Why don't white students go to Banneker?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi everyone,

I'm a reporter with the Washington City Paper, and I'm working on a story on a question that has been raised several times on this forum: Why don't white students go to Banneker? I'm interested in speaking with parents who fall under one of these categories:

- You have (or recently have) a child at Banneker
- You're considering Banneker
- You opted not to apply to Banneker, or got in but decided not to go there

If you match the description, please feel free to send me an email at awiener (at) washingtoncitypaper (dot) com.

Thanks very much!
Aaron

Because its Majority Black and located in Georgia Avenue near Howard University. Whites will not send their kids to majority black schools regardless of the test scores. People will say "Wilson" but lets be honest the "honor courses" or "humanities program" are Majority white and a school within a school where whites are the majority

Then how do explain all of the sudden interest in Cleveland Elementary School right down the street? White people just discovered it. It frequently appeared on this year's DCUM lottery threads.

(I'm black and didn't mention Cleveland to a soul until my kids got in. It's golden. Also one of the things I loved about Cleveland is that is majority AA/Latino, so my kids get to experience a strong minority populated educational setting, where all of the high achievers and school leadership looked like them.)

Wow, that's racist

Nope, it is not. It is countering a racist society that has a preschool to prison pipeline for Black children. Please stop calling black people racists for trying to counter institutional racism. It is not cute.

+1

NP here. I can understand what PP is saying, but why does it have to be "all"? Why do "all" of the high achievers and school leadership have to be black? I think that is what set the other PP off, and I agree it is problematic.

Jeez, you get her larger point, so why all the nitpicking? She could've said all or most but the idea's the same--Cleveland apparently has a large number of middle class black families, so any divisions are less racial and more so socioeconomic and many high achievers are actually minority students--a relative rarity in DC. Actually, Cleveland sounds great to me.

[Anonymous]

I wish the posters who are worried about sending their white kid to a mostly black high school would read the Banneker alum's post about Banneker being full of black nerds. This is not the same as sending your kid to Ballou! When we attended the open house back when dd was applying to schools, the Banneker students gave tours. They were nice, respectful kids who talked about how much they had to work but it was worth it. A friend of mine substitute taught there and she said the kids were great.

Banneker may not work for your kid, I get that. But what bothers me is educated white families not even investigating Banneker directly based on preconceived notions. Do your research like you would do for anything else and then decide.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's a topic that should be addressed in your piece – SAT scores. How does a selective admission school score below the national average on the SAT?

Below is data taken directly from the Banneker web site:
http://benjaminbanneker.k12.dc.us/about_bbahs.html

READING
DCPS 473
Banneker 496
National 496

MATH
DCPS 466
Banneker 506
National 514



WRITING
DCPS 461
Banneker 486
National 488

Those Banneker scores seem surprisingly low. If true, well, that answers the reporter's question.

I was thinking the same thing. For a test in school, the scores aren't anything special. It would be helpful to compare them to Wilson and TJ in Va, a real test in school. As for parents not sending their white kids to a majority AA school, that really oversimplifies the issues. its that a white kid would likely be the ONLY white kid in the entire school. I would worry about bullying, exclusion etc if that were my kid. No one wants to be the ONLY. Most white parents have their elem kids in majority non white elem schools but parents worry less about elem. By middle and high school, parents with high achieving kids (And also likely higher income), know its time to really buckle down and get hard core into academics, IB, AP and honors. Also, middle and HS is when the really serious behvaviroal and violent issues start to play out as the kids get older. The challenges of very low income kids really becomes a different reality at that age.

This. I moved to DC from Europe without much of a clue about race relations in this country. It didn't take long living in DC to realize that there is quite a bit of anti-white sentiment among black people in this town. I am a liberal and know that there are partially understandable reasons for that, but it is this fact that makes me not want to send my kids to a school that is almost entirely or even majority black, regardless of test scores.

I'm from Europe too, don't pull the race card on this one, there are so many racial incidents and the rise of the far right in Europe right now. You clearly don't know much about American history, if you say "I am a liberal and know there are partially understandable reasons for that..." You do know we just had Emancipation Day and the significance of that don't you. I actually think the race relations here, though many, are at least out in the open and Americans for the most part are attempting to understand and work on it. Europe likes to sit back and feel superior and pretend that they don't have any issues.

I didn't say or imply anything about race relations in Europe or whether Americans are working on theirs or not, so that's completely besides the point. I wasn't making an argument that things are better in Europe either. And I am quite well informed abot American history, but I don't think that the history of slavery excuses all of the attitudes of present-day blacks towards whites. Clearly, you have a different opinion on that, but I don't think we'll bget far debating this here given the tone of your post.

