how to tell 10 yo they have to change schools

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:How much studying does a 10 yo need to do? Go over her spelling words?

Maybe piano isn’t a good fit. Does she even want to play the piano of is this something you force her to do?

She has tests every other week or so, so yes, there's a lot of studying. Claims she doesn't need to study because she knows all the material, but I don't think so. She asked to learn the piano, but she refuses to practice, and so I routinely get really embarrassing emails from her teacher about her lack of progression.

I really feel bad for DD. You are the problem OP

Because I don't like being accused of letting my child slack off when I spend every evening reminding, asking, begging, bribing, cajoling, and threating, only to be ignored? Sure, ok. I'm the problem.

Who is accusing you? And why are you so thin-skinned that you can't stand up to an "accusation" like this?

Not OP, and there have been some really nasty (mostly deleted) comments on this thread. If OP caught any of them I can't blame her for feeling upset.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much studying does a 10 yo need to do? Go over her spelling words?

Maybe piano isn’t a good fit. Does she even want to play the piano of is this something you force her to do?

She has tests every other week or so, so yes, there's a lot of studying. Claims she doesn't need to study because she knows all the material, but I don't think so. She asked to learn the piano, but she refuses to practice, and so I routinely get really embarrassing emails from her teacher about her lack of progression.

I really feel bad for DD. You are the problem OP

Because I don't like being accused of letting my child slack off when I spend every evening reminding, asking, begging, bribing, cajoling, and threating, only to be ignored? Sure, ok. I'm the problem.

Who is accusing you? And why are you so thin-skinned that you can't stand up to an "accusation" like this?

Not OP, and there have been some really nasty (mostly deleted) comments on this thread. If OP caught any of them I can't blame her for feeling upset.

I think OP was referring to getting emails from the piano teacher. It puzzles me why a grown person is embarrassed by receiving an email from a piano teacher saying that their child isn't progressing in piano. What exactly is "embarrassing" about this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much studying does a 10 yo need to do? Go over her spelling words?

Maybe piano isn’t a good fit. Does she even want to play the piano of is this something you force her to do?

She has tests every other week or so, so yes, there's a lot of studying. Claims she doesn't need to study because she knows all the material, but I don't think so. She asked to learn the piano, but she refuses to practice, and so I routinely get really embarrassing emails from her teacher about her lack of progression.

I really feel bad for DD. You are the problem OP

Because I don't like being accused of letting my child slack off when I spend every evening reminding, asking, begging, bribing, cajoling, and threating, only to be ignored? Sure, ok. I'm the problem.

Who is accusing you? And why are you so thin-skinned that you can't stand up to an "accusation" like this?

Not OP, and there have been some really nasty (mostly deleted) comments on this thread. If OP caught any of them I can't blame her for feeling upset.

I think OP was referring to getting emails from the piano teacher. It puzzles me why a grown person is embarrassed by receiving an email from a piano teacher saying that their child isn't progressing in piano. What exactly is "embarrassing" about this?

Since OP didn't quote the piano teacher's email, we don't know. Could be the teacher was rude to OP about it, or blamed OP personally. Could be the teacher was very kind and OP took it the wrong way. We have no idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot of posters are out of line blaming OP. This is a clear SN case. I would guess combination ASD and ADHD which is just pure hell. OP's child's brain does not work right and there are no magic parenting methods that turn children like this into normal functioning kids that you can be proud of rather than constantly embarrassed by. OP, your kid needs medication. It's a game changer and you will go from wishing you had an abortion to actually loving spending time with her, at least until the dosage wears off.

Mom's rigidity, hypersensitivity to criticism, difficulty in projecting how others think (e.g. that the public school folks would know that her daughter had to leave her previous school) suggests to me that she has her own special needs in play. This is going to be a difficult mix.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

And I guess the other question is, how do we help her in a future where she won't any friends? I would never let my child be friends with someone who was kicked out of school, so I am sure the parents in her new public will feel the same.

