This should tell you how elite college admissions really are

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Not sure why people think that the post was racist. I am giving objective detailed data on the students accepted because otherwise stats mean very little. Also, these kids are not "academic drones". Many are accomplished kids with good EC's and participate in many real community service projects.


I am just saying that none of that seems to have helped them get into a top 20 school. Use the information as you will.

And btw, many universities like Brown have actually said they are trying to recruit more kids from Texas. I guess they are looking for a "different profile" than these kids. v

Of course. You don't think anyone really wants your typical UMC white kids, do you? This is known.

there is another thread on this board about 2019 Whitman admits - 5% of the class is going to Ivy and even higher to top 25 schools. Whitman is 67% white and less than 10% black or Hispanic. UMC white kids are getting in.

Now if you argue they're athletes and legacies, then you should complain about that.

If you don't believe they are athletes and legacies, then UMC whites should admit that they problem is with their kid not the system (and little bit themselves since they're not legacies).

Nothing more irritating that UMC white people complaining they suffer from discrimination. Get a life.

I think an important consideration here is that the University of Texas is much stronger than the University of Maryland.

Great Maryland kids probably work harder on applying to private schools, and Harvard knows it will get most of the Maryland kids it admits, even if the parents have to take out huge loans or loot their IRAs.

Harvard probably knows it will have to fight harder to get Virginia kids to come, and a lot harder to reel in Texas kids.

Really? Because every ranking site would say otherwise. Show one list where UT is higher than UMD.

Why would they have to fight harder for VA and TX students? Come on man.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Not sure why people think that the post was racist. I am giving objective detailed data on the students accepted because otherwise stats mean very little. Also, these kids are not "academic drones". Many are accomplished kids with good EC's and participate in many real community service projects.


I am just saying that none of that seems to have helped them get into a top 20 school. Use the information as you will.

And btw, many universities like Brown have actually said they are trying to recruit more kids from Texas. I guess they are looking for a "different profile" than these kids. v

Of course. You don't think anyone really wants your typical UMC white kids, do you? This is known.

there is another thread on this board about 2019 Whitman admits - 5% of the class is going to Ivy and even higher to top 25 schools. Whitman is 67% white and less than 10% black or Hispanic. UMC white kids are getting in.

Now if you argue they're athletes and legacies, then you should complain about that.

If you don't believe they are athletes and legacies, then UMC whites should admit that they problem is with their kid not the system (and little bit themselves since they're not legacies).

Nothing more irritating that UMC white people complaining they suffer from discrimination. Get a life.

I think an important consideration here is that the University of Texas is much stronger than the University of Maryland.

Great Maryland kids probably work harder on applying to private schools, and Harvard knows it will get most of the Maryland kids it admits, even if the parents have to take out huge loans or loot their IRAs.

Harvard probably knows it will have to fight harder to get Virginia kids to come, and a lot harder to reel in Texas kids.

Really? Because every ranking site would say otherwise. Show one list where UT is higher than UMD.

Seriously?
US News - Texas at 49, UMD at 63
QS World Rankings - Texas at 63, UMD at 126
WSJ/Times Higher Education - Texas at 62, UMD at 81
Niche - Texas at 48, UMD at 105

Delusional.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Texas consistently ranks in the bottom half of states on education, so I wouldn’t say that a school that’s in the top quarter of a bunch of mediocre schools is going to be a stronger contender for top college/university admissions.

Texas has bad income, wealth and opportunity inequality, but it has some of the best high schools in the country. A regular public high school with 20
National Merit semifinalists in a class of 550 is a strong high school.

NMS cutoff scores are set on a state-by-state basis, so how one Texas high school does is relevant only to other Texas schools. But now I’m curious to know what school OP is talking about, because looking at the latest list, it looks like the only school with exactly 20 is a private school.

Texas cutoff is 221. Two below Maryland and one below VA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is owed Harvard. Do you understand that you are competing globally for 2000 or so spots? Tell me when you looked at the acceptance rate did you think of another outcome ? I’m trying to understand why you are so surprisEd.

Seriously. The only thing that’s changed since I was young is the enormous amount of parents who think their child with half a brain can get into Harvard.

You mean parents who spend their whole life making their kids study for a test... think they DESERVE (are ENTITLED) to Harvard.

Step back and take a deep breath and be nice, won't you? I swear half the people posting are high school kids.

The world has evolved from a time 20 years ago when Harvard and the other top colleges held themselves up as the best of the American universities and told all applicants we're seeking for the best and brightest students and these are our standards and expectations, and if you meet them you have a fair chance of being admitted. That was understood. And now they've gone from "fair chance" to virtually no chance of being admitted in part because we're giving all these spots to athletes and legacies and all the other special interest groups. At the same time they still call themselves the best universities taking in the best and brightest students. There's a certain inconsistency and hypocrisy involved here. And it's clearer and clearer than ever. And before you shout in capitalized letters, no, I'm not someone who has any stakes in these admissions games, and am just an amused observer from the sidelines.

