Achilles

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sal's immaturity and arrogance applies to his coaching at SJC. Screams on the side lines, says derogatory things to players and doesn't really create a team atmosphere. His style of 'coaching' is the same as what others have said about his Achilles teams. Focus is on the top players, doesn't really concern himself with development of the whole team, puts only the top players out, sometimes to the detriment of the game. Not exactly a role model or coach that develops talent in the players for the long-term to create a solid team and win championships.

I've seen this on display 1st hand as well. We would never let our kid play for him, he sets a horrible example for kids.

Three years later and al these comments have aged well. Achilles is struggling because of the lead character.

[Anonymous]

With that said, can someone detail what has happened over the last year or two? I've heard that some of their teams almost dissolved, some were kicked out of MLS Next, etc., but I know nothing firsthand.
With that said, my son has played against Sal teams, both Achilles and SJCHS, and the amount of screaming and abuse that comes out of that man's mouth all game is just breathtaking. Can't imagine letting my kid play for him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:With that said, can someone detail what has happened over the last year or two? I've heard that some of their teams almost dissolved, some were kicked out of MLS Next, etc., but I know nothing firsthand.
With that said, my son has played against Sal teams, both Achilles and SJCHS, and the amount of screaming and abuse that comes out of that man's mouth all game is just breathtaking. Can't imagine letting my kid play for him.

The MLS Next badge is a powerful thing for parents focused on keeping up with the Jones's. Ignoring all else subjectively.
Stockholm Syndrome in the midst of all the negatives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our son has played for Sal for 2 years now. Previously played at DC United and left DCU to play for Sal. What we found is that Bethesda, Potomac, Pipeline, and every other club in the play the same style of soccer. Kick the ball far upfield and see who runs faster. Talk about a money grab!

Sal and Vinny are awesome coaches, training is intense and they have a great 07 team. Not sure why all the complaints, but hey you can't please everyone. I recommend to anyone who loves soccer and wants to see your child progress in possession based soccer. Hope this helps and open to any questions or comments!

Any program that markets "possession based futbol and individual technical development" as their philosophy and culture has to show the fruits at least occasionally on the weekend.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our son has played for Sal for 2 years now. Previously played at DC United and left DCU to play for Sal. What we found is that Bethesda, Potomac, Pipeline, and every other club in the play the same style of soccer. Kick the ball far upfield and see who runs faster. Talk about a money grab!

Sal and Vinny are awesome coaches, training is intense and they have a great 07 team. Not sure why all the complaints, but hey you can't please everyone. I recommend to anyone who loves soccer and wants to see your child progress in possession based soccer. Hope this helps and open to any questions or comments!

Any program that markets "possession based futbol and individual technical development" as their philosophy and culture has to show the fruits at least occasionally on the weekend.

Yeah, I've seen just the opposite too...BSC, Potomac and Pipleine all play a really nice possession game, whereas Achilles seems to try and recruit big and strong players and try to out-physical the other teams.

Again though, I'm with one of the PPs...does anyone have firsthand knowledge of what's happened with their teams over the past few years?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our son has played for Sal for 2 years now. Previously played at DC United and left DCU to play for Sal. What we found is that Bethesda, Potomac, Pipeline, and every other club in the play the same style of soccer. Kick the ball far upfield and see who runs faster. Talk about a money grab!

Sal and Vinny are awesome coaches, training is intense and they have a great 07 team. Not sure why all the complaints, but hey you can't please everyone. I recommend to anyone who loves soccer and wants to see your child progress in possession based soccer. Hope this helps and open to any questions or comments!

Any program that markets "possession based futbol and individual technical development" as their philosophy and culture has to show the fruits at least occasionally on the weekend.

Yeah, I've seen just the opposite too...BSC, Potomac and Pipleine all play a really nice possession game, whereas Achilles seems to try and recruit big and strong players and try to out-physical the other teams.

Again though, I'm with one of the PPs...does anyone have firsthand knowledge of what's happened with their teams over the past few years?