Wow. I was going to try to post something sympathetic and supportive, but then I read this …

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

And I guess the other question is, how do we help her in a future where she won't any friends? I would never let my child be friends with someone who was kicked out of school, so I am sure the parents in her new public will feel the same.

How would other parents know she'd been kicked out? Also, how does this experience not teach you that some kids who need to leave a school are good kids who deserve friends?

Have you tried medicating for the anxiety? If it's severe enough to be leading to a school placement, then medication and therapy are probably warranted.

No, two different psychiatrists said meds weren't warranted and refused to prescribe.

They would know she was kicked out because 5th grade (next year) isn't an entrance/outplacement year.

public schools don’t have “entrance years.” nobody is going to care where you kid came from.

also you need to consult with a behavioral psychologist who specializes in parenting.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:DD10 has very low frustration tolerance. We've had several assessments, but nothing has turned up beyond "mild anxiety" for which she has been in unsuccessful therapy. Unfortunately, her private school is no longer willing to handle her outbursts and has suggested she go public next year.

She will be devastated. And obviously, she'll blame herself. What can we do to make this transition better for her?

Well, she has herself to blame. My suggestion is work with that. Behavior has consequences. This is a teaching moment.

What other consequences? She's basically been grounded all year (no friends over). She has zero devices left. I haven't decided if losing the last was permanent. I'm honestly at a loss of what else there is.

Do you realize how stupid and outlandish and rigid you sound? What you're essentially saying is, "We've been doing the exact same things over and over again for years and they aren't working. How do we continue doing the exact same thing?" Your parenting is a serious problem. It's not working. Whatever you did for your other kids, this one is different. It is literally unbelievable to me that you cannot see this and think you should just do more of the same punishing that already hasn't been working for years. You need a completely different approach and viewpoint and probably family therapy. Not "what else can we take away?" A totally different paradigm. Because this one isn't working for this child.

Obviously I can't reward a child like this, and the early posters realized that.

yes you can “reward” her. because she’s a child, your child in fact, and she deserves to be loved by her parents regardless of what happens at school. you give her (appropriate) consequences but you don’t withhold love.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

And I guess the other question is, how do we help her in a future where she won't any friends? I would never let my child be friends with someone who was kicked out of school, so I am sure the parents in her new public will feel the same.

Troll.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Your child is 10. If her behavior is so bad that it’s getting her kicked out of school, she either:

1.) has some undiagnosed issue
2.) she has never been disciplined in her life.

Have you done a neuropsych?

Yes. Twice. Like I said, both showed nothing other than mild anxiety.

She is constantly disciplined for not abiding by our rules, so often that it's exhausting and I wish I had never had kids.

If this is the case, then you sit her down and calmly and matter of factly tell her that she will be moving schools next year, and exactly the reasons why. She needs to learn that her actions have consequences.

You might also consider putting her on a low does of Lexapro. I wouldn’t be surprised if the “mild anxiety” is more than that.

Wouldn't the neuropsych evals have picked up anything else?

That’s because she doesn’t have anything else. There are discipline issues that the parents didn’t do correctly at a younger age and now child is a world class brat.

Like I said, she's grounded more often than not and has been since K. We do discipline, every single day.

May I gently suggest, as someone who has the same tendency, that if you're disciplining that much you aren't doing so effectively? The usual problem is not consistently enforcing the rules, so your kids never know when they will get away with stuff. Maybe having fewer rules that are more of a big deal to you might help. That way you always discipline for those infractions, but your kid has some freedom within those boundaries.

This. I have a child who has some outbursts at home, but never at school. I stopped saying "no" all the time. I didn't realize how much I said no or don't do that. Unless it was something dangerous, I would try and reframe how I said it. "I want ice cream!" Instead of saying no or not today, I would say something like, "such a great idea, but why don't we go this weekend since we have x activity in 15 minutes. Would you like to go to Mitsys or Thomas Sweet for ice cream on Saturday?" Gives them more autonomy and gives them the answer, but not right then. Teaches them patience and explains why you can't have that thing right now.

