Hardy/Deal vs Arlington middle schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We left Capitol Hill for one of the N Arlington middle schools two years ago. I'm not finding that my kids are remotely sheltered or stifled in VA. Their 7th and 8th grade friends take city buses and Metro all around the DMV on their own to get to sports practices, music practices, to see friends, for scouting etc.

Are you happy with the middle school? Do you have a comparison point from friends who stayed in dc and went to dcps or charters? Or that were at deal or hardy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I cannot believe that there’s a serious argument going on on DCUM on whether DCPS even at its best holds a candle to APS. The only reasonable argument that can be made is that sending your kids to a top school district isn’t necessary.

Those schools in Arlington are massive. Is it really that hard to imagine why a parent would prefer Latin or Walls or BASIS?

Better question: is it really hard to understand why a parent with a spot at BASIS would bail to Arlington anyway? We left BASIS after 2 years for a better public school in Arlington, superior in every way but for science challenge and maybe executive function coaching. The “massive” MS we went with had smaller classes than BASIS across the board. No kidding. It also had better teachers overall (with hardly any turnover or newbies) and fewer in-class disruptions.

Doesn't really seem like a good example since roughly half of BASIS's entire student body bails for somewhere else (usually because it's too hard).

BASIS isn't a DCPS

BASIS is the best you can do academically for MS in the DC public system for a STEM oriented kid. It's a lot better than Hardy and Deal for math and science. OP might want to consider BASIS.

I don't think so -- it seems like OP wants to be in a school pyramid and is focused on either Ward 3 or Arlington. I don't think we should bring in BASIS (And I say this as someone who is happy there).

NP. Huh? Those are not good arguments against mentioning BASIS as an option for OP. We're happy there too, at least academically and socially. Colleagues left NE DC for Alexandria before COVID and are complaining that their MS HS students have not been challenged at all by the public they moved for. Friends left EOTP charters for Bethesda and were upset that the schools there were not worth the move either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I cannot believe that there’s a serious argument going on on DCUM on whether DCPS even at its best holds a candle to APS. The only reasonable argument that can be made is that sending your kids to a top school district isn’t necessary.

Those schools in Arlington are massive. Is it really that hard to imagine why a parent would prefer Latin or Walls or BASIS?

Better question: is it really hard to understand why a parent with a spot at BASIS would bail to Arlington anyway? We left BASIS after 2 years for a better public school in Arlington, superior in every way but for science challenge and maybe executive function coaching. The “massive” MS we went with had smaller classes than BASIS across the board. No kidding. It also had better teachers overall (with hardly any turnover or newbies) and fewer in-class disruptions.

Doesn't really seem like a good example since roughly half of BASIS's entire student body bails for somewhere else (usually because it's too hard).

BASIS isn't a DCPS

BASIS is the best you can do academically for MS in the DC public system for a STEM oriented kid. It's a lot better than Hardy and Deal for math and science. OP might want to consider BASIS.

I don't think so -- it seems like OP wants to be in a school pyramid and is focused on either Ward 3 or Arlington. I don't think we should bring in BASIS (And I say this as someone who is happy there).

NP. Huh? Those are not good arguments against mentioning BASIS as an option for OP. We're happy there too, at least academically and socially. Colleagues left NE DC for Alexandria before COVID and are complaining that their MS HS students have not been challenged at all by the public they moved for. Friends left EOTP charters for Bethesda and were upset that the schools there were not worth the move either.

We love BASIS too and I feel grateful for the school all the time. However, this OP specifically asked to compare Deal and Hardy to Arlington. Not every post needs to involve BASIS!

[Anonymous]

OP here. I'm thrilled BASIS is great for the PPs. But that is not the school I wanted Intel on. I want it for Deal, Hardy, and Arlington. Places where we are guaranteed a traditional option that appears to be at least OK, and poasibly good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I'm thrilled BASIS is great for the PPs. But that is not the school I wanted Intel on. I want it for Deal, Hardy, and Arlington. Places where we are guaranteed a traditional option that appears to be at least OK, and poasibly good.

DC parent here. Go with Arlington. Much better school in addition to much better functioning school system. Plus you get all the great in state college options of VA then saving you hundreds of thousands of dollars.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We moved from Capitol Hill when our eldest was 11 to Arlington, about a mile from Ballston. Our kids walked to high school, took ART and metro buses and Metro all over Arlington and into DC on the weekends. Neither of them bothered to get their drivers license until they were in college because it just wasn't necessary. They weren't sheltered or stifled at all.

