So few liberal arts majors

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And psych isn't even a real liberal arts major. It's mostly kids who want business but can't handle the math.

no

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The US decided it was “behind”min STEM so the pendulum swung too far in that direction. And just look at all the joy all this tech has brought us.

Social media algorithms that polarize us politically and socially and keep us addicted to it.

A generation of students who’ve never read a novel.

Algo trading that has lead to flash crashes, and just siphons off value from the financial markets without creating any actual value.

Crypto nonsense.

I’m not a Luddite, and I know technology is important for advancement of humanity, but our students should spend at least as much time considering what they SHOULD do (and for whom they should do it) as they spend considering what they CAN do. Which is why I encouraged my DC to only consider colleges that have a strong liberal arts core (even if DC majors in a STEM subject)

I'm a programmer and my parents were the same way. I think about some of the classes I took that integrated computer science with philosophy every stinking day. The world would be a much better place if we taught ethics and philosophy to programmers so they pushed back on the insane tech bros.

In the 80s I double majored in CS and Philosophy. They are related in ways some people cannot imagine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

False dichotomy. You can have a rigorous liberal arts education AND major in something “practical”.

+100

I don’t understand why people think they can’t get a good job or meaningful career with a liberal arts education. I would hire a liberal arts graduate over a business degree undergrad any day.

depends on what you are hiring them for, no? More than likely, you wouldn't hire an English major for a Financial Analyst position. A business grad would at least have some finance and accounting background. An English major grad wouldn't know what goes into a Balance Sheet vs Income Statement, or what a P&L is. Can they be learned on the job? Sure, but more than likely, companies would prefer that new hires already have some knowledge rather than having to train them from scratch.

Most reputable companies do provide training. A graduate with a strong liberal arts background- balanced in both quantitative and qualitative skills and critical thinking is likely a much more successful job candidate for a financial analyst job than a business major.

Management training programs are both shrinking and are incredibly hard to get into.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

This. And Bachelors degree holders with 'social science' degrees frequently are not paid tremendously well. This can make it hard to pay back student loans. We have a huge issue in the US with student loan debt, outside the DCUM bubble that is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:College has gotten too expensive to justify a liberal arts major. And I say that as someone with a liberal arts BA, MA, and PhD.

We told our kids that we will fully fund their college educations, but they had to pick a major that was going to be employable upon graduation and one that could provide them with financial stability.

My nephew is an English Language & Lit major at Harvard. There is very little chance that he'll find employment after graduation that will justify the $330k-$350k my sister & BIL are paying for his education.

I wouldn't be so sure. I know an English major from Harvard who is a MD at Goldman and another who retired at 45 from venture capital. Most places will hire a Harvard grad, regardless of the major.

+1. At top schools without “professional” majors, the liberal arts majors get these jobs.

So, basically, unless you go to a top school, if you major in liberal arts, you have to go to grad school to get a good paying job. That seems to sum up this thread.

It all comes down to $. As a pp said, studying liberal arts is for the aristocracy. Sure, you can get a job if you pay $300k+ for the top 20 undergrad OR you can spend half that at on a liberal arts degree at a lower ranked school and then invest another $100k on grad school. Either way it is an expensive degree for someone who doesn't need to take out loans to cover education costs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

False dichotomy. You can have a rigorous liberal arts education AND major in something “practical”.

+100

I don’t understand why people think they can’t get a good job or meaningful career with a liberal arts education. I would hire a liberal arts graduate over a business degree undergrad any day.

+100. Early specialization is not necessarily good. Many LAC graduates build foundational skills in writing, critical thinking, math, presentation, communication etc and go on to be senior leaders of multi national companies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

False dichotomy. You can have a rigorous liberal arts education AND major in something “practical”.

+100

I don’t understand why people think they can’t get a good job or meaningful career with a liberal arts education. I would hire a liberal arts graduate over a business degree undergrad any day.

depends on what you are hiring them for, no? More than likely, you wouldn't hire an English major for a Financial Analyst position. A business grad would at least have some finance and accounting background. An English major grad wouldn't know what goes into a Balance Sheet vs Income Statement, or what a P&L is. Can they be learned on the job? Sure, but more than likely, companies would prefer that new hires already have some knowledge rather than having to train them from scratch.

Most reputable companies do provide training. A graduate with a strong liberal arts background- balanced in both quantitative and qualitative skills and critical thinking is likely a much more successful job candidate for a financial analyst job than a business major.

Management training programs are both shrinking and are incredibly hard to get into.

+1 my company gives a test that includes excel and financial statement knowledge. all of the poetry analysis in the world won't help with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

False dichotomy. You can have a rigorous liberal arts education AND major in something “practical”.

+100

I don’t understand why people think they can’t get a good job or meaningful career with a liberal arts education. I would hire a liberal arts graduate over a business degree undergrad any day.

+100. Early specialization is not necessarily good. Many LAC graduates build foundational skills in writing, critical thinking, math, presentation, communication etc and go on to be senior leaders of multi national companies.

The top undergraduate majors by far for top execs are business and STEM.

I don’t really get why there is this argument when it comes to average outcomes or what humanities folks end up doing for a living.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

The discussion isn't about studying anything frivolous. It's about liberal arts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The US decided it was “behind”min STEM so the pendulum swung too far in that direction. And just look at all the joy all this tech has brought us.

