felt heard. In my late teens and early 20's I struggled really badly with OCD and depression and pleaded to God to help me but I felt no comfort only suicidal. The only thing that helped me in the end was antidepressants and therapy. I stopped believing in God after this bout of depression and it all seems a lot of hateful made up nonsense to me now. But I do often think it would be nice to believe, some of my good friends do, I just can't seem to make that stretch. Whatever happens I know Catholic Church is not for me or any religion who thinks that being in a same sex relationship is a sin.

Sorry I have not been

Your family wasn’t Catholic, but your parents sent you away to Catholic boarding school? Why did they do that? Did you tell your parents you were unhappy at a boarding school that wasn’t the religion your family embraced?

What were your parents doing, making you miserable and isolated? Were they wanting to make you Catholic, even if they themselves weren’t?

I wanted to be a boarder as most of my friends were. I could have attended as a day student. My parents sent me there as I had learning differences and was counseled out of another secular private school. In those days if you had learning differences in public school you were put with all the troublemakers and not expected to achieve anything. The catholic school was the only private school in the area at the time that has learning specialists. I enjoyed some aspects of school as I loved my friends there. Not all the teachers were judgmental. I never told my parents I was unhappy about the religious aspect I kept it to myself.I even thought about converting to Catholicism. It is only as an adult I can see the impact it had on me.

So you chose this school.

Is “counseling out” mean you were kicked out, for a lack of better terminology? The secular private school made you leave?

So the Catholics took you in, provided you with actual learning opportunities, you loved your friends at the Catholic school, and you admit all the teachers weren’t judgemental…but you are still depressed because of it?

Op, we all have a right to feel our feelings, but you seem to be looking for reasons to focus on the negative, ignore the positive, and stay mired in the past?

How many years have you been graduated from high school? Did you attend college? Do you have a career/job?

Sorry I have not been clear. School was not the reason for my depression. It came about after struggling with OCD from my late teens onwards. Another pp asked if I had experience with God so I explained my background on Catholic school. ence with depression. I just wanted to give some context to my religious journey and struggle to believe.

ok, I am OCD also, and adhd. I had a terrible educational experience.

Do you think God made you OCD? Are you mad He won’t take your OCD away?

As I don't believe in God I don't think he made me OCD. I just realized in my worst suicidal days where I looked to him for comfort (when I did still believe) - there was none, it all felt very hollow and lonely. My OCD has improved as I've got older and had a lot of therapy, but it is still there in the background.

Or you can look at it different way: he was there for you when you had your worst suicidal days and that is why you are still here and typing this. He knew you are worthy and he gave you another chance to live and to find him.

Right, people who believe in God can always find excuses for "his" actions, or lack thereof.

Why do you always comment the same comments on people’s threads? Do you think you are helping op at all, talking about the Loch Ness monster?

I think it’s insensitive to do so: make your own thread!

That’s a different poster. I asked the question which rhetorically mentioned the Loch Ness monster. Instead of complaining about it over and over, why not answer it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am asking this question after reading a previous post about people being depressed because they don't have religion in their lives. I am an atheist in my 40s, although I considered myself Christian until my early 20's. However with life and experience I find it impossible to believe in a 'God' and especially anything written in the Bible. It all seems totally unbelievable to me and I hate the way it has given people reasons to discriminate against LGBTQ communities.

I struggle on and off with depression and sometimes I wished I did have a faith to comfort me. It is very easy for people to say you should turn to Jesus etc, but to me it is like believing in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

OP, have you ever found anything in your life?

I went to a Catholic boarding school and was one of the few non catholic students (although baptized Christian). I was judged by some very uptight religious teachers and overheard them gossip about my 'unorthodox'family. I tried to make them like me more by attending all the optional evening prayer services and tried to talk to God but never felt heard. In my late teens and early 20's I struggled really badly with OCD and depression and pleaded to God to help me but I felt no comfort only suicidal. The only thing that helped me in the end was antidepressants and therapy. I stopped believing in God after this bout of depression and it all seems a lot of hateful made up nonsense to me now. But I do often think it would be nice to believe, some of my good friends do, I just can't seem to make that stretch. Whatever happens I know Catholic Church is not for me or any religion who thinks that being in a same sex relationship is a sin.