I truly didn't want to leave DC, but almost everything about our lives got easier when we moved, without giving up very much. My commute got longer, but only by about 15 minutes each way. DH's commute was shorter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We moved from Capitol Hill when our eldest was 11 to Arlington, about a mile from Ballston. Our kids walked to high school, took ART and metro buses and Metro all over Arlington and into DC on the weekends. Neither of them bothered to get their drivers license until they were in college because it just wasn't necessary. They weren't sheltered or stifled at all.

I truly didn't want to leave DC, but almost everything about our lives got easier when we moved, without giving up very much. My commute got longer, but only by about 15 minutes each way. DH's commute was shorter.

Oooh this is the most compelling thing I’ve heard. Tell me what got easier in your life. And were you able to make new adult friends? We are so settled in our DC neighborhood that I am having trouble envisioning the move. But our inbound MS is terrible and I’m tired of the constant lottery uncertainty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I cannot believe that there’s a serious argument going on on DCUM on whether DCPS even at its best holds a candle to APS. The only reasonable argument that can be made is that sending your kids to a top school district isn’t necessary.

Those schools in Arlington are massive. Is it really that hard to imagine why a parent would prefer Latin or Walls or BASIS?

Better question: is it really hard to understand why a parent with a spot at BASIS would bail to Arlington anyway? We left BASIS after 2 years for a better public school in Arlington, superior in every way but for science challenge and maybe executive function coaching. The “massive” MS we went with had smaller classes than BASIS across the board. No kidding. It also had better teachers overall (with hardly any turnover or newbies) and fewer in-class disruptions.

Doesn't really seem like a good example since roughly half of BASIS's entire student body bails for somewhere else (usually because it's too hard).

BASIS isn't a DCPS

BASIS is the best you can do academically for MS in the DC public system for a STEM oriented kid. It's a lot better than Hardy and Deal for math and science. OP might want to consider BASIS.

I don't think so -- it seems like OP wants to be in a school pyramid and is focused on either Ward 3 or Arlington. I don't think we should bring in BASIS (And I say this as someone who is happy there).

NP. Huh? Those are not good arguments against mentioning BASIS as an option for OP. We're happy there too, at least academically and socially. Colleagues left NE DC for Alexandria before COVID and are complaining that their MS HS students have not been challenged at all by the public they moved for. Friends left EOTP charters for Bethesda and were upset that the schools there were not worth the move either.

We love BASIS too and I feel grateful for the school all the time. However, this OP specifically asked to compare Deal and Hardy to Arlington. Not every post needs to involve BASIS!

DCUM Law Number 342: All posts about DC public schools inevitably end up about BASIS DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We moved from Capitol Hill when our eldest was 11 to Arlington, about a mile from Ballston. Our kids walked to high school, took ART and metro buses and Metro all over Arlington and into DC on the weekends. Neither of them bothered to get their drivers license until they were in college because it just wasn't necessary. They weren't sheltered or stifled at all.

I truly didn't want to leave DC, but almost everything about our lives got easier when we moved, without giving up very much. My commute got longer, but only by about 15 minutes each way. DH's commute was shorter.

Oooh this is the most compelling thing I’ve heard. Tell me what got easier in your life. And were you able to make new adult friends? We are so settled in our DC neighborhood that I am having trouble envisioning the move. But our inbound MS is terrible and I’m tired of the constant lottery uncertainty.

I'd move to Arlington before sending my kids to many of the DC neighborhood schools. Sadly. But don't let this poster fool you: your life virtually anywhere in Arlington, including the area of the county that this poster is describing, WILL be decidedly more suburban and less interesting than anywhere in DC other than Upper Northwest and your kids' upbringing absolutely will be more sheltered. The experience that OP is describing -- not getting drivers' licenses, bussing and metroing by themselves all over town, etc. -- is the minority. Most Arlington parents don't allow that. And no Arlington kids who we knew ever metro'd into DC on weekends by themselves. In fact, most didn't go to DC ever. Maybe things have changed, or maybe OP and her family were unicorns because they moved to Arlington when the kids were older, but most Arlington parents simply don't -- or didn't, at least -- engage in the free-range parenting that she describes.

