What's the best way to prepare for language immersion?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not the PP. This may be harder than it sounds, but I’d start by changing the website to all present info in Mandarin, in addition to English. Right now it’s all English, which to me signals it is an immersion program for English speakers. I’d also translate all messages from the school to families in Mandarin. Again, it’s currently all English.

Longer term, subsidize a bus pick up in the downtown/Chinatown areas. Schools like Thomson and Seaton have high populations of Mandarin speakers. Make it more convenient for those families to send their kids to YY.

Yes, because YY is just that, a program for English speakers. That's what the stakeholders have always wanted - YY board, admins, parents. The teachers aren't really stakeholders because most work on one-year visas.

Why signal otherwise? If it isn't broken...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not the PP. This may be harder than it sounds, but I’d start by changing the website to all present info in Mandarin, in addition to English. Right now it’s all English, which to me signals it is an immersion program for English speakers. I’d also translate all messages from the school to families in Mandarin. Again, it’s currently all English.

Longer term, subsidize a bus pick up in the downtown/Chinatown areas. Schools like Thomson and Seaton have high populations of Mandarin speakers. Make it more convenient for those families to send their kids to YY.

Yes, because YY is just that, a program for English speakers. That's what the stakeholders have always wanted - YY board, admins, parents. The teachers aren't really stakeholders because most work on one-year visas.

Why signal otherwise? If it isn't broken...

Agree with this. We know that first gen Chinese are going straight for MoCo. When we lived overseas, we sent our kids to American schools. We would never have chosen a YY-style program. HOWEVER, a YY-style program where English was taught to 3 and 4 year olds, even if the teachers were all young, inexperienced Americans, would be insanely and instantly oversubscribed anywhere in the world. We are so lucky in DC to have options for our little kids to get exposure and practice with other languages.

[Anonymous]

Also, ethnic Chinese have deep problems with racism that go unaddressed - they would never voluntarily enroll in any school like YY which has to serve AA and Hispanic students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Also, ethnic Chinese have deep problems with racism that go unaddressed - they would never voluntarily enroll in any school like YY which has to serve AA and Hispanic students.

+1. YY bashers never, ever address this.

[Anonymous]

+ 1 have heard this from friends in Mandarin program in another state. They viewed the YY program as better in that respect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not the PP. This may be harder than it sounds, but I’d start by changing the website to all present info in Mandarin, in addition to English. Right now it’s all English, which to me signals it is an immersion program for English speakers. I’d also translate all messages from the school to families in Mandarin. Again, it’s currently all English.

Longer term, subsidize a bus pick up in the downtown/Chinatown areas. Schools like Thomson and Seaton have high populations of Mandarin speakers. Make it more convenient for those families to send their kids to YY.

Yes, because YY is just that, a program for English speakers. That's what the stakeholders have always wanted - YY board, admins, parents. The teachers aren't really stakeholders because most work on one-year visas.

Why signal otherwise? If it isn't broken...

Agree with this. We know that first gen Chinese are going straight for MoCo. When we lived overseas, we sent our kids to American schools. We would never have chosen a YY-style program. HOWEVER, a YY-style program where English was taught to 3 and 4 year olds, even if the teachers were all young, inexperienced Americans, would be insanely and instantly oversubscribed anywhere in the world. We are so lucky in DC to have options for our little kids to get exposure and practice with other languages.

I suspect that poster above was being sarcastic, PP. Of course an effective immersion language program needs a bunch of native speakers. I think we're lucky to live in a world-class city. The half-assed way DC immersion charters and DCI teach kids languages doesn't make me feel so lucky.

To the PPs who accuse Chinese immigrants of horrible racism. Well, it is their language and culture. If you don't like their culture, can't your children learn a language linked to a culture you like better? Um, how does having a big group of AA and Latino kids in a Chinese immersion program help with learning Chinese? Seems to me, common sense dictates that you want a good group of Chinese speaking kids and some others!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, ethnic Chinese have deep problems with racism that go unaddressed - they would never voluntarily enroll in any school like YY which has to serve AA and Hispanic students.

+1. YY bashers never, ever address this.

Neither would I voluntarily enroll in any school that purports to be a 50% Chinese immersion program but primarily serves AA and Hispanic students. No way. Too stupid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ If only the world worked like this. Not even in the program yet and already drinking the Kool-aid.

Check back with us 7 or 8 years from now.

How about you pull back from the wine bottle, and pay your children and husband some attention! Oops, my bad... that's why you have your au pair.

Check back with me 7 or 8 years from now, after your husband has left you and started a new family with your au pair!