OMG, how delusional are you! Therhim in the back.e are CURRENT racial problems in this country caused by current society's unwillingness to dismantle the current vestiges of institutional racism. If a black man knew or did not know of slavery does not effect how a white cop decides if he will shoot him in the back.

Can we continue the conversation about a high school without mentioning slavery...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Problematic. LOL

Because of white frailty. White frailty is a drag.

http://www.alternet.org/culture/why-white-people-freak-out-when-theyre-called-out-about-race

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Problematic. LOL

Because of white frailty. White frailty is a drag.

http://www.alternet.org/culture/why-white-people-freak-out-when-theyre-called-out-about-race

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish the posters who are worried about sending their white kid to a mostly black high school would read the Banneker alum's post about Banneker being full of black nerds. This is not the same as sending your kid to Ballou! When we attended the open house back when dd was applying to schools, the Banneker students gave tours. They were nice, respectful kids who talked about how much they had to work but it was worth it. A friend of mine substitute taught there and she said the kids were great.

Banneker may not work for your kid, I get that. But what bothers me is educated white families not even investigating Banneker directly based on preconceived notions. Do your research like you would do for anything else and then decide.

??

I wish you read this whole thread before writing such a comment. No one is saying Banneker is Ballou, yet there are a good number of reasons why whites and higher SES blacks prefer to send their kids elsewhere. I was surprised, for example, to see those low SAT scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Problematic. LOL

Because of white frailty. White frailty is a drag.

http://www.alternet.org/culture/why-white-people-freak-out-when-theyre-called-out-about-race

What an incredible amount of BS. Would you say it represents the views of many parientes and students at Banneker? I sure hope not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish the posters who are worried about sending their white kid to a mostly black high school would read the Banneker alum's post about Banneker being full of black nerds. This is not the same as sending your kid to Ballou! When we attended the open house back when dd was applying to schools, the Banneker students gave tours. They were nice, respectful kids who talked about how much they had to work but it was worth it. A friend of mine substitute taught there and she said the kids were great.

Banneker may not work for your kid, I get that. But what bothers me is educated white families not even investigating Banneker directly based on preconceived notions. Do your research like you would do for anything else and then decide.

??

I wish you read this whole thread before writing such a comment. No one is saying Banneker is Ballou, yet there are a good number of reasons why whites and higher SES blacks prefer to send their kids elsewhere. I was surprised, for example, to see those low SAT scores.

Yes, I've read the whole thread and I know no one mentioned Ballou. I was searching for an analogy and maybe that wasn't a good one. But it's pretty obvious that some posters are making assumptions about how a white kid would be treated by his/her fellow students at Banneker and those assumptions are clearly not based on direct investigation of the actual conditions at Banneker. And if you reject Banneker out of hand just based on test scores and no other research, then, yes, I think you're not acting responsibly. Like I said, investigate directly and then decide. I'm fine with white families rejecting Banneker. I'm not fine when it's done out of failure to actually check out the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Exactly.

Remember in the film about the big upcoming fight, Muhammad Ali commented with astonishment that the airline pilots were black?

It's quite dated, but you get the idea: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jclLiDjwuE0

It's important that my children see leaders, high achievers, involved parents (especially fathers!), who look like them so that they grow up with an understanding that this is possible. They are constantly fed a narrow stereotype of what AA youth represent, and it's so undermining. I like that they see teachers and families in a positive light and that they are exposed to a broad spectrum of people throughout the black community. African, Caribbean, homegrown DC, affluent, public housing----so much is represented within Cleveland. It's wonderful.

I don't think my stance is comparable to white supremacy. I believe it's more akin to single-sex education. I went to an all-girls school and a majority female college. I had a very different experience than those who went co-ed. Girls speak up in class and excel in math. Girls are strong and capable. Female head of school, female teachers. Great experience.

I also went to Banneker and relished being surrounded by a bunch of fellow black nerds. It felt great to belong and never be afraid of "acting white" or "talking white" when I just wanted to embrace algebra. I'm glad they had us all take Latin our first year there. I only pray my children get in and have the opportunity to be smart and engaged in a safe environment like Banneker. Other predominantly-black high schools punish their nerds. I don't want that for my children.

Understand it or not, it's real.

Well said, fellow Achiever.

