How many in your schools senior class have no tips at all?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
OP here Please read the title of the thread- I am asking about other schools. I only revealed my childs situation to explain that I have no sour grapes. Also my child did not have any famous relatives- I agree colleges want that and so do privates- So
to update and further clarify the numbers I originally cited in my first post: The 2 non tip students who got into ivies (not my daughter who had a tip, tho unused) did not have famous or well connected parents.
What about your school, your childs class. How many have tips? thats the information sought in the thread.

Why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, why would you count Ivy legacy as a hook, since it's only really applicable to one school. For all the children who did not get into the particular Ivy that parent attended, it's no hook at all.

OP here. DC did not apply to ivy I attended. But my college was listed on the private school application I filled out for her many years ago.
I agree that its only a tip for one place. But in terms of the competition faced by students with no tips at all- its something.
She didn't apply because there were certain things about the school that made it really a bad choice for her and made even the safety school a better choice for her. So she didn't apply to my college.
When my daughter applied to her private school, I saw that 30% of that year's graduating class went to an ivy. So I assumed, erroneously, that if she was in the top 30% of the class, she would be a candidate for an ivy. As I discovered- so not true!!!
So when she graduated I looked at the numbers for her class.
Can someone please look at the numbers for your childs class and tell me if this is an anomaly? or is 24 out of 81 usual? That is my question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A few thoughts.
1) extra time is not an advantage if it is proportional and legit to a dress a learning disability. It is supposed to be compensation for a deficit. But, I agree the system needs reform. Kids usually get a round block od extra time without proof that it is proportional to the need - in other words, if a deficit warrants an extra 10 minutes that kid likely will get 30 min or 60 min more- or no extra time at all.
2) but OP's point that privates stack their schools with students with hooks is well taken. It is one way they try to ensure that their college placements exceed averages. Of course, the best advantage is just an inredibly self-motivated student with insane talent and supportive parents with an interest and means of suportting the child in any way possible.

The other problem is that many parents have seized unfair timing advantages for their non-disabled kids by paying a "specialist" to label their kid with some specious disorder. It throws the whole practice into disrepute - too many aggressive parents gaming the system.

My high-IQ kid has a language-based learning disability that interferes mightily with her ability to demonstrate what she knows. I would give just about anything to make it go away, but it never will. Some extra time on a test allows her to come closer to her potential and helps her not dissolve into a puddle of anxiety and self-loathing. But that in no way affects your kid.

I am interested in understanding how you know what she knows if she can't express it. The puddle of anxiety and self loathing- where are they coming from? If your child has high IQ and has language problems, then I am assuming that he/she is good at spatial reasoning. But why is that a disability?
My DC had a 99% vebal score and 50% spatial score. So math felt hard for her. But was it? It was hard only compared to something else she was good at. Should she have gotten extra time on her math tests? She just worked hard and got As anyway, despite being only of average ability.

FYI, mathematical ability is more strongly correlated with verbal ability than spatial ability/perceptional reasoning. Also, 50th percentile is average, NOT disabled. Why so lacking in sympathy for disabled kids? I bet you would be too ashamed to express these opinions IRL.

I dint know it was correlated with language ability. All my friends know that I have these opinions, and that I don't have sympathy because I don't look down on these children- I feel badly that there aren't proper schools for them. I think they are perfectly fine and not disabled, and shouldn't take drugs or have extra time. I went to a school that would be perfect for someone that has those ways of being. Even though I was a good test taker, my parents thought it was better to focus on process. But the schools aren't around.
Agree 50% isn't disabled, obviously.
There was only one kid with dyslexia in DC class and that kid was miserable. Despite extra time etc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, why would you count Ivy legacy as a hook, since it's only really applicable to one school. For all the children who did not get into the particular Ivy that parent attended, it's no hook at all.

OP here. DC did not apply to ivy I attended. But my college was listed on the private school application I filled out for her many years ago.
I agree that its only a tip for one place. But in terms of the competition faced by students with no tips at all- its something.
She didn't apply because there were certain things about the school that made it really a bad choice for her and made even the safety school a better choice for her. So she didn't apply to my college.
When my daughter applied to her private school, I saw that 30% of that year's graduating class went to an ivy. So I assumed, erroneously, that if she was in the top 30% of the class, she would be a candidate for an ivy. As I discovered- so not true!!!
So when she graduated I looked at the numbers for her class.
Can someone please look at the numbers for your childs class and tell me if this is an anomaly? or is 24 out of 81 usual? That is my question.

Hold on a sec, OP. I'm confused. Are you asking people to say whether their kids have hooks/tips for college admission, or for their underlying private primary/secondary school admission? It's starting to sound like you're asking people to tally up the various hooks/tips that might have somehow helped with admissions to primary/secondary school. If so, I suppose that includes things like older sibling at school, etc. What are you really asking here?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What on earth is an unused tip? Is she AA but didn't check the box, include a photo, or do an alumni interview? Is her dad a Princeton alum but you omitted that from the application? Trying to imagine how someone could have a "tip" that isn't apparent in the application. Seems like it wouldn't be much of one in that case.

