Why does no one acknowledge how overworked teachers are?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

I mean, this sounds like my unpaid graduate work. Except mine was cognitively challenging. I worked PT to just barely eat. And it lasted three years. This wasn't a business degree, though.

I always found the people going straight into business soulless, though. It wasn't something I aspired to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

Aside from the fact that student teaching is different from being a teacher, I just want to take a moment to point out that this woman is getting weirdly competitive with her son, and is YET another example of how teachers honestly have no idea what happens in the "business" world (lets set aside the fact that they never specify an industry). Yeah, the college student interns sitting at the front desk do indeed have low stress jobs. I don't expect anything of them.

This has nothing in common with my job, or the jobs the rest of us have. And yeah, I do regularly pay for the interns to have food because they make almost nothing. It's not some free lunch that materializes out of the imagined good will of my generic "business." I'd be aghast at the idea that my intern's own mom was feeling jealous of them because I sprung for some Subway, lol.

you must be feeling some type of triggered to think that PP was jealois. It seemed like a pretty objective comparison

Only a right winger would call this being "triggered" and also not know how to spell.

Three negative posts in three minutes! All on the same theme! Definitely not the same person

I understand that we are supposed to pretend that you are not the same clueless teacher who decided she was making an "objective" comparison.

I'm honestly not sure why you (all lol) are so annoyed by that innocuous post. The PP was sharing her intern experience and comparing it to what her son shared his was. But okay, continue now with your strange way of opening up discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:This generation of teachers is the most under-worked and over-entitled ever.

In the 1970s my mother would carry bags of books home with her every single night and sit up grading her HS kids French homework, putting in corrections and encouragement and grades. Every single night.

Homework just doesn't exist on that level any more. You'r'e lucky if the teacher checks its been done, but they don't engage with it at all.

I do this. Every single night. I work every Saturday. Every Sunday. I am comfortable estimating I work 70 hours at least one week a month and never under 60. My coworkers are quitting because of the workload and I’m seriously considering it.

I’m underworked and over-entitled?

You teach Elementary. there is a world of difference between Elementary and High School in terms of workload and rigor. You are basically spending your weekend putting smiley faces on bad pictures.

Now this right here is a troll. I'd encourage others to ignore going forward

No. What I am is a critic. I am the original poster of the mother who was a teacher in the 70s who bust a nut every night for her HS students. I'm also a parent of 2 kids in the US education system and I've met exactly 1 excellent teacher in their ES experience and 0 in their MS experience and probably 2 maybe 3 excellent teachers in their HS experience. The rest have been bottom-feeders, bottom feeders who are uninspiring and entitled, who think staying after school for 30 mins is a HUGE impingement on their lives, who literally don't give a F about the individuals in their class.

Who in their right mind would become a teacher these days? Nothing but contempt from parents, orders from the school system, all for low pay and high stress. In the past, it was a women's job, because women couldn't become rocket scientists, computer programmers, politicians, etc. Now they can. The best and the brightest are NOT going into education

That is correct, the bottom 20% are going into education thinking it is going to be an easy ride.

What a total load of BS that is. Anyone with a degree or who knows a current teacher can tell you how hard it is.

Are you talking about how hard an M.Ed is? Because I have gone through that program at a decent public university, and uh...yeah. My colleagues were decidedly not geniuses, and the coursework was not terribly challenging.

But all the students in an M.Ed program have already taken their undergraduate majors in their subjects. And you have people coming from all different qualities of undergrad institutions to take their M.Ed. The M.Ed is a fairly generic introduction to pedagogy, principles and research on learning, child development etc. But it's not going to be as challenging of course content as your undergraduate major in a discipline as it has to be fairly generic professional preparation for people from a wide range of backgrounds. However learning to enact it well in the classroom is much harder. I don't think this speaks to the broader quality of students that go into education. I think you still get plenty of top arts and humanities students going into teaching fields because there aren't that many options out there.