How do I know? We raised our kids there. Lived there for decades. We now live in DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We moved from Capitol Hill when our eldest was 11 to Arlington, about a mile from Ballston. Our kids walked to high school, took ART and metro buses and Metro all over Arlington and into DC on the weekends. Neither of them bothered to get their drivers license until they were in college because it just wasn't necessary. They weren't sheltered or stifled at all.

I truly didn't want to leave DC, but almost everything about our lives got easier when we moved, without giving up very much. My commute got longer, but only by about 15 minutes each way. DH's commute was shorter.

Oooh this is the most compelling thing I’ve heard. Tell me what got easier in your life. And were you able to make new adult friends? We are so settled in our DC neighborhood that I am having trouble envisioning the move. But our inbound MS is terrible and I’m tired of the constant lottery uncertainty.

I'd move to Arlington before sending my kids to many of the DC neighborhood schools. Sadly. But don't let this poster fool you: your life virtually anywhere in Arlington, including the area of the county that this poster is describing, WILL be decidedly more suburban and less interesting than anywhere in DC other than Upper Northwest and your kids' upbringing absolutely will be more sheltered. The experience that OP is describing -- not getting drivers' licenses, bussing and metroing by themselves all over town, etc. -- is the minority. Most Arlington parents don't allow that. And no Arlington kids who we knew ever metro'd into DC on weekends by themselves. In fact, most didn't go to DC ever. Maybe things have changed, or maybe OP and her family were unicorns because they moved to Arlington when the kids were older, but most Arlington parents simply don't -- or didn't, at least -- engage in the free-range parenting that she describes.

How do I know? We raised our kids there. Lived there for decades. We now live in DC.

Appreciate the counterpoint. These are the issues we are struggling with. I grew up super sheltered and driven around by my parents in our exurb until I could drive myself. We deliberately moved somewhere my kids could have some agency and autonomy at a young age. I know there’s probably a middle ground between our current situation and the one I grew up in but I have these visions of moving to the suburbs and my kids becoming these boring kids who just get carted around from one travel sports practice to another and otherwise spend the rest of the time snacking and gaming alone in our house. The autonomy they have right now gives them so much confidence, especially one of my kids who otherwise tends to be a little anxious. And I think, on balance, it outweighs a bit of the school downsides around here, and that being more responsible and confident helps them advocate for themselves and know they are capable of doing hard things. But I know we could try hard to carry this over to the suburbs if we find somewhere our kids are still able to walk/bike/bus/metro to at least a few places on their own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We moved from Capitol Hill when our eldest was 11 to Arlington, about a mile from Ballston. Our kids walked to high school, took ART and metro buses and Metro all over Arlington and into DC on the weekends. Neither of them bothered to get their drivers license until they were in college because it just wasn't necessary. They weren't sheltered or stifled at all.

I truly didn't want to leave DC, but almost everything about our lives got easier when we moved, without giving up very much. My commute got longer, but only by about 15 minutes each way. DH's commute was shorter.

Oooh this is the most compelling thing I’ve heard. Tell me what got easier in your life. And were you able to make new adult friends? We are so settled in our DC neighborhood that I am having trouble envisioning the move. But our inbound MS is terrible and I’m tired of the constant lottery uncertainty.

I'd move to Arlington before sending my kids to many of the DC neighborhood schools. Sadly. But don't let this poster fool you: your life virtually anywhere in Arlington, including the area of the county that this poster is describing, WILL be decidedly more suburban and less interesting than anywhere in DC other than Upper Northwest and your kids' upbringing absolutely will be more sheltered. The experience that OP is describing -- not getting drivers' licenses, bussing and metroing by themselves all over town, etc. -- is the minority. Most Arlington parents don't allow that. And no Arlington kids who we knew ever metro'd into DC on weekends by themselves. In fact, most didn't go to DC ever. Maybe things have changed, or maybe OP and her family were unicorns because they moved to Arlington when the kids were older, but most Arlington parents simply don't -- or didn't, at least -- engage in the free-range parenting that she describes.

How do I know? We raised our kids there. Lived there for decades. We now live in DC.