Oxbridge can still claim that. Harvard, not so much.

It makes you wonder if it is worth aspiring to these schools anymore.

+1
My kids are in elementary; I have two Ivy League degrees. We are white immigrants and when we grew up we read about these great American schools for the most brilliant minds which demanded excellence above everything. There were actually weekly articles about famous American schools in the children's magazine I grew up with.

But these days excellence is a minor consideration. These schools are for social jockeying above any kind of intellectual pursuit. So disgusting. I can't believe things changed so much so quickly.

I don't want my kids to participate in this at all. When the time comes, they can perhaps apply to Oxbridge if they really are excellent or just go to college at our home country. Which, amazingly enough, turns out to be is so much more intellectual and rigorous and fair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Really? Because every ranking site would say otherwise. Show one list where UT is higher than UMD.

Seriously?
US News - Texas at 49, UMD at 63
QS World Rankings - Texas at 63, UMD at 126
WSJ/Times Higher Education - Texas at 62, UMD at 81
Niche - Texas at 48, UMD at 105

Delusional.

I am not the PP. I know UT is great. But, 49 is not appreciably different from 63.
ACT 25-75
UT 26-33
UMD 29-33

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is owed Harvard. Do you understand that you are competing globally for 2000 or so spots? Tell me when you looked at the acceptance rate did you think of another outcome ? I’m trying to understand why you are so surprisEd.

Seriously. The only thing that’s changed since I was young is the enormous amount of parents who think their child with half a brain can get into Harvard.

You mean parents who spend their whole life making their kids study for a test... think they DESERVE (are ENTITLED) to Harvard.

This is so true. The parents who have spent tens of thousands of dollars on soccer and math club, or violin and ice scaring—they want their deserved elite college, damnit! They have been on their kids for 18 years molding the perfect college applicant. They are mad when junior isn’t special enough for Harvard. Then they blame the brown kids.

We are parents who spend a lot of time on math and music. We do it because these are great things to know and also, a great ground to teach our kids some lessons about the value of hard work. The idea that they are special is antithetical to that and the fact colleges that US (and pretty much only US colleges) are pretending to admit kids who are special is where a lot of problems come from.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Really? Because every ranking site would say otherwise. Show one list where UT is higher than UMD.

Seriously?
US News - Texas at 49, UMD at 63
QS World Rankings - Texas at 63, UMD at 126
WSJ/Times Higher Education - Texas at 62, UMD at 81
Niche - Texas at 48, UMD at 105

Delusional.

I am not the PP. I know UT is great. But, 49 is not appreciably different from 63.
ACT 25-75
UT 26-33
UMD 29-33


Who said it was? I was responding to PP who said every ranking site has UMD higher than University of Texas. It doesn't matter if 49 is not appreciably different than 63 - objectively, it is higher...which directly refutes PP's claim.

[Anonymous]

UMD is much better than UT. Just sayin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is owed Harvard. Do you understand that you are competing globally for 2000 or so spots? Tell me when you looked at the acceptance rate did you think of another outcome ? I’m trying to understand why you are so surprisEd.

Seriously. The only thing that’s changed since I was young is the enormous amount of parents who think their child with half a brain can get into Harvard.

You mean parents who spend their whole life making their kids study for a test... think they DESERVE (are ENTITLED) to Harvard.

Step back and take a deep breath and be nice, won't you? I swear half the people posting are high school kids.

The world has evolved from a time 20 years ago when Harvard and the other top colleges held themselves up as the best of the American universities and told all applicants we're seeking for the best and brightest students and these are our standards and expectations, and if you meet them you have a fair chance of being admitted. That was understood. And now they've gone from "fair chance" to virtually no chance of being admitted in part because we're giving all these spots to athletes and legacies and all the other special interest groups. At the same time they still call themselves the best universities taking in the best and brightest students. There's a certain inconsistency and hypocrisy involved here. And it's clearer and clearer than ever. And before you shout in capitalized letters, no, I'm not someone who has any stakes in these admissions games, and am just an amused observer from the sidelines.

Oxbridge can still claim that. Harvard, not so much.

It makes you wonder if it is worth aspiring to these schools anymore.

+1
My kids are in elementary; I have two Ivy League degrees. We are white immigrants and when we grew up we read about these great American schools for the most brilliant minds which demanded excellence above everything. There were actually weekly articles about famous American schools in the children's magazine I grew up with.