Sorry I have not been

Your family wasn’t Catholic, but your parents sent you away to Catholic boarding school? Why did they do that? Did you tell your parents you were unhappy at a boarding school that wasn’t the religion your family embraced?

What were your parents doing, making you miserable and isolated? Were they wanting to make you Catholic, even if they themselves weren’t?

I wanted to be a boarder as most of my friends were. I could have attended as a day student. My parents sent me there as I had learning differences and was counseled out of another secular private school. In those days if you had learning differences in public school you were put with all the troublemakers and not expected to achieve anything. The catholic school was the only private school in the area at the time that has learning specialists. I enjoyed some aspects of school as I loved my friends there. Not all the teachers were judgmental. I never told my parents I was unhappy about the religious aspect I kept it to myself.I even thought about converting to Catholicism. It is only as an adult I can see the impact it had on me.

So you chose this school.

Is “counseling out” mean you were kicked out, for a lack of better terminology? The secular private school made you leave?

So the Catholics took you in, provided you with actual learning opportunities, you loved your friends at the Catholic school, and you admit all the teachers weren’t judgemental…but you are still depressed because of it?

Op, we all have a right to feel our feelings, but you seem to be looking for reasons to focus on the negative, ignore the positive, and stay mired in the past?

How many years have you been graduated from high school? Did you attend college? Do you have a career/job?

Sorry I have not been clear. School was not the reason for my depression. It came about after struggling with OCD from my late teens onwards. Another pp asked if I had experience with God so I explained my background on Catholic school. ence with depression. I just wanted to give some context to my religious journey and struggle to believe.

ok, I am OCD also, and adhd. I had a terrible educational experience.

Do you think God made you OCD? Are you mad He won’t take your OCD away?

As I don't believe in God I don't think he made me OCD. I just realized in my worst suicidal days where I looked to him for comfort (when I did still believe) - there was none, it all felt very hollow and lonely. My OCD has improved as I've got older and had a lot of therapy, but it is still there in the background.

Or you can look at it different way: he was there for you when you had your worst suicidal days and that is why you are still here and typing this. He knew you are worthy and he gave you another chance to live and to find him.

Right, people who believe in God can always find excuses for "his" actions, or lack thereof.

Why do you always comment the same comments on people’s threads? Do you think you are helping op at all, talking about the Loch Ness monster?

I think it’s insensitive to do so: make your own thread!

That’s a different poster. I asked the question which rhetorically mentioned the Loch Ness monster. Instead of complaining about it over and over, why not answer it?

So two insensitive posters are threadjacking?

There is an answer; it’s the same answer that answers your repeated question, each time you threadjack. If you can’t understand that science can’t prove or disprove the existence of God, that sounds like you have a personal issue.

To believe in God demands an act of faith. But so does a decision not to believe in God. Neither position can be based on absolute certainty. Both rest on faith, because nobody can prove absolutely that God exists or that he does not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am asking this question after reading a previous post about people being depressed because they don't have religion in their lives. I am an atheist in my 40s, although I considered myself Christian until my early 20's. However with life and experience I find it impossible to believe in a 'God' and especially anything written in the Bible. It all seems totally unbelievable to me and I hate the way it has given people reasons to discriminate against LGBTQ communities.

I struggle on and off with depression and sometimes I wished I did have a faith to comfort me. It is very easy for people to say you should turn to Jesus etc, but to me it is like believing in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

OP, have you ever found anything in your life?

I went to a Catholic boarding school and was one of the few non catholic students (although baptized Christian). I was judged by some very uptight religious teachers and overheard them gossip about my 'unorthodox'family. I tried to make them like me more by attending all the optional evening prayer services and tried to talk to God but never felt heard. In my late teens and early 20's I struggled really badly with OCD and depression and pleaded to God to help me but I felt no comfort only suicidal. The only thing that helped me in the end was antidepressants and therapy. I stopped believing in God after this bout of depression and it all seems a lot of hateful made up nonsense to me now. But I do often think it would be nice to believe, some of my good friends do, I just can't seem to make that stretch. Whatever happens I know Catholic Church is not for me or any religion who thinks that being in a same sex relationship is a sin.

Sorry I have not been

Your family wasn’t Catholic, but your parents sent you away to Catholic boarding school? Why did they do that? Did you tell your parents you were unhappy at a boarding school that wasn’t the religion your family embraced?

