Over 280 University of California STEM faculty members have signed an open letter calling on the UC Board of Regents to

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:At my DC’s OOS school the kids getting into UCLA and Berkeley each year are not the top performers. Looking at the scattergrams many can’t even break a 1300 on the SAT. It is a head scratcher. The lack of SAT makes it much easier to create a narrative in your PIQs that will get you in. It’s insane.

THIS. Ever since they stopped taking SATs I've noticed exactly this. I've lost so much respect for the UC System. And I'm a graduate of that system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At my DC’s OOS school the kids getting into UCLA and Berkeley each year are not the top performers. Looking at the scattergrams many can’t even break a 1300 on the SAT. It is a head scratcher. The lack of SAT makes it much easier to create a narrative in your PIQs that will get you in. It’s insane.

THIS. Ever since they stopped taking SATs I've noticed exactly this. I've lost so much respect for the UC System. And I'm a graduate of that system.

How come UCLA and UCB are ranked in T20? I think it's after CA go TO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At my DC’s OOS school the kids getting into UCLA and Berkeley each year are not the top performers. Looking at the scattergrams many can’t even break a 1300 on the SAT. It is a head scratcher. The lack of SAT makes it much easier to create a narrative in your PIQs that will get you in. It’s insane.

THIS. Ever since they stopped taking SATs I've noticed exactly this. I've lost so much respect for the UC System. And I'm a graduate of that system.

How come UCLA and UCB are ranked in T20? I think it's after CA go TO.

Who's going to tell him/her?

[Anonymous]

I am glad that they want to reinstate testing. I hope the Board of Regents actually listen to them. The problem, however, does start in the K-12. We give the kids chrome books and tell them to go on iReady and think that if they spend enough time on the platform, they are learning. This is a fallacy. Kids also do not spend time working on math problems like they used to. They want immediate answers. They can't stand to be frustrated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am glad that they want to reinstate testing. I hope the Board of Regents actually listen to them. The problem, however, does start in the K-12. We give the kids chrome books and tell them to go on iReady and think that if they spend enough time on the platform, they are learning. This is a fallacy. Kids also do not spend time working on math problems like they used to. They want immediate answers. They can't stand to be frustrated.

It isn’t on the students what curriculum they are given. Of course students are frustrated because so many schools have gotten rid of direct instruction and math textbooks that have worked examples.

CA just spent millions and millions on a new math framework that Jo Boaler, a Stanford Education professor who doesn’t have any type of advanced math coursework and has never really taught higher higher school math has been championing. It encourages de-tracking, emphasized “equity” and alleged inquiry over mastery.

This hurts poor, bright students the most. It ends up being the opposite of equity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"For example, for three consecutive year, 20-30% of UC Berkeley first-semester calculus students who participated in mathematical diagnostic testing displayed severe[b][u] preparation deficits."

Ouch.

How is this going to be fixed by SAT scores if it is the HS math instruction that sucks?

100% sounds like they need to do an audit on California’s public education system.

The entire California education system is terrible and has been for decades.

I taught there years ago and had kids in the schools more recently. Their K12 is the worst in the country, even at the "good" schools.

The "good" California schools made rural Alabama and south Texas bario schools I taught at look like elite private schools in comparison.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAT is a racist test. There is no reason to go back to it.

Racists against mathematics?

PP meant to say STEM degrees are racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAT is a racist test. There is no reason to go back to it.

The SAT is the best measure to identify and elevate smart and brilliant minority kids who are otherwised overlooked and ignored by test optional.

Test optional specifically benefits mediocre wealthy students of all colors and races.

Can you explain how they’re overlooked? If you don’t have good grades, you are not qualified.

The high SAT kids generally have great grades AND high SATs

Test optional rejects the high performers for the best "narrative" which is exasperated by inflated grades.

SAT scores are the best objective measure to indicate the most qualified students

[Anonymous]

San Francisco instituted an equity driven math program in their high schools based on that crackpot Stanford professor's research. Turns out they hid the real data that showed de-tracking math (putting all students of all abilities in the same math class) hurt everyone, low performers and high performers.

California just can't help themselves.

Equity is the driver, not excellence. Now that UC's are getting walloped reputationally you see a pushback.

California outlaws the SAT. They thought that they would be on the vanguard of a new world order of education and all colleges would follow them. Instead they are becoming an academic laughingstock.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At my DC’s OOS school the kids getting into UCLA and Berkeley each year are not the top performers. Looking at the scattergrams many can’t even break a 1300 on the SAT. It is a head scratcher. The lack of SAT makes it much easier to create a narrative in your PIQs that will get you in. It’s insane.

THIS. Ever since they stopped taking SATs I've noticed exactly this. I've lost so much respect for the UC System. And I'm a graduate of that system.

How come UCLA and UCB are ranked in T20? I think it's after CA go TO.

