Are most girls just mean?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 2 teenage girls. They are not mean. They are kind and quiet girls. They intentionally avoid mean girls. From my observation, it seems that most of the "mean girl" behavior is in the most popular circles which my girls are not part of.

I will say this. My girls are not proactively mean but they have developed a survival instinct to fight back against mean girls that pick on other girls, basically learning to fight fire with fire. Even though I'm proud of them for doing that, it makes me sad at the same time.

OP here. My DD has always been included in most things in preschool and early elementary and I guess these people may become the popular girls. My daughter is pretty and fairly good at most things she tries, just like her brothers. She goes to public school and we are on the high end of income and house. Being rich in public doesn’t seem to help her socially. Some girls seem to get jealous or mean about material items our family cares nothing about. Girls may put things down for no reason. Ugh. I hate this.

I am going to say that if your DD gives off the vibe you do here, it doesn't surprise me that girls are mean... but you are very much misunderstanding why. You come across like exactly the parent you are criticizing. Your daughter is pretty. Your daughter is good at things. So is your son. You are rich comparatively. You have a nice house. You are sad that being rich doesn't help her socially(?!?). Girls are jealous of your kid's (implicitly) super fancy stuff that you are too rich to care about. Like... you probably don't intend to, but you absolutely come across as the problem.

My daughter is generally included by most of the girls despite them being mean to her and others.

I only wrote that we have a nice home stating it does not seem to give her any social advantages. If anything, it seems to be negative. She has a very well decorated room with a closet full of nice clothes she mostly does not wear.

When my boys’ friends came over, we had a 5000sf basement that they loved playing in. We always had the latest video game or toys so they enjoyed coming over to play. They raided our pantry of snacks and loved it.

NP. If you have a 5000 sf basement, then yes, other kids and their parents might be envious of your family's financial resources. Even more so if you all live on one income. Your DD might have better friendship luck at a large, coed private school, and/or a religious school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The boys turn mean at 11. Idk why, but they’re just behind the girls.

I'm noticing this with my second son who is 11, but never happened with my first son who is 14. Honestly, I wish he would be a bit meaner.

NP. This also describes my kids, down to the ages. Younger DS is empathetic, passionate, has lots of friends, but carries grudges and can be really mean. Older DS is just a nice kid - as siblings, unfortunately, he has learned to be a bit mean back to his brother but otherwise gets taken advantage of by his friends, I think.

I’m not sure you can describe someone who is really mean and holds grudges as empathetic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many girls are not mean, but most of them form their tiny circles and they are not inclusive to other kids outside of their circle. They don't say mean words but they ignore your existences and not responding to you. Not thick skin kids take the cues and know that they are not really welcomed to join them to hang out or play together.

This is absolutely what it looks like. I'm genuinely curious -"cool" kids excluding others is an age old problem - why isn't the obvious solution coaching the excluded kids to make their own groups of genuine, nice friends? It seems like such a simple solution over begging for inclusion, or pressuring to invite the whole class or whatever. Forcing yourself into a friend group never ends well. Why isn't that the lesson?

We have truly tried this. Repeatedly. Some of the “not cool” groups are still essentially “closed” to new members. If you aren’t already in since 3rd grade or whatever, too bad. The remaining girls: A- are painfully quiet and basically just don’t talk even when you have them over and don’t reciprocate invites or return texts B- have very hyper specific interests and have basically nothing in common with my DD. She has tried the theatre kids, the band kids and a group obsessed with horseback riding. or C- kids that just don’t want to socialize with anyone period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 2 teenage girls. They are not mean. They are kind and quiet girls. They intentionally avoid mean girls. From my observation, it seems that most of the "mean girl" behavior is in the most popular circles which my girls are not part of.

I will say this. My girls are not proactively mean but they have developed a survival instinct to fight back against mean girls that pick on other girls, basically learning to fight fire with fire. Even though I'm proud of them for doing that, it makes me sad at the same time.

OP here. My DD has always been included in most things in preschool and early elementary and I guess these people may become the popular girls. My daughter is pretty and fairly good at most things she tries, just like her brothers. She goes to public school and we are on the high end of income and house. Being rich in public doesn’t seem to help her socially. Some girls seem to get jealous or mean about material items our family cares nothing about. Girls may put things down for no reason. Ugh. I hate this.

Your thinking is twisted. Unless you live in a small town where you have a 50 room mansion and everyone else is on public housing I can’t imagine you’re the only one with a nice house. Towns typically have a range, either lower income to middle income families or upper middle to top income. Kids typically don’t choose their friends by their house although some mothers try to do that. They choose based on friendship.

You have no idea what someone has for an income based on what you see. Work with your daughter on how to be a friend. She could compliment one kid every day on something. She can practice smiling and greeting everyone. Ask some of the quieter kids if she can play with them. If she’s nice, friendly, outgoing it will encourage friends to do the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The boys turn mean at 11. Idk why, but they’re just behind the girls.

Up to a point, then some boys turn psychopaths at adolescence/adulthood. Look at which gender commits most murders.
I prefer mean girls over homicidal men.

Everyone prefers mean girls over homicidal men, but if you’re sitting idly at home, who are you more likely to fixate on and have negative thoughts about: someone who’s mean to you or a serial killer?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's mean parents.

It’s not. It’s just the kids’ personalities and how they are wired emotionally. The meanest girl, super mean, I can’t believe some of the things she says, has very normal, low key parents. Think: low maintenance, friendly, not competitive, free range type parents. I’m not friends with the mother, but she lives in the neighborhood and we chat occasionally. She has mentioned her daughter is a handful…so I think she is some what aware. I have many examples I can think of where mean kids come from very normal parents. I really think it’s a combination of how they are wired and early friendships.