But these days excellence is a minor consideration. These schools are for social jockeying above any kind of intellectual pursuit. So disgusting. I can't believe things changed so much so quickly.

I don't want my kids to participate in this at all. When the time comes, they can perhaps apply to Oxbridge if they really are excellent or just go to college at our home country. Which, amazingly enough, turns out to be is so much more intellectual and rigorous and fair.

Gosh, if your country is so great why did you come to the US. I hate immigrants that deliberately move to another country and just bash their new homeland and prop up the country they left for some reason. Go back to your paradise if you don't like our education system. Bye Felicia.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is owed Harvard. Do you understand that you are competing globally for 2000 or so spots? Tell me when you looked at the acceptance rate did you think of another outcome ? I’m trying to understand why you are so surprisEd.

Seriously. The only thing that’s changed since I was young is the enormous amount of parents who think their child with half a brain can get into Harvard.

You mean parents who spend their whole life making their kids study for a test... think they DESERVE (are ENTITLED) to Harvard.

Step back and take a deep breath and be nice, won't you? I swear half the people posting are high school kids.

The world has evolved from a time 20 years ago when Harvard and the other top colleges held themselves up as the best of the American universities and told all applicants we're seeking for the best and brightest students and these are our standards and expectations, and if you meet them you have a fair chance of being admitted. That was understood. And now they've gone from "fair chance" to virtually no chance of being admitted in part because we're giving all these spots to athletes and legacies and all the other special interest groups. At the same time they still call themselves the best universities taking in the best and brightest students. There's a certain inconsistency and hypocrisy involved here. And it's clearer and clearer than ever. And before you shout in capitalized letters, no, I'm not someone who has any stakes in these admissions games, and am just an amused observer from the sidelines.

Oxbridge can still claim that. Harvard, not so much.

It makes you wonder if it is worth aspiring to these schools anymore.

+1
My kids are in elementary; I have two Ivy League degrees. We are white immigrants and when we grew up we read about these great American schools for the most brilliant minds which demanded excellence above everything. There were actually weekly articles about famous American schools in the children's magazine I grew up with.

But these days excellence is a minor consideration. These schools are for social jockeying above any kind of intellectual pursuit. So disgusting. I can't believe things changed so much so quickly.

I don't want my kids to participate in this at all. When the time comes, they can perhaps apply to Oxbridge if they really are excellent or just go to college at our home country. Which, amazingly enough, turns out to be is so much more intellectual and rigorous and fair.

You only learned half the story. The universities you read about had brilliant and outstanding scholars - and still do. And athletes and legacies had even more of an admissions bump back then. What has significantly changed from 30-40 years ago is the number of students from outside the US applying to elite US universities. This means more competition. The percentage of URMs at the Ivy’s, for example, is actually lower than it was in the 1980s.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No one is owed Harvard. Do you understand that you are competing globally for 2000 or so spots? Tell me when you looked at the acceptance rate did you think of another outcome ? I’m trying to understand why you are so surprisEd.

It's not even 2000, it's 1600. One thousand, six hundred slots and 40,000+ applicants

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:UMD is much better than UT. Just sayin.

Said no one ever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:UMD is much better than UT. Just sayin.

Said no one outside of the State of Maryland. Ever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Texas consistently ranks in the bottom half of states on education, so I wouldn’t say that a school that’s in the top quarter of a bunch of mediocre schools is going to be a stronger contender for top college/university admissions.

Texas has bad income, wealth and opportunity inequality, but it has some of the best high schools in the country. A regular public high school with 20
National Merit semifinalists in a class of 550 is a strong high school.

NMS cutoff scores are set on a state-by-state basis, so how one Texas high school does is relevant only to other Texas schools. But now I’m curious to know what school OP is talking about, because looking at the latest list, it looks like the only school with exactly 20 is a private school.

No response to this means we’re admitting the Texas school profile is fake, right?

[Anonymous]

NP. I have no idea what you are trying to say? These are the schools with 20 or more NMSFs from TX. Mostly publics.

Liberal Arts and Science HS - 32
Westlake HS - 28
Westwood HS - 57
Coppell HS - 33
Highland Park HS - 27
Hockaday School - 20
St. Marks School - 31
Texas Academy of Math and Science - 72
Flower Mound HS - 22
Edward S. Marcus HS - 21
Clear Lake HS - 21
St. John's School - 38
Seven Lakes HS - 24
Plano East HS - 35
Plano West HS - 62
Carroll HS - 21
William P Clements HS - 29
The Woodlands College Prep HS - 28
https://www.generalacademic.com/uploads/2/0/2/4/20246907/nmsf_texas_2019.pdf