Appreciate the counterpoint. These are the issues we are struggling with. I grew up super sheltered and driven around by my parents in our exurb until I could drive myself. We deliberately moved somewhere my kids could have some agency and autonomy at a young age. I know there’s probably a middle ground between our current situation and the one I grew up in but I have these visions of moving to the suburbs and my kids becoming these boring kids who just get carted around from one travel sports practice to another and otherwise spend the rest of the time snacking and gaming alone in our house. The autonomy they have right now gives them so much confidence, especially one of my kids who otherwise tends to be a little anxious. And I think, on balance, it outweighs a bit of the school downsides around here, and that being more responsible and confident helps them advocate for themselves and know they are capable of doing hard things. But I know we could try hard to carry this over to the suburbs if we find somewhere our kids are still able to walk/bike/bus/metro to at least a few places on their own.

I understand. And I'm certainly not doubting the sincerity of that poster's post or the experience of her particular family. But I'd be stunned to hear that it's now anything close to the norm in Arlington. If anything, I'd guess the situation that I described is "worse" because if anything the county has gotten more wealthy than it already was when we were raising our kids there. Having a metro nearby doesn't make a neighborhood "urban." Arlington may be more dense than most suburbs, but it's the suburbs and people live like it's the suburbs. A mile from the Ballston metro is 100 percent suburban.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We moved from Capitol Hill when our eldest was 11 to Arlington, about a mile from Ballston. Our kids walked to high school, took ART and metro buses and Metro all over Arlington and into DC on the weekends. Neither of them bothered to get their drivers license until they were in college because it just wasn't necessary. They weren't sheltered or stifled at all.

I truly didn't want to leave DC, but almost everything about our lives got easier when we moved, without giving up very much. My commute got longer, but only by about 15 minutes each way. DH's commute was shorter.

Oooh this is the most compelling thing I’ve heard. Tell me what got easier in your life. And were you able to make new adult friends? We are so settled in our DC neighborhood that I am having trouble envisioning the move. But our inbound MS is terrible and I’m tired of the constant lottery uncertainty.

I'd move to Arlington before sending my kids to many of the DC neighborhood schools. Sadly. But don't let this poster fool you: your life virtually anywhere in Arlington, including the area of the county that this poster is describing, WILL be decidedly more suburban and less interesting than anywhere in DC other than Upper Northwest and your kids' upbringing absolutely will be more sheltered. The experience that OP is describing -- not getting drivers' licenses, bussing and metroing by themselves all over town, etc. -- is the minority. Most Arlington parents don't allow that. And no Arlington kids who we knew ever metro'd into DC on weekends by themselves. In fact, most didn't go to DC ever. Maybe things have changed, or maybe OP and her family were unicorns because they moved to Arlington when the kids were older, but most Arlington parents simply don't -- or didn't, at least -- engage in the free-range parenting that she describes.

How do I know? We raised our kids there. Lived there for decades. We now live in DC.

Appreciate the counterpoint. These are the issues we are struggling with. I grew up super sheltered and driven around by my parents in our exurb until I could drive myself. We deliberately moved somewhere my kids could have some agency and autonomy at a young age. I know there’s probably a middle ground between our current situation and the one I grew up in but I have these visions of moving to the suburbs and my kids becoming these boring kids who just get carted around from one travel sports practice to another and otherwise spend the rest of the time snacking and gaming alone in our house. The autonomy they have right now gives them so much confidence, especially one of my kids who otherwise tends to be a little anxious. And I think, on balance, it outweighs a bit of the school downsides around here, and that being more responsible and confident helps them advocate for themselves and know they are capable of doing hard things. But I know we could try hard to carry this over to the suburbs if we find somewhere our kids are still able to walk/bike/bus/metro to at least a few places on their own.

I understand. And I'm certainly not doubting the sincerity of that poster's post or the experience of her particular family. But I'd be stunned to hear that it's now anything close to the norm in Arlington. If anything, I'd guess the situation that I described is "worse" because if anything the county has gotten more wealthy than it already was when we were raising our kids there. Having a metro nearby doesn't make a neighborhood "urban." Arlington may be more dense than most suburbs, but it's the suburbs and people live like it's the suburbs. A mile from the Ballston metro is 100 percent suburban.

I have a kid at Dorothy Hamm and I'm located about a mile from the Ballston Metro. My kid is really independent because everything is so close. They bike to school everyday. They bike to the central library to get books. They bike to Washington-Liberty for swim practice. They bike to a local field for rec flag football. They bike to their piano lesson. They bike to friends' houses to study. They bike to their scout meeting. On early release days, they usually end up at Starbucks at Lee Heights with about half of the middle school. (All of these locations are walkable, my kid just prefers to ride their bike.)

