Did anyone's kid choose quality of life/social factors over prestige?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, what do you mean by social/quality of life? My penn seas DD picked it because of social fit and ability to continue music and be an engineer. She just finished freshman year with a 3.91. The two other top-12 she got accepted to had a similar feel but Penn edged them out with arts and collaboration among engineering evident at admitted days. UVA is very Greek-forward, fewer club spots for freshmen than penn, arts are not easy to do as an engineeri and not at all the quality of life she wanted.

I think by social I mean friendly, laid back kids, lots of parties, lots of hanging out on the lawn. And there is probably some element of wanting preppy and mainstream.
Greek forward is viewed as a positive to her. She is very smart but isn't a striver (if striver means pushing the envelope beyond what is asked) or an academic and she isn't quirky at all. No obscure interests or passions. Little career direction. She is very well-liked, very hard working, and a perfectionist. She has done very well at a challenging magnet school in highest rigor courses. But she is not entering college with passions about economics or philosophy or robotics or anything really.

Penn is known as the “social ivy”

Penn and Cornell are well known for student suicides. The head of mental health counseling switched jobs from Cornell to U Penn and committed suicide at U Penn while head of mental health counseling.

September of 2019. Jumped from the 17th floor. Was head of counseling at Cornell for almost 10 years before accepting same position at U Penn.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like she really wants to go to UVA. So let her. Trust that she knows what she wants. UVA is not for everyone. If she likes it that much it’s probably for her!

[Anonymous]

3 yrs ago, DS chose Wisconsin over Berkeley, Michigan & Dartmouth. DH & I struggled with the decision back then, but he had compelling reasons for making the choice. We knew we needed to let him make the choice and not force him to a school that we preferred solely for perceived prestige reasons.
Best decision, no regrets. He is very happy, successful, and already has some great options for life beyond college.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I cannot imagine anyone sending a child to Columbia in this current environment, so that wouldn't even be a consideration at my house. Penn, maybe.

But I would take UVA over Penn any day.

I'm not going to say that nothing is happening at Columbia because that would be lying and only Donald Trump is allowed to do that, but things at Columbia really are not as bad on a day to day basis as Trump, Fox News, and the rest of them want you to think. And I am a Jew who is frequently in the neighborhood of Columbia.

That being said, based on the description of the kid, I don't think it is the best fit. But not because of "this current environment."

Oh, of course not. But will you at least allow that different people have different views on how "bad" things are? Just because you're used to it, as an adult living in the area, does not mean that it doesn't impact students who have to deal with it in a different way on a daily basis.

My view is definitely not universal - you are correct. I despise all of the posters here who act like they speak for everyone.

But my opinion is a lot more informed than 95% of the posters here. I am a Jew who is more likely to be concerned about this. I live nearby. I know a lot of kids and faculty there. So I feel like I have a good perspective.

And those stirring up much of the drama have a tendency for hyperbole and to spin news in a way that creates drama. Anyone who doesn't take Fox News (and MSNBC) with a grain of salt should not be allowed to operate heavy machinery.

+1

This is a huge problem within the Jewish community right now. So much of what I hear and read about what “Jewish parents” think does not apply to me.

I am the poster of the post you responded to and also a Jew and I agree with you 100%. I have a very nuanced perspective on things and no one gives me a second to explain. I do not appreciate Trump inserting himself into the situation - the way he is handling things is not helping. Something needed to be done but this is not the righit answer.

Amen, sister.

DH and I long ago lost interest in discussing our nuanced perspective with those who clearly are not open to it. This includes some of our closest friends. They don’t hesitate to talk/rant when we’re together, but when (if) it comes back around to us, we just say, “yeah, it’s complicated,” in an agreeably sympathetic voice. It’s true - it IS complicated. But after some pretty awful attempts to explain our nuanced POV, we just leave it there.

Yup. Totally agree. My BFF is passionately Zionist and is constantly sending my articles to read, asking me questions, etc. I agree with them on many things and in some ways appreciate their passion but they just won't stop. I was recently trying to discuss an important, stressful personal medical issue with them and they changed the topic to something Israel-related and I got very angry. I am more of an ally than a lot of other people but they are just going to drive me away.

