What really IS the point of AAP?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

NP. But if "good students" are thriving in AAP, then doesn't that mean that it should be offered?

Or maybe someone could fix the systematic issues in Gen Ed classes like the constant disruptions, the dumbing down of material or the entire class not being taught at grade level (since some students can't keep up). Maybe there should be a class below Gen Ed? Or when I was in school there was Gifted, Honors and then Gen Ed. Kids who were way below grade level or failing were held back.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

No offense, but why should we care about gifted students and not care about good students? The majority of AAP is not gifted unless by a sheer miracle FCPS is blessed with an obscene percentage of gifted students

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

No offense, but why should we care about gifted students and not care about good students? The majority of AAP is not gifted unless by a sheer miracle FCPS is blessed with an obscene percentage of gifted students

...because that's why the program was started

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

NP. But if "good students" are thriving in AAP, then doesn't that mean that it should be offered?

Or maybe someone could fix the systematic issues in Gen Ed classes like the constant disruptions, the dumbing down of material or the entire class not being taught at grade level (since some students can't keep up). Maybe there should be a class below Gen Ed? Or when I was in school there was Gifted, Honors and then Gen Ed. Kids who were way below grade level or failing were held back.

In 3rd grade? It's not that I disbelieve you, but I think that's nuts. And wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

No offense, but why should we care about gifted students and not care about good students? The majority of AAP is not gifted unless by a sheer miracle FCPS is blessed with an obscene percentage of gifted students

Conversely why should we care about good students and neglect the mediocre ones?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

No offense, but why should we care about gifted students and not care about good students? The majority of AAP is not gifted unless by a sheer miracle FCPS is blessed with an obscene percentage of gifted students

Conversely why should we care about good students and neglect the mediocre ones?

DP

Because schools aren't allowed to separate out ESOL and developmentally delayed students. It makes more sense to let the advanced kids separate but some students have to stay so FCPS doesn't get sued. That's it in a nutshell.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no point period.

I did gifted and talented 30 years ago in elementary school and there is absolutely no point.

There is no point to accelerate math, there is no point to attend afterschool training classes, there is no point for TJ either.

Accelerating math does more harm than good in many cases. Most folks aren't actually learning the material properly, additionally 1 class of Calculus in high school is plenty. Skipping more than one math sequence in college is universally panned.

The workplace does not care about AAP or TJ.

Success in life is based on who you know and your work ethic. Raw intelligence can make things easier and faster sometimes but that's about it.

It comes down to who you know basically and for kids with parents who do not know anybody who can help with connections etc., TJ does make a great dal of difference due to virtually all classmates/friends going on to become scientists, engineers, doctors, lawyers and professors etc. Most Asians would fall into this category of lacking social capital.

That's not true about Asians anymore. They are the wealthiest and highest paid professionals. You many not know this because you don't have any wealthy Asian friends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

NP. But if "good students" are thriving in AAP, then doesn't that mean that it should be offered?

Or maybe someone could fix the systematic issues in Gen Ed classes like the constant disruptions, the dumbing down of material or the entire class not being taught at grade level (since some students can't keep up). Maybe there should be a class below Gen Ed? Or when I was in school there was Gifted, Honors and then Gen Ed. Kids who were way below grade level or failing were held back.

I remember the parents of many B students demanding their children be allowed to take AP Lit. The school complied but the course had to be watered down since those same parents complained when their children were getting C's and D's.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

I don't think it's transparent and I have three kids in the program. I think it should be expanded. FCPS cuts at the 99th percentile for AAP. MD cuts at 97th percentile. Unnecessary forced scarcity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

I have kids in both. It would not lower the bar! The AAP stuff was presented in a more creative way and a little more in depth. All but the weakest students could handle AAP and the weakest students are the ones who actually need the help, not the brightest.

