Lessons Learned- College Admissions- If you had to do it all again.....

[Anonymous]

Also, don't think an EC has to be a club or sport. If your kid really likes something that isn't school, that's still an activity. Helping with hackathons? Chess tournaments? Maintaining a nature trail? There are things an introvert can do that don't require mingling but do show interests outside of schoolwork, and that matters. My kid did none of those.

This is true. My DC didn’t have a single sport, but has done a lot of community theater and related internships. Didn’t even do that much with HS theater. Got a letter of rec from someone with the community theater program. Got into all matches, some of which are top 30-40 LACs, and a top 40 national university with a bit of merit offered.

[Anonymous]

If I had to do it all over again, I'd tell my kids to look at schools where they think they'll fit in socially and make good friends. I wouldn't focus on majors during the application process (since their interests changed dramatically in college) or prestige.

I'd also take a closer look at what the school can offer the student. One of my children went to a school that's "prestigious" in the DMV but is poor as dirt. There is money for a certain activity, but beyond that, there's not much going on in terms of speakers, campus events, etc. Even the available course list each semester is pretty lackluster and repetitive. So while my kid went to a more "prestigious" school, it certainly wasn't a very enjoyable experience for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I found the Jeff Seligo book eye-opening. Some of it I already knew, but it never occurred to me how much a kid’s chosen major could factor into the admissions decision.

I’m glad my senior DC didn’t want to major in STEM! 😁

This is not our experience. DC has wanted to do engineering since 8th grade. Never even thought about how much more competitive applying to E schools would be. Got into all of the state (Michigan, UIUC, UVA, etc) flagships, T10 and T20. Rejected by MIT and Columbia. Good stats, SAT north of 1500 but not over 1550. I guess ignorance is bliss. DC would’ve been much more stressed if knowing how stiff the engineering competition actually is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Start the Common App in 9th grade...keep using it to add all the EC stats. You get into the habit of logging your accomplishment as well as have a fair sense where your application is weak.

Chart your courses for the entire HS journey beginning of 9th grade

Advanced Math actually starts from ES years. Don't wait for the school to enrich and accelerate. You can do it on your own by using Khan Academy.

College visits from 10th grade. Virtual is absolutely fine. Interview them.

You can do this?? I didn't even know that.

+2. Is this true?

[Anonymous]

A couple of posters have mentioned ED, but that feels premature for some students who haven't had a chance to visit schools junior year because of covid. The visits kids did earlier may not have been very memorable for them, right, so wouldn't it be better to visit campus before committing through ED? A couple other posters also mentioned that kids' feelings about various schools may change from the fall of senior year to the spring.
My big issue is that if you need a little merit or other financial aid, how can you compare packages? Wouldn't you be missing the opportunity to save tens of thousands of dollars if you go ED and that school offers nothing while other schools in the same league or close to it offer you aid? I don't think there is an opportunity to go ED but then say, sorry, another school offered for example $100k over 4 years in merit aid so the kid needs to take that, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A couple of posters have mentioned ED, but that feels premature for some students who haven't had a chance to visit schools junior year because of covid. The visits kids did earlier may not have been very memorable for them, right, so wouldn't it be better to visit campus before committing through ED? A couple other posters also mentioned that kids' feelings about various schools may change from the fall of senior year to the spring.
My big issue is that if you need a little merit or other financial aid, how can you compare packages? Wouldn't you be missing the opportunity to save tens of thousands of dollars if you go ED and that school offers nothing while other schools in the same league or close to it offer you aid? I don't think there is an opportunity to go ED but then say, sorry, another school offered for example $100k over 4 years in merit aid so the kid needs to take that, right?

No, I don’t think so re: your last point. ED is great if you have the means to pay in full without worrying about it and your child is obsessed with a school. It’s certainly a gamble if those conditions aren’t met. EA is better from both an aid and keeping your options open perspective, but it’s not always offered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A couple of posters have mentioned ED, but that feels premature for some students who haven't had a chance to visit schools junior year because of covid. The visits kids did earlier may not have been very memorable for them, right, so wouldn't it be better to visit campus before committing through ED? A couple other posters also mentioned that kids' feelings about various schools may change from the fall of senior year to the spring.
My big issue is that if you need a little merit or other financial aid, how can you compare packages? Wouldn't you be missing the opportunity to save tens of thousands of dollars if you go ED and that school offers nothing while other schools in the same league or close to it offer you aid? I don't think there is an opportunity to go ED but then say, sorry, another school offered for example $100k over 4 years in merit aid so the kid needs to take that, right?

No, I don’t think so re: your last point. ED is great if you have the means to pay in full without worrying about it and your child is obsessed with a school. It’s certainly a gamble if those conditions aren’t met. EA is better from both an aid and keeping your options open perspective, but it’s not always offered.

Disagree 100%. You can run the NPC and see if the school is affordable long before you decide to ED there.

If you are applying to a college that gives merit aid, and your stats qualify you, it is unlikely you need the admissions boost ED provides.