What were your parents doing, making you miserable and isolated? Were they wanting to make you Catholic, even if they themselves weren’t?

I wanted to be a boarder as most of my friends were. I could have attended as a day student. My parents sent me there as I had learning differences and was counseled out of another secular private school. In those days if you had learning differences in public school you were put with all the troublemakers and not expected to achieve anything. The catholic school was the only private school in the area at the time that has learning specialists. I enjoyed some aspects of school as I loved my friends there. Not all the teachers were judgmental. I never told my parents I was unhappy about the religious aspect I kept it to myself.I even thought about converting to Catholicism. It is only as an adult I can see the impact it had on me.

So you chose this school.

Is “counseling out” mean you were kicked out, for a lack of better terminology? The secular private school made you leave?

So the Catholics took you in, provided you with actual learning opportunities, you loved your friends at the Catholic school, and you admit all the teachers weren’t judgemental…but you are still depressed because of it?

Op, we all have a right to feel our feelings, but you seem to be looking for reasons to focus on the negative, ignore the positive, and stay mired in the past?

How many years have you been graduated from high school? Did you attend college? Do you have a career/job?

Sorry I have not been clear. School was not the reason for my depression. It came about after struggling with OCD from my late teens onwards. Another pp asked if I had experience with God so I explained my background on Catholic school. ence with depression. I just wanted to give some context to my religious journey and struggle to believe.

ok, I am OCD also, and adhd. I had a terrible educational experience.

Do you think God made you OCD? Are you mad He won’t take your OCD away?

As I don't believe in God I don't think he made me OCD. I just realized in my worst suicidal days where I looked to him for comfort (when I did still believe) - there was none, it all felt very hollow and lonely. My OCD has improved as I've got older and had a lot of therapy, but it is still there in the background.

Or you can look at it different way: he was there for you when you had your worst suicidal days and that is why you are still here and typing this. He knew you are worthy and he gave you another chance to live and to find him.

Right, people who believe in God can always find excuses for "his" actions, or lack thereof.

Why do you always comment the same comments on people’s threads? Do you think you are helping op at all, talking about the Loch Ness monster?

I think it’s insensitive to do so: make your own thread!

That’s a different poster. I asked the question which rhetorically mentioned the Loch Ness monster. Instead of complaining about it over and over, why not answer it?

So two insensitive posters are threadjacking?

There is an answer; it’s the same answer that answers your repeated question, each time you threadjack. If you can’t understand that science can’t prove or disprove the existence of God, that sounds like you have a personal issue.

To believe in God demands an act of faith. But so does a decision not to believe in God. Neither position can be based on absolute certainty. Both rest on faith, because nobody can prove absolutely that God exists or that he does not.

That’s not an answer to the question. I did not say anything about science. All I asked was using the same logic you did, what couldn’t be given credit for the creation of the universe?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am asking this question after reading a previous post about people being depressed because they don't have religion in their lives. I am an atheist in my 40s, although I considered myself Christian until my early 20's. However with life and experience I find it impossible to believe in a 'God' and especially anything written in the Bible. It all seems totally unbelievable to me and I hate the way it has given people reasons to discriminate against LGBTQ communities.

I struggle on and off with depression and sometimes I wished I did have a faith to comfort me. It is very easy for people to say you should turn to Jesus etc, but to me it is like believing in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

OP, have you ever found anything in your life?

I went to a Catholic boarding school and was one of the few non catholic students (although baptized Christian). I was judged by some very uptight religious teachers and overheard them gossip about my 'unorthodox'family. I tried to make them like me more by attending all the optional evening prayer services and tried to talk to God but never felt heard. In my late teens and early 20's I struggled really badly with OCD and depression and pleaded to God to help me but I felt no comfort only suicidal. The only thing that helped me in the end was antidepressants and therapy. I stopped believing in God after this bout of depression and it all seems a lot of hateful made up nonsense to me now. But I do often think it would be nice to believe, some of my good friends do, I just can't seem to make that stretch. Whatever happens I know Catholic Church is not for me or any religion who thinks that being in a same sex relationship is a sin.

Sorry I have not been

Your family wasn’t Catholic, but your parents sent you away to Catholic boarding school? Why did they do that? Did you tell your parents you were unhappy at a boarding school that wasn’t the religion your family embraced?