The major difference is math, which would be addressed in base schools. AAP is good, but there is no reason why 90% of it could not be taught to all but. Few Gen Ed students. It’s just not that special. I live in a high performing school district in another state and their classrooms had many of the same textbooks and approaches that my older kid had in AAP, aside from math enrichment. Having that experience really makes me think. My younger kid got ripped off in FCPS. The Gen Ed kids get really screwed in all of this.

I disagree. Thanks to COVID the learning gaps have grown considerably.

Also, all kids need help in school. Granted, the level of help varies with the child's capabilities, but saying that only the "weakest" students need help is stupid.

So literal. I meant the extra help. Good heavens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

NP. But if "good students" are thriving in AAP, then doesn't that mean that it should be offered?

Or maybe someone could fix the systematic issues in Gen Ed classes like the constant disruptions, the dumbing down of material or the entire class not being taught at grade level (since some students can't keep up). Maybe there should be a class below Gen Ed? Or when I was in school there was Gifted, Honors and then Gen Ed. Kids who were way below grade level or failing were held back.

I remember the parents of many B students demanding their children be allowed to take AP Lit. The school complied but the course had to be watered down since those same parents complained when their children were getting C's and D's.

The test to get into AAP is a half-assed IQ test. That has little relation to how good a kids grades are or how good a student they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

IMO your son SHOULD be in AAP. This doesn't mean we should eliminate AAP. What has happened is the political school board and administrators have decided to socially engineer the program so that kids who have less intelligence but are teachers' pets, or meet other "equity" based characteristics will get into the program. This doesn't mean a lot of kids don't need and thrive in AAP. It just means it is watered down and has become a social engineering tool to some extent. If you want to change it, vote out the wokies on the school board

There are tons of kids who would thrive in it who for whatever reason don't have good cogat scores. My kid got in for sixth thanks to near perfect SOLs and deserves to be in. They'll get one year. I'm in favor of tracking and expanding the availability of the AAP curriculum past kids who get decent scores on cogats (which have very little to do with how good a student the kid is)

No offense, but the idea that all AAP requires is a "good student" is precisely why it has become a watered down and ineffective program. There are plenty of gifted kids that are not "good students" because they have already been bored to tears for two years. The original development of AAP was supposed to focus on gifted kids, not "good students." Of course, it now cannot do that because it is full of merely "good students."

NP. But if "good students" are thriving in AAP, then doesn't that mean that it should be offered?

Or maybe someone could fix the systematic issues in Gen Ed classes like the constant disruptions, the dumbing down of material or the entire class not being taught at grade level (since some students can't keep up). Maybe there should be a class below Gen Ed? Or when I was in school there was Gifted, Honors and then Gen Ed. Kids who were way below grade level or failing were held back.

I remember the parents of many B students demanding their children be allowed to take AP Lit. The school complied but the course had to be watered down since those same parents complained when their children were getting C's and D's.

The test to get into AAP is a half-assed IQ test. That has little relation to how good a kids grades are or how good a student they are.

There's a reasonably good correlation between the Cogat and school success. Provided there's no prepping. Better correlation than between a full IQ test and school success.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Science nerd mom here. Tax bracket is over 250k.

Yes my kids play sports. Healthy bodies are important to us.

Yes my kids are in AAP. Healthy minds are important to us.

AAP is the only reason why we are in FCPS or living in Fairfax county. We would otherwise live in CA.

AAP exists in part to keep the tax bracket average here high. Without it, a good portion of Fairfax county would just move. It’s very expensive to live here, and honestly without kids we could live in a more affordable area. The tracking works for us.

Creating this kind of competitive educational system also does one more thing: instead of teaching 1-4 different levels of kids in one class at a school, it’s down to about 1-2 for gen Ed and and AAP. It is a little easier for teachers. And I think helpful is raising kids up without lowering kids down.