***sips blue raspberry lemonade Kool-aid*** it's my favorite kind!!

Not at YY, new poster, no dog in this fight-

While I understand that a lot of these YY posts are pretty hostile, I think it is important to note that a lot of parents have magical thinking when it comes to immersion. It would also benefit everyone to have a close connection with families who have native level proficiency.

I understand that it easy to say that those with au pairs are privileged, which is true, but it is equally true that the school isn’t going to magically turn your monolingual child into a multilingual child without some really hard work and sacrifices on your part. We save as much as we can to travel to Spanish speaking places (at a Spanish immersion school) and really put significant effort to maximize Spanish speaking situations (camps, tutors, enrichment, etc) and we are a Spanish speaking family!

If you’re not willing to do anything outside of the minimum, I’m sorry but the chances of your child actually speaking the target language are really low.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, ethnic Chinese have deep problems with racism that go unaddressed - they would never voluntarily enroll in any school like YY which has to serve AA and Hispanic students.

+1. YY bashers never, ever address this.

Probably because they're also racists!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ If only the world worked like this. Not even in the program yet and already drinking the Kool-aid.

Check back with us 7 or 8 years from now.

How about you pull back from the wine bottle, and pay your children and husband some attention! Oops, my bad... that's why you have your au pair.

Check back with me 7 or 8 years from now, after your husband has left you and started a new family with your au pair!

***sips blue raspberry lemonade Kool-aid*** it's my favorite kind!!

Not at YY, new poster, no dog in this fight-

While I understand that a lot of these YY posts are pretty hostile, I think it is important to note that a lot of parents have magical thinking when it comes to immersion. It would also benefit everyone to have a close connection with families who have native level proficiency.

I understand that it easy to say that those with au pairs are privileged, which is true, but it is equally true that the school isn’t going to magically turn your monolingual child into a multilingual child without some really hard work and sacrifices on your part. We save as much as we can to travel to Spanish speaking places (at a Spanish immersion school) and really put significant effort to maximize Spanish speaking situations (camps, tutors, enrichment, etc) and we are a Spanish speaking family!

If you’re not willing to do anything outside of the minimum, I’m sorry but the chances of your child actually speaking the target language are really low.

Great post, PP. Really low is right (not that many immersion parents mind). To my mind, most of the critical posts on this particular thread haven't been "hostile" as much as inconveniently incisive.

You're right that magical thinking is sadly pervasive in the world of DC public charter immersion. When parents insist that they don't need a close connection with families who have a native level proficiency during the years of immersion, or regular childcare providers who speak the target language either, the joke is on the immersion students who don't speak the target language at home.

In our several years of recent experience with an immersion program, the hard work and sacrifices are mostly lacking in these DC charter programs. You meet many families with the resources to provide the necessary language inputs who don't bother. You see more of what it takes at Oyster.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, ethnic Chinese have deep problems with racism that go unaddressed - they would never voluntarily enroll in any school like YY which has to serve AA and Hispanic students.

+1. YY bashers never, ever address this.

Probably because they're also racists!

You win, PP. Ethnic Chinese like me are racists. So why do you want your kid to make a huge investment in learning about our language and culture, spending no less than half of their PreK3-5th grade classroom time doing this? Because there's a great shortage of world languages and cultures to learn about in the District of Columbia? If you think we're racist as a group (some truth to this), try the Mandarin-speaking Mainland Chinese, particularly Northerners. We Southerners are amateurs by comparison.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ If only the world worked like this. Not even in the program yet and already drinking the Kool-aid.

Check back with us 7 or 8 years from now.

How about you pull back from the wine bottle, and pay your children and husband some attention! Oops, my bad... that's why you have your au pair.

Check back with me 7 or 8 years from now, after your husband has left you and started a new family with your au pair!

***sips blue raspberry lemonade Kool-aid*** it's my favorite kind!!

Not at YY, new poster, no dog in this fight-

While I understand that a lot of these YY posts are pretty hostile, I think it is important to note that a lot of parents have magical thinking when it comes to immersion. It would also benefit everyone to have a close connection with families who have native level proficiency.

I understand that it easy to say that those with au pairs are privileged, which is true, but it is equally true that the school isn’t going to magically turn your monolingual child into a multilingual child without some really hard work and sacrifices on your part. We save as much as we can to travel to Spanish speaking places (at a Spanish immersion school) and really put significant effort to maximize Spanish speaking situations (camps, tutors, enrichment, etc) and we are a Spanish speaking family!

If you’re not willing to do anything outside of the minimum, I’m sorry but the chances of your child actually speaking the target language are really low.