What were your parents doing, making you miserable and isolated? Were they wanting to make you Catholic, even if they themselves weren’t?

I wanted to be a boarder as most of my friends were. I could have attended as a day student. My parents sent me there as I had learning differences and was counseled out of another secular private school. In those days if you had learning differences in public school you were put with all the troublemakers and not expected to achieve anything. The catholic school was the only private school in the area at the time that has learning specialists. I enjoyed some aspects of school as I loved my friends there. Not all the teachers were judgmental. I never told my parents I was unhappy about the religious aspect I kept it to myself.I even thought about converting to Catholicism. It is only as an adult I can see the impact it had on me.

So you chose this school.

Is “counseling out” mean you were kicked out, for a lack of better terminology? The secular private school made you leave?

So the Catholics took you in, provided you with actual learning opportunities, you loved your friends at the Catholic school, and you admit all the teachers weren’t judgemental…but you are still depressed because of it?

Op, we all have a right to feel our feelings, but you seem to be looking for reasons to focus on the negative, ignore the positive, and stay mired in the past?

How many years have you been graduated from high school? Did you attend college? Do you have a career/job?

Sorry I have not been clear. School was not the reason for my depression. It came about after struggling with OCD from my late teens onwards. Another pp asked if I had experience with God so I explained my background on Catholic school. ence with depression. I just wanted to give some context to my religious journey and struggle to believe.

ok, I am OCD also, and adhd. I had a terrible educational experience.

Do you think God made you OCD? Are you mad He won’t take your OCD away?

As I don't believe in God I don't think he made me OCD. I just realized in my worst suicidal days where I looked to him for comfort (when I did still believe) - there was none, it all felt very hollow and lonely. My OCD has improved as I've got older and had a lot of therapy, but it is still there in the background.

Or you can look at it different way: he was there for you when you had your worst suicidal days and that is why you are still here and typing this. He knew you are worthy and he gave you another chance to live and to find him.

Right, people who believe in God can always find excuses for "his" actions, or lack thereof.

Why do you always comment the same comments on people’s threads? Do you think you are helping op at all, talking about the Loch Ness monster?

I think it’s insensitive to do so: make your own thread!

That’s a different poster. I asked the question which rhetorically mentioned the Loch Ness monster. Instead of complaining about it over and over, why not answer it?

So two insensitive posters are threadjacking?

There is an answer; it’s the same answer that answers your repeated question, each time you threadjack. If you can’t understand that science can’t prove or disprove the existence of God, that sounds like you have a personal issue.

To believe in God demands an act of faith. But so does a decision not to believe in God. Neither position can be based on absolute certainty. Both rest on faith, because nobody can prove absolutely that God exists or that he does not.

That’s not an answer to the question. I did not say anything about science. All I asked was using the same logic you did, what couldn’t be given credit for the creation of the universe?

Make your own thread. You are blatantly, without care, taking over a thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am asking this question after reading a previous post about people being depressed because they don't have religion in their lives. I am an atheist in my 40s, although I considered myself Christian until my early 20's. However with life and experience I find it impossible to believe in a 'God' and especially anything written in the Bible. It all seems totally unbelievable to me and I hate the way it has given people reasons to discriminate against LGBTQ communities.

I struggle on and off with depression and sometimes I wished I did have a faith to comfort me. It is very easy for people to say you should turn to Jesus etc, but to me it is like believing in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

OP, have you ever found anything in your life?

I went to a Catholic boarding school and was one of the few non catholic students (although baptized Christian). I was judged by some very uptight religious teachers and overheard them gossip about my 'unorthodox'family. I tried to make them like me more by attending all the optional evening prayer services and tried to talk to God but never felt heard. In my late teens and early 20's I struggled really badly with OCD and depression and pleaded to God to help me but I felt no comfort only suicidal. The only thing that helped me in the end was antidepressants and therapy. I stopped believing in God after this bout of depression and it all seems a lot of hateful made up nonsense to me now. But I do often think it would be nice to believe, some of my good friends do, I just can't seem to make that stretch. Whatever happens I know Catholic Church is not for me or any religion who thinks that being in a same sex relationship is a sin.

Sorry I have not been

Your family wasn’t Catholic, but your parents sent you away to Catholic boarding school? Why did they do that? Did you tell your parents you were unhappy at a boarding school that wasn’t the religion your family embraced?

