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Montgomery County Public Schools (MCPS)
Race in MoCo magnets
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Anonymous
| Is being hispanic an advantage in getting a spot into a magnet program in MoCo. I'm really just curious. |
Anonymous
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I think it's pure lottery for the MS, so race doesn't factor into it.
For the Highly Gifted ES Centers and TP ES Magnet. It is an application process. MoCo states "Criteria used to evaluate candidates include above-grade-level achievement; teacher, parent, and community recommendations; test scores, and report card grades. All Grade 3 parents are mailed an application. School staff and parents can recommend Grade 3 students." No discussion of diversity impact - so it is possible that diversity is considered, but I have heard nothing about that. I welcome any clarification. |
Anonymous
The Takoma Park Middle School Science and Math magnet is an application program. So is the humanities magnet program at Eastern Middle School. You'd have to check the MCPS website to determine which programs are application and which are lottery. |
Anonymous
| I think it's an advantage if MoCo can figure out that you're a minority, without being allowed to ask it directly on the application. We know a family that works this by mentioning background in the application essays, having the kids join diversity-related groups that get mentioned in the application packet, and the like. It's not that hard to finagle this, when the application essays (in our year at least) were along the lines of "how would you introduce yourself to new kids?" |
Anonymous
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Race is not a permitted consideration on MoCo magnet applications. It is not asked on the application form, although nothing precludes the kind of volunteer mention described by PP above.
If one had evidence that race was influencing the decision-making, it would be grounds for a lawsuit. This is well-settled law in MD. See Eisenberg case & history. As one who has a child in a magnet, I can't say that minority race helps kids get in, as there is very little diversity in our program, and that is the biggest drawback about it, IMO. I would like to see more diversity, but why the lack of diversity happens (clearly not for lack of bright minority students) and how to rectify it is a subject for another thread. TPMS and EMS are both application magnets which require high test scores, good grades, teacher recs., etc. They are NOT entrance by lottery. |
Anonymous
| FWIW: When we were applying to Takoma, I was told by someone who I can argue has reason to know [but cannot say absolutely that this person DID know] that there is pressure to make the program geographically diverse, and there is some sense that this can be a proxy for ethnic diversity (which I believe, as pp said, cannot be explicitly used as a criteria). So, while a child who is not qualified will not be admitted, there are many more qualified children than slots. So of those qualified, some choice may be made to favor "up county" and "east county" over "west county." |
Anonymous
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As far as I know, as someone mentioned there was a big court case in MD a few years ago and race cannot be used for magnet program selection. Here is an old article that mentioned a case - not sure if it is the same one the PP mentioned
http://www.nytimes.com/2000/04/02/weekinreview/ideas-trends-bus-stop-the-lost-promise-of-school-integration.html?pagewanted=1 That said, there can be geographic diversity. Also, I believe in response to protests from black parents about the makeup of the middle school magnets the county made more of the magnet programs open instead of by test scores only. I think that is the Consortia/Choice option. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A15425-2005Mar7.html |
Anonymous
One has to be careful in speaking about "magnets." In the article you reference, parents of color were complaining about poor admittance numbers/rates for students of color to what I would call the "competitive" magnets like Takoma Park Middle School and Eastern Middle School. These magnet schools usually teach a large cohort of students at least 1-2 years above grade level. When you refer to "consortia" or "choice" programs, IMO, these are not of the same quality/reputation as the "competitive" magnets. (I am not saying they're not good.) I am speaking here of the middle school consortia which includes Loiderman (the arts school) and 2 others (whose names escape me at the moment but one of which focuses on aeronautics). I would call these "thematic" magnets. Kids also must apply to these, but they are selected more on interest rather than academic achievement or aptitude/IQ testing. I want to make the distinction, because I actually believe that AfAm/Latino parents have every right to be concerned that their kids are not being selected for the competitive magnets. But, I think MoCo tries to hide the ball a little bit by offering these "thematic" magnets and pretending they are the same. I would like to see more transparency in MoCo about the competitive magnet selection process at all levels -- elem/middle/high -- (who gets in )w/ what grades, recs, test scores, etc.), but I'm afraid that this would reveal that there are many qualified students who are not selected, thus putting pressure on the whole magnet concept. I also would like to see more thought as to what kind of biases might be built into the current selection process. (i.e. Latino kids who don't speak English as a first language are much less likely to do well on the standardized tests which are a critical component of the admission process and at least two instruments -- the parent and teacher rec. -- depend on identifying a student as "gifted" and may intrinsically be subject to biases which weed out AfAm/Latino students.) Also, cultural and socioeconomic barriers to application/participation need to be mitigated (like providing buses and application help as the cited article mentioned, but more). |
Anonymous
| The Blair magnet seems to be predominantly Asian and Indian kids. |
Anonymous
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The difference between the "magnets" and the "consortium" schools is that entrance to the magnets is by application including essays and a test (in December of the year before), while the consortium schools like Loiederman are by lottery.
That said, it's true that there isn't a lot of diversity in the magnets. MCPS leadership is pretty concerned about this, which you can see in public statements by school board members. I too have heard that the "geographic" diversity requirement is indeed a proxy for race. (Although I'm not sure how well this would work, given that a higher percentage of caucasian parents from downcounty are probably applying to magnets to escape their local MS and HS, while more Whitman and Churchill families are probably staying where they are! Maybe in practice the "geographic diversity" just ends up compensating for this, who really knows.) Also, if there's any way kids can indicate race on the magnet application, this would probably help. With Hispanic kids, the name might help. (With Asian kids, ironically, having an ethnic name might hurt. On the MoCo parent listserve a few days ago somebody posted proceedings from a court case where a parent alleged that his kid was denied a magnet slot because he was Asian, despite test scores in the high 90s. While you could argue about the kid's so-so grades and teacher recs, which MoCo did, I found MoCo's separate argument that they "didn't know the kid was Asian" to be disingeneous and ridiculous, given that the kid's last name was on all his application forms.) |
Anonymous
| Presumably the solution for increasing diversity at the "lottery" schools would be to increase minority applicants? If admission is truly a numbers game, based on probabilities, which I believe is the case. I know MoCo does outreach to minority communities, but maybe it's not having enough effect. |
Anonymous
I actually think the "thematic" magnets, which are done by lottery, are a great thing. They take the pressure off kids of all races to get into, for example at the MS level, one of only two competitive magnets. If a kid can say they're doing music at Loiderman, then the kids feels good about himself/herself, is doing something they truly like. I actually hate this system of testing kids for MS and HS, and even though my kids have done fairly well at it, it's still really stressfull. But Weast has made noises about cutting the thematic magnets. And he doesn't seem enamored of the test-based magnets. And he's threatened to cut busses to all of them.... |
Anonymous
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18:23 here again. I should clarify that I think the lack of diversity in the test-based magnets is a bad thing. I just wanted to pitch in in support of the thematic magnets.
I'm not sure what the solution is to increasing diversity in the magnets. Some (but not all) of the magnets send out your kid's test score together with the median test score of accepted students, and this helps a bit with transparency. But there are certainly other problems, like a PP mentioned, related to the test-based admissions process. |
Anonymous
| The three MSMC schools take race, gender, FARMS and your home middle school ALL into account. It is NOT a true lottery. It is due to the purpose of WHY the MSMC was started in the first place. MCPS gets this information all from your child's school records. Once you put their ID number on the form, they pull all that data and enter it into the mix. |
Anonymous
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http://www.scribd.com/doc/26156319/2008-MSMC-MCPS-Program-Booklet
see page 18 for all the "rules" about the MSMC lottery |