We haven't quite gotten to Metroing downtown yet as an 11 yo, in part because I'd want them to be in a group with friends and I don't think any other friends parents would allow that right now, but they absolutely get around our part of town really independently. It's very different than my experience growing up in a suburb where I would depend on a ride from my parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We moved from Capitol Hill when our eldest was 11 to Arlington, about a mile from Ballston. Our kids walked to high school, took ART and metro buses and Metro all over Arlington and into DC on the weekends. Neither of them bothered to get their drivers license until they were in college because it just wasn't necessary. They weren't sheltered or stifled at all.

I truly didn't want to leave DC, but almost everything about our lives got easier when we moved, without giving up very much. My commute got longer, but only by about 15 minutes each way. DH's commute was shorter.

Oooh this is the most compelling thing I’ve heard. Tell me what got easier in your life. And were you able to make new adult friends? We are so settled in our DC neighborhood that I am having trouble envisioning the move. But our inbound MS is terrible and I’m tired of the constant lottery uncertainty.

I'd move to Arlington before sending my kids to many of the DC neighborhood schools. Sadly. But don't let this poster fool you: your life virtually anywhere in Arlington, including the area of the county that this poster is describing, WILL be decidedly more suburban and less interesting than anywhere in DC other than Upper Northwest and your kids' upbringing absolutely will be more sheltered. The experience that OP is describing -- not getting drivers' licenses, bussing and metroing by themselves all over town, etc. -- is the minority. Most Arlington parents don't allow that. And no Arlington kids who we knew ever metro'd into DC on weekends by themselves. In fact, most didn't go to DC ever. Maybe things have changed, or maybe OP and her family were unicorns because they moved to Arlington when the kids were older, but most Arlington parents simply don't -- or didn't, at least -- engage in the free-range parenting that she describes.

How do I know? We raised our kids there. Lived there for decades. We now live in DC.

Appreciate the counterpoint. These are the issues we are struggling with. I grew up super sheltered and driven around by my parents in our exurb until I could drive myself. We deliberately moved somewhere my kids could have some agency and autonomy at a young age. I know there’s probably a middle ground between our current situation and the one I grew up in but I have these visions of moving to the suburbs and my kids becoming these boring kids who just get carted around from one travel sports practice to another and otherwise spend the rest of the time snacking and gaming alone in our house. The autonomy they have right now gives them so much confidence, especially one of my kids who otherwise tends to be a little anxious. And I think, on balance, it outweighs a bit of the school downsides around here, and that being more responsible and confident helps them advocate for themselves and know they are capable of doing hard things. But I know we could try hard to carry this over to the suburbs if we find somewhere our kids are still able to walk/bike/bus/metro to at least a few places on their own.

I understand. And I'm certainly not doubting the sincerity of that poster's post or the experience of her particular family. But I'd be stunned to hear that it's now anything close to the norm in Arlington. If anything, I'd guess the situation that I described is "worse" because if anything the county has gotten more wealthy than it already was when we were raising our kids there. Having a metro nearby doesn't make a neighborhood "urban." Arlington may be more dense than most suburbs, but it's the suburbs and people live like it's the suburbs. A mile from the Ballston metro is 100 percent suburban.

For the kind of autonomy PP is talking about, you need walkability and transit accessibility not just to your home but to a majority of the places you want/need to go too. There are a lot of places in DC proper I'd be hesitant to move to for this reason.

But maybe explains the differences in people's experience? Ex: moving to Arlington from Glover Park vs moving to Arlington from Mt Pleasant.

[Anonymous]

Hi OP, I don't have firsthand experience with both Hardy and Arlington, but my kid is currently at Hardy and we have friends whose children went to middle school in Arlington (they’re now in high school). I haven’t heard anything from them that makes me regret choosing to stay in DC and send our kid to Hardy. If anything, it seemed like their kids dealt with much more online drama than what our child is experiencing at Hardy right now (which is none), though of course that’s very anecdotal.
My kid takes the city bus to school, goes to cafés with friends afterward, and really enjoys what the Georgetown area has to offer. Many kids get into Algebra in 7th grade, and they read 3 books a year in ELA (which is low, of course. Is it more anywhere else?). Sports and club offerings are plentiful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are facing a similar decision to OP. We live EOTP and have never had luck in the lottery. Both of our kids are strong students and one will be starting MS in the fall. We love DC and don’t want to leave. Our eldest DS has a lot of freedom in our neighborhood to walk around, meet up with friends, and we think this gives him a sense of independence and confidence you can’t get everywhere. We went to an open house for a middle school in the suburbs and were surprised at how the school talked about the kids getting there, crossing the street, etc and addressing parent concerns that seemed suited to kids much younger than MS age. I’m worried my kids will end up a bit sheltered and stifled. But it may be worth it for the better schools and the certainty.