What were your parents doing, making you miserable and isolated? Were they wanting to make you Catholic, even if they themselves weren’t?

I wanted to be a boarder as most of my friends were. I could have attended as a day student. My parents sent me there as I had learning differences and was counseled out of another secular private school. In those days if you had learning differences in public school you were put with all the troublemakers and not expected to achieve anything. The catholic school was the only private school in the area at the time that has learning specialists. I enjoyed some aspects of school as I loved my friends there. Not all the teachers were judgmental. I never told my parents I was unhappy about the religious aspect I kept it to myself.I even thought about converting to Catholicism. It is only as an adult I can see the impact it had on me.

So you chose this school.

Is “counseling out” mean you were kicked out, for a lack of better terminology? The secular private school made you leave?

So the Catholics took you in, provided you with actual learning opportunities, you loved your friends at the Catholic school, and you admit all the teachers weren’t judgemental…but you are still depressed because of it?

Op, we all have a right to feel our feelings, but you seem to be looking for reasons to focus on the negative, ignore the positive, and stay mired in the past?

How many years have you been graduated from high school? Did you attend college? Do you have a career/job?

Sorry I have not been clear. School was not the reason for my depression. It came about after struggling with OCD from my late teens onwards. Another pp asked if I had experience with God so I explained my background on Catholic school. ence with depression. I just wanted to give some context to my religious journey and struggle to believe.

ok, I am OCD also, and adhd. I had a terrible educational experience.

Do you think God made you OCD? Are you mad He won’t take your OCD away?

As I don't believe in God I don't think he made me OCD. I just realized in my worst suicidal days where I looked to him for comfort (when I did still believe) - there was none, it all felt very hollow and lonely. My OCD has improved as I've got older and had a lot of therapy, but it is still there in the background.

Or you can look at it different way: he was there for you when you had your worst suicidal days and that is why you are still here and typing this. He knew you are worthy and he gave you another chance to live and to find him.

+1

You mom attempted suicide, and so did you. You both lived, and are both able to live beautiful lives. Lots and lots of people who have had two suicide attempts in their immediate family are not here to talk about it, because unfortunately, they were able to commit suicide.

Statistically, a parent and child both attempting suicide and both surviving is pretty amazing, That sounds weird, it’s not amazing op and his mom attempted suicide. It’s very sad and certainly very scary. But both of you lived and I assume have not suffered any long term physical health challenges from the physical aspects of attempting to end your own lives? Some people survive and are bedridden, have to use a wheelchair, lose their ability to communicate, etc.

You both survived with no physical problems- that’s actually very heartening.

I didn't attempt suicide. I said I felt suicidal.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Postscript: I am a big fan of humility. I cannot prove my side, and you cannot prove your side.

If G-d wanted His existence to be provable, He could easily make it so, as in the Bible. Why doesn't He?

I have a number of theories on the topic, but mainly it boils down to me being a mortal humans who will never have all the answers in life.

As for how being religious makes you happy, if you read my piece about travel with family being an atonement for sin, it's a meaningful reframe of life that often comes along with a sense of community.

God proved his existence to us in so many ways. Some people just chose to ignore the evidence.

Where is this evidence?

I see evidence God exists in the world He created.

Do you have evidence I don’t see God in the world He created? If you do, well, that’s news to me. You could not be more wrong.

Oh, I don’t doubt you believe you see it

I also don’t doubt that you don’t see the presupposition of what you typed. That’s not how evidence works. What couldn’t be given credit for the origin of the universe with that logic? I see the evidence of the Loch Ness monster in the world, the Loch Ness monster created. See?

We’ve had this conversation how many times?

Evidence is not needed nor could any evidence prove or disprove God.

We don’t have tests, measurements, tools, or scientific knowledge to measure God.

You are asking repeatedly for evidence, and I give the same answer consistently correct answer, over and over again.

Sorry you can’t come to terms with reality.

You didn’t answer the question. And you never do. Wonder why that is?

Science doesn't have the processes to prove or disprove the existence of God. Science studies and attempts to explain only the natural world.

Scientists don't try to prove or disprove God's existence because they know there isn't an experiment that can ever detect God. And if you believe in God, it doesn't matter what scientists discover about the Universe.

Why would belief in God require that science give a specific answer to this question, that we don’t know the answer to, and probably will never know?