I do. 50+ years ago, smart women who were shut out of most professions became teachers and nurses. Smart women are no longer so restricted and have lots of options including law school, business school, and other professional and graduate programs. They can become psychologists, consultants, businesspeople, doctors, lawyers, the list goes on.

As a result, those at the bottom of the class become teachers.

Even if this were true, this is acceptable to you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

Aside from the fact that student teaching is different from being a teacher, I just want to take a moment to point out that this woman is getting weirdly competitive with her son, and is YET another example of how teachers honestly have no idea what happens in the "business" world (lets set aside the fact that they never specify an industry). Yeah, the college student interns sitting at the front desk do indeed have low stress jobs. I don't expect anything of them.

This has nothing in common with my job, or the jobs the rest of us have. And yeah, I do regularly pay for the interns to have food because they make almost nothing. It's not some free lunch that materializes out of the imagined good will of my generic "business." I'd be aghast at the idea that my intern's own mom was feeling jealous of them because I sprung for some Subway, lol.

Agreed. That was a really weird (not to mention very uninformed) post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This generation of teachers is the most under-worked and over-entitled ever.

In the 1970s my mother would carry bags of books home with her every single night and sit up grading her HS kids French homework, putting in corrections and encouragement and grades. Every single night.

Homework just doesn't exist on that level any more. You'r'e lucky if the teacher checks its been done, but they don't engage with it at all.

I do this. Every single night. I work every Saturday. Every Sunday. I am comfortable estimating I work 70 hours at least one week a month and never under 60. My coworkers are quitting because of the workload and I’m seriously considering it.

I’m underworked and over-entitled?

You teach Elementary. there is a world of difference between Elementary and High School in terms of workload and rigor. You are basically spending your weekend putting smiley faces on bad pictures.

Now this right here is a troll. I'd encourage others to ignore going forward

No. What I am is a critic. I am the original poster of the mother who was a teacher in the 70s who bust a nut every night for her HS students. I'm also a parent of 2 kids in the US education system and I've met exactly 1 excellent teacher in their ES experience and 0 in their MS experience and probably 2 maybe 3 excellent teachers in their HS experience. The rest have been bottom-feeders, bottom feeders who are uninspiring and entitled, who think staying after school for 30 mins is a HUGE impingement on their lives, who literally don't give a F about the individuals in their class.

Who in their right mind would become a teacher these days? Nothing but contempt from parents, orders from the school system, all for low pay and high stress. In the past, it was a women's job, because women couldn't become rocket scientists, computer programmers, politicians, etc. Now they can. The best and the brightest are NOT going into education

That is correct, the bottom 20% are going into education thinking it is going to be an easy ride.

What a total load of BS that is. Anyone with a degree or who knows a current teacher can tell you how hard it is.

Are you talking about how hard an M.Ed is? Because I have gone through that program at a decent public university, and uh...yeah. My colleagues were decidedly not geniuses, and the coursework was not terribly challenging.

But all the students in an M.Ed program have already taken their undergraduate majors in their subjects. And you have people coming from all different qualities of undergrad institutions to take their M.Ed. The M.Ed is a fairly generic introduction to pedagogy, principles and research on learning, child development etc. But it's not going to be as challenging of course content as your undergraduate major in a discipline as it has to be fairly generic professional preparation for people from a wide range of backgrounds. However learning to enact it well in the classroom is much harder. I don't think this speaks to the broader quality of students that go into education. I think you still get plenty of top arts and humanities students going into teaching fields because there aren't that many options out there.

I do. 50+ years ago, smart women who were shut out of most professions became teachers and nurses. Smart women are no longer so restricted and have lots of options including law school, business school, and other professional and graduate programs. They can become psychologists, consultants, businesspeople, doctors, lawyers, the list goes on.

As a result, those at the bottom of the class become teachers.