Probably under the banner of not evolving with the times, and a dash of egomaniacal narcissism. (allegedly)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our son has played for Sal for 2 years now. Previously played at DC United and left DCU to play for Sal. What we found is that Bethesda, Potomac, Pipeline, and every other club in the play the same style of soccer. Kick the ball far upfield and see who runs faster. Talk about a money grab!

Sal and Vinny are awesome coaches, training is intense and they have a great 07 team. Not sure why all the complaints, but hey you can't please everyone. I recommend to anyone who loves soccer and wants to see your child progress in possession based soccer. Hope this helps and open to any questions or comments!

Any program that markets "possession based futbol and individual technical development" as their philosophy and culture has to show the fruits at least occasionally on the weekend.

Like all clubs, Achilles has its good and bad. There are several(?) posters on this board who clearly have an axe to grind. As you can see from the history of this board, they went away when registration was required and now they're back to bash the club and can post multiple messages without it being clear they're doing so. This will be a lengthy post, but if anyone is genuinely interested in Achilles, I hope it will be helpful.

The above statement that Achilles is based on "possession based futbol and individual technical development" is absolutely true. It is stressed throughout training and in games. Achilles squads are generally physically smaller than their opponents and technically adept. They insist on building from the back and through the midfield. Sal and Vin Caccavale are the coaches of the top teams from the lower ages through U16. Throughout the years my son has been exposed to a lot of coaches at different clubs, camps, and private training. I honestly think Sal and Vin are two of the best I've seen at teaching the fundamental skills required to play this type of soccer, specifically as a midfield player. Their training sessions focus much more on individual skill than other programs and it shows in the quality of player they produce. Players focus on passing, receiving, 1v1 skills, being able to run with the ball, etc. And until about U14, the focus is on small-sided competition and movement and interchange in tighter spaces. They stress competition in their training sessions and both are high-energy and involved.

The descriptions of abuse from the sidelines are outdated and overblown. Sal has mellowed over the years, and while he still shouts, it's mostly limited to getting his players to "work," "win it back," "go the other way," or my favorite, "be a player."

The results on the field have not been great recently. Last year, their teams finished at or near the bottom in their MLS Next divisions at U13 (2010), U14 (2009), and U16 (2007). As good as the coaches are at teaching midfield play and skills, the teams falter in the attacking and defensive thirds and get little to no training for these positions. I've often seen Achilles teams lose matches in which they had probably the top 8 players on the pitch. Some of it is a function of the style and lack of physical dominance, but I think some of it is lack of ideas and asking kids to make decisions under intense pressure without a plan or pattern to play.

This year, Achilles is fielding MLS Next teams at the U13 (2011), U14 (2010), U16 (2008), and U19 (2005) age groups. The changes were not communicated to parents until very late in spring and parents still don't know how or why these age groups came about. Achilles is struggling to make these groups work and are bending the Late Developer rules in MLS Next to play players both up a year and down a year. Their 2010 team will have at least two and as many as four 2009 birth year players in a match. Their 2008 team will have a mix of players from 2009, 2008, and 2007. The 2007 and 2009 groups have been Achilles's strongest teams over the last several years and it was curious why these two age groups would go away. Maybe they negotiated a way to have their best players play in multiple age groups. You can see the effect of the roster shuffling if you take a look at their results in the Copa Rayados in August. In a tournament where players had to play on-age, Achilles lost almost every match, some by lopsided scores, and often to lower-level teams. In their MLS Next league games, they've been at least competitive, thanks to playing players down.

I have no idea what the future holds for Achilles. I think they fill a niche in the area and I hope they rebound fully. With better communication and determination, they could parlay their coaching skills into something great. They could be the upstart, destination club they were a couple of years ago.