[Anonymous]

Both my kids (one girl one boy) have encountered their share of mean peers. Girls are more likely to tell you what’s going on, boys are less likely to talk about it. Or they accept the $hit-talk put downs as acceptable part of boy-hood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's mean parents.

It’s not. It’s just the kids’ personalities and how they are wired emotionally. The meanest girl, super mean, I can’t believe some of the things she says, has very normal, low key parents. Think: low maintenance, friendly, not competitive, free range type parents. I’m not friends with the mother, but she lives in the neighborhood and we chat occasionally. She has mentioned her daughter is a handful…so I think she is some what aware. I have many examples I can think of where mean kids come from very normal parents. I really think it’s a combination of how they are wired and early friendships.

You have no idea how the parents are at home with the kids. There are a lot of types of dysfunction. Kids learn that behavior first at home in immediate family - this includes siblings and extended family, nanny, etc. Some may be more susceptible to being mean but it doesn't just show up out of the blue.

[Anonymous]

This is a bizarre thread. I wonder how many of you actually have tween girls. Yes, there are always going to be a handful of girls (and boys!!!) in every class that are not nice, but I would never claim that it's MOST of them.

I have three girls - HS, MS, ES - and yes, we've encountered kids who are snobs, who exclude other kids, etc., but all three of my girls have found really nice groups of friends in all three age groups (and my HSer isn't friends with the same kids she was friends with in ES, friend groups shift over time, they've always been great kids). They're kind and supportive of one another.

My girls have made friends through school, Girl Scouts, sports, activities, and after school clubs. Maybe it's time for OP to expand out from just her child's small elementary school class.

[Anonymous]

OP is a religious nut job

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I only have daughters (and only had sisters too) and they are teens now. And yes in our experience most girls are at worst mean and catty and at best just not thoughtful. There are a few nice ones but they are very hard to identify and in high demand as friends. The remaining girls tend to be anti-social (want to read at recess, only want to discuss very limited subjects, don't want to hang out or do things outside of school, or the parents don't let them.)

I'm hoping college is a better experience for them.

Your description of "anti-social" girls is off. That's just a girl who knows who she is and is okay hanging out on her own. Those are actually good qualities. It's just irritating to you during the awkward, anxious jockeying for friends that tweens engage in, because you want these kids to hang out with your kid, who may be less discerning about friends and just want someone to hang out with. Which is also fine, and can also be a good quality to serves her well..

But I'd like to discourage people from thinking that any child who doesn't hit it off with your kid or doesn't want to be friends with your kid is "mean" or "anti-social." Are you friends with literally every woman your age in your general vicinity? I am not. It's okay for kids to have preferences, to sometimes choose to be alone rather than play with someone whose interests are different than theirs, or to have niche interests that excite them even if it's not what everyone is doing.

[Anonymous]

Yes, I have two daughters. Both experienced incredible meanness from elementary school through middle school. Things in high school got much, much better for my older daughter. Moms are often oblivious to how cruel their daughters can be.

[Anonymous]

I have a tween and I would say there have been bouts of mean girl behavior but I really don’t think of any one as a mean girl. The dynamics are really tough. Yes there’s always some jealousy over something but it’s rarely money. My kid is intensely jealous/annoyed by the Girl Scout troup leader’s daughter because she always has an inside scoop and tries to take over the activities. Her mom is one of the nicest people I have ever met but does give her kid special roles and doesn’t seem to understand how the daughter uses that to boss the other girls around. But that’s just something we talk about, and honestly my kid is prone to bossiness so it’s good for her to be on the other side of it.

But outside of groups that she’s sort of stuck in she just hangs out with other girls who are nice to her. We tell her all the time you can be friendly with out being friends and that’s served her really well. She has done such a good job of not getting wrapped up in the drama and if someone is rude to her she just says whatever and moves on. She has friends outside of school as well and a close relationship with a cousin and I think that gives her the confidence to not get bogged down with the drama. I highly recommend trying to invest in multiple friend groups, even if some are different ages or something. It’s really helpful.

[Anonymous]

We had a group of boy mean moms. When I say mean, I mean vicious. I had a girl so not sure how the boys were, but the moms were busy sowing high drama at that age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I only have daughters (and only had sisters too) and they are teens now. And yes in our experience most girls are at worst mean and catty and at best just not thoughtful. There are a few nice ones but they are very hard to identify and in high demand as friends. The remaining girls tend to be anti-social (want to read at recess, only want to discuss very limited subjects, don't want to hang out or do things outside of school, or the parents don't let them.)

I'm hoping college is a better experience for them.

Your description of "anti-social" girls is off. That's just a girl who knows who she is and is okay hanging out on her own. Those are actually good qualities. It's just irritating to you during the awkward, anxious jockeying for friends that tweens engage in, because you want these kids to hang out with your kid, who may be less discerning about friends and just want someone to hang out with. Which is also fine, and can also be a good quality to serves her well..

But I'd like to discourage people from thinking that any child who doesn't hit it off with your kid or doesn't want to be friends with your kid is "mean" or "anti-social." Are you friends with literally every woman your age in your general vicinity? I am not. It's okay for kids to have preferences, to sometimes choose to be alone rather than play with someone whose interests are different than theirs, or to have niche interests that excite them even if it's not what everyone is doing.

Fine. The point is - it’s not that easy to just “find other friends.” Plenty of girls are not even really looking for friends.