I'll never forget my first day at Banneker. I was so used to being picked on for being smart that I didn't bother to raise my hand when the Biology teacher asked a question about cells. Every single hand in the class went up. I'd never experienced that before. It took a week for it to finally sink in that no one was going to tease, threaten, or attack me. We had two fights over the four years that I was there. The first group was suspended. The second group was expelled. Someone stole a jacket one year. The principal called an assembly, talked about us being a family, and the coat was returned right away. If you arrived early enough in the morning, there was always a student playing classical music on the piano in the auditorium. We had college recruiters visit several times a week from different schools, and (like Ali) I was always amazed that these people from Harvard, Dartmouth, and Stanford were black. At 14 or 15, it did something to me.

It was the first time that I'd seen large swaths of people who looked like me defy stereotypes every single day. All the same, there were a handful of white and Asian students there. The Latino population was second to ours. We constantly celebrated and recognized diversity (Celebrate Success Assemblies), and we had open discussions about race and stereotypes everyday. If not for Banneker I'd still have a very narrow view of the rest of the world. I don't know why more white families don't send their kids there, but the school is more than meets the eye.

[Anonymous]

Great account, PP. Love the hand-raising anecdote. I had a slightly similar experience being around smart black kids for the first time, but it wasn't until my first year at the HBCU I attended (HIU).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish the posters who are worried about sending their white kid to a mostly black high school would read the Banneker alum's post about Banneker being full of black nerds. This is not the same as sending your kid to Ballou! When we attended the open house back when dd was applying to schools, the Banneker students gave tours. They were nice, respectful kids who talked about how much they had to work but it was worth it. A friend of mine substitute taught there and she said the kids were great.

Banneker may not work for your kid, I get that. But what bothers me is educated white families not even investigating Banneker directly based on preconceived notions. Do your research like you would do for anything else and then decide.

??

I wish you read this whole thread before writing such a comment. No one is saying Banneker is Ballou, yet there are a good number of reasons why whites and higher SES blacks prefer to send their kids elsewhere. I was surprised, for example, to see those low SAT scores.

Not PP but I completely agree with him/her. It has been stated many times that AA as a whole don't perform as well on the SATs so comparing Banneker's SATs does NOTHING for the argument. Banneker outperform DCPS and who do you think is even taking SATs other than the kids at the decent high schools. It's really a moot point since most colleges are going away from even requiring SATs for admission (because they acknowledge the gap as well and know that SATs aren't an indicative measure of success). William and Mary just announced removing SATs for higher than 3.5 GPAs yesterday. The fact is Banneker is a great school. It is pretty sad that you don't see many folks in DC consider it. I do think that will start to change soon.

[Anonymous]

One truth I'm gathering from this post is that high-SES or high-education parents -- their "race" being irrelevant -- seek to place their kids in a school with likewise high-SES or high-education parents, or in a public magnet school (because magnet schools require a certain achievement level). And, the parents with a lot of disposable income will predominately choose to place their kids in a private school regardless.

Of course, it is so easy to accuse white parents of "racism" when they seek to avoid lower-performing DCPS schools (see the Hardy threads, for example), but when you see high-SES black parents doing the same thing, it puts the truth back in view.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's a topic that should be addressed in your piece – SAT scores. How does a selective admission school score below the national average on the SAT?

Below is data taken directly from the Banneker web site:
http://benjaminbanneker.k12.dc.us/about_bbahs.html

READING
DCPS 473
Banneker 496
National 496

MATH
DCPS 466
Banneker 506
National 514



WRITING
DCPS 461
Banneker 486
National 488

Those Banneker scores seem surprisingly low. If true, well, that answers the reporter's question.

I was thinking the same thing. For a test in school, the scores aren't anything special. It would be helpful to compare them to Wilson and TJ in Va, a real test in school. As for parents not sending their white kids to a majority AA school, that really oversimplifies the issues. its that a white kid would likely be the ONLY white kid in the entire school. I would worry about bullying, exclusion etc if that were my kid. No one wants to be the ONLY. Most white parents have their elem kids in majority non white elem schools but parents worry less about elem. By middle and high school, parents with high achieving kids (And also likely higher income), know its time to really buckle down and get hard core into academics, IB, AP and honors. Also, middle and HS is when the really serious behvaviroal and violent issues start to play out as the kids get older. The challenges of very low income kids really becomes a different reality at that age.

This. I moved to DC from Europe without much of a clue about race relations in this country. It didn't take long living in DC to realize that there is quite a bit of anti-white sentiment among black people in this town. I am a liberal and know that there are partially understandable reasons for that, but it is this fact that makes me not want to send my kids to a school that is almost entirely or even majority black, regardless of test scores.