Have you talked to her instead of punishing her? Some doctors think punishments are not good for kids. I find that having a star chart where my child earns certain things has helped him. Some doctors don't like star charts either, but that is what has helped my kid. We started with daily start charts now have weekly and long term star charts. Makes them learn about how you have to work for really big things.

Have you attended any of Dr. Becky's workshops? I found them helpful. Some of the things worked for my kid and some things didn't. I also realized my child needed more sleep. Goes to bed 7:30-8PM every night and wakes up around 7am.

Also, let kids be kids. I was annoyed when my child wouldn't study or do their homework right away. Let them play! Does she have playdates? Ride her bike? Just be a kid? Why does she always have to practice piano? Maybe tell her she needs to practice 3 days a week for at least 30 minutes or 90 minutes per week and she gets to pick the time/ how long. That gives her autonomy but doesn't make her do it every single day if she doesn't want to. Same thing with studying and homework.

You need to stop punishing her. Talk to her. Ask her what she thinks are appropriate responses for not doing things and give her more autonomy. Would you like to do your math homework or practice piano? Would you like to do writing homework now or would you like to ride your bike for 25 minutes first and then do your writing homework? Also, if she doesn't like piano tell her she can quit, but needs to pick another activity- music or athletic. Tell her once she picks it she needs to see it through for that session/ season as it costs $ and you made a commitment to your team/ teacher.

Also, get rid of the screens! We only now allow screens on the weekend and are strict about it and our child has been SO much better. We used to have meltdowns after the screens were turned off. Now he needs to earn the screen time and it is limited to 30 minutes at a time. He turns it off on his OWN now.

Maybe this is a blessing OP. Maybe your child will thrive at public school. Look at the positive. But honestly cut all the punishments, cut the screens, and give your kid more autonomy over stuff.

PP you quoted, and I agree with so much of what you said, but staunchly disagree with the bolded. Star charts were great for my sensitive kid (don't need them now that she's a tween, but they were a godsend when she was in preschool and primary school), but teaching kids work before play is invaluable.

But the focusing on some positives, talking through things in a bright way, and getting rid of screens are all huge. That doesn't just mean removing devices - just make no or low TV a habit. We have family movie night and kids can do school assigned screen time, and that's about it. My kids went insane (youngest still does) when it was time to end the TV show or movie, so it wasn't worth it to do TV except in small doses.

Though given that OP has tried to get her kid to do homework first, and it didn't just take 3 weeks of fits and now it's done, maybe what you suggested would actually work, or PPs are right that there's something non-neurotypical going on.

I'd also suggest that for anxious kids autonomy can be the worst. Giving my sensitive child choices made her freak out even more.

Some punishments are probably still worth it - framed as logical consequences of behavior where at all possible - for really non-negotiables like hurting other people. But yes, cut screens, give rewards.

Some days my kid comes home straight after school. It isn't fair for him to do his homework after spending 7 hours sitting and doing work most of the day. That is when I used to get pushback. Let them play! Look at the success of Finland's school system. Homework isn't give out like how it is given out here either.

Some days my kid plays on the playground after school and then comes home and does work. Other days if he comes straight home, I let him play for a bit and then do his work. That works for HIM. Something else might work for another kid.

I say this as someone who always did my work first. Never had an issue at school at all. I got burned out and it didn't work for me in the long run actually.

I don't give my kid total autonomy, I give them 2 or 3 choices. After living overseas and having one or two choices for things and coming back to America to our gigantic grocery stores was an issue for me. I literally would turn around and leave.

I didn't say no consequences. Punishments when a kid is struggling and acts out won't help the child in the long run. If they are doing something dangerous and hurting someone of course they need a consequence. But a consequence without discussing it (no yelling or tones) won't make the child want to come to you and talk about it.

After I changed my approach, my son and his close friends tell me more things because they feel comfortable telling me. One kid told me his mom would yell at him and take away his toys. This kid said "poop" (not the s word) at school and got a talking to from the teacher, but was afraid to tell his parents. I never want my child to be afraid to come to me because of how I react.

To the OP check out Deeply Feeling Child with Dr. Becky or the Explosive Child.