To everyone else - sorry for the threadjack.

💗 Hang in there and know you’re far from alone on this. 💗 Now back to the primary discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, what do you mean by social/quality of life? My penn seas DD picked it because of social fit and ability to continue music and be an engineer. She just finished freshman year with a 3.91. The two other top-12 she got accepted to had a similar feel but Penn edged them out with arts and collaboration among engineering evident at admitted days. UVA is very Greek-forward, fewer club spots for freshmen than penn, arts are not easy to do as an engineeri and not at all the quality of life she wanted.

I think by social I mean friendly, laid back kids, lots of parties, lots of hanging out on the lawn. And there is probably some element of wanting preppy and mainstream.
Greek forward is viewed as a positive to her. She is very smart but isn't a striver (if striver means pushing the envelope beyond what is asked) or an academic and she isn't quirky at all. No obscure interests or passions. Little career direction. She is very well-liked, very hard working, and a perfectionist. She has done very well at a challenging magnet school in highest rigor courses. But she is not entering college with passions about economics or philosophy or robotics or anything really.

Penn is known as the “social ivy”

Penn and Cornell are well known for student suicides. The head of mental health counseling switched jobs from Cornell to U Penn and committed suicide at U Penn while head of mental health counseling.

That was a while ago and he barely worked at Penn, had just started the job, so it doesn’t seem relevant.

Sure, brush U Penn student & faculty suicides under the rug.

https://thedp.com/article/2022/02/we-should-talk-more-about-suicide-upenn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, what do you mean by social/quality of life? My penn seas DD picked it because of social fit and ability to continue music and be an engineer. She just finished freshman year with a 3.91. The two other top-12 she got accepted to had a similar feel but Penn edged them out with arts and collaboration among engineering evident at admitted days. UVA is very Greek-forward, fewer club spots for freshmen than penn, arts are not easy to do as an engineeri and not at all the quality of life she wanted.

I think by social I mean friendly, laid back kids, lots of parties, lots of hanging out on the lawn. And there is probably some element of wanting preppy and mainstream.
Greek forward is viewed as a positive to her. She is very smart but isn't a striver (if striver means pushing the envelope beyond what is asked) or an academic and she isn't quirky at all. No obscure interests or passions. Little career direction. She is very well-liked, very hard working, and a perfectionist. She has done very well at a challenging magnet school in highest rigor courses. But she is not entering college with passions about economics or philosophy or robotics or anything really.

Penn is known as the “social ivy”

Penn and Cornell are well known for student suicides. The head of mental health counseling switched jobs from Cornell to U Penn and committed suicide at U Penn while head of mental health counseling.

That was a while ago and he barely worked at Penn, had just started the job, so it doesn’t seem relevant.

Sure, brush U Penn student & faculty suicides under the rug.

https://thedp.com/article/2022/02/we-should-talk-more-about-suicide-upenn

Penn has taken it seriously by taking steps such as appointing a chief wellness officer who is a psychiatrist and their new president is also a medical doctor. I think mental health is a serious issue at all top schools but Penn has been a leader in confronting it.

[Anonymous]

Best fit for the DC is almost always the best choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:My DC is committed to UVA (out of state and chose over Berkeley, Michigan, Northwestern and a few others) and very excited about it but about 10 days ago got off the waitlists for SEAS at both Penn and Columbia. DC was given roughly 2 weeks to decide by each school because of pending financial aid (we receive(d) a minimal amount as we have 2 older kids in college).
DC really wants to stick with UVA because they believe it will be a more enjoyable, well-rounded. classic college experience.
Major is uncertain but probably statistics/data science or economics. DC applied to different majors at each school and I'm not actually sure what.

What would you do as a parent in this situation? All the schools will end up costing about the same (roughly $75K/year give or take).
Did your kid make a similar choice?

