Anonymous wrote:Muslima, under Shariah, would a Muslim be allowed to convert to Christianity and leave Islam?

Anonymous wrote:Here are the differences between Jizya and Zakat, according to Wikipedia:

Zakat
obligatory upon Muslims
net worth of assets must exceed the Nisab (excess money for personal need) for Zakat to be obligatory
only payable on assets continuously owned over one lunar year that are in excess of the Nisab
the amount of Zakat paid is fixed and specified by Sharee'ah
paid only by the owner of the assets himself/herself
refusal to pay Zakat has no specific punishment by Sharee'ah law in life; punishment is delayed to the end time[35]
should be paid seeking God's pleasure [Qur'an 30:39]


Jizya
obligatory upon Dhimmis
required even if the Dhimmi's wealth or property does not exceed Nisab
paid according to a contract, but usually paid yearly regardless of Nisab
the amount paid is not fixed or specified by Sharee'ah, but is at least one gold Dinar with no maximum amount [32][33]
paid by all able-bodied adult males of military age and affording power[34]
refusal to pay Jizya is considered a breach of The Dhimma contract; as a consequence the Dhimmi's blood (life) and assets would become permissible[36]
is a tax on non-Muslims.[37]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakat


Once again, what Muslims *claim* about Islam is different from what is actually practiced around the world. Jizya has often been used as an excuse to confiscate Christian and minority property in an unfair way.

Separating people into different groups under the law is, and always will be, a lousy idea. Ever heard of "separate but equal?" Segregation laws? And guess what, people enforcing those laws always had some rationale that it was "fair" or "better for everyone." This type of system invites inequality, discrimination, and worse. This, by itself, should be enough to convince a person that Islam is not perfect. No religion should be dictating laws.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here are the differences between Jizya and Zakat, according to Wikipedia:

Zakat
obligatory upon Muslims
net worth of assets must exceed the Nisab (excess money for personal need) for Zakat to be obligatory
only payable on assets continuously owned over one lunar year that are in excess of the Nisab
the amount of Zakat paid is fixed and specified by Sharee'ah
paid only by the owner of the assets himself/herself
refusal to pay Zakat has no specific punishment by Sharee'ah law in life; punishment is delayed to the end time[35]
should be paid seeking God's pleasure [Qur'an 30:39]


Jizya
obligatory upon Dhimmis
required even if the Dhimmi's wealth or property does not exceed Nisab
paid according to a contract, but usually paid yearly regardless of Nisab
the amount paid is not fixed or specified by Sharee'ah, but is at least one gold Dinar with no maximum amount [32][33]
paid by all able-bodied adult males of military age and affording power[34]
refusal to pay Jizya is considered a breach of The Dhimma contract; as a consequence the Dhimmi's blood (life) and assets would become permissible[36]
is a tax on non-Muslims.[37]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakat


Once again, what Muslims *claim* about Islam is different from what is actually practiced around the world. Jizya has often been used as an excuse to confiscate Christian and minority property in an unfair way.

Separating people into different groups under the law is, and always will be, a lousy idea. Ever heard of "separate but equal?" Segregation laws? And guess what, people enforcing those laws always had some rationale that it was "fair" or "better for everyone." This type of system invites inequality, discrimination, and worse. This, by itself, should be enough to convince a person that Islam is not perfect. No religion should be dictating laws.

I don't even know where to begin.

So I'll just type.

I couldn't even get through the Quaran "guidelines" above. WHO has time to familiarize him/herself with those rules anyway? If you have that much time, then spend it with your kids or with your friends or with your spouse!

omg, folks! It's amazing to me just HOW MUCH people want to be told what to do every second of their lives!

Who doesn't see that?

Religion is control over the masses, and it's the power behind these so-called governments.

yikes! Get me off this thread! My head's spinning.

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here are the differences between Jizya and Zakat, according to Wikipedia:

Zakat
obligatory upon Muslims
net worth of assets must exceed the Nisab (excess money for personal need) for Zakat to be obligatory
only payable on assets continuously owned over one lunar year that are in excess of the Nisab
the amount of Zakat paid is fixed and specified by Sharee'ah
paid only by the owner of the assets himself/herself
refusal to pay Zakat has no specific punishment by Sharee'ah law in life; punishment is delayed to the end time[35]
should be paid seeking God's pleasure [Qur'an 30:39]


Jizya
obligatory upon Dhimmis
required even if the Dhimmi's wealth or property does not exceed Nisab
paid according to a contract, but usually paid yearly regardless of Nisab
the amount paid is not fixed or specified by Sharee'ah, but is at least one gold Dinar with no maximum amount [32][33]
paid by all able-bodied adult males of military age and affording power[34]
refusal to pay Jizya is considered a breach of The Dhimma contract; as a consequence the Dhimmi's blood (life) and assets would become permissible[36]
is a tax on non-Muslims.[37]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakat


Once again, what Muslims *claim* about Islam is different from what is actually practiced around the world. Jizya has often been used as an excuse to confiscate Christian and minority property in an unfair way.