[Anonymous]

I just reread the Post above and thought I left out several challenges with Achilles. 1. Sal has a tendency to focus on his best players. The club could go a long way toward giving all the kids the same amount of attention. And as noted, if your kid is a defender or forward, there is little to no coaching in games or in scrimmages. 2. The practice locations vary with little notice. Lots of clubs struggle for field space so this is not strange. Training for the MLS Next groups have been, for the most part, at St. John's in the fall. The spring is more of a crap shoot with practices in Bethesda, Silver Spring, Wheaton, and sometimes the soccerplex. Which leads me to the third, the instability. It feels like the club's existence is on a knife's edge. There is little communication about their status with MLS Next and the scramble to try to make competitive teams among age groups is worrisome. I have NOT heard anything to this effect, but if they ever lose their affiliation with St. John's it feels like the whole thing could fold. Anyway, that's my fourteen-ish cents' worth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just reread the Post above and thought I left out several challenges with Achilles. 1. Sal has a tendency to focus on his best players. The club could go a long way toward giving all the kids the same amount of attention. And as noted, if your kid is a defender or forward, there is little to no coaching in games or in scrimmages. 2. The practice locations vary with little notice. Lots of clubs struggle for field space so this is not strange. Training for the MLS Next groups have been, for the most part, at St. John's in the fall. The spring is more of a crap shoot with practices in Bethesda, Silver Spring, Wheaton, and sometimes the soccerplex. Which leads me to the third, the instability. It feels like the club's existence is on a knife's edge. There is little communication about their status with MLS Next and the scramble to try to make competitive teams among age groups is worrisome. I have NOT heard anything to this effect, but if they ever lose their affiliation with St. John's it feels like the whole thing could fold. Anyway, that's my fourteen-ish cents' worth.

Very fair and balanced

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just reread the Post above and thought I left out several challenges with Achilles. 1. Sal has a tendency to focus on his best players. The club could go a long way toward giving all the kids the same amount of attention. And as noted, if your kid is a defender or forward, there is little to no coaching in games or in scrimmages. 2. The practice locations vary with little notice. Lots of clubs struggle for field space so this is not strange. Training for the MLS Next groups have been, for the most part, at St. John's in the fall. The spring is more of a crap shoot with practices in Bethesda, Silver Spring, Wheaton, and sometimes the soccerplex. Which leads me to the third, the instability. It feels like the club's existence is on a knife's edge. There is little communication about their status with MLS Next and the scramble to try to make competitive teams among age groups is worrisome. I have NOT heard anything to this effect, but if they ever lose their affiliation with St. John's it feels like the whole thing could fold. Anyway, that's my fourteen-ish cents' worth.

From the descriptions of the program philosophy and combined with the consistent prolonged poor results in games, sounds like this organization is more suited for private training on specific technical elements of the game.

Rather than a competitive club with teams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:With that said, can someone detail what has happened over the last year or two? I've heard that some of their teams almost dissolved, some were kicked out of MLS Next, etc., but I know nothing firsthand.
With that said, my son has played against Sal teams, both Achilles and SJCHS, and the amount of screaming and abuse that comes out of that man's mouth all game is just breathtaking. Can't imagine letting my kid play for him.

It’s not all peachy at other schools in WCAC- let me tell you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our son has played for Sal for 2 years now. Previously played at DC United and left DCU to play for Sal. What we found is that Bethesda, Potomac, Pipeline, and every other club in the play the same style of soccer. Kick the ball far upfield and see who runs faster. Talk about a money grab!

Sal and Vinny are awesome coaches, training is intense and they have a great 07 team. Not sure why all the complaints, but hey you can't please everyone. I recommend to anyone who loves soccer and wants to see your child progress in possession based soccer. Hope this helps and open to any questions or comments!

Any program that markets "possession based futbol and individual technical development" as their philosophy and culture has to show the fruits at least occasionally on the weekend.

Like all clubs, Achilles has its good and bad. There are several(?) posters on this board who clearly have an axe to grind. As you can see from the history of this board, they went away when registration was required and now they're back to bash the club and can post multiple messages without it being clear they're doing so. This will be a lengthy post, but if anyone is genuinely interested in Achilles, I hope it will be helpful.