I see a real problem in the way the DCI feeders enroll low SES monolingual English-speaking parents (mostly AA) who lack the sophistication to begin to understand how much time, hard work and family money goes into making immersion pay off. They aren't taught this by admins looking to boost a school's lottery and enrollment stats. Charters encourage families who lack the wherewithal to ensure that their kids can learn to speak target languages to enroll in these programs at the expense of critically important ELA instruction.

Parents are told that mere "language exposure" at the expense of English instruction year in and year out sets kids up for academic and career success. Sounds like OP believes this.

I also don't like how the charters set the bar so low for speaking target languages that parents come under little pressure to make the investments to ensure that their immersion students can actually speak target languages.

[Anonymous]

The best 2 ways to prepare for immersion are, 1) to move to an ethnic neighborhood where the target language is commonly heard and 2) to be affluent enough to afford au pairs, tutors, trips abroad, summer language camps etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ If only the world worked like this. Not even in the program yet and already drinking the Kool-aid.

Check back with us 7 or 8 years from now.

How about you pull back from the wine bottle, and pay your children and husband some attention! Oops, my bad... that's why you have your au pair.

Check back with me 7 or 8 years from now, after your husband has left you and started a new family with your au pair!

***sips blue raspberry lemonade Kool-aid*** it's my favorite kind!!

Not at YY, new poster, no dog in this fight-

While I understand that a lot of these YY posts are pretty hostile, I think it is important to note that a lot of parents have magical thinking when it comes to immersion. It would also benefit everyone to have a close connection with families who have native level proficiency.

I understand that it easy to say that those with au pairs are privileged, which is true, but it is equally true that the school isn’t going to magically turn your monolingual child into a multilingual child without some really hard work and sacrifices on your part. We save as much as we can to travel to Spanish speaking places (at a Spanish immersion school) and really put significant effort to maximize Spanish speaking situations (camps, tutors, enrichment, etc) and we are a Spanish speaking family!

If you’re not willing to do anything outside of the minimum, I’m sorry but the chances of your child actually speaking the target language are really low.

Great post, PP. Really low is right (not that many immersion parents mind). To my mind, most of the critical posts on this particular thread haven't been "hostile" as much as inconveniently incisive.

You're right that magical thinking is sadly pervasive in the world of DC public charter immersion. When parents insist that they don't need a close connection with families who have a native level proficiency during the years of immersion, or regular childcare providers who speak the target language either, the joke is on the immersion students who don't speak the target language at home.

In our several years of recent experience with an immersion program, the hard work and sacrifices are mostly lacking in these DC charter programs. You meet many families with the resources to provide the necessary language inputs who don't bother. You see more of what it takes at Oyster.

I wouldn’t hold oyster up as an example, sorry. They’re a mess and don’t do a good job teaching grammar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ If only the world worked like this. Not even in the program yet and already drinking the Kool-aid.

Check back with us 7 or 8 years from now.

How about you pull back from the wine bottle, and pay your children and husband some attention! Oops, my bad... that's why you have your au pair.

Check back with me 7 or 8 years from now, after your husband has left you and started a new family with your au pair!

***sips blue raspberry lemonade Kool-aid*** it's my favorite kind!!

Not at YY, new poster, no dog in this fight-

While I understand that a lot of these YY posts are pretty hostile, I think it is important to note that a lot of parents have magical thinking when it comes to immersion. It would also benefit everyone to have a close connection with families who have native level proficiency.

I understand that it easy to say that those with au pairs are privileged, which is true, but it is equally true that the school isn’t going to magically turn your monolingual child into a multilingual child without some really hard work and sacrifices on your part. We save as much as we can to travel to Spanish speaking places (at a Spanish immersion school) and really put significant effort to maximize Spanish speaking situations (camps, tutors, enrichment, etc) and we are a Spanish speaking family!

If you’re not willing to do anything outside of the minimum, I’m sorry but the chances of your child actually speaking the target language are really low.

I see a real problem in the way the DCI feeders enroll low SES monolingual English-speaking parents (mostly AA) who lack the sophistication to begin to understand how much time, hard work and family money goes into making immersion pay off. They aren't taught this by admins looking to boost a school's lottery and enrollment stats. Charters encourage families who lack the wherewithal to ensure that their kids can learn to speak target languages to enroll in these programs at the expense of critically important ELA instruction.

Parents are told that mere "language exposure" at the expense of English instruction year in and year out sets kids up for academic and career success. Sounds like OP believes this.

I also don't like how the charters set the bar so low for speaking target languages that parents come under little pressure to make the investments to ensure that their immersion students can actually speak target languages.

Our DCI feeder does a pretty good job telling parents they should learn Spanish and offering classes on the weekends etc.

That said I don’t know what you’re proposing - are you seriously expecting a public school to tell low income families they don’t belong? Please clarify.