Are the City of Alexandria public schools really that bad?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are some good elementary schools in ACPS and some students (gifted) can really excel at the high school BUT I think the middle school is really the downfall.

And, there is only one middle and one high school. We bailed on Alexandria City for Fairfax County.

There's only one middle school? Seriously? That's simply incorrect; two buildings with five school assignments and front-offices.

They are thinking of collapsing those structures though. It's under review now.

This is correct, although the "under review" status is largely the product of one single member of the School Board who carries little weight. Both the Hammond and GW PTAs have appeared before the School Board at a formal session and asked that the consolidation of the campus sub-schools be stopped and the existing structure be preserved.

Incorrect. I think there was some concern that the restructure might be pushed though at the end of the last school year, with the switch to take place in the fall, and there was push back from the community to do a more thorough evaluation, which has been ongoing throughout the summer and into the fall, with "workgroup" that includes staff, admin, parents, and school board members. To my knowledge, neither PTA has come out with a formal position rejecting restructuring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are some good elementary schools in ACPS and some students (gifted) can really excel at the high school BUT I think the middle school is really the downfall.

And, there is only one middle and one high school. We bailed on Alexandria City for Fairfax County.

There's only one middle school? Seriously? That's simply incorrect; two buildings with five school assignments and front-offices.

They are thinking of collapsing those structures though. It's under review now.

This is correct, although the "under review" status is largely the product of one single member of the School Board who carries little weight. Both the Hammond and GW PTAs have appeared before the School Board at a formal session and asked that the consolidation of the campus sub-schools be stopped and the existing structure be preserved.

Incorrect. I think there was some concern that the restructure might be pushed though at the end of the last school year, with the switch to take place in the fall, and there was push back from the community to do a more thorough evaluation, which has been ongoing throughout the summer and into the fall, with "workgroup" that includes staff, admin, parents, and school board members. To my knowledge, neither PTA has come out with a formal position rejecting restructuring.

Both indeed have. See the School Board May 2013 meetings -- both PTA Presidents appeared in person. That was around the time when the School Board member made the legendary comment regarding demographics.

[Anonymous]

Again, I believe any PTA statements at that point were out of concern for restructuring the schools immediately, as is, the schools would reopen in the fall back down to one school on each campus. The concern was that of course that would be too fast.
It may be that after the reports and discussions that will take place in the coming months, this year's PTA at one or both campuses will decide to take a position against restructuring for the 2014-15 school year, but that has not yet come to pass. It may be moot if there ends up being no recommendations from the working group or staff to restructure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are some good elementary schools in ACPS and some students (gifted) can really excel at the high school BUT I think the middle school is really the downfall.

And, there is only one middle and one high school. We bailed on Alexandria City for Fairfax County.

There's only one middle school? Seriously? That's simply incorrect; two buildings with five school assignments and front-offices.

They are thinking of collapsing those structures though. It's under review now.

This is correct, although the "under review" status is largely the product of one single member of the School Board who carries little weight. Both the Hammond and GW PTAs have appeared before the School Board at a formal session and asked that the consolidation of the campus sub-schools be stopped and the existing structure be preserved.

Incorrect. I think there was some concern that the restructure might be pushed though at the end of the last school year, with the switch to take place in the fall, and there was push back from the community to do a more thorough evaluation, which has been ongoing throughout the summer and into the fall, with "workgroup" that includes staff, admin, parents, and school board members. To my knowledge, neither PTA has come out with a formal position rejecting restructuring.

Both indeed have. See the School Board May 2013 meetings -- both PTA Presidents appeared in person. That was around the time when the School Board member made the legendary comment regarding demographics.

Incorrect. The PTA of both schools wanted to make sure that nothing was changed in the coming (now current) school year. I was physically present at both the GW PTA meeting and the school board. The concern was immediate change.

Also, if you're going to denigrate the school system as a whole know your facts. There are two physical structures, Francis Hammond on Seminary, George Washington on Mt. Vernon Ave. In the current structure, Hammond has 3 schools, GW 2. All with their own administrative offices, combined electives (generally).

As to the quality of the middle schools? I was in a near panic about them, and I have been blown away at how happy my kid is, how engaged she is, how interesting, and even in the age of Standards testing all the time, how creative are the lessons.