Agreed. I got a very similar impression when moving here (from California). That attitude, combined with clearly lower test and SAT scores than relevant alternatives, makes it very unlikely our kids will go to Banneker.

So are the race relations different or better in California? Is this a DC thing? I have lived in California as well, but in a community with virtually no AA, so I did not experience it there.

Race relations are in general much better in California, and also of a different kind. AA over there are a minority even within the minorities, compared to Latinos and Asians, leading to much different historical contexts and priorities. DC is a quite complex city, with an international crowd, a national crowd and a local crowd, and the racial tensions at the local level is something i hadn't experienced before.

I just spit out my coffee on this one. No way in hell race relations are better in CA than in DC. I was born and raised in southern CA. So you think bevause blacks are a minority it makes things better? Have you ever heard of the Rodney King riots? Race relations are far worse in CA. You have AA vs white, AA vs Mexican, Mexican vs white, Armenian vs black, Filipino vs black/white, I could go on an on. There are many racists in CA on all sides of the coin. They are just segregated and spread out more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's a topic that should be addressed in your piece – SAT scores. How does a selective admission school score below the national average on the SAT?

Below is data taken directly from the Banneker web site:
http://benjaminbanneker.k12.dc.us/about_bbahs.html

READING
DCPS 473
Banneker 496
National 496

MATH
DCPS 466
Banneker 506
National 514



WRITING
DCPS 461
Banneker 486
National 488

Those Banneker scores seem surprisingly low. If true, well, that answers the reporter's question.

I was thinking the same thing. For a test in school, the scores aren't anything special. It would be helpful to compare them to Wilson and TJ in Va, a real test in school. As for parents not sending their white kids to a majority AA school, that really oversimplifies the issues. its that a white kid would likely be the ONLY white kid in the entire school. I would worry about bullying, exclusion etc if that were my kid. No one wants to be the ONLY. Most white parents have their elem kids in majority non white elem schools but parents worry less about elem. By middle and high school, parents with high achieving kids (And also likely higher income), know its time to really buckle down and get hard core into academics, IB, AP and honors. Also, middle and HS is when the really serious behvaviroal and violent issues start to play out as the kids get older. The challenges of very low income kids really becomes a different reality at that age.

This. I moved to DC from Europe without much of a clue about race relations in this country. It didn't take long living in DC to realize that there is quite a bit of anti-white sentiment among black people in this town. I am a liberal and know that there are partially understandable reasons for that, but it is this fact that makes me not want to send my kids to a school that is almost entirely or even majority black, regardless of test scores.

Agreed. I got a very similar impression when moving here (from California). That attitude, combined with clearly lower test and SAT scores than relevant alternatives, makes it very unlikely our kids will go to Banneker.

So are the race relations different or better in California? Is this a DC thing? I have lived in California as well, but in a community with virtually no AA, so I did not experience it there.

Race relations are in general much better in California, and also of a different kind. AA over there are a minority even within the minorities, compared to Latinos and Asians, leading to much different historical contexts and priorities. DC is a quite complex city, with an international crowd, a national crowd and a local crowd, and the racial tensions at the local level is something i hadn't experienced before.

I just spit out my coffee on this one. No way in hell race relations are better in CA than in DC. I was born and raised in southern CA. So you think bevause blacks are a minority it makes things better? Have you ever heard of the Rodney King riots? Race relations are far worse in CA. You have AA vs white, AA vs Mexican, Mexican vs white, Armenian vs black, Filipino vs black/white, I could go on an on. There are many racists in CA on all sides of the coin. They are just segregated and spread out more.

What can i say. Perhaps it is you bringing or seeing conflict everywhere you go? I just shared my experience and views. Here a large group of people seem obsessed with race. Not over there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One truth I'm gathering from this post is that high-SES or high-education parents -- their "race" being irrelevant -- seek to place their kids in a school with likewise high-SES or high-education parents, or in a public magnet school (because magnet schools require a certain achievement level). And, the parents with a lot of disposable income will predominately choose to place their kids in a private school regardless.

Of course, it is so easy to accuse white parents of "racism" when they seek to avoid lower-performing DCPS schools (see the Hardy threads, for example), but when you see high-SES black parents doing the same thing, it puts the truth back in view.

In general, I agree. However, there are definitely at least a few (trolls, hopefully) who like to spew out racist/classist statements about certain schools--just check out one of the Hardy threads.