Bad Art Friend

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to God, I'd like to pursue writing, but I just CANNOT STAND writer Twitter. And it seems like you have to have a Twitter following to get published. Have some other folks decided not to take certain career paths because of social media nonsense?

Hi, I'm a published novelist and not on Twitter, as are lots of my author friends.

Most of us are on Insta, which can be annoying in its own way, but def. not mean and toxic like Twitter.

are the insta accounts about your life as a writer? how does it work as a writer marketing platform?

Yes. My account is 75 percent promoting other writers and other books, and then the rest is about my books -- like look at this review! Or here I am signing books at a bookstore.

People tag me in their posts, and I repost those too.

Sometimes it's just random pics of my dog, but 99 percent of the time it is book related.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol this story has so many phases.

Phase 1: NYT Mag story comes out, bunch of blue checkmarks on Twitter are like "Wow, Dawn is a B, Team Larsen" unprompted. Lots of people like/agree with these posts.
Phase 2: Something smells off to some folks, they dig around, those chat transcripts get widely circulated, suddenly a lot of people who liked/agreed with the blue checkmarks are like "Oh."
Phase 3: Some people get way over-obsessed and start harassing not only the blue checkmarks but even some of the people who were pointing out issues with the original story in Phase 2. So now even some defenders of DD are like "whoa, stop -- ya'll are crazy."

It's too much! Yes, it's a more nuanced story than the NYT's article original represented. Yes, Celeste Ng seems like a real B at this point. Yes, Dorland got done dirty by Grub Street, Larsen, Kolker, and those damn blue checkmarks. But also.... people need to dial it down. Yelling at people online and treating this as some kind of showdown between a saint and a villain is not the way. Everyone in this story is flawed, including Dorland. There is no clear "winner" here and trying to anoint one was the whole problem with the initial reaction to the story.

I say this as someone who think Larsen was the instigator here, but can relate to aspects of both Larsen's and Dorland's experiences. I've been bullied/ostracized by a group of people who thought they were too good for me. But I've also had someone go after me beyond any reasonable measure simply because they were Big Mad and I know how helpless Larsen probably felt as Dorland was calling all her employers and publications and demanding they destroy Larsen. Like, it's all not great. I still think Larsen to some extent brought this on herself (with the help of the CMs who look worse and worse every day) and should have just written a better story about the same subject but less obviously based on Dorland. But she didn't murder someone! People need to take the intensity down from 11 to like a 4.

I agree to a point. I think it goes back to what a pp said earlier. That this all feels gaslighting. I can almost guarantee if they condoned the plagiarism or even tried to have an actual discussion about it then the mons would die down. I think people are swamping to these anonymous boards because a lot of us would still like our writing published, so are staying silent on Twitter.

Yeah, I think that if there had been a round of condemnation, this would have died out quickly.

Instead people are afraid, because they have now seen concretely what people like Ng can do to beginning writers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honest to God, I'd like to pursue writing, but I just CANNOT STAND writer Twitter. And it seems like you have to have a Twitter following to get published. Have some other folks decided not to take certain career paths because of social media nonsense?

Agreed. This has been a barrier to my development and confidence as a writer, tbh. I've mostly kept away from social media for my mental health. Privacy is incredibly important to me as a survivor of violence. But my lack of social capital via a notable twitter/ig presence, or the desire to achieve one, has discouraged me from submitting my work and connecting with other writers out of fear of rejection. I'm still trying to forge my own little path but I do worry that there is no space left in this field for people who aren't Extremely Online.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to God, I'd like to pursue writing, but I just CANNOT STAND writer Twitter. And it seems like you have to have a Twitter following to get published. Have some other folks decided not to take certain career paths because of social media nonsense?

Agreed. This has been a barrier to my development and confidence as a writer, tbh. I've mostly kept away from social media for my mental health. Privacy is incredibly important to me as a survivor of violence. But my lack of social capital via a notable twitter/ig presence, or the desire to achieve one, has discouraged me from submitting my work and connecting with other writers out of fear of rejection. I'm still trying to forge my own little path but I do worry that there is no space left in this field for people who aren't Extremely Online.

This is how i feel too -- that success would require embracing Extremely Online stuff, which i just can't ever do.

[Anonymous]

It's not just Extremely Online, it's Extremely Online with a side of Approved Workshopping.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to God, I'd like to pursue writing, but I just CANNOT STAND writer Twitter. And it seems like you have to have a Twitter following to get published. Have some other folks decided not to take certain career paths because of social media nonsense?

Agreed. This has been a barrier to my development and confidence as a writer, tbh. I've mostly kept away from social media for my mental health. Privacy is incredibly important to me as a survivor of violence. But my lack of social capital via a notable twitter/ig presence, or the desire to achieve one, has discouraged me from submitting my work and connecting with other writers out of fear of rejection. I'm still trying to forge my own little path but I do worry that there is no space left in this field for people who aren't Extremely Online.

This is how i feel too -- that success would require embracing Extremely Online stuff, which i just can't ever do.