Agreed. I have one of those arts and humanities degrees which is often made fun of. All of the top students went into tech or grad school. Facebook, Huffpo, start ups. Ph.D. programs, typically in other fields. I only know a few who went into teaching, and it was because they couldn't find much else. The career path for these teachers has been--mediocre undergrad skills-->failed job search-->tutoring or substitute teaching-->retraining as a teacher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

Aside from the fact that student teaching is different from being a teacher, I just want to take a moment to point out that this woman is getting weirdly competitive with her son, and is YET another example of how teachers honestly have no idea what happens in the "business" world (lets set aside the fact that they never specify an industry). Yeah, the college student interns sitting at the front desk do indeed have low stress jobs. I don't expect anything of them.

This has nothing in common with my job, or the jobs the rest of us have. And yeah, I do regularly pay for the interns to have food because they make almost nothing. It's not some free lunch that materializes out of the imagined good will of my generic "business." I'd be aghast at the idea that my intern's own mom was feeling jealous of them because I sprung for some Subway, lol.

Agreed. That was a really weird (not to mention very uninformed) post.

I don't see why it was weird. It was in response to people wondering why more students aren't entering teaching; I think seeing the difference in the internship period is a reason why.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

I mean, this sounds like my unpaid graduate work. Except mine was cognitively challenging. I worked PT to just barely eat. And it lasted three years. This wasn't a business degree, though.

I always found the people going straight into business soulless, though. It wasn't something I aspired to.

I thought that was odd, too. Bragging that they had to work hard but that being a student teacher isn't cognitively challenging. I mean, McDonald's employees also work hard at cognitively light jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

Aside from the fact that student teaching is different from being a teacher, I just want to take a moment to point out that this woman is getting weirdly competitive with her son, and is YET another example of how teachers honestly have no idea what happens in the "business" world (lets set aside the fact that they never specify an industry). Yeah, the college student interns sitting at the front desk do indeed have low stress jobs. I don't expect anything of them.

This has nothing in common with my job, or the jobs the rest of us have. And yeah, I do regularly pay for the interns to have food because they make almost nothing. It's not some free lunch that materializes out of the imagined good will of my generic "business." I'd be aghast at the idea that my intern's own mom was feeling jealous of them because I sprung for some Subway, lol.

Agreed. That was a really weird (not to mention very uninformed) post.

I don't see why it was weird. It was in response to people wondering why more students aren't entering teaching; I think seeing the difference in the internship period is a reason why.

Her son's high school internship is nothing like the experience the rest of us had. Most of us had to work hard during our training periods. Have you ever seen what a pharmacist has to go through?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

Aside from the fact that student teaching is different from being a teacher, I just want to take a moment to point out that this woman is getting weirdly competitive with her son, and is YET another example of how teachers honestly have no idea what happens in the "business" world (lets set aside the fact that they never specify an industry). Yeah, the college student interns sitting at the front desk do indeed have low stress jobs. I don't expect anything of them.

This has nothing in common with my job, or the jobs the rest of us have. And yeah, I do regularly pay for the interns to have food because they make almost nothing. It's not some free lunch that materializes out of the imagined good will of my generic "business." I'd be aghast at the idea that my intern's own mom was feeling jealous of them because I sprung for some Subway, lol.

Agreed. That was a really weird (not to mention very uninformed) post.

+1

i don't know why teachers have to be so aggressive about putting down literally every other profession, even apparently their own childrens'!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

I mean, this sounds like my unpaid graduate work. Except mine was cognitively challenging. I worked PT to just barely eat. And it lasted three years. This wasn't a business degree, though.

I always found the people going straight into business soulless, though. It wasn't something I aspired to.

I thought that was odd, too. Bragging that they had to work hard but that being a student teacher isn't cognitively challenging. I mean, McDonald's employees also work hard at cognitively light jobs.

okay, i wouldn't say that this was a mcdonald's job though. some teacher is gonna get really mad lol

[Anonymous]

in b4 teacher threatens to quit

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

Aside from the fact that student teaching is different from being a teacher, I just want to take a moment to point out that this woman is getting weirdly competitive with her son, and is YET another example of how teachers honestly have no idea what happens in the "business" world (lets set aside the fact that they never specify an industry). Yeah, the college student interns sitting at the front desk do indeed have low stress jobs. I don't expect anything of them.