We moved from Capitol Hill when our eldest was 11 to Arlington, about a mile from Ballston. Our kids walked to high school, took ART and metro buses and Metro all over Arlington and into DC on the weekends. Neither of them bothered to get their drivers license until they were in college because it just wasn't necessary. They weren't sheltered or stifled at all.

I truly didn't want to leave DC, but almost everything about our lives got easier when we moved, without giving up very much. My commute got longer, but only by about 15 minutes each way. DH's commute was shorter.

Oooh this is the most compelling thing I’ve heard. Tell me what got easier in your life. And were you able to make new adult friends? We are so settled in our DC neighborhood that I am having trouble envisioning the move. But our inbound MS is terrible and I’m tired of the constant lottery uncertainty.

I'd move to Arlington before sending my kids to many of the DC neighborhood schools. Sadly. But don't let this poster fool you: your life virtually anywhere in Arlington, including the area of the county that this poster is describing, WILL be decidedly more suburban and less interesting than anywhere in DC other than Upper Northwest and your kids' upbringing absolutely will be more sheltered. The experience that OP is describing -- not getting drivers' licenses, bussing and metroing by themselves all over town, etc. -- is the minority. Most Arlington parents don't allow that. And no Arlington kids who we knew ever metro'd into DC on weekends by themselves. In fact, most didn't go to DC ever. Maybe things have changed, or maybe OP and her family were unicorns because they moved to Arlington when the kids were older, but most Arlington parents simply don't -- or didn't, at least -- engage in the free-range parenting that she describes.

How do I know? We raised our kids there. Lived there for decades. We now live in DC.

Appreciate the counterpoint. These are the issues we are struggling with. I grew up super sheltered and driven around by my parents in our exurb until I could drive myself. We deliberately moved somewhere my kids could have some agency and autonomy at a young age. I know there’s probably a middle ground between our current situation and the one I grew up in but I have these visions of moving to the suburbs and my kids becoming these boring kids who just get carted around from one travel sports practice to another and otherwise spend the rest of the time snacking and gaming alone in our house. The autonomy they have right now gives them so much confidence, especially one of my kids who otherwise tends to be a little anxious. And I think, on balance, it outweighs a bit of the school downsides around here, and that being more responsible and confident helps them advocate for themselves and know they are capable of doing hard things. But I know we could try hard to carry this over to the suburbs if we find somewhere our kids are still able to walk/bike/bus/metro to at least a few places on their own.

I understand. And I'm certainly not doubting the sincerity of that poster's post or the experience of her particular family. But I'd be stunned to hear that it's now anything close to the norm in Arlington. If anything, I'd guess the situation that I described is "worse" because if anything the county has gotten more wealthy than it already was when we were raising our kids there. Having a metro nearby doesn't make a neighborhood "urban." Arlington may be more dense than most suburbs, but it's the suburbs and people live like it's the suburbs. A mile from the Ballston metro is 100 percent suburban.

I have a kid at Dorothy Hamm and I'm located about a mile from the Ballston Metro. My kid is really independent because everything is so close. They bike to school everyday. They bike to the central library to get books. They bike to Washington-Liberty for swim practice. They bike to a local field for rec flag football. They bike to their piano lesson. They bike to friends' houses to study. They bike to their scout meeting. On early release days, they usually end up at Starbucks at Lee Heights with about half of the middle school. (All of these locations are walkable, my kid just prefers to ride their bike.)

We haven't quite gotten to Metroing downtown yet as an 11 yo, in part because I'd want them to be in a group with friends and I don't think any other friends parents would allow that right now, but they absolutely get around our part of town really independently. It's very different than my experience growing up in a suburb where I would depend on a ride from my parents.

You are describing a suburban existence. I know the Starbucks you're talking about. It couldn't be more suburban. Not to mention that most city kids in middle school don't hang out in the local Starbucks.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with any of it. Just saying that it ain't city living.