My girl goes to school with FARM kids, which after reading this site a few weeks, is an anathema on these boards. Some of those kids don't perform very well on the tests. I think ACPS could work to make that better. However, I think on a personal level, my daughter is engaged, challenged, has a wonderful group of friends and we really like the community.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are some good elementary schools in ACPS and some students (gifted) can really excel at the high school BUT I think the middle school is really the downfall.

And, there is only one middle and one high school. We bailed on Alexandria City for Fairfax County.

There's only one middle school? Seriously? That's simply incorrect; two buildings with five school assignments and front-offices.

They are thinking of collapsing those structures though. It's under review now.

This is correct, although the "under review" status is largely the product of one single member of the School Board who carries little weight. Both the Hammond and GW PTAs have appeared before the School Board at a formal session and asked that the consolidation of the campus sub-schools be stopped and the existing structure be preserved.

Incorrect. I think there was some concern that the restructure might be pushed though at the end of the last school year, with the switch to take place in the fall, and there was push back from the community to do a more thorough evaluation, which has been ongoing throughout the summer and into the fall, with "workgroup" that includes staff, admin, parents, and school board members. To my knowledge, neither PTA has come out with a formal position rejecting restructuring.

Both indeed have. See the School Board May 2013 meetings -- both PTA Presidents appeared in person. That was around the time when the School Board member made the legendary comment regarding demographics.

Incorrect. The PTA of both schools wanted to make sure that nothing was changed in the coming (now current) school year. I was physically present at both the GW PTA meeting and the school board. The concern was immediate change.

Also, if you're going to denigrate the school system as a whole know your facts. There are two physical structures, Francis Hammond on Seminary, George Washington on Mt. Vernon Ave. In the current structure, Hammond has 3 schools, GW 2. All with their own administrative offices, combined electives (generally).

As to the quality of the middle schools? I was in a near panic about them, and I have been blown away at how happy my kid is, how engaged she is, how interesting, and even in the age of Standards testing all the time, how creative are the lessons.

My girl goes to school with FARM kids, which after reading this site a few weeks, is an anathema on these boards. Some of those kids don't perform very well on the tests. I think ACPS could work to make that better. However, I think on a personal level, my daughter is engaged, challenged, has a wonderful group of friends and we really like the community.

PP, I am the PP you quoted -- I think you missed my message. I agree with you completely. My complaint is that the ACPS MS system largely works, does indeed offer a terrific environment, can engage students (and does), and should NOT be tinkered with by ACPS's amateur school board. And the GW and FCH MS PTA presidents did appear before the school board to say so in the May '13 meetings, before the MS working group was created.

[Anonymous]

I am a former GW teacher that left at the end of last year. As a teacher I and several other colleagues were for reforming into one school. Part of the problem at the time I was there was lack of communication between schools in the same building, resources used inefficiently because they belonged to one or the other "school", discipline expectations were drastically different etc... I am no longer there, but I have a lot of friends at GW saying things are changing for the better and that the two new principals definitely work together. Not sure about the other problems I brought up here.
Like anywhere else I've been, GW has a lot of amazing teachers and a couple rotten apples.

[Anonymous]

PP...forgive the punctuation above...it's 3am!

[Anonymous]

Cange at the middle school level - the schools were failing and in case the OEI bill went forward and legal challenges were lost, the middle schools would head to failing status and possible state takeover. They are doing the work now that is required when the school is failing - they are reogranzing. TC Williams did the same a few years ago. The City doesn't want to face mulitple failing schools in state takeover.

[Anonymous]

What gives in Alexandria? Why are poor kids doing so poorly in ACPS compared to rest of VA? I take ACPS boosters at their word; I'm sure their kids are doing great and they have great/engaging teachers. But ACPS' focus has been on the achievement gap for years (decades?) and there really hasn't been much progress.

Take Mt Vernon Community School - the white kids basically have a 100% pass rate on grade 3, 4, 5 SOLs. And the Hispanic kids are doing very poorly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe even that, without proof that has not to date been forthcoming.

True. There's no proof. It's just conjecture. 750 students is a huge class. If the average Northern Va high school which is much smaller than TC has between 5-10 ivy leave bound seniors, then at least 10 or so sounds reasonable for TC. But we won't know for sure unless the school publishes those stats.