The above statement that Achilles is based on "possession based futbol and individual technical development" is absolutely true. It is stressed throughout training and in games. Achilles squads are generally physically smaller than their opponents and technically adept. They insist on building from the back and through the midfield. Sal and Vin Caccavale are the coaches of the top teams from the lower ages through U16. Throughout the years my son has been exposed to a lot of coaches at different clubs, camps, and private training. I honestly think Sal and Vin are two of the best I've seen at teaching the fundamental skills required to play this type of soccer, specifically as a midfield player. Their training sessions focus much more on individual skill than other programs and it shows in the quality of player they produce. Players focus on passing, receiving, 1v1 skills, being able to run with the ball, etc. And until about U14, the focus is on small-sided competition and movement and interchange in tighter spaces. They stress competition in their training sessions and both are high-energy and involved.

The descriptions of abuse from the sidelines are outdated and overblown. Sal has mellowed over the years, and while he still shouts, it's mostly limited to getting his players to "work," "win it back," "go the other way," or my favorite, "be a player."

The results on the field have not been great recently. Last year, their teams finished at or near the bottom in their MLS Next divisions at U13 (2010), U14 (2009), and U16 (2007). As good as the coaches are at teaching midfield play and skills, the teams falter in the attacking and defensive thirds and get little to no training for these positions. I've often seen Achilles teams lose matches in which they had probably the top 8 players on the pitch. Some of it is a function of the style and lack of physical dominance, but I think some of it is lack of ideas and asking kids to make decisions under intense pressure without a plan or pattern to play.

This year, Achilles is fielding MLS Next teams at the U13 (2011), U14 (2010), U16 (2008), and U19 (2005) age groups. The changes were not communicated to parents until very late in spring and parents still don't know how or why these age groups came about. Achilles is struggling to make these groups work and are bending the Late Developer rules in MLS Next to play players both up a year and down a year. Their 2010 team will have at least two and as many as four 2009 birth year players in a match. Their 2008 team will have a mix of players from 2009, 2008, and 2007. The 2007 and 2009 groups have been Achilles's strongest teams over the last several years and it was curious why these two age groups would go away. Maybe they negotiated a way to have their best players play in multiple age groups. You can see the effect of the roster shuffling if you take a look at their results in the Copa Rayados in August. In a tournament where players had to play on-age, Achilles lost almost every match, some by lopsided scores, and often to lower-level teams. In their MLS Next league games, they've been at least competitive, thanks to playing players down.

I have no idea what the future holds for Achilles. I think they fill a niche in the area and I hope they rebound fully. With better communication and determination, they could parlay their coaching skills into something great. They could be the upstart, destination club they were a couple of years ago.

This is a very accurate description of Achilles program -- this poster knows the program well. Vin and Sal are very good at helping develop players' technical skills. That is true. The program is singularly focused on getting players to play the ball quickly and maintain possession. But that is all. These are good skills and will allow a player to handle pressure. But unfortunately for Achilles, the game of soccer has many dimensions to it -- and ball possession is but one of these. Achilles is great example of why America has not produced many elite/dangerous international players. Achilles focuses singularly on small-sided possession drills and does a nice job of that. But there is no room for imagination and creativity at the club -- which is ultimately why America continues to produce players that can "exist" at the international level -- but in supporting roles only (i.e., can keep possession under pressure, etc.). Achilles will never develop dangerous playmakers as it does not allow players to explore their talents. To do this, one must be willing to experience failure and there must be some tolerance for mistakes...which are inevitable when you explore and push the limits of your talents. Achilles is not environment that allows for this type of creativity and exploration. If you are not blessed with natural physical gifts (i.e., have a ceiling on what you can realistically do on the pitch) and your best and highest use as a player is destined to be maintaining ball possession as a supporting cast member -- Achilles is a great place for you. If you are physically gifted and have the natural ability to "do more" (e.g., win tackles, ball striker, play interesting long balls, etc.) -- Achilles will not allow you explore these gifts. The players are discouraged from doing so and they play with considerable fear -- which, again, is classic "American" soccer (e.g., lots of negative ball movement out of fear of dispossession). To be honest, Achilles would be better suited as a clinic and camp business. For those looking for a "team" feel -- this is not the club. The consistent negativity (that starts at the top) trickles down to the players. When things go wrong (e.g., possession is lost), players are quick to turn on one another (that is the Achilles way). If I were in a foxhole -- the last people on Earth I'd want beside me are Achilles players. There is no "team" -- only individuals. To recap, Achilles will help improve technical capabilities as it relates to maintaining possession under pressure. If small-sided possession was a sport -- Achilles would be the #1 club in the US. But the game of soccer has many layers and dimensions -- which is why it is such a wonder sport. Vin and Sal are focused on only one small (albeit important) part of the overall mosaic of the game. But they will never produce truly exceptional talent because the club does not support creative exploration and creates a culture of fear and blame, which is a shame (but not wholly surprising; Vin played a now defunct D2 program and Sal played at AU -- these are not guys that played at the highest level by any stretch).

