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Manodedios wrote:Pepe wrote:novasoccer15324 wrote:
I won't name names but if you take some of the more successful coaches on this list by measurement of trophies they have won, and you put them with developing players, most of them would struggle. On this list you're going to run into coaches who do not know how to develop players, only know how to crack the whip on them and motivate them to play harder and be more competitive players, but not actually develop them more. That is why they don't work with younger age groups and they don't work with developmental players, only players who have already made it to a very high level. This masks their lack of coaching ability.
How does this relate to college coaches then? Aren't high-level/high-performing teams essentially college-lite teams? I'd argue they are and for our team who have top tier players and those who make ENCL national selection games, they are college players just waiting until they graduate. Never mind the fact some are already verbally committed to D1s. Very little to develop when they are top U17 talent other than now it's about how you USE the players in situations and counter opposing teams formations and style of play. Now they are coaching, not developing... two totally different mindsets.
That is more or less the typical mindset (regarding development) in US Soccer, and based on my experience w/ VDA, not surprised that would be what you see if you are there. But do you really think a 16 year old junior likely DOESN’T have a lot they still need to develop to have success in 2-3-4 years? I wouldn’t ignore how some of a prior clubs ‘21 and ‘22 players are doing at the next level - e.g. are they getting minutes, etc., especially if they were a highly rated recruit for their school, like the ‘22 VDA players at Wake Forest.
In my experience, most of the people who are interested in best coaches *for girls* at the U14-U18 level in this area are interested precisely because the next step for those girls is usually college. So it is a very good point — looking at the college rosters to see how many games/minutes that prior grads from a club are playing is a good idea. Each player bio page usually has those stats available. Plus, you can see where the other girls on the roster played before they came to the school. I know a lot of folks say that you don’t have to play ECNL to play in college, and that’s true, but if you look at the current rosters you’ll see that a path other than ECNL or high-level DA is kind of unusual for the top 30 D1 *or* D3 schools. And for academically competitive schools, Ivys and top academic D3s, it’s just as prevalent as at big soccer powerhouses like Florida State or UCLA.
This is one of the toughest areas of development for GKs, especially girls. Being the absolute dictator in the back and being able to back it up. As the girls get older that command presence plus the trust of the defensive line teammates that the GK is correct when she calls it — that’s what separates a top GK from the others. The partnership between the CBs and the GKs can be pretty cool to see if that clicks well on a defensively minded team.
Is staying in San Diego an option? Kidding not kidding. She should be fine at any of those three clubs, understanding that teammate and coaching fit may result in another move in another year or so. I’d recommend paying attention to the ECNL/HS seasons split. As someone mentioned earlier, MD HS season is in the fall, so the ECNL season is in the spring. Virginia is opposite - ECNL in the fall, HS in the spring. Private schools play school soccer in the fall regardless of location in MD or VA. Whether your daughter intends to play HS soccer, it might make sense to sync the HS season where you live with a club that accommodates that HS season.
My kid, at 12, did all the things that were possible without bending the time-space continuum, including multiple sports and super y/swim/futsal. He’ll be fine if he’s doing it because he wants to and not because he feels he’ll fall behind. If he’s doing out of love, not fear, he’ll be able to self-regulate and you’ll be able to let him skip things every once in a while when it’s clear he needs a rest.
Cruzado wrote:Godot wrote:So structurally, where does this leave ostensibly high-level club soccer at U14+ in the local area?
For both girls and boys, on the Virginia side of the Potomac, there’s ECNL at Loudoun, VA Union (Mclean/SYC), VDA (PWSI/VSA), BRAVE (BRYC/VYS), Arlington.
For girls, there’s GA at FCV and Metro United.
For boys, there’s MLS Next at Alexandria and SYC (an alternative to VA Union, for the combo group right? I haven’t had a boy in travel soccer for a few years). Plus Bethesda and DC United north of the Potomac.
This actually seems like decent consolidation to me, something that’s been needed for a while now. My prediction, worth exactly the zero dollars that you all paid for it, is that MLS Next will slowly fade and the top ECNL boys teams will end up playing against the MLS academy teams in some format. GA will quickly fade, and FCV really ought to consider that partnership with a geographically rational ECNL team for the sake of the players. We’ll end up with 4-5 local clubs that are really top feeders to both pros and college, and those will be the clubs that capture a large young player pool from a geographic area that the club dominates. So eventually, Loudoun, Arlington, and VDA win their areas, with Fairfax still up for grabs among the VA Union//SYC//BRYC//VYS machinations. This also has to do with resources for hiring and keeping coaching staffs — the big clubs with huge natural player pools at the young rec and young travel levels have the revenue to support coaches’ salaries. That gets a lot harder when you’re smaller.
I agree with most of what you wrote, but in curious ti hear your thoughts on why you think MLS Next will fade.
I really have no idea and no opinion on that, other than I do find it odd and somewhat frustrating as a parent to not have a clear sense of what the “top” youth league is … I had been assuming that it’s MLS Next and that it’s here to stay, and it was ECNL that was more likely to fold into MLS Next. That’s based on nothing really, other than a vague sense that with the MLS and their youth academies behind it, they won’t be going away.