Do I think it’s fair? The reality is that it is done in other counties/states but not so blatantly and not so much on such a large scale. The other reality is that a lot of parents assume their kids will get in and get mad when their kids don’t get in. So the OPs question gets posted much more often because people become aware of the difference. This is leads to my next observation:

I have one kid who is extremely intelligent (in aap) and another who is not as gifted in math (not in aap). But both do well because they know there is another group of kids who are in the smart class. The awareness that intelligence is awarded is important to them at this age and having local level IV is good.

In that aspect, it’s nice to have AAP. I think if there was a longitudinal study to see the effects of having this separation on overall graduation levels and advanced education in fcps that would most likely be the reason to keep aap vs eliminate it. But my observation is that it is good for our kids overall- even if they don’t get into aap.

But it IS lowering kids down. AAP kids frequently act entitled and like they are better than he general Ed kids and are frequently treated that way, too. Our school has a “fusion lab” with really cool stem stuff. My AAP kid is in there frequently and says it’s super fun, but my non-AAP kid has never been in there. The AAP class this year got an extra field trip that the gen ed kids didn’t get. How do you think that makes the gen ed kids feel? Like they’re not good enough.

Oh well. Life's not fair. Those AAP kids will also be getting higher salaries and live in nicer neighborhoods. Or do you think all of society should convert to socialism?

Hahahahaa, this is absolutely not the case. I know two former AAP/TJ kids - both are government employees. One lives in Burke, the other lives in Reston.

Wow, you know a whole two students? Have you contacted the american sociological association to publish your study? I was talking ON AVERAGE, genius. Clearly somebody never went to AAP lol

lol, AAP is a fairfax county thing, didn't exist where I grew up. My point is that AAP and even TJ do not have the long-lasting impact that you seem to think it does. Also, outside of this small community, nobody cares what high school you or your kid went to. Do you think tech bros out west are asking Brendan and Ella what high school they went to when they're interviewing for jobs? Nope nope nope.

- Ivy league undergrad, turned down an ivy league grad school for a better more rigorous curriculum, worked in tech for 20 years, now retired at 45. Tell me your quals, sweetie pie.

I don't think AAP has any effect at all. I just think the kids in AAP are intellectually superior to those that are not. Fellow ivy leaguer here, but only for my PhD

I would not say they are "intellectually superior," necessarily. I think they are likely above average kids who have spent the time or their parents pushed them in through an appeal, etc. Not that it's a bad thing, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think every AAP kid is "intellectually superior."

The part that is unfair is that through exposure to that peer group, those kids advance more than a kid with equal IQ who doesn't get accepted and is stuck with the Gen Ed program. Instead of having 20% of the FCPS kids own AAP, they should improve the Gen Ed program, give the under achievers the help they need, and have a very small AAP program for the 3-5% that are actually gifted.

The way the program was initially designed, it was supposed to include intellectually gifted students and other students who could keep up and fill out the classes to give the gifted students a large cohort. The program has expanded somewhat over time. But that's how it started and that's how it is now, too.

.

It is just unnecessary to have 20% of the kids (50% in some schools) in a special program. Other kids could keep up, too. Just raise the bar for everyone and get rid of it. It’s so divisive but it makes the parents feel special.

Getting rid of AAP would lower the bar for everyone, not raise it.

I’m a parent of a kid in AAP. I don’t feel “special” that my kid is in AAP. I’m appreciative that she’s in an environment that challenges her and feeds her curiosity for learning.

My son also has a curiosity for learning, but his 131 COGAT wasn’t good enough for AAP. He’s clearly bright and would succeed in the AAP environment. Why does your daughter deserve it over my son? The admission process isn’t transparent or necessarily fair. Only those who manage to get in think it is.

I don't think it's transparent and I have three kids in the program. I think it should be expanded. FCPS cuts at the 99th percentile for AAP. MD cuts at 97th percentile. Unnecessary forced scarcity.

FCPS does not cut at the 99th percentile. There are tons of kids in AAP with CogAT scores in the 120-130 range. There are even kids in the 110-120 range. GBRS is by far the most important factor for AAP admission.