[Anonymous]

based on my experience with Achilles the post above is very accurate. Possession without a purpose. Kids do not understand soccer at all. They even cannot produce good 3v3 team because there is a scoring part not only possession.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our son has played for Sal for 2 years now. Previously played at DC United and left DCU to play for Sal. What we found is that Bethesda, Potomac, Pipeline, and every other club in the play the same style of soccer. Kick the ball far upfield and see who runs faster. Talk about a money grab!

Sal and Vinny are awesome coaches, training is intense and they have a great 07 team. Not sure why all the complaints, but hey you can't please everyone. I recommend to anyone who loves soccer and wants to see your child progress in possession based soccer. Hope this helps and open to any questions or comments!

Any program that markets "possession based futbol and individual technical development" as their philosophy and culture has to show the fruits at least occasionally on the weekend.

Like all clubs, Achilles has its good and bad. There are several(?) posters on this board who clearly have an axe to grind. As you can see from the history of this board, they went away when registration was required and now they're back to bash the club and can post multiple messages without it being clear they're doing so. This will be a lengthy post, but if anyone is genuinely interested in Achilles, I hope it will be helpful.

The above statement that Achilles is based on "possession based futbol and individual technical development" is absolutely true. It is stressed throughout training and in games. Achilles squads are generally physically smaller than their opponents and technically adept. They insist on building from the back and through the midfield. Sal and Vin Caccavale are the coaches of the top teams from the lower ages through U16. Throughout the years my son has been exposed to a lot of coaches at different clubs, camps, and private training. I honestly think Sal and Vin are two of the best I've seen at teaching the fundamental skills required to play this type of soccer, specifically as a midfield player. Their training sessions focus much more on individual skill than other programs and it shows in the quality of player they produce. Players focus on passing, receiving, 1v1 skills, being able to run with the ball, etc. And until about U14, the focus is on small-sided competition and movement and interchange in tighter spaces. They stress competition in their training sessions and both are high-energy and involved.

The descriptions of abuse from the sidelines are outdated and overblown. Sal has mellowed over the years, and while he still shouts, it's mostly limited to getting his players to "work," "win it back," "go the other way," or my favorite, "be a player."

The results on the field have not been great recently. Last year, their teams finished at or near the bottom in their MLS Next divisions at U13 (2010), U14 (2009), and U16 (2007). As good as the coaches are at teaching midfield play and skills, the teams falter in the attacking and defensive thirds and get little to no training for these positions. I've often seen Achilles teams lose matches in which they had probably the top 8 players on the pitch. Some of it is a function of the style and lack of physical dominance, but I think some of it is lack of ideas and asking kids to make decisions under intense pressure without a plan or pattern to play.