It’s a good point, and I’m pretty blind here too as I haven’t had a son in travel soccer in a long time. But my sense of it then was that the MLS Academy teams were always well above any of the club-based affiliated teams talent-wise, including during the DA years. And it was the MLS academy teams being annoyed at the dilution happening in the rest of the DA — an inevitability of the financial structures of the non-professional-sponsored youth leagues — that ultimately led to the MLS Academy breakaway and the DA’s downfall. So I expect that hasn’t changed, and the MLS Next club-based teams will face similar financial incentives to do things in ways that do not please the MLS academy teams (e.g. lots of tournaments) and, like the former DA teams, will be similarly uneven, talent-wise. On the other hand, ECNL in this area is more focused on the youth market itself and on colleges, not on a pathway to pros like MLS Next, so will attract a decent population of players in its own right and perhaps be self-sustaining financially because they don’t have to do things in a pro development way. So if the MLS Next club-based teams can’t keep up with the MLS Academy teams, which, let’s be honest, will be pulling all the real talent anyway, and the MLS Academy teams get disgruntled and refuse to attend big moneymaker tournaments for youths, and just seek out the best available competitive landscape, I see the chances of survival as being higher for ECNL boys teams/clubs generally.
100% pure speculation.
So structurally, where does this leave ostensibly high-level club soccer at U14+ in the local area?
For both girls and boys, on the Virginia side of the Potomac, there’s ECNL at Loudoun, VA Union (Mclean/SYC), VDA (PWSI/VSA), BRAVE (BRYC/VYS), Arlington.
For girls, there’s GA at FCV and Metro United.
For boys, there’s MLS Next at Alexandria and SYC (an alternative to VA Union, for the combo group right? I haven’t had a boy in travel soccer for a few years). Plus Bethesda and DC United north of the Potomac.
This actually seems like decent consolidation to me, something that’s been needed for a while now. My prediction, worth exactly the zero dollars that you all paid for it, is that MLS Next will slowly fade and the top ECNL boys teams will end up playing against the MLS academy teams in some format. GA will quickly fade, and FCV really ought to consider that partnership with a geographically rational ECNL team for the sake of the players. We’ll end up with 4-5 local clubs that are really top feeders to both pros and college, and those will be the clubs that capture a large young player pool from a geographic area that the club dominates. So eventually, Loudoun, Arlington, and VDA win their areas, with Fairfax still up for grabs among the VA Union//SYC//BRYC//VYS machinations. This also has to do with resources for hiring and keeping coaching staffs — the big clubs with huge natural player pools at the young rec and young travel levels have the revenue to support coaches’ salaries. That gets a lot harder when you’re smaller.
For both girls and boys, on the Virginia side of the Potomac, there’s ECNL at Loudoun, VA Union (Mclean/SYC), VDA (PWSI/VSA), BRAVE (BRYC/VYS), Arlington.
For girls, there’s GA at FCV and Metro United.
For boys, there’s MLS Next at Alexandria and SYC (an alternative to VA Union, for the combo group right? I haven’t had a boy in travel soccer for a few years). Plus Bethesda and DC United north of the Potomac.
This actually seems like decent consolidation to me, something that’s been needed for a while now. My prediction, worth exactly the zero dollars that you all paid for it, is that MLS Next will slowly fade and the top ECNL boys teams will end up playing against the MLS academy teams in some format. GA will quickly fade, and FCV really ought to consider that partnership with a geographically rational ECNL team for the sake of the players. We’ll end up with 4-5 local clubs that are really top feeders to both pros and college, and those will be the clubs that capture a large young player pool from a geographic area that the club dominates. So eventually, Loudoun, Arlington, and VDA win their areas, with Fairfax still up for grabs among the VA Union//SYC//BRYC//VYS machinations. This also has to do with resources for hiring and keeping coaching staffs — the big clubs with huge natural player pools at the young rec and young travel levels have the revenue to support coaches’ salaries. That gets a lot harder when you’re smaller.
Wow. That’s a big shakeup if true. Anyone have a link or more facts? Would it be like the Virginia Union/Mclean/SYC structure, where except for the merged ECNL teams the full range of non-ECNL teams still play and exist for their home clubs? We’ve seen this kind of movie before (Loudoun and FCV back in the first year of GDA comes to mind) when it didn’t work out so well. But here, it seems like BRYC is bringing the ECNL membership and FCV is bringing the recent college placement reputation, and VYS offers a geographic location between the two? So it might work out.
soccer_dc wrote:My DD is just getting started. What are some lessons particularly for the pre-HS years in ECNL or GA? What should she focus most on, not worry about? What matters most in those early years. Extra coaching, skills, conditioning, teammates? I’ve mostly tried to stay hands off and just want her to keep going as long as she continues to love it.