This is the list Mort Sherman wrote in a "we're making progress" editorial in an Alexandria newspaper. I don't think it ratifies the concept of dozens of acceptances.

http://www.connectionnewspapers.com/news/2012/may/24/commentary-making-progress-transforming-tc-william/

The colleges these students will attend this fall include Alexandria School of Practical Nursing, Art Institute of Dallas, Bennett College, Brigham Young University, Case Western Reserve University, Catholic University, Christopher Newport University, Colgate University, College of William and Mary, Columbia College Chicago, Columbia University, Cornell University, Davidson College, Emory University, Ferrum College, George Fox University, George Mason University, George Washington University, Georgetown University, Gettysburg College, Hampton University, Harvey Mudd College, James Madison University, Johns Hopkins University, Longwood University, Marshall University, Mary Baldwin College, Marymount University, New York University, Northern Virginia Community College, Northwestern University, The Ohio State University, Old Dominion University, Philadelphia University, Radford University, Richard Bland College, San Diego State University, Syracuse University, Tulane University, Tuskegee University, and the University of California at Santa Barbara."

So, I see Columbia and Cornell. I guess it is possible two students got accepted to all 8 Ivies, but I'm having some difficulty with the notion of "dozens" accepted. I similarly have a problem believing they chose not to attend, especially since this list is attached to a Scholarship of Alexandria list.

There must've been some ivy league bound students that did not receive the Scholarship of Alexandria. But who knows how many.

You're reaching there, friend.

But aren't there TC families "with money?" Where are the TC boosters? There must be another list someplace.

I have not seen a full list but I just saw burgundy farm's list of college destinations for the 8graders who graduated from burgundy four years ago, together with their high schools. I was struck by the fact that the burgundy kids who went to TC had particularly impressive college destinations. If I recall correctly it was something like yale, yale, U Chicago, Oberlin another excellent school. Maybe princeton? In any case: I am not a TC booster-- I took my kids out of an ACPS elementary school to send them to burgundy-- but at this point my plan is for them to go to TC after Burgundy.

[Anonymous]

Except, Burgundy's not exactly known for its rigor, pp. As private schools go, it's ... well... just not that good.

[Anonymous]

Oh, for goodness sake. How is this even relevant? "Burgundy is not known for its rigor." True! And yet it sends the large majority of its graduates to excellent private high schools and excellent colleges. So, gee, maybe despite the lack of "rigor," it's getting something right! Maybe it just smarts with bright kids who someone survive the lack of rigor! But regardless, so f-ing what? The point is that the burgundy kids who went to TC and graduated in 2013 are going on to top notch colleges. So once again, despite what you seem to view as the crumminess of their k-8 school and their high school, we seem to have some disturbing evidence that -- gasp -- at least five kids from TC are going to good colleges!

There must be a trick in here somewhere...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: And TC is just a bastion of problems, including a dropout rate of around 40% for Hispanics and a daycare center for the children of students, although it does offer a lot of classes, has some excellent faculty, and some upper middle class white kids do very well (and their parents cynically believe that this gives them a leg up on college admissions by virtue of "surviving" a poor school). SATs just came out and I think TC's was around 1,435 or something like that, nearly 300 points lower than the better Arlington and FFX high schools..

How is meeting the needs of students, including student parents, a bad thing?

[Anonymous]

And-- take the TC test score stats available from the state. You can see that quite a lot of TC kids have excellent test scores. You can have a large school with low mean test scores and low medians, yet nonetheless have a sizeable number of kids who do spectacularly well. Anyone making decisions about TC based on means and medians will miss the more important question, which is: how will a bright kid with a supportive family fare at TC? Answer: most bright kids do fine.

Does this make TC the right choice for every kid. Of course not. I plan to send one kid to TC and the other to a private HS, b/c I think one kid will thrive at TC and the other won't. But as ever, it's not about whether TC is "good" or "bad"-- it reflects the diverse strengths and challenges of the population it draws on, and works well for some kids, not so well for others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: And TC is just a bastion of problems, including a dropout rate of around 40% for Hispanics and a daycare center for the children of students, although it does offer a lot of classes, has some excellent faculty, and some upper middle class white kids do very well (and their parents cynically believe that this gives them a leg up on college admissions by virtue of "surviving" a poor school). SATs just came out and I think TC's was around 1,435 or something like that, nearly 300 points lower than the better Arlington and FFX high schools..

How is meeting the needs of students, including student parents, a bad thing?

Because apparently that poster does not want her children exposed to "that kind of behavior" and would prefer if student parents just dropped out of school, hid their heads in shame and stayed out of sight.