Science is an amazing, wonderful undertaking: it teaches us about life, the world and the universe. But it has not revealed to us why the universe came into existence nor what preceded its birth in the Big Bang. Biological evolution has not brought us the slightest understanding of how the first living organisms emerged from inanimate matter on this planet and how the advanced eukaryotic cells—the highly structured building blocks of advanced life forms—ever emerged from simpler organisms. Neither does it explain one of the greatest mysteries of science: how did consciousness arise in living things? Where do symbolic thinking and self-awareness come from? What is it that allows humans to understand the mysteries of biology, physics, mathematics, engineering and medicine? And what enables us to crt sceate great works of art, music, architecture and literature? Science is nowhere near to explaining these deep mysteries.

Science does Not yet know why the universe came into existence - but it's working on it. Pp is really into "God of the Gaps" stuff.

Okay. Calm down, everyone. Science is working why on the universe exists, and also working the meaning of life for us. The answers should be ready sometime in the next millennia.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I am asking this question after reading a previous post about people being depressed because they don't have religion in their lives. I am an atheist in my 40s, although I considered myself Christian until my early 20's. However with life and experience I find it impossible to believe in a 'God' and especially anything written in the Bible. It all seems totally unbelievable to me and I hate the way it has given people reasons to discriminate against LGBTQ communities.

I struggle on and off with depression and sometimes I wished I did have a faith to comfort me. It is very easy for people to say you should turn to Jesus etc, but to me it is like believing in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

OP, have you ever found anything in your life?

I went to a Catholic boarding school and was one of the few non catholic students (although baptized Christian). I was judged by some very uptight religious teachers and overheard them gossip about my 'unorthodox'family. I tried to make them like me more by attending all the optional evening prayer services and tried to talk to God but never felt heard. In my late teens and early 20's I struggled really badly with OCD and depression and pleaded to God to help me but I felt no comfort only suicidal. The only thing that helped me in the end was antidepressants and therapy. I stopped believing in God after this bout of depression and it all seems a lot of hateful made up nonsense to me now. But I do often think it would be nice to believe, some of my good friends do, I just can't seem to make that stretch. Whatever happens I know Catholic Church is not for me or any religion who thinks that being in a same sex relationship is a sin.

Sorry I have not been

Your family wasn’t Catholic, but your parents sent you away to Catholic boarding school? Why did they do that? Did you tell your parents you were unhappy at a boarding school that wasn’t the religion your family embraced?

What were your parents doing, making you miserable and isolated? Were they wanting to make you Catholic, even if they themselves weren’t?

I wanted to be a boarder as most of my friends were. I could have attended as a day student. My parents sent me there as I had learning differences and was counseled out of another secular private school. In those days if you had learning differences in public school you were put with all the troublemakers and not expected to achieve anything. The catholic school was the only private school in the area at the time that has learning specialists. I enjoyed some aspects of school as I loved my friends there. Not all the teachers were judgmental. I never told my parents I was unhappy about the religious aspect I kept it to myself.I even thought about converting to Catholicism. It is only as an adult I can see the impact it had on me.

So you chose this school.

Is “counseling out” mean you were kicked out, for a lack of better terminology? The secular private school made you leave?

So the Catholics took you in, provided you with actual learning opportunities, you loved your friends at the Catholic school, and you admit all the teachers weren’t judgemental…but you are still depressed because of it?

Op, we all have a right to feel our feelings, but you seem to be looking for reasons to focus on the negative, ignore the positive, and stay mired in the past?

How many years have you been graduated from high school? Did you attend college? Do you have a career/job?

Sorry I have not been clear. School was not the reason for my depression. It came about after struggling with OCD from my late teens onwards. Another pp asked if I had experience with God so I explained my background on Catholic school. ence with depression. I just wanted to give some context to my religious journey and struggle to believe.

ok, I am OCD also, and adhd. I had a terrible educational experience.

Do you think God made you OCD? Are you mad He won’t take your OCD away?

As I don't believe in God I don't think he made me OCD. I just realized in my worst suicidal days where I looked to him for comfort (when I did still believe) - there was none, it all felt very hollow and lonely. My OCD has improved as I've got older and had a lot of therapy, but it is still there in the background.

Or you can look at it different way: he was there for you when you had your worst suicidal days and that is why you are still here and typing this. He knew you are worthy and he gave you another chance to live and to find him.

