For those 45+, how good were the 1990s, actually?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I immigrated to the US in the late 90s from....Bosnia (I know why you mentioned it, of course) and always felt like I couldn't believe how good things were before 9/11 happened. It's like something shifted after that day and we have never been able to get back on track.

I was in NYC on that day, so it was up close and in my face, but I’ve felt like that was the death of so much collective optimism, and the void was replaced by so much cynicism and paranoia.

Then came smartphones and social media, which at first felt like progress, but it eventually only served to make us far more cynical and disconnected.

Then came Covid, and that was really the final blow to any feeling of “we’re in this life thing together.” What a sorry state we’re in now.

Yes. Covid was transformatively terrible for society

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It was grinding poverty for lots of people in Appalachia and the inner cities.

1992, I had just started working in public health. I had positions in communities with extremely concentrated poverty. I realized later that the object poverty I saw masked how poor I myself was. It would have been obvious in a regular working class setting. But I felt so fortunate to be able to buy $5 new shoes at Ames rather than getting used shoes for 50 cents at the flea market like most of my clients. I just normalized all of us having holes in the bottom of our shoes.

I left Appalachia in 1991 to find employment. That's why I am here.

[Anonymous]

Im 40. I was age 16 by the year 2000.

I don’t know why you want 45+. What about 43 year olds?

I loved the 90s. I now see it as a carefree-ish time that we didn’t appreciate, before 9/11/2001.

[Anonymous]

Right regarding 9/11. We did not have the awareness of and fear of terrorism in the 90s. Nor did our government, apparently,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP needs to keep in mind that in the 1990s the white middle class suburban demographics was the majority, if not by far the biggest single demographic cohort in the country. If you want to take the stance that if you were white and middle class then you only have an biased perspective of life in the 1990s, you're ignoring how the majority actually experienced the 90s, which means you're risking seeking out a minority and biased perspective of the decade. And contrary to what some youngsters like to believe, gays and minorities weren't persecuted, you'd have to go back much earlier.

That aside, there were huge ranges in how people "experienced" the decade as well as variations within the decade itself, from the brief 1991-2 recession to the boom of the end of the decade (which incidentally set up the framework for the great recession in the long run). I remember plenty of uncertainty and fears about everything, which is utterly typical for every decade and every generation. Some things feel better about the 90s, especially the pre social media era. There's been a great deal of cultural changes in larger society, some for the better, some that are neutral, and some that simply means a different kind of future than previously assumed. I actually think Europe actually is having a much harder time with this than the US.

I will say technology improvements, for all its benefits, has sped up the pace of how things are done and lived these days compared to the 1990s, which did move at a fast pace of its own. It seems like the more technology we have, the faster we have to live our lives. The pace is breathtaking nowadays and the ability to step out of it to a slower lifestyle seems impossible, at least without significant economic implications.

It is pretty sweeping to say gays and minorities weren't persecuted.

Just because you didn't experience it personally, does not mean it is not true.

Yes many people had the good life in the 1990s but there was still discrimination.

Mid 60’s here. Graduated from HS in 1978 so lived through both the 80s and the 90s as a lesbian. Here’s my take. The music and the clubs were like nothing that exists today. We had Black Sabbath, Queen, MeatLoaf, . . . Gay clubs in virtually any larger city were so full of energy and life. I don’t know that any generation will ever experience the wonder that was ours every single day if we weren’t too afraid to go.

But, gay clubs were hidden and you had to be afraid to go in. They were in undesirable (dangerous) neighborhoods, so safety was a concern. And, if you were seen entering, you risked your livelihood - losing your job and your housing, particularly in the early era of AIDS. Men got paid more than women just because they were men. Getting married wasn’t even a dream and if you lived with a partner, you set up a separate bedroom so you could pretend you weren’t together since that was vital for your safety and financial security.

And, finding people like yourself was like finding an underground community. You got publications like Lesbian Connections delivered in brown paper so no one would know what it was and the second it was delivered, you devoured it because you were so desperate for connections. That’s how you found out about things like the Michigan Women’s Music Festival.

I am white so I only observed the treatment of those who weren’t. But non white people were forced into their own communities. If they dared to buy a house in a white area, they had to worry about their kids being beaten up at the bus stop. Our parents didn’t allow us to play with non white kids or bring them around our house ever. There were segregated pools and grocery stores where the “colored” shopped. We were taught to be afraid of them.