Separating people into different groups under the law is, and always will be, a lousy idea. Ever heard of "separate but equal?" Segregation laws? And guess what, people enforcing those laws always had some rationale that it was "fair" or "better for everyone." This type of system invites inequality, discrimination, and worse. This, by itself, should be enough to convince a person that Islam is not perfect. No religion should be dictating laws.

If you want to have a serious discussion about Islam, please refrain from quoting Sheikh Wikipedia. The web is full of salafists, wahabists,fatwa lovers, islam bashers, ect. The most reliable and authentic sources of information about Islam is of course the Qur’an and Prophet Muhammad PBUH’s Hadiths, that's what Muslims live by, not wikipedia. Islamic Figh (jurisprudence) is very complex, as the rules are not static. For every situation, the Fiqh can change depending on the person's specific circumstances~

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, under Shariah, would a Muslim be allowed to convert to Christianity and leave Islam?

So, yes the majority of the Muslim scholars are saying "Kill" is the punishment, a minority is saying "No". Hope it is not too confusing and of course Allah knows best!

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here are the differences between Jizya and Zakat, according to Wikipedia:

Zakat
obligatory upon Muslims
net worth of assets must exceed the Nisab (excess money for personal need) for Zakat to be obligatory
only payable on assets continuously owned over one lunar year that are in excess of the Nisab
the amount of Zakat paid is fixed and specified by Sharee'ah
paid only by the owner of the assets himself/herself
refusal to pay Zakat has no specific punishment by Sharee'ah law in life; punishment is delayed to the end time[35]
should be paid seeking God's pleasure [Qur'an 30:39]


Jizya
obligatory upon Dhimmis
required even if the Dhimmi's wealth or property does not exceed Nisab
paid according to a contract, but usually paid yearly regardless of Nisab
the amount paid is not fixed or specified by Sharee'ah, but is at least one gold Dinar with no maximum amount [32][33]
paid by all able-bodied adult males of military age and affording power[34]
refusal to pay Jizya is considered a breach of The Dhimma contract; as a consequence the Dhimmi's blood (life) and assets would become permissible[36]
is a tax on non-Muslims.[37]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakat


Once again, what Muslims *claim* about Islam is different from what is actually practiced around the world. Jizya has often been used as an excuse to confiscate Christian and minority property in an unfair way.

Separating people into different groups under the law is, and always will be, a lousy idea. Ever heard of "separate but equal?" Segregation laws? And guess what, people enforcing those laws always had some rationale that it was "fair" or "better for everyone." This type of system invites inequality, discrimination, and worse. This, by itself, should be enough to convince a person that Islam is not perfect. No religion should be dictating laws.

If you want to have a serious discussion about Islam, please refrain from quoting Sheikh Wikipedia. The web is full of salafists, wahabists,fatwa lovers, islam bashers, ect. The most reliable and authentic sources of information about Islam is of course the Qur’an and Prophet Muhammad PBUH’s Hadiths, that's what Muslims live by, not wikipedia. Islamic Figh (jurisprudence) is very complex, as the rules are not static. For every situation, the Fiqh can change depending on the person's specific circumstances~

Ok, are you refuting any of the post you are responding to?

Are you denying that jizya has historically been used as a reason to unfairly confiscate property from minorities in Muslim countries?

Are you denying that Sharia law sets up a system of "separate but equal" for non-Muslims?

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, under Shariah, would a Muslim be allowed to convert to Christianity and leave Islam?

So, yes the majority of the Muslim scholars are saying "Kill" is the punishment, a minority is saying "No". Hope it is not too confusing and of course Allah knows best!

Thank you, all we needed to know!

A true and loving God would not have left this so ambivalent for "scholars" to figure out. It really shouldn't be so hard, Muslima!!

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, under Shariah, would a Muslim be allowed to convert to Christianity and leave Islam?

So, yes the majority of the Muslim scholars are saying "Kill" is the punishment, a minority is saying "No". Hope it is not too confusing and of course Allah knows best!

Thank you, all we needed to know!

A true and loving God would not have left this so ambivalent for "scholars" to figure out. It really shouldn't be so hard, Muslima!!

Actually, differences of opinions are a blessing in some Fiqh rulings, because the ruling is "if there is a different of opinions between scholars, you can choose whichever one your heart believes is the correct opinion" and there won't be a sin in doing so, so no it is not so hard!!!Allah is a loving God, if you knew how Allah manages your affairs, your heart would melt out of love for Him~

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, under Shariah, would a Muslim be allowed to convert to Christianity and leave Islam?

So, yes the majority of the Muslim scholars are saying "Kill" is the punishment, a minority is saying "No". Hope it is not too confusing and of course Allah knows best!

Thank you, all we needed to know!