Right, people who believe in God can always find excuses for "his" actions, or lack thereof.

Why do you always comment the same comments on people’s threads? Do you think you are helping op at all, talking about the Loch Ness monster?

I think it’s insensitive to do so: make your own thread!

That’s a different poster. I asked the question which rhetorically mentioned the Loch Ness monster. Instead of complaining about it over and over, why not answer it?

So two insensitive posters are threadjacking?

There is an answer; it’s the same answer that answers your repeated question, each time you threadjack. If you can’t understand that science can’t prove or disprove the existence of God, that sounds like you have a personal issue.

To believe in God demands an act of faith. But so does a decision not to believe in God. Neither position can be based on absolute certainty. Both rest on faith, because nobody can prove absolutely that God exists or that he does not.

That’s not an answer to the question. I did not say anything about science. All I asked was using the same logic you did, what couldn’t be given credit for the creation of the universe?

Make your own thread. You are blatantly, without care, taking over a thread.

What are you talking about? This thread is literally about how a non believer might come to believe, and my posts were in response to someone who said “look at the evidence’. It could not be more on topic.

You are the one Gish galloping off track. Want it to stop? Then answer the question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Postscript: I am a big fan of humility. I cannot prove my side, and you cannot prove your side.

If G-d wanted His existence to be provable, He could easily make it so, as in the Bible. Why doesn't He?

I have a number of theories on the topic, but mainly it boils down to me being a mortal humans who will never have all the answers in life.

As for how being religious makes you happy, if you read my piece about travel with family being an atonement for sin, it's a meaningful reframe of life that often comes along with a sense of community.

God proved his existence to us in so many ways. Some people just chose to ignore the evidence.

Where is this evidence?

I see evidence God exists in the world He created.

Do you have evidence I don’t see God in the world He created? If you do, well, that’s news to me. You could not be more wrong.

Oh, I don’t doubt you believe you see it

I also don’t doubt that you don’t see the presupposition of what you typed. That’s not how evidence works. What couldn’t be given credit for the origin of the universe with that logic? I see the evidence of the Loch Ness monster in the world, the Loch Ness monster created. See?

No, I have not seen the evidence of Loch Ness monster, but I never researched it.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I am asking this question after reading a previous post about people being depressed because they don't have religion in their lives. I am an atheist in my 40s, although I considered myself Christian until my early 20's. However with life and experience I find it impossible to believe in a 'God' and especially anything written in the Bible. It all seems totally unbelievable to me and I hate the way it has given people reasons to discriminate against LGBTQ communities.

I struggle on and off with depression and sometimes I wished I did have a faith to comfort me. It is very easy for people to say you should turn to Jesus etc, but to me it is like believing in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

OP, have you ever found anything in your life?

I went to a Catholic boarding school and was one of the few non catholic students (although baptized Christian). I was judged by some very uptight religious teachers and overheard them gossip about my 'unorthodox'family. I tried to make them like me more by attending all the optional evening prayer services and tried to talk to God but never felt heard. In my late teens and early 20's I struggled really badly with OCD and depression and pleaded to God to help me but I felt no comfort only suicidal. The only thing that helped me in the end was antidepressants and therapy. I stopped believing in God after this bout of depression and it all seems a lot of hateful made up nonsense to me now. But I do often think it would be nice to believe, some of my good friends do, I just can't seem to make that stretch. Whatever happens I know Catholic Church is not for me or any religion who thinks that being in a same sex relationship is a sin.

Sorry I have not been

Your family wasn’t Catholic, but your parents sent you away to Catholic boarding school? Why did they do that? Did you tell your parents you were unhappy at a boarding school that wasn’t the religion your family embraced?

What were your parents doing, making you miserable and isolated? Were they wanting to make you Catholic, even if they themselves weren’t?

I wanted to be a boarder as most of my friends were. I could have attended as a day student. My parents sent me there as I had learning differences and was counseled out of another secular private school. In those days if you had learning differences in public school you were put with all the troublemakers and not expected to achieve anything. The catholic school was the only private school in the area at the time that has learning specialists. I enjoyed some aspects of school as I loved my friends there. Not all the teachers were judgmental. I never told my parents I was unhappy about the religious aspect I kept it to myself.I even thought about converting to Catholicism. It is only as an adult I can see the impact it had on me.