And, once you hit a certain age, somewhere between 16 and 18, you were expected to move out and take care of yourself. Parents weren’t financing their kids’ college or their kids’ lives after HS graduation. We all pounded the pavement for jobs by the time were were 14 because our parents weren’t giving us money, but back then, 10 year olds could babysit your kids and parents went out often so there was that.

Oh, and don’t forget that women couldn’t get credit cards until the 1980s, couldn’t sign contracts, had difficulty renting apartments, etc. So, you were stuck in bad and abusive marriages. I remember when my friend’s parents divorced, my dad had to find her mom an apartment because women couldn’t apply or advertise for an apartment (back then, you advertised that you needed one, landlords didn’t advertise that they had availability).

So, do I miss the music and the clubs? Definitely yes. It was a gazillion times better than today. But, life today is so much better. As a society, we treat people the same regardless of race, sexual orientation, gender . . . I could finally get married and by the time it was legal in DC, we had been together almost two decades with kids, dogs and a house. Yes, school is more expensive for my kids than it was for me, but as a society, we generally help our kids whereas that wasn’t the case when I went to college. And, we all have health insurance without ridiculous conditions and high deductibles. HMOs and PPOs are amazing and people don’t even get what a huge change that is. And, while people criticize insurance companies, if you lived through the 80s and 90s, you’d understand how it was borne out of over treatment. Before conditions were set, people would stay in the hospital for weeks for a minor surgery and months or years for mental health issues.

And while the internet has its downsides, it sure does make finding people, travel, jobs, and everything else so much easier. Even social media has its upsides, like being able to stay in touch with family and watching them grow up when you live far away.

Thanks for the trip down memory lane. Now I’m going to go put on some hard rock while I go about the rest of my morning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP needs to keep in mind that in the 1990s the white middle class suburban demographics was the majority, if not by far the biggest single demographic cohort in the country. If you want to take the stance that if you were white and middle class then you only have an biased perspective of life in the 1990s, you're ignoring how the majority actually experienced the 90s, which means you're risking seeking out a minority and biased perspective of the decade. And contrary to what some youngsters like to believe, gays and minorities weren't persecuted, you'd have to go back much earlier.

That aside, there were huge ranges in how people "experienced" the decade as well as variations within the decade itself, from the brief 1991-2 recession to the boom of the end of the decade (which incidentally set up the framework for the great recession in the long run). I remember plenty of uncertainty and fears about everything, which is utterly typical for every decade and every generation. Some things feel better about the 90s, especially the pre social media era. There's been a great deal of cultural changes in larger society, some for the better, some that are neutral, and some that simply means a different kind of future than previously assumed. I actually think Europe actually is having a much harder time with this than the US.

I will say technology improvements, for all its benefits, has sped up the pace of how things are done and lived these days compared to the 1990s, which did move at a fast pace of its own. It seems like the more technology we have, the faster we have to live our lives. The pace is breathtaking nowadays and the ability to step out of it to a slower lifestyle seems impossible, at least without significant economic implications.

It is pretty sweeping to say gays and minorities weren't persecuted.

Just because you didn't experience it personally, does not mean it is not true.

Yes many people had the good life in the 1990s but there was still discrimination.

Gay guy who grew up in the 80s and 90s. I was out in the 90s. Things are more tolerant today, sure, but it wasn't a benighted dark age in the 1990s either. There was already a thriving gay club scene in most cities. 90s compared to the 80s was much better and open for gays.

Not sure what you mean by minority persecution. 1990s was also the era of political correctness. Do remember the Rodney King riots and Al Sharpton and the Tawana Brawley rape hoax, but the black middle class was exploding in size compared to previous generations. Black Americans had enormously influential cultural impact. You're sounding like there were posses of people hunting down black people for moving into a white neighborhood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP needs to keep in mind that in the 1990s the white middle class suburban demographics was the majority, if not by far the biggest single demographic cohort in the country. If you want to take the stance that if you were white and middle class then you only have an biased perspective of life in the 1990s, you're ignoring how the majority actually experienced the 90s, which means you're risking seeking out a minority and biased perspective of the decade. And contrary to what some youngsters like to believe, gays and minorities weren't persecuted, you'd have to go back much earlier.