ED is the best choice for a high stats kid who wants admission to a competitive college. Indisputable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This was my 3rd going through, and I’m vocal as to how brutal it was for us. My take-always - if they know what they want to study, do the legwork up front. Compare programs. You may be surprised by which schools you eliminate, or in our case, added and ultimately got accepted to.

Make sure your child understands the “most rigorous” box on the application and which schools (reaches) this matters to.

Visit schools early, just to get an understanding of how big a public flagship is vs SLAC. It’s expensive and time-consuming to get accepted to a mix of schools and then have to answer what you like/dislike when that could have been done early.

Which brings me to the final - set expectations that they may not know til April or later. My first too were accepted ED and know by Thanksgiving. Tons of time to celebrate, sweatshirts for everyone for Christmas, time to find roommates, and visit. And if waitlisted - ugh! Some schools allow for dorm selections once admitted, and if there isn’t enough housing, then there is so much anxiety because all the ED and EA kids get priority. We are eliminating one for this very reason.

Sorry, can you explain what this means?

On what the school counselor submits, there is a question asking whether the student took the most rigorous curriculum available. If, for example, the school offered Calc BC but student only took AB, counselor will not check that box. Ivys and highly selective schools sift applications based on this. There is ample discussion on this on this forum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A couple of posters have mentioned ED, but that feels premature for some students who haven't had a chance to visit schools junior year because of covid. The visits kids did earlier may not have been very memorable for them, right, so wouldn't it be better to visit campus before committing through ED? A couple other posters also mentioned that kids' feelings about various schools may change from the fall of senior year to the spring.
My big issue is that if you need a little merit or other financial aid, how can you compare packages? Wouldn't you be missing the opportunity to save tens of thousands of dollars if you go ED and that school offers nothing while other schools in the same league or close to it offer you aid? I don't think there is an opportunity to go ED but then say, sorry, another school offered for example $100k over 4 years in merit aid so the kid needs to take that, right?

No, I don’t think so re: your last point. ED is great if you have the means to pay in full without worrying about it and your child is obsessed with a school. It’s certainly a gamble if those conditions aren’t met. EA is better from both an aid and keeping your options open perspective, but it’s not always offered.

Disagree 100%. You can run the NPC and see if the school is affordable long before you decide to ED there.

If you are applying to a college that gives merit aid, and your stats qualify you, it is unlikely you need the admissions boost ED provides.

ED is the best choice for a high stats kid who wants admission to a competitive college. Indisputable.

NPC numbers don't mean that's what you'll actually get. I went to an overpriced private college and knew more than a few kids who had to forgo attending altogether because the final numbers they got from FA didn't match their expectations. Or, worse still, were the ones who got numbers similar to the NPC in year one, but then got "adjusted" figures in year 2 and had to transfer. Merit aid, especially at a cut-and-dry place like Alabama, is different, you're right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This was my 3rd going through, and I’m vocal as to how brutal it was for us. My take-always - if they know what they want to study, do the legwork up front. Compare programs. You may be surprised by which schools you eliminate, or in our case, added and ultimately got accepted to.

Make sure your child understands the “most rigorous” box on the application and which schools (reaches) this matters to.

Visit schools early, just to get an understanding of how big a public flagship is vs SLAC. It’s expensive and time-consuming to get accepted to a mix of schools and then have to answer what you like/dislike when that could have been done early.

Which brings me to the final - set expectations that they may not know til April or later. My first too were accepted ED and know by Thanksgiving. Tons of time to celebrate, sweatshirts for everyone for Christmas, time to find roommates, and visit. And if waitlisted - ugh! Some schools allow for dorm selections once admitted, and if there isn’t enough housing, then there is so much anxiety because all the ED and EA kids get priority. We are eliminating one for this very reason.

Sorry, can you explain what this means?

On what the school counselor submits, there is a question asking whether the student took the most rigorous curriculum available. If, for example, the school offered Calc BC but student only took AB, counselor will not check that box. Ivys and highly selective schools sift applications based on this. There is ample discussion on this on this forum.

It's a scale. It's not yes or no. My kid didn't have the top box checked, or even the next one down, and he's going to Georgetown next year. Don't let this poster scare you. You take the most rigorous courses for you[i]. That's the point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This was my 3rd going through, and I’m vocal as to how brutal it was for us. My take-always - if they know what they want to study, do the legwork up front. Compare programs. You may be surprised by which schools you eliminate, or in our case, added and ultimately got accepted to.

Make sure your child understands the “most rigorous” box on the application and which schools (reaches) this matters to.

Visit schools early, just to get an understanding of how big a public flagship is vs SLAC. It’s expensive and time-consuming to get accepted to a mix of schools and then have to answer what you like/dislike when that could have been done early.

Which brings me to the final - set expectations that they may not know til April or later. My first too were accepted ED and know by Thanksgiving. Tons of time to celebrate, sweatshirts for everyone for Christmas, time to find roommates, and visit. And if waitlisted - ugh! Some schools allow for dorm selections once admitted, and if there isn’t enough housing, then there is so much anxiety because all the ED and EA kids get priority. We are eliminating one for this very reason.

Sorry, can you explain what this means?