So you chose this school.

Is “counseling out” mean you were kicked out, for a lack of better terminology? The secular private school made you leave?

So the Catholics took you in, provided you with actual learning opportunities, you loved your friends at the Catholic school, and you admit all the teachers weren’t judgemental…but you are still depressed because of it?

Op, we all have a right to feel our feelings, but you seem to be looking for reasons to focus on the negative, ignore the positive, and stay mired in the past?

How many years have you been graduated from high school? Did you attend college? Do you have a career/job?

Sorry I have not been clear. School was not the reason for my depression. It came about after struggling with OCD from my late teens onwards. Another pp asked if I had experience with God so I explained my background on Catholic school. ence with depression. I just wanted to give some context to my religious journey and struggle to believe.

ok, I am OCD also, and adhd. I had a terrible educational experience.

Do you think God made you OCD? Are you mad He won’t take your OCD away?

As I don't believe in God I don't think he made me OCD. I just realized in my worst suicidal days where I looked to him for comfort (when I did still believe) - there was none, it all felt very hollow and lonely. My OCD has improved as I've got older and had a lot of therapy, but it is still there in the background.

Or you can look at it different way: he was there for you when you had your worst suicidal days and that is why you are still here and typing this. He knew you are worthy and he gave you another chance to live and to find him.

+1

You mom attempted suicide, and so did you. You both lived, and are both able to live beautiful lives. Lots and lots of people who have had two suicide attempts in their immediate family are not here to talk about it, because unfortunately, they were able to commit suicide.

Statistically, a parent and child both attempting suicide and both surviving is pretty amazing, That sounds weird, it’s not amazing op and his mom attempted suicide. It’s very sad and certainly very scary. But both of you lived and I assume have not suffered any long term physical health challenges from the physical aspects of attempting to end your own lives? Some people survive and are bedridden, have to use a wheelchair, lose their ability to communicate, etc.

You both survived with no physical problems- that’s actually very heartening.

I didn't attempt suicide. I said I felt suicidal.

God aside, can you see the beauty of this life? I know we all have some difficult and traumatic experiences, but I cannot stop waking up every day and be amused by the beauty around me. Can you take some time every morning to observe how perfectly God created this world, to admire it and to appreciate it? Some people call it meditation, I call it prayer. It does require time and effort and discipline, but there is a reward for doing this.

[Anonymous]

How do you believe an unproven "theory" life came into being from 2 rocks banging in space. Can you rub 2 rocks together and even make an amoeba? Start there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How do you believe an unproven "theory" life came into being from 2 rocks banging in space. Can you rub 2 rocks together and even make an amoeba? Start there.

And you wonder how they came up with the expression "dumb as a fundamentalist Baptist."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How do you believe an unproven "theory" life came into being from 2 rocks banging in space. Can you rub 2 rocks together and even make an amoeba? Start there.

Gee I don't know. I guess God must have done it. (And even the religious people on here always say nobody takes the Bible literally)

[Anonymous]

I haven't read this whole thread, but OP, if you are still here, I would recommend watching some videos by Bishop Robert Barron. He has a lot of short clips that address some of the fundamental arguments (from logic and science) for the existence of God and he has a very approachable way of explaining these concepts. As a convert to Catholicism myself, I find that most people who don't believe in God actually don't believe some false God they made up in their mind. The absolute first question to answer is what we mean by God. The why we believe and what we owe to God questions are somewhat naturally answered once we understand who God is (and what He is not). So my advice is to focus on that fundamental question.

My other advice is to keep an open mind. God cannot come into your heart if you keep is sealed. You have to at least entertain the possibility that God exists, otherwise, don't bother down this path. But I think you are already there because you sense a dissatisfaction with the way things are. My own spiritual journey started from that same feeling, and that was enough of an opening to let God in, despite my atheist upbringing. As I started to read more theistic readings (I didn't start with Christianity but more general theism), i had all this skepticism (I am a lawyer by trade so the skepticism was endless). But I remember the moment vividly when I just suspended my skepticism and pretended that God did exist (literally just a moment "let me pretend there is a God"). Everything suddenly sense and all the pieces of my worldview that clashed or seem disjointed all came together once I looked at them through the theistic lens. Not saying that it will happen for you like this, but just that everyone will have their own unique/personal ah ha moments and to be open to them.