The OP is an obvious fake who is upset that, although her trolling post has generated a lot of interest, it has not resulted in parents trying to publicly break down the number of Ivy legacies, under-represented minorities, recruited athletes, and students getting extra time at their school. Thus, she (or he) comes back and asks again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What on earth is an unused tip? Is she AA but didn't check the box, include a photo, or do an alumni interview? Is her dad a Princeton alum but you omitted that from the application? Trying to imagine how someone could have a "tip" that isn't apparent in the application. Seems like it wouldn't be much of one in that case.

The OP is an obvious fake who is upset that, although her trolling post has generated a lot of interest, it has not resulted in parents trying to publicly break down the number of Ivy legacies, under-represented minorities, recruited athletes, and students getting extra time at their school. Thus, she (or he) comes back and asks again.

I might also point out I've never met a "Yale grad" who writes as poorly as the OP.

Quick Yale quiz for OP:

1. What was the one most sought after Art History class for undergrads and what one-word descriptor was it called by?
2. What was the alphabetic nickname of the Master of TD?
3. What is the first line of the TD cheer?
4. What did some members of SY College do after the third quarter of football games?
5. Who was the popular professor who focused on Soviet History?
6. How many credits were required for graduation?
7. What was "Beinecke"?
8. What was "speed line"?
9. What was the name of the orientation activity for Freshman before the start of the formal academic year?
10. What group would stand outside the post office and ask a question to many students in an attempt to start a discourse?
11. What was "Machine City"?
12. What were the rules of Tang?
13. What was the Tyng Cup?
14. What was the name of the Yale performance dance group?
15. What name did Yale's marching band like to go by?
16. What's a "Dramat"?
17. What was "Richter's" and who was it named after?
18. What's "traying"?

[Anonymous]

Agree pp. No Yale grad writes or spells as poorly as OP

[Anonymous]

Op here sorry for offensively poor writing which should not reflect on schoo only me. I am doing this on phone
I will answer as much of the quiz as possible. I attended in the 70s
Art history course was scully
TD too sporty. Did not go there
Did not attend football games
Wolfgang gave Russia course. Wish I had taken it
9 credits required each year
Beinecke rare book library
Tang was drinking game? Not involved with that
Machine city in basement of library had machines with snacks and booths to sit in
Some colleges had college funded drama groups that put on plays. Calhoun had one.
Did not see marching band because not at football games

And as everyone knows
JE sucks because they killed the bladderball

[Anonymous]

OP you just sound really lame.

[Anonymous]

Well you sound like you are in the 4 th grade. !! Besides you can't say lame anymore as an insult because it offends the disabled. It's early in the morning for insults. What happened to you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op here sorry for offensively poor writing which should not reflect on schoo only me. I am doing this on phone
I will answer as much of the quiz as possible. I attended in the 70s
Art history course was scully
TD too sporty. Did not go there
Did not attend football games
Wolfgang gave Russia course. Wish I had taken it
9 credits required each year
Beinecke rare book library
Tang was drinking game? Not involved with that
Machine city in basement of library had machines with snacks and booths to sit in
Some colleges had college funded drama groups that put on plays. Calhoun had one.
Did not see marching band because not at football games

And as everyone knows
JE sucks because they killed the bladderball

Ok well done, you passed the quiz. Good one re: JE huge extra credit.

I still think your original post is not likely to elicit productive information but either you're awesome at using Google and I salute your commitment or you did go to Yale.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Other favorite things at Yale: BK Prisoner Society, Things that go bump in the night at Linsley chit, Law school dining hall cooked eggs to order for breakfast.
What is the problem with my original post?
Here is another try:
If your school has posted that the median 50% SAT scores are between x and y and you know that 30 % of the class is getting extra time, how can you adjust the numbers so that they are approximately what they would be without the extra time. Then compare your student and refigure where they are in terms of their percentile for the class. This presupposes that the colleges can in some way tell who is getting extra time. WAIT- they aren't supposed to be able to do that. but I suspect they can.
Why does this make a difference? Because if you are trying to figure out where its appropriate to apply you need to adjust these numbers. You don't want your child set up for failure, yet you don't want to aim too low either. You want to be realistic.
My child was told not to apply to any ivies, even with a tip at yale, because she was not sporty enough- despite very high everything else possible. You cannot always depend on counselor to give realistic advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A few thoughts.
1) extra time is not an advantage if it is proportional and legit to a dress a learning disability. It is supposed to be compensation for a deficit. But, I agree the system needs reform. Kids usually get a round block od extra time without proof that it is proportional to the need - in other words, if a deficit warrants an extra 10 minutes that kid likely will get 30 min or 60 min more- or no extra time at all.
2) but OP's point that privates stack their schools with students with hooks is well taken. It is one way they try to ensure that their college placements exceed averages. Of course, the best advantage is just an inredibly self-motivated student with insane talent and supportive parents with an interest and means of suportting the child in any way possible.