Where does he/she want to work? What industry or career?
How far from you (flights etc)?
How important is Greek life and sports?

-we're in Columbia, MD.
-Greek life is very important or so she says now (without experiencing it)
-sports don't have to be high level (declined Michigan although clearly the sports are better there) but is the kind of kid who will go to the football games, basketball games, soccer games, ice hockey games for the social aspect regardless of how bad the teams are
-wants to probably live on the East coast (big reason for declining Berkeley), probably either in consulting or finance or tech

Penn has very active Greek life.

[Anonymous]

Just want to reiterate that UVA rush is going to be very competitive for an oos girl, and rush at Penn less so. I was rush director at my sorority decades ago and am shocked at how much rush is different than I experienced. At UVA, very superficial things that she has little control over, like the high school she attended, will matter (strong preference for private schools and feeder affluent public schools) as well as how much she fits a sorority’s type in terms the way she dresses and looks.

[Anonymous]

I actually really like UVA but it’s overvalued on this board. Penn and Columbia are going to offer significantly better resources and are more prestigious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just want to reiterate that UVA rush is going to be very competitive for an oos girl, and rush at Penn less so. I was rush director at my sorority decades ago and am shocked at how much rush is different than I experienced. At UVA, very superficial things that she has little control over, like the high school she attended, will matter (strong preference for private schools and feeder affluent public schools) as well as how much she fits a sorority’s type in terms the way she dresses and looks.

Parent of two daughters who graduated from NOVA public high schools who attended UVA and who both rushed. Neither had any problem getting the bids that they wanted.

Assuming that OP’s daughter has half the personality and likeability that OP says she has, she will have no trouble rushing at UVA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just want to reiterate that UVA rush is going to be very competitive for an oos girl, and rush at Penn less so. I was rush director at my sorority decades ago and am shocked at how much rush is different than I experienced. At UVA, very superficial things that she has little control over, like the high school she attended, will matter (strong preference for private schools and feeder affluent public schools) as well as how much she fits a sorority’s type in terms the way she dresses and looks.

Parent of two daughters who graduated from NOVA public high schools who attended UVA and who both rushed. Neither had any problem getting the bids that they wanted.

Assuming that OP’s daughter has half the personality and likeability that OP says she has, she will have no trouble rushing at UVA.

Your dds are probably at sororities with lots of other girls from their high schools. It’s a lot harder for oos girls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just want to reiterate that UVA rush is going to be very competitive for an oos girl, and rush at Penn less so. I was rush director at my sorority decades ago and am shocked at how much rush is different than I experienced. At UVA, very superficial things that she has little control over, like the high school she attended, will matter (strong preference for private schools and feeder affluent public schools) as well as how much she fits a sorority’s type in terms the way she dresses and looks.

Parent of two daughters who graduated from NOVA public high schools who attended UVA and who both rushed. Neither had any problem getting the bids that they wanted.

Assuming that OP’s daughter has half the personality and likeability that OP says she has, she will have no trouble rushing at UVA.

Your dds are probably at sororities with lots of other girls from their high schools. It’s a lot harder for oos girls.

Wrong. Both of my daughters’ sororities were full of OOS “girls” and not a single one of them were from their same high school. You really don’t know what you’re talking about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Yes- gave up UMD for a large SEC school. No regrets.

Most of the SEC is at UMD's level or higher. Definitely Vandy, UF, UT-Austin, UGA. Then you have UTK, UofSC, Texas A&M, and Auburn, which might not have been on UMD's level a decade ago but are now. That's half the SEC right there. Many of the schools in the bottom half are on the come up as well, such as Ole Miss, which offers killer OOS scholarships. Hotty Toddy!

(DP) No, "most" of them are not. Those first three mentioned above, OK, I guess. (UF's debatable.) Georgia's a lower tier, although it's improving.

UMD alums (or parents) are the only ones who would think of "tiers" when looking at that list of schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I actually really like UVA but it’s overvalued on this board. Penn and Columbia are going to offer significantly better resources and are more prestigious.

More? Maybe

Significantly more? Probably not.