A true and loving God would not have left this so ambivalent for "scholars" to figure out. It really shouldn't be so hard, Muslima!!

Actually, differences of opinions are a blessing in some Fiqh rulings, because the ruling is "if there is a different of opinions between scholars, you can choose whichever one your heart believes is the correct opinion" and there won't be a sin in doing so, so no it is not so hard!!!Allah is a loving God, if you knew how Allah manages your affairs, your heart would melt out of love for Him~

This is easy for you to say. I'm sure the many people over the centuries who have been murdered because they left Islam would beg to differ as to whether differences of opinion are a "blessing."

Listen, a good religion should stand on its own merits. You don't discuss the merits. Your rationale so far has been "Allah is loving and Islam is perfect because I say so." Nothing about Islam or Allah seem particularly loving or perfect, according to YOUR OWN description of the religion!

Muslima wrote:
I am not here to convince you about the merits of Islam. I shared the message of Islam based on the questions that were asked. Islam is enough for me, that is all that matters to me, It stands on its own merits, it is Perfect~ I am not here to convince you of anything. Whatever you choose for your life is your decision, as long as you're happy with it, what do you have to worry about?

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much I don't understand I guess (and I'm not anti-Islam). I normally meet my neighbors when walking my dog (exercise and a reason to be outside). It's a super friendly neighborhood and we'll talk for hours. My Muslim neighbors (there are 3 houses, so not just one family) used to literally run from me, cross the sidewalk to not be on the same side as me. I did know that their kids were extremely afraid of my small dog, but I didn't realize it was the issue with the adults. Turns out I was told that Muslims view dogs as unclean. My dog is pretty laid back and doesn't jump on people or even act interested.

Anyways, just thought that I had crazy rude neighbors for years.

I was involved in my HOA's social committee for years as well. We had trouble getting the Muslims to come to our socials because we served wine and beer (and they said they wouldn't attend because of that). So we had a few dry socials and low and behold, no one else would show up for those either.

I had to laugh at the bold part because I do the same thing loool. Please don't take offense to it. Muslims have to do what is called Wudu before they pray (ablutions). One of the things that invalidates your wudu is if a dog's saliva touches you have to do it again. It is not the dog that's impure, but its saliva. So, sometimes, I'm in a state of ablution and a dog comes towards me, I'm afraid it will start licking me, so you better believe, I will run just because I don't want to go back and do my ablutions again.

As for the Muslims in your HOA, no idea why they didn't attend the dry socials. Not every human being is social, and that has nothing to do with religion...

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:
I am not here to convince you about the merits of Islam. I shared the message of Islam based on the questions that were asked. Islam is enough for me, that is all that matters to me, It stands on its own merits, it is Perfect~ I am not here to convince you of anything. Whatever you choose for your life is your decision, as long as you're happy with it, what do you have to worry about?

Do you understand what it stands on its own merits means? You should at least be able to describe said merits, and you can't.

You are the one saying Islam is perfect, but you can't seem to back that up. Why should I believe you if you have nothing to back yourself up with? You are the one coming on the internet, saying something is perfect, and are not quite able to explain what that means. Why shouldn't we challenge you on that? I'm happy that Islam is enough for you, but you don't seem to know why or how.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not anti-Islam.

I just want Muslims to stay in their own countries and not come here. Nothing good comes of it when they do.

Uh, Muslims have been coming to the United States since the 1700s.

But I would bet if you go back in time, Native Americans would say the same about Christians.

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much I don't understand I guess (and I'm not anti-Islam). I normally meet my neighbors when walking my dog (exercise and a reason to be outside). It's a super friendly neighborhood and we'll talk for hours. My Muslim neighbors (there are 3 houses, so not just one family) used to literally run from me, cross the sidewalk to not be on the same side as me. I did know that their kids were extremely afraid of my small dog, but I didn't realize it was the issue with the adults. Turns out I was told that Muslims view dogs as unclean. My dog is pretty laid back and doesn't jump on people or even act interested.

Anyways, just thought that I had crazy rude neighbors for years.

I was involved in my HOA's social committee for years as well. We had trouble getting the Muslims to come to our socials because we served wine and beer (and they said they wouldn't attend because of that). So we had a few dry socials and low and behold, no one else would show up for those either.

I had to laugh at the bold part because I do the same thing loool. Please don't take offense to it. Muslims have to do what is called Wudu before they pray (ablutions). One of the things that invalidates your wudu is if a dog's saliva touches you have to do it again. It is not the dog that's impure, but its saliva. So, sometimes, I'm in a state of ablution and a dog comes towards me, I'm afraid it will start licking me, so you better believe, I will run just because I don't want to go back and do my ablutions again.

As for the Muslims in your HOA, no idea why they didn't attend the dry socials. Not every human being is social, and that has nothing to do with religion...

This is so fucking nutty, it pisses me off that I'm supposed to respect it. You and every other religious person should be marginalized as the fools you are.