On what the school counselor submits, there is a question asking whether the student took the most rigorous curriculum available. If, for example, the school offered Calc BC but student only took AB, counselor will not check that box. Ivys and highly selective schools sift applications based on this. There is ample discussion on this on this forum.

It's a scale. It's not yes or no. My kid didn't have the top box checked, or even the next one down, and he's going to Georgetown next year. Don't let this poster scare you. You take the most rigorous courses for you[i]. That's the point.

+1 million

The "most rigorous courses" thing is soooooooo overblown. It's the urban legend of choice for the College Confidential set.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Also, don't think an EC has to be a club or sport. If your kid really likes something that isn't school, that's still an activity. Helping with hackathons? Chess tournaments? Maintaining a nature trail? There are things an introvert can do that don't require mingling but do show interests outside of schoolwork, and that matters. My kid did none of those.

This is true. My DC didn’t have a single sport, but has done a lot of community theater and related internships. Didn’t even do that much with HS theater. Got a letter of rec from someone with the community theater program. Got into all matches, some of which are top 30-40 LACs, and a top 40 national university with a bit of merit offered.

So appreciative of these responses. DC loves music and has learned to play 2 instruments watching YouTube lessons. In terms of helping. DC is the “go to” for free math lessons from neighbors, cousins and, as a junior, classmates who know they can get a well explained lesson from a non judgmental peer (as explained in a recent note with gift card sent to our house). Problem I see is that none of these hours are verifiable by an institution or organization, which seems to be what you need to do to document ECs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What would you do differently? What advice would you give to yourself one or two years earlier? Would you have your DC take different courses? Would you and DC apply to different schools? What did you wish you knew as a parent of a sophomore/junior? Thanks in advance!

High school is a good time for parents to practice the gentle art of shutting up and letting your kid decide, even if it means subjecting your friends to the rants you have withheld (try to limit that, too, and provide baked goods or pedicure gift certificates to compensate).

I would have asked sooner if my generally independent kid wanted help, and what kind, and I would have listened.

(I have a kid with very good stats and very limited ECs. I think that kept him out of one place where he probably would have done very well academically, but you know what? Someone who helped make their school's clubs or sports happen got that spot, and I think that's totally fair.)

Thanks so much for your advice. We have a very smart, very introverted child. Not enough ECs. Wonder if you mind sharing the type of school your DC was rejected, or a comparable one. Thanks

Big state (not our state) school known for computer science/engineering (is that precise enough to be helpful?). He did get into some selective schools, but not ones with an admit rate below 20%.

Also, don't think an EC has to be a club or sport. If your kid really likes something that isn't school, that's still an activity. Helping with hackathons? Chess tournaments? Maintaining a nature trail? There are things an introvert can do that don't require mingling but do show interests outside of schoolwork, and that matters. My kid did none of those.

But also, getting into a school with a 30% admit rate is still a path towards a happy life. Maybe getting into someplace very good, not jaw-droppingly OH WOW, is a tradeoff your kid is willing to make in exchange for being left alone.

Yes, this is very helpful. Appreciate the response and advice. Thanks!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Also, don't think an EC has to be a club or sport. If your kid really likes something that isn't school, that's still an activity. Helping with hackathons? Chess tournaments? Maintaining a nature trail? There are things an introvert can do that don't require mingling but do show interests outside of schoolwork, and that matters. My kid did none of those.

This is true. My DC didn’t have a single sport, but has done a lot of community theater and related internships. Didn’t even do that much with HS theater. Got a letter of rec from someone with the community theater program. Got into all matches, some of which are top 30-40 LACs, and a top 40 national university with a bit of merit offered.

So appreciative of these responses. DC loves music and has learned to play 2 instruments watching YouTube lessons. In terms of helping. DC is the “go to” for free math lessons from neighbors, cousins and, as a junior, classmates who know they can get a well explained lesson from a non judgmental peer (as explained in a recent note with gift card sent to our house). Problem I see is that none of these hours are verifiable by an institution or organization, which seems to be what you need to do to document ECs.

How about an essay on teaching himself to play an instrument? Could be great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Also, don't think an EC has to be a club or sport. If your kid really likes something that isn't school, that's still an activity. Helping with hackathons? Chess tournaments? Maintaining a nature trail? There are things an introvert can do that don't require mingling but do show interests outside of schoolwork, and that matters. My kid did none of those.

This is true. My DC didn’t have a single sport, but has done a lot of community theater and related internships. Didn’t even do that much with HS theater. Got a letter of rec from someone with the community theater program. Got into all matches, some of which are top 30-40 LACs, and a top 40 national university with a bit of merit offered.

So appreciative of these responses. DC loves music and has learned to play 2 instruments watching YouTube lessons. In terms of helping. DC is the “go to” for free math lessons from neighbors, cousins and, as a junior, classmates who know they can get a well explained lesson from a non judgmental peer (as explained in a recent note with gift card sent to our house). Problem I see is that none of these hours are verifiable by an institution or organization, which seems to be what you need to do to document ECs.

How about an essay on teaching himself to play an instrument? Could be great.

Also, if a teacher or guidance counselor knows of his tutoring, they can mention it in their letter of recommendation.