Technical ball handling and foot skills, then speed of play (this is often more mental than physical), then speed/stamina. Lots of great YouTube training videos.
soccer_dc wrote:mocosoccerparent wrote:soccer_dc wrote:mocosoccerparent wrote:Hi - I am hoping someone can offer a balanced perspective on how I can best help my soccer-obsessed DD reach her full (and from what I can tell, great) potential. I have not wanted to post until now because I knew I'd get a lot of responses that basically just said my kid was clearly some no-name loser playing for a no-name club. Hopefully that won't be the case now. I'll preface by saying that I was not athletic in the slightest so I have no "reliving my glory days" baggage but also no frame of reference.
DD is 13 and currently plays for a travel club that doesn't get discussed a lot on these boards. She's a leader on her team and contributes substantially. I have heard from numerous coaches that she's very talented. She lives, eats, sleeps, and breathes the sport - when she's not practicing or playing, she's watching matches on TV or practicing on her own. She absolutely loves it and is very self-motivated. Her team plays EDP and finishes middle of the standings every season. DD is happy with her team, coach, and teammates but she wants to continue to develop as a player and continue to play all the way through college, though she recognizes that prime recruiting and scholarship opportunities are few and far between.
So my question is, given everything, should she stay with her current team/club for the foreseeable future? Try to go to a different club where she may not be on the top team or may have to travel much further for games and practices? Wait until high school and then move? I feel like the culture in this area is cutthroat and given how much she loves the sport, I'm reluctant to see her make a move to a place where the competition within the team is just as brutal as with opposing teams! Any insights are appreciated.
She seems to have the self motivation to achieve her goals. What remains is whether she has the talent. The best way to find out would be to tryout for a ECNL or GA team. Those leagues are designed for exposure to college coaches and give the best path to playing in college. 13 is a good age to start this process and now is the time of year when teams begin having ID sessions. Contact coaches and ask if she could come to some training sessions. You don't need to wait for ID sessions to be announced, contact the coaches now. At a minimum you'll get an evaluation from the coaches on where she stands talent wise. You could always go back to the current club if the travel and commitment take the fun out of it for her. But once she reaches HS it may be too late for the college path. While some EDP players do make it to college, it's an easier path playing with an ECNL club due to the exposure, coaching connections, training with better players, etc.
Thanks! I'm curious what options are worth pursuing. We're in Montgomery County so it would be difficult to drive to Baltimore or far into Virginia multiple times a week. What teams are realistic options?
Bethesda Soccer Club would be the first choice near you. Depending on where you are in Mont Co, Arlington Soccer or McLean (VA Union) might be within range.
It’s worth having her try out with a couple of different ECNL or GA clubs. It will give you an indication of how she compares to the girls currently on the team and it is by far the easiest route to real college looks, if that’s what she’s motivated to do. It will also give you a sense of what the driving would be like and whether your family thinks it’s worth it to make that drive. And just trying out or joining a practice or two with each of the clubs mentioned might give her an idea about whether that’s a move she would want to make next year, or whether she wants to stay where she is. Girls can still play in college from EDP teams, it just takes quite a bit more energy and initiative and may not garner the type of looks she wants.
With this being my DD’s final club soccer year, and in some ways to test out the new user-name-required forum, i thought I’d throw a classic question out there. My DD is graduating from high school and will be playing in college. So the youth soccer journey ended where she wanted it to, but we definitely learned a few things along the way that might be useful to the younger kids looking for the same goal.
- Being at an ECNL and maybe a GA club matters for college recruiting and it matters sooner than you think. Like, 8th grade it starts mattering.
- WHICH ECNL/GA club matters nowhere near as much as earlier threads might lead you to believe.
- Be honest with yourself about how good (or not) your DD is. Get an opinion on that from someone outside of your club structure or a club that’s trying to woo your DD away if you can’t realistically gauge it yourself. All of the girls who play ECNL/GA and also in other leagues can play college soccer somewhere, but you need to know if you’re way off base with whether your DD is good enough to play at a top 30 NCAA D1 college.
- Targeting schools early on also matters. Your DD needs to be in contact with a narrow list of college coaches by December of her sophomore year in HS if she does think she can play at one of those top 30s, or even the top 50/70 soccer schools. Which includes all the Ivys, basically.
- Grades really matter.
I wish I had known a few of these things five years ago! Any other thoughts out there?
- Being at an ECNL and maybe a GA club matters for college recruiting and it matters sooner than you think. Like, 8th grade it starts mattering.
- WHICH ECNL/GA club matters nowhere near as much as earlier threads might lead you to believe.
- Be honest with yourself about how good (or not) your DD is. Get an opinion on that from someone outside of your club structure or a club that’s trying to woo your DD away if you can’t realistically gauge it yourself. All of the girls who play ECNL/GA and also in other leagues can play college soccer somewhere, but you need to know if you’re way off base with whether your DD is good enough to play at a top 30 NCAA D1 college.
- Targeting schools early on also matters. Your DD needs to be in contact with a narrow list of college coaches by December of her sophomore year in HS if she does think she can play at one of those top 30s, or even the top 50/70 soccer schools. Which includes all the Ivys, basically.
- Grades really matter.
I wish I had known a few of these things five years ago! Any other thoughts out there?