That aside, there were huge ranges in how people "experienced" the decade as well as variations within the decade itself, from the brief 1991-2 recession to the boom of the end of the decade (which incidentally set up the framework for the great recession in the long run). I remember plenty of uncertainty and fears about everything, which is utterly typical for every decade and every generation. Some things feel better about the 90s, especially the pre social media era. There's been a great deal of cultural changes in larger society, some for the better, some that are neutral, and some that simply means a different kind of future than previously assumed. I actually think Europe actually is having a much harder time with this than the US.

I will say technology improvements, for all its benefits, has sped up the pace of how things are done and lived these days compared to the 1990s, which did move at a fast pace of its own. It seems like the more technology we have, the faster we have to live our lives. The pace is breathtaking nowadays and the ability to step out of it to a slower lifestyle seems impossible, at least without significant economic implications.

It is pretty sweeping to say gays and minorities weren't persecuted.

Just because you didn't experience it personally, does not mean it is not true.

Yes many people had the good life in the 1990s but there was still discrimination.

Gay guy who grew up in the 80s and 90s. I was out in the 90s. Things are more tolerant today, sure, but it wasn't a benighted dark age in the 1990s either. There was already a thriving gay club scene in most cities. 90s compared to the 80s was much better and open for gays.

Not sure what you mean by minority persecution. 1990s was also the era of political correctness. Do remember the Rodney King riots and Al Sharpton and the Tawana Brawley rape hoax, but the black middle class was exploding in size compared to previous generations. Black Americans had enormously influential cultural impact. You're sounding like there were posses of people hunting down black people for moving into a white neighborhood.

Grow up in a backward state, the larger cities with state colleges have vibrate LGTQ scene mixed with thriving artist districts. Until privileged rich kids start building condos.

[Anonymous]

Um, did no one remember that Matthew Sheppard was murder in 1998? So much for care free times in the 90s being gay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Um, did no one remember that Matthew Sheppard was murder in 1998? So much for care free times in the 90s being gay.

Gay guy again. The Matthew Shephard murder is a bit more complicated than a zealous hunt to kill gays. And one murder doesn't equivalent a nationwide persecution, correct? I was singing in gay choruses in midwestern cities the year Matthew Shephard was killed. If you could show a pattern, it'd be something, but you can't because there really isn't. One man died in a country of 275 million people. Oh well. I'll repeat what I said, the 1990s were not a benighted dark ages. It wasn't as open as today's world and absolutely there were still homophobia and a great deal of it was within families struggling to accept homosexual children and I know of sad cases. But that is not persecution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The 1990s were fantastic. You could expect to go to a good university, for a reasonable amount of money. You could raise kids as a single mom and send them to a good university. You really felt like you could be anything in the world you put your mind to. And it was fun -

Yep. My first Bachelors was about $10-15,000 total, all tuition, books, etc. Not counting meals or gasoline. That was mid 90s! Don't even want to see the over-inflated prices of one now.

Yeah. We didn’t have to have our parents as guarantors either when we’d go to put in a rental application for an apartment or sublet.

[Anonymous]

i appreciate the internet, but i feel sorry for young people having to deal with social media (even linkedin is awful) and the lack of dance clubs. The closest thing to find is line dancing country places--but most of the patrons are us gen-xers!

[Anonymous]

No one mentioned the eating disorders and the absolute chokehold fat free foods had on us. Kate Moss and Snackwells.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No one mentioned the eating disorders and the absolute chokehold fat free foods had on us. Kate Moss and Snackwells.

ehh --sticking to the outside aisles of the grocery store was always a thing, and there was more recognition that overeating isn't healthy.

eating disorders are mental health first and foremost.

[Anonymous]

I was born in 70. What I miss most about the 80s and 90s is kids playing outside. My grandchildren don't have the experience of walking to a friend's home or playing games outside without a parent. I drive around my neighborhood and don't see kids very often even though I know they're there. There was just an expectation of liveliness in the outside world that we don't see anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP needs to keep in mind that in the 1990s the white middle class suburban demographics was the majority, if not by far the biggest single demographic cohort in the country. If you want to take the stance that if you were white and middle class then you only have an biased perspective of life in the 1990s, you're ignoring how the majority actually experienced the 90s, which means you're risking seeking out a minority and biased perspective of the decade. And contrary to what some youngsters like to believe, gays and minorities weren't persecuted, you'd have to go back much earlier.