This has nothing in common with my job, or the jobs the rest of us have. And yeah, I do regularly pay for the interns to have food because they make almost nothing. It's not some free lunch that materializes out of the imagined good will of my generic "business." I'd be aghast at the idea that my intern's own mom was feeling jealous of them because I sprung for some Subway, lol.

Agreed. That was a really weird (not to mention very uninformed) post.

I don't see why it was weird. It was in response to people wondering why more students aren't entering teaching; I think seeing the difference in the internship period is a reason why.

Her son's high school internship is nothing like the experience the rest of us had. Most of us had to work hard during our training periods. Have you ever seen what a pharmacist has to go through?

It was her son's business school internship. Why are you giving me some whataboutism with a pharmacy. It was also her sharing her personal experience, which is why I go back to my OG statement that you are...TRIGGERED

[Anonymous]

I agree, teachers are overworked. But it is similar in my office. I work part-time, I'm an hourly employee with flexible time. I get to the office early and leave by noon every day. I have Fridays off. I don't stay a minute past noon. Whenever I have to travel (only 3x a year), once the event is over, I leave. I don't have to do anything past the event. But my salaried co-workers have to work so much. They are expected to go to the events (parties, happy hours, meetings) after the main event. Sometimes they get to their hotel rooms well past 1am, and they have to wake up at the same time I do. At the office it's the same. They are expected to stay after hours if things need to be completed, and they often work 10-hour days.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

I mean, this sounds like my unpaid graduate work. Except mine was cognitively challenging. I worked PT to just barely eat. And it lasted three years. This wasn't a business degree, though.

I always found the people going straight into business soulless, though. It wasn't something I aspired to.

I thought that was odd, too. Bragging that they had to work hard but that being a student teacher isn't cognitively challenging. I mean, McDonald's employees also work hard at cognitively light jobs.

The way I read it, is that all the busy work outside of teaching was the part that isn't that cognitively challenging. And I totally agree. I can lesson plan, grade, browse for materials while watching netflix or sitting on my porch. It is time consuming though, which is what she claimed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My year long student teaching program was the most grueling year of my life. I had to submit detailed lesson plans for every single word that came out of my mouth in a 7 hr day one week in advance. I even had to submit lesson plans for weekly spelling tests. After school I had to attend 3+ hrs of grad classes at night. Weekends were spent writing the lesson plans and finding/making materials (pre-internet). While it wasn’t cognitively challenging work, it was exhausting nonetheless. All of it was unpaid and I had to work PT to help pay expenses (plus my student loan had to be repaid after I graduated).

My son’s business internships have been fairly low stress and well paid. He goes out to business meals with colleagues that are all paid for. He doesn’t need a PT job because he is being paid. He has no work outside of his 9-5.

If people want to attract students to teaching, something needs to change. They could start by paying student teachers.

Aside from the fact that student teaching is different from being a teacher, I just want to take a moment to point out that this woman is getting weirdly competitive with her son, and is YET another example of how teachers honestly have no idea what happens in the "business" world (lets set aside the fact that they never specify an industry). Yeah, the college student interns sitting at the front desk do indeed have low stress jobs. I don't expect anything of them.

This has nothing in common with my job, or the jobs the rest of us have. And yeah, I do regularly pay for the interns to have food because they make almost nothing. It's not some free lunch that materializes out of the imagined good will of my generic "business." I'd be aghast at the idea that my intern's own mom was feeling jealous of them because I sprung for some Subway, lol.

Agreed. That was a really weird (not to mention very uninformed) post.

I don't see why it was weird. It was in response to people wondering why more students aren't entering teaching; I think seeing the difference in the internship period is a reason why.

Her son's high school internship is nothing like the experience the rest of us had. Most of us had to work hard during our training periods. Have you ever seen what a pharmacist has to go through?

It was her son's business school internship. Why are you giving me some whataboutism with a pharmacy. It was also her sharing her personal experience, which is why I go back to my OG statement that you are...TRIGGERED

Why is she giving us some whataboutism about her son's high school experience internship working at a front desk?