This year, Achilles is fielding MLS Next teams at the U13 (2011), U14 (2010), U16 (2008), and U19 (2005) age groups. The changes were not communicated to parents until very late in spring and parents still don't know how or why these age groups came about. Achilles is struggling to make these groups work and are bending the Late Developer rules in MLS Next to play players both up a year and down a year. Their 2010 team will have at least two and as many as four 2009 birth year players in a match. Their 2008 team will have a mix of players from 2009, 2008, and 2007. The 2007 and 2009 groups have been Achilles's strongest teams over the last several years and it was curious why these two age groups would go away. Maybe they negotiated a way to have their best players play in multiple age groups. You can see the effect of the roster shuffling if you take a look at their results in the Copa Rayados in August. In a tournament where players had to play on-age, Achilles lost almost every match, some by lopsided scores, and often to lower-level teams. In their MLS Next league games, they've been at least competitive, thanks to playing players down.

I have no idea what the future holds for Achilles. I think they fill a niche in the area and I hope they rebound fully. With better communication and determination, they could parlay their coaching skills into something great. They could be the upstart, destination club they were a couple of years ago.

This is a very accurate description of Achilles program -- this poster knows the program well. Vin and Sal are very good at helping develop players' technical skills. That is true. The program is singularly focused on getting players to play the ball quickly and maintain possession. But that is all. These are good skills and will allow a player to handle pressure. But unfortunately for Achilles, the game of soccer has many dimensions to it -- and ball possession is but one of these. Achilles is great example of why America has not produced many elite/dangerous international players. Achilles focuses singularly on small-sided possession drills and does a nice job of that. But there is no room for imagination and creativity at the club -- which is ultimately why America continues to produce players that can "exist" at the international level -- but in supporting roles only (i.e., can keep possession under pressure, etc.). Achilles will never develop dangerous playmakers as it does not allow players to explore their talents. To do this, one must be willing to experience failure and there must be some tolerance for mistakes...which are inevitable when you explore and push the limits of your talents. Achilles is not environment that allows for this type of creativity and exploration. If you are not blessed with natural physical gifts (i.e., have a ceiling on what you can realistically do on the pitch) and your best and highest use as a player is destined to be maintaining ball possession as a supporting cast member -- Achilles is a great place for you. If you are physically gifted and have the natural ability to "do more" (e.g., win tackles, ball striker, play interesting long balls, etc.) -- Achilles will not allow you explore these gifts. The players are discouraged from doing so and they play with considerable fear -- which, again, is classic "American" soccer (e.g., lots of negative ball movement out of fear of dispossession). To be honest, Achilles would be better suited as a clinic and camp business. For those looking for a "team" feel -- this is not the club. The consistent negativity (that starts at the top) trickles down to the players. When things go wrong (e.g., possession is lost), players are quick to turn on one another (that is the Achilles way). If I were in a foxhole -- the last people on Earth I'd want beside me are Achilles players. There is no "team" -- only individuals. To recap, Achilles will help improve technical capabilities as it relates to maintaining possession under pressure. If small-sided possession was a sport -- Achilles would be the #1 club in the US. But the game of soccer has many layers and dimensions -- which is why it is such a wonder sport. Vin and Sal are focused on only one small (albeit important) part of the overall mosaic of the game. But they will never produce truly exceptional talent because the club does not support creative exploration and creates a culture of fear and blame, which is a shame (but not wholly surprising; Vin played a now defunct D2 program and Sal played at AU -- these are not guys that played at the highest level by any stretch).

Hard Truth, but backed up by years of poor results and watching them scrambling like wolverines in the middle third, while unable to score or stop anyone from scoring.

Players with one dimensional play indoctrinated into them, struggle when exposed to box-to-box high level tactics later.
Hopefully the younger kids who transition out get enough time to adjust to the real goal-line to goal-line world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:based on my experience with Achilles the post above is very accurate. Possession without a purpose. Kids do not understand soccer at all. They even cannot produce good 3v3 team because there is a scoring part not only possession.

To what Achilles 3v3 teams are you referring? Do clubs produce 3v3 teams?