That aside, there were huge ranges in how people "experienced" the decade as well as variations within the decade itself, from the brief 1991-2 recession to the boom of the end of the decade (which incidentally set up the framework for the great recession in the long run). I remember plenty of uncertainty and fears about everything, which is utterly typical for every decade and every generation. Some things feel better about the 90s, especially the pre social media era. There's been a great deal of cultural changes in larger society, some for the better, some that are neutral, and some that simply means a different kind of future than previously assumed. I actually think Europe actually is having a much harder time with this than the US.

I will say technology improvements, for all its benefits, has sped up the pace of how things are done and lived these days compared to the 1990s, which did move at a fast pace of its own. It seems like the more technology we have, the faster we have to live our lives. The pace is breathtaking nowadays and the ability to step out of it to a slower lifestyle seems impossible, at least without significant economic implications.

It is pretty sweeping to say gays and minorities weren't persecuted.

Just because you didn't experience it personally, does not mean it is not true.

Yes many people had the good life in the 1990s but there was still discrimination.

Mid 60’s here. Graduated from HS in 1978 so lived through both the 80s and the 90s as a lesbian. Here’s my take. The music and the clubs were like nothing that exists today. We had Black Sabbath, Queen, MeatLoaf, . . . Gay clubs in virtually any larger city were so full of energy and life. I don’t know that any generation will ever experience the wonder that was ours every single day if we weren’t too afraid to go.

But, gay clubs were hidden and you had to be afraid to go in. They were in undesirable (dangerous) neighborhoods, so safety was a concern. And, if you were seen entering, you risked your livelihood - losing your job and your housing, particularly in the early era of AIDS. Men got paid more than women just because they were men. Getting married wasn’t even a dream and if you lived with a partner, you set up a separate bedroom so you could pretend you weren’t together since that was vital for your safety and financial security.

And, finding people like yourself was like finding an underground community. You got publications like Lesbian Connections delivered in brown paper so no one would know what it was and the second it was delivered, you devoured it because you were so desperate for connections. That’s how you found out about things like the Michigan Women’s Music Festival.

I am white so I only observed the treatment of those who weren’t. But non white people were forced into their own communities. If they dared to buy a house in a white area, they had to worry about their kids being beaten up at the bus stop. Our parents didn’t allow us to play with non white kids or bring them around our house ever. There were segregated pools and grocery stores where the “colored” shopped. We were taught to be afraid of them.

And, once you hit a certain age, somewhere between 16 and 18, you were expected to move out and take care of yourself. Parents weren’t financing their kids’ college or their kids’ lives after HS graduation. We all pounded the pavement for jobs by the time were were 14 because our parents weren’t giving us money, but back then, 10 year olds could babysit your kids and parents went out often so there was that.

Oh, and don’t forget that women couldn’t get credit cards until the 1980s, couldn’t sign contracts, had difficulty renting apartments, etc. So, you were stuck in bad and abusive marriages. I remember when my friend’s parents divorced, my dad had to find her mom an apartment because women couldn’t apply or advertise for an apartment (back then, you advertised that you needed one, landlords didn’t advertise that they had availability).

So, do I miss the music and the clubs? Definitely yes. It was a gazillion times better than today. But, life today is so much better. As a society, we treat people the same regardless of race, sexual orientation, gender . . . I could finally get married and by the time it was legal in DC, we had been together almost two decades with kids, dogs and a house. Yes, school is more expensive for my kids than it was for me, but as a society, we generally help our kids whereas that wasn’t the case when I went to college. And, we all have health insurance without ridiculous conditions and high deductibles. HMOs and PPOs are amazing and people don’t even get what a huge change that is. And, while people criticize insurance companies, if you lived through the 80s and 90s, you’d understand how it was borne out of over treatment. Before conditions were set, people would stay in the hospital for weeks for a minor surgery and months or years for mental health issues.

And while the internet has its downsides, it sure does make finding people, travel, jobs, and everything else so much easier. Even social media has its upsides, like being able to stay in touch with family and watching them grow up when you live far away.

Thanks for the trip down memory lane. Now I’m going to go put on some hard rock while I go about the rest of my morning.

I graduated from high school in 1985, so I'm a few years younger than you. But I have a hard time believing that things changed so drastically in only 7 yrs, because what I bolded was not my experience at all. Maybe location played a role? I graduated from high school in Nashville. My first boss (1983, high school job) was openly gay. I went to gay clubs and bars with friends all through my college years (also in Nashville) and all of my friends were out. I'm sorry you hard that part of the experience. You're spot on about the music and dance scene. Nashville had (probably still does) an amazing music scene totally unrelated to country.