USnews rankings are not tied to student quality or even faculty quality anymore.
Rankings by SAT when the universities were all test required did not lead to UCB or UCLA to be in the top 20, maybe not the T30, if LACs included--at least 7 LACs had stronger SAT ranges than UCB and UCLA, and easily over 20 private universities did.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:San Francisco instituted an equity driven math program in their high schools based on that crackpot Stanford professor's research. Turns out they hid the real data that showed de-tracking math (putting all students of all abilities in the same math class) hurt everyone, low performers and high performers.

California just can't help themselves.

Equity is the driver, not excellence. Now that UC's are getting walloped reputationally you see a pushback.

California outlaws the SAT. They thought that they would be on the vanguard of a new world order of education and all colleges would follow them. Instead they are becoming an academic laughingstock.

+1
tide will turn even in CA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How has no one made a more comprehensive exam than the sat?

ACT

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"For example, for three consecutive year, 20-30% of UC Berkeley first-semester calculus students who participated in mathematical diagnostic testing displayed severe[b][u] preparation deficits."

Ouch.

How is this going to be fixed by SAT scores if it is the HS math instruction that sucks?

If you only admit students with an SAT math score of 700+ for STEM majors at UCLA/Berkeley, then you will have a well-prepared undergraduate class, regarld of HS teaching quality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Alarmed by rising failure and remediation rates, professors argue that test-blind policies obscure preparation gaps, leading vulnerable students to struggle in rigorous gateway courses.

https://ucstudentsuccess.org/

That's great news and much needed. Wish they had done so before this year. We're in-state and my DS wanted to go to a UC (he would have gone to any out of his top 4-5 choices). He has a 1550 but wasn't able to submit it because of test-blind. He did not get into any of his top 5 UC choices (he was guaranteed a UC since he was in in the top 9% of CA HS seniors by GPA, but only got into UC Riverside and UC Santa Cruz, which aren't great for his intended major). He is going to a private (to a so-called "new ivy") but we're frustrated by UC's test-blind policy and hearing how they have needed to create remedial sections for math at UC San Diego (where my DS didn't get in despite a 790 in math on the SAT and A in AP calculus). We are happy that it might get better for others.

Are you from an upper middle class area? If so, you likely still would have the same issue due to regional admission. UCs aren’t really made to be solely elite kids. That’s what private schools, like the ones your kid is going to, are for.

Actually, they are supposed to be for the academically elite. Community college, Cal State system, UC System, flagship of the UC system. This isn't a regional thing. It is a high school dependent thing. However so few blacks and Hispanics would be selected for UC Berkeley that UC's look at the HIGH SCHOOL instead of the general applicant pool.

Except opportunity isn’t equal across the state. You’d eliminate any poor person or individual born in a rural area from having a top education.

I think this is part of the political problem in California. There’s a lot of rural whites who don’t understand this yet, because they think whites are always superior, but who if admissions tests come back are going to be displeased to learn that the top UCs are effectively closed to rural whites.

That is inaccurate

Going back to requiring the SATs benefits all of the poor smart kids the most, no matter what their race is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Alarmed by rising failure and remediation rates, professors argue that test-blind policies obscure preparation gaps, leading vulnerable students to struggle in rigorous gateway courses.

https://ucstudentsuccess.org/

That's great news and much needed. Wish they had done so before this year. We're in-state and my DS wanted to go to a UC (he would have gone to any out of his top 4-5 choices). He has a 1550 but wasn't able to submit it because of test-blind. He did not get into any of his top 5 UC choices (he was guaranteed a UC since he was in in the top 9% of CA HS seniors by GPA, but only got into UC Riverside and UC Santa Cruz, which aren't great for his intended major). He is going to a private (to a so-called "new ivy") but we're frustrated by UC's test-blind policy and hearing how they have needed to create remedial sections for math at UC San Diego (where my DS didn't get in despite a 790 in math on the SAT and A in AP calculus). We are happy that it might get better for others.

Are you from an upper middle class area? If so, you likely still would have the same issue due to regional admission. UCs aren’t really made to be solely elite kids. That’s what private schools, like the ones your kid is going to, are for.

Actually, they are supposed to be for the academically elite. Community college, Cal State system, UC System, flagship of the UC system. This isn't a regional thing. It is a high school dependent thing. However so few blacks and Hispanics would be selected for UC Berkeley that UC's look at the HIGH SCHOOL instead of the general applicant pool.

Except opportunity isn’t equal across the state. You’d eliminate any poor person or individual born in a rural area from having a top education.

I think this is part of the political problem in California. There’s a lot of rural whites who don’t understand this yet, because they think whites are always superior, but who if admissions tests come back are going to be displeased to learn that the top UCs are effectively closed to rural whites.

You just proved you know very little about California.

The majority of rural students in California are hispanic.