
Exactly what many of us are arguing for! We want to give our kids an edge by rigging admissions and creating obstacles that exclude the less fortunate. |
No, standardized test scores are the most reliable predictor of success, which is why some schools are starting to shift away from test optional. The Academic Senate of the University of California found that: https://senate.universityofcalifornia.edu/_files/underreview/sttf-report.pdf "standardized test scores aid in predicting important aspects of student success, including undergraduate grade point average (UGPA), retention, and completion. At UC, test scores are currently better predictors of first-year GPA than high school grade point average (HSGPA) ... test scores are better predictors of success for students who are Underrepresented Minority students (URMs), who are first-generation, or whose families are low-income ... The STTF found that California high schools vary greatly in grading standards, and that grade inflation is part of why the predictive power of HSGPA has decreased since the last UC study." The UC ultimately ignored the Senate findings and moved away from standardized testing, with the desire for holistic admission trumping evidence-based outcomes. |
Although some like to make this claim, I think common sense by those with actual experience realize that holistic admissions is even more predictive than tests which can be easily gamed. |
And the UChicago study of the same year (2020) found the opposite, unweighted HS GPA still trumped standardized test scores as a predictor of college success. What's obvious to anyone willing to apply any critical thinking to the topic is that both of these factors (and more) are preferable than any one factor in isolation. |
Of course it does. That is exactly why it is the number 1 factor for college admissions. |
Holistics admissions are the best, but they require a lot of inputs. TJ admissions aren't truly holistic, since they are mostly based on fluff essays and experience factors. GPA isn't heavily weighted, and they aren't considering course rigor or even SOL scores from the previous year. |
They're not qualified. Not for TJ. You can create another school for the mediocre kids you want to give participation trophies to but humanity needs to develop the smart kids so the mediocre kids can pretend they solved global warming by blocking traffic and throwing tomato soup on the Mona Lisa |
Right, because common sense is better than science and data. You sound like someone that injected ivermectin and bleach during COVID. |
The U. Chicago study measured one thing. Graduation rates across a very large sample of schools. Most of them non-selective Studies measuring performance at highly selective schools fund test scores to be far better predictors. "Across the high schools studied, students with high school GPAs under 1.5 had around a 20% chance of graduating from college. For students with GPAs of 3.75 or higher, those chances rose to around 80%." I think anyone willing to apply critical reading to this thread would realize that noone has implied that test scores alone is better than test scores plus gpa. But of the two, test scores are FAR more productive than gpa in competitive environments. Yet somehow, we decided to eliminate test scores. |
Don't say such stupid things. It undermines your credibility and the credibility of everyone on your side of the argument. A 1600 sat and 3.8 gpa gets into more selective schools than a 1400 sat and 4.0 gpa. Lots of perfect gpas at mediocre schools. Not a lot of perfect sat score at mediocre schools. |
Holistic admissions are the best for wealthy kids. Stuyvesant/Bronx Science/Brooklyn Tech admissions is based on a single test and over 50% of students are free/reduced lunch. TJ used holistic admissions and 2% were free reduced lunch. Holistic admissions measure privilege. |
DP, but 1600 is an edge case (~500 per year nationwide). A more reasonable comparison might be to compare a 1500/3.8 profile to a 1400/4.0 profile. Obviously schools look at lot more than just these two things, but on this basis alone I'd like a student's chances for admission better with the 1400/4.0 profile. |
Progressive education reform and criminal justice reform policies showing themselves not to work. Who knew? It’s almost like allowing a permissive attitude toward crime and a lax environment for admission at rigorous schools doesn’t create a utopian society. |
So true! Hard to argue with that! |
I get that you hate the reforms but you really need to stop lying. Sure, the kids getting in now may not have had years of expensive prep but seem to have much greater potential than the third rate preppers that were being admitted in the past. |