The other problem is that many parents have seized unfair timing advantages for their non-disabled kids by paying a "specialist" to label their kid with some specious disorder. It throws the whole practice into disrepute - too many aggressive parents gaming the system.

My high-IQ kid has a language-based learning disability that interferes mightily with her ability to demonstrate what she knows. I would give just about anything to make it go away, but it never will. Some extra time on a test allows her to come closer to her potential and helps her not dissolve into a puddle of anxiety and self-loathing. But that in no way affects your kid.

+1 Exactly! The people complaining about "aggressive parents" have no idea what it is like to have a child with difficulties in learning. We have worked long and hard to get our kids to a place where they can live up to their full potential. I will never understand why this upsets parents. At the same time I'm more than confident that they wouldn't care if our kids were left out in the cold with their problems as long as their precious little snowflake was able to get ahead….my child being given an accommodation (after extensive and expensive testing) should in no way affect your child's ability. Besides, my child's private will not allow any accommodations unless they are fully diagnosed by a licensed professional after a series of tests and any private that is allowing parents to make the rules should be in question - maybe that is the bigger issue.

But it does affect the grades other kids get. There are curves, and when some students are required to think and articulate quickly, and others are not, they aren't competing on a level playing field. And part of performance and learning in high school is competing with your classmates, much as we hate to say that out loud. Just like I have colleagues I adore but with whom I am also in competition. What child would not benefit greatly from extra time to think and organize his to present his of her analysis. Your dd may want the time due to whatever her issue may be, but in the meantime she Leo gets a benefit that other kids do not. Part of timed tests is the ability to perform under pressure and time constraints. When those constraints evaporate, all students would be expected to perform better.

PP, you just don't get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A few thoughts.
1) extra time is not an advantage if it is proportional and legit to a dress a learning disability. It is supposed to be compensation for a deficit. But, I agree the system needs reform. Kids usually get a round block od extra time without proof that it is proportional to the need - in other words, if a deficit warrants an extra 10 minutes that kid likely will get 30 min or 60 min more- or no extra time at all.
2) but OP's point that privates stack their schools with students with hooks is well taken. It is one way they try to ensure that their college placements exceed averages. Of course, the best advantage is just an inredibly self-motivated student with insane talent and supportive parents with an interest and means of suportting the child in any way possible.

The other problem is that many parents have seized unfair timing advantages for their non-disabled kids by paying a "specialist" to label their kid with some specious disorder. It throws the whole practice into disrepute - too many aggressive parents gaming the system.

My high-IQ kid has a language-based learning disability that interferes mightily with her ability to demonstrate what she knows. I would give just about anything to make it go away, but it never will. Some extra time on a test allows her to come closer to her potential and helps her not dissolve into a puddle of anxiety and self-loathing. But that in no way affects your kid.

+1 Exactly! The people complaining about "aggressive parents" have no idea what it is like to have a child with difficulties in learning. We have worked long and hard to get our kids to a place where they can live up to their full potential. I will never understand why this upsets parents. At the same time I'm more than confident that they wouldn't care if our kids were left out in the cold with their problems as long as their precious little snowflake was able to get ahead….my child being given an accommodation (after extensive and expensive testing) should in no way affect your child's ability. Besides, my child's private will not allow any accommodations unless they are fully diagnosed by a licensed professional after a series of tests and any private that is allowing parents to make the rules should be in question - maybe that is the bigger issue.

But it does affect the grades other kids get. There are curves, and when some students are required to think and articulate quickly, and others are not, they aren't competing on a level playing field. And part of performance and learning in high school is competing with your classmates, much as we hate to say that out loud. Just like I have colleagues I adore but with whom I am also in competition. What child would not benefit greatly from extra time to think and organize his to present his of her analysis. Your dd may want the time due to whatever her issue may be, but in the meantime she Leo gets a benefit that other kids do not. Part of timed tests is the ability to perform under pressure and time constraints. When those constraints evaporate, all students would be expected to perform better.

PP, you just don't get it.

Actually, I do get it. There are after legitimate reasons a child may benefit from extra time, whether for reading, writing, or analysis. But, along with that extra time intended for those purposes, the child also has that time to mull over and reconsider thoughts, to formulate under less stress than other kids, and to be methodical. As a result, comparing a test taken with extra time to one taken without that cushion is like comparing apples to oranges. And the kids given extra time get an advantage. What about that is inaccurate?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What on earth is an unused tip? Is she AA but didn't check the box, include a photo, or do an alumni interview? Is her dad a Princeton alum but you omitted that from the application? Trying to imagine how someone could have a "tip" that isn't apparent in the application. Seems like it wouldn't be much of one in that case.

The OP is an obvious fake who is upset that, although her trolling post has generated a lot of interest, it has not resulted in parents trying to publicly break down the number of Ivy legacies, under-represented minorities, recruited athletes, and students getting extra time at their school. Thus, she (or he) comes back and asks again.

The DCUM solipsist returns.