I’m very sorry for this, PPs. As a visual artist I feel similarly. The cream is not rising to the top, just the IG detritus.

[Anonymous]

Twitter is toxic. I would not be able to write at all if I were required to maintain a presence there. I understand entree to some genres is predicated on a social media presence, but I write literary fiction and no one has cared, yet. I'm still emerging as a writer, at the stage of having an agent and novel manuscripts to shop. Just wanted to offer encouragement for those who are trying to break in without wasting all their writing time acting like a hypocritical "woke" wanker on Twitter, bullying anyone who dares have an independent thought.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to God, I'd like to pursue writing, but I just CANNOT STAND writer Twitter. And it seems like you have to have a Twitter following to get published. Have some other folks decided not to take certain career paths because of social media nonsense?

Agreed. This has been a barrier to my development and confidence as a writer, tbh. I've mostly kept away from social media for my mental health. Privacy is incredibly important to me as a survivor of violence. But my lack of social capital via a notable twitter/ig presence, or the desire to achieve one, has discouraged me from submitting my work and connecting with other writers out of fear of rejection. I'm still trying to forge my own little path but I do worry that there is no space left in this field for people who aren't Extremely Online.

This is how i feel too -- that success would require embracing Extremely Online stuff, which i just can't ever do.

I’m very sorry for this, PPs. As a visual artist I feel similarly. The cream is not rising to the top, just the IG detritus.

Now you just sound bitter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Twitter is toxic. I would not be able to write at all if I were required to maintain a presence there. I understand entree to some genres is predicated on a social media presence, but I write literary fiction and no one has cared, yet. I'm still emerging as a writer, at the stage of having an agent and novel manuscripts to shop. Just wanted to offer encouragement for those who are trying to break in without wasting all their writing time acting like a hypocritical "woke" wanker on Twitter, bullying anyone who dares have an independent thought.

+1

Also, you can build a small Twitter following and presence just tweeting occasionally (usually praise for writing I read and enjoyed) and following other writers and publications. I tweet maybe twice a month. And I NEVER dive into stuff like Bad Art Friend on Twitter. I just use it as a place to find good writing, info about classes or events I might want to attend, as well as support for stuff like 1000wordsofsummer or my daily writing practice. I don't pay attention to politics on Twitter or trending topics or anything. I don't care. I get my news from the paper and a couple podcasts. Twitter is just a way to decompress at the end of the day (like DCUM) and I have zero interest in being Extremely Online. It's a waste. I'd rather be writing!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to God, I'd like to pursue writing, but I just CANNOT STAND writer Twitter. And it seems like you have to have a Twitter following to get published. Have some other folks decided not to take certain career paths because of social media nonsense?

Agreed. This has been a barrier to my development and confidence as a writer, tbh. I've mostly kept away from social media for my mental health. Privacy is incredibly important to me as a survivor of violence. But my lack of social capital via a notable twitter/ig presence, or the desire to achieve one, has discouraged me from submitting my work and connecting with other writers out of fear of rejection. I'm still trying to forge my own little path but I do worry that there is no space left in this field for people who aren't Extremely Online.

This is how i feel too -- that success would require embracing Extremely Online stuff, which i just can't ever do.

I’m very sorry for this, PPs. As a visual artist I feel similarly. The cream is not rising to the top, just the IG detritus.

Now you just sound bitter.

DP. Maybe? It doesn't seem that far off though. I don't know anything about the visual art world, but if getting noticed means making art that gets noticed on IG, that changes art, and maybe not for the best.

[Anonymous]

From Data Lounge:

Check out Celeste Ng’s Wikipedia page. Someone has added this:

"In October 2021, she was involved in an online controversy wherein she stated a kidney donor should “go f*ck herself and her one kidney.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:From Data Lounge:

Check out Celeste Ng’s Wikipedia page. Someone has added this:

"In October 2021, she was involved in an online controversy wherein she stated a kidney donor should “go f*ck herself and her one kidney.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would love to know what Reese thinks of this situation - she’s the ultimate loyal friend who goes out of her way to bring women up.

Reese Witherspoon?

Makes sense, Reese needs to not pick any of these authors for her book club.

Reese seems like someone with a lot of integrity. And I think it’s part of her brand to be nice and uplifting to women. I bet she picks a book next based on illness or disability for her book club but doesn’t comment on the discourse.

She produced BLL and knows Ng.

I don't think she will comment, but I think Ng is toast in Hollywood. I bet Reese is having her canceled right now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would love to know what Reese thinks of this situation - she’s the ultimate loyal friend who goes out of her way to bring women up.

Reese Witherspoon?

Makes sense, Reese needs to not pick any of these authors for her book club.

Reese seems like someone with a lot of integrity. And I think it’s part of her brand to be nice and uplifting to women. I bet she picks a book next based on illness or disability for her book club but doesn’t comment on the discourse.

She produced BLL and knows Ng.

I don't think she will comment, but I think Ng is toast in Hollywood. I bet Reese is having her canceled right now.

I doubt it. Hollywood doesn't care.

[Anonymous]

God, is this saga going to be never-ending?

But this entire thread is excellent.