I agree with you on the homework. Plus I have to supervise homework at the moment, so I can’t effectively require that it be done after school. It’s more important to set up routines and expectations, less important that it follow any rigid structure. At the end of the day you also want your kid to self-initiate and plan on their own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD10 has very low frustration tolerance. We've had several assessments, but nothing has turned up beyond "mild anxiety" for which she has been in unsuccessful therapy. Unfortunately, her private school is no longer willing to handle her outbursts and has suggested she go public next year.

She will be devastated. And obviously, she'll blame herself. What can we do to make this transition better for her?

Have you done a neuropsych with someone adept at diagnosing ASD *in girls*?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot of posters are out of line blaming OP. This is a clear SN case. I would guess combination ASD and ADHD which is just pure hell. OP's child's brain does not work right and there are no magic parenting methods that turn children like this into normal functioning kids that you can be proud of rather than constantly embarrassed by. OP, your kid needs medication. It's a game changer and you will go from wishing you had an abortion to actually loving spending time with her, at least until the dosage wears off.

I cannot believe the number of people in this thread who actively despise their children.

"does not work right"

"children like this"

"loving spending with with her... until the dosage wears off."

No wonder your kids act out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

And I guess the other question is, how do we help her in a future where she won't any friends? I would never let my child be friends with someone who was kicked out of school, so I am sure the parents in her new public will feel the same.

At this point there is no reason to tell her that she is being kicked out. Tell her that you have decided that the school is not the best match for her and that you believe that public will be a better fit for her.

[Anonymous]

Please get your daughter in therapy. Not to achieve any of your own goals for her but because she is CRYING out for help in every way possible. You don’t need a diagnosis or Rx for therapy you just have to need professional help. I have a child who was counseled out of private and I truly believe she wanted to do better and live up to their strict expectations but she was not capable of doing it, the same way some people can run a 3 hour marathon but I literally cannot do that regardless of what you take away from me or bribe me to try.

You also need to revisit your evaluations and psychiatrists. If the school was telling you no problems that’s what they but on the input to the evaluation and that obviously was not true. Getting removed from a school at 10 is significant, even from a private.

Please also look into parent training for neurodivergent children. We did parent management training through Alvlord Baker and it was amazing for us and our daughter. What you are doing is not working. Please don’t take away her books. Please, just don’t. There are other ways to parent.

My daughter after 4 years at public and a lot of therapy and a change in parenting approach is thriving. She has friends and is doing well in school. Don’t give up on your child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Please get your daughter in therapy. Not to achieve any of your own goals for her but because she is CRYING out for help in every way possible. You don’t need a diagnosis or Rx for therapy you just have to need professional help. I have a child who was counseled out of private and I truly believe she wanted to do better and live up to their strict expectations but she was not capable of doing it, the same way some people can run a 3 hour marathon but I literally cannot do that regardless of what you take away from me or bribe me to try.

You also need to revisit your evaluations and psychiatrists. If the school was telling you no problems that’s what they but on the input to the evaluation and that obviously was not true. Getting removed from a school at 10 is significant, even from a private.

Please also look into parent training for neurodivergent children. We did parent management training through Alvlord Baker and it was amazing for us and our daughter. What you are doing is not working. Please don’t take away her books. Please, just don’t. There are other ways to parent.

My daughter after 4 years at public and a lot of therapy and a change in parenting approach is thriving. She has friends and is doing well in school. Don’t give up on your child.

Ok I see now you say she’s in therapy. Maybe try another therapist, sometimes the first one is not a good fit. I think any therapy is not going to be enough to counteract the feelings of disappointing her family all night and every weekend after being unsuccessful at school. Poor kid.

[Anonymous]

Your kid needs support with building personal tolerance and the ability and resources to deal with others. Essentially she needs more tools in her toolkit. She needs reinforcement of growth strategies. She needs conversation to see and analyze her own behavior. And she needs help in learning how to deal with other people who will inevitably frustrate her.

School change isn’t going to be what solves this. Consistency, patience, reinforcement.