Social media algorithms that polarize us politically and socially and keep us addicted to it.

A generation of students who’ve never read a novel.

Algo trading that has lead to flash crashes, and just siphons off value from the financial markets without creating any actual value.

Crypto nonsense.

I’m not a Luddite, and I know technology is important for advancement of humanity, but our students should spend at least as much time considering what they SHOULD do (and for whom they should do it) as they spend considering what they CAN do. Which is why I encouraged my DC to only consider colleges that have a strong liberal arts core (even if DC majors in a STEM subject)

I'm a programmer and my parents were the same way. I think about some of the classes I took that integrated computer science with philosophy every stinking day. The world would be a much better place if we taught ethics and philosophy to programmers so they pushed back on the insane tech bros.

Lol no. College should not be indoctrination of certain beliefs like for or against tech bros which is the whole bs feminism major toxic masculinity

That is not what they are saying. They are saying that a grounding in ethics would help people recognize unethical behavior and make good ethical decisions about what they will tolerate.

Everybody should study ethics in college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

False dichotomy. You can have a rigorous liberal arts education AND major in something “practical”.

This. Your options are not Business Administration or 17th Century English Literature.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The US decided it was “behind”min STEM so the pendulum swung too far in that direction. And just look at all the joy all this tech has brought us.

Social media algorithms that polarize us politically and socially and keep us addicted to it.

A generation of students who’ve never read a novel.

Algo trading that has lead to flash crashes, and just siphons off value from the financial markets without creating any actual value.

Crypto nonsense.

I’m not a Luddite, and I know technology is important for advancement of humanity, but our students should spend at least as much time considering what they SHOULD do (and for whom they should do it) as they spend considering what they CAN do. Which is why I encouraged my DC to only consider colleges that have a strong liberal arts core (even if DC majors in a STEM subject)

I'm a programmer and my parents were the same way. I think about some of the classes I took that integrated computer science with philosophy every stinking day. The world would be a much better place if we taught ethics and philosophy to programmers so they pushed back on the insane tech bros.

Lol no. College should not be indoctrination of certain beliefs like for or against tech bros which is the whole bs feminism major toxic masculinity

That is not what they are saying. They are saying that a grounding in ethics would help people recognize unethical behavior and make good ethical decisions about what they will tolerate.

Everybody should study ethics in college.

What do you think of the fact that Sam Bankman-Fried's mother teaches ethics at Stanford?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just trying to read my car manual this weekend because I had a question about something and it was gibberish. Clearly, the world needs more English majors who can write clearly. It was just shockingly bad.

That is why someone with a STEM background with very strong communication skills and writing skills can go far. Every company needs a strong marketing team, someone who can write the manuals, etc. But it's hard for an English only major to be strong in the products of many companies . Hence by both skill sets are important

LOL I’m but a lowly English major but I’m pretty sure I could write a car user manual without an extensive background in STEM. Of course I also took advanced math and science classes because I went to a liberal arts college so maybe that qualifies me to explain what the various lights on the dashboard signify.

STEM people always think they can easily master the humanities and that humanities folks can’t do STEM but that’s just arrogance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

False dichotomy. You can have a rigorous liberal arts education AND major in something “practical”.

+100

I don’t understand why people think they can’t get a good job or meaningful career with a liberal arts education. I would hire a liberal arts graduate over a business degree undergrad any day.

depends on what you are hiring them for, no? More than likely, you wouldn't hire an English major for a Financial Analyst position. A business grad would at least have some finance and accounting background. An English major grad wouldn't know what goes into a Balance Sheet vs Income Statement, or what a P&L is. Can they be learned on the job? Sure, but more than likely, companies would prefer that new hires already have some knowledge rather than having to train them from scratch.

Most reputable companies do provide training. A graduate with a strong liberal arts background- balanced in both quantitative and qualitative skills and critical thinking is likely a much more successful job candidate for a financial analyst job than a business major.

Management training programs are both shrinking and are incredibly hard to get into.

+1 my company gives a test that includes excel and financial statement knowledge. all of the poetry analysis in the world won't help with that.

I’m a litigator who majored I history and taught myself to read a P&L and use Excel. If those are the skills employers are hiring for instead of writing skills, that explains a lot. A LOT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very few kids live in the DCUM bubble and can afford to major in something frivolous knowing that their school’s prestige and parental connections will ensure they do well anyway. Most kids are forced to be practical.

False dichotomy. You can have a rigorous liberal arts education AND major in something “practical”.

+100

I don’t understand why people think they can’t get a good job or meaningful career with a liberal arts education. I would hire a liberal arts graduate over a business degree undergrad any day.

depends on what you are hiring them for, no? More than likely, you wouldn't hire an English major for a Financial Analyst position. A business grad would at least have some finance and accounting background. An English major grad wouldn't know what goes into a Balance Sheet vs Income Statement, or what a P&L is. Can they be learned on the job? Sure, but more than likely, companies would prefer that new hires already have some knowledge rather than having to train them from scratch.

Most reputable companies do provide training. A graduate with a strong liberal arts background- balanced in both quantitative and qualitative skills and critical thinking is likely a much more successful job candidate for a financial analyst job than a business major.

Management training programs are both shrinking and are incredibly hard to get into.

+1 my company gives a test that includes excel and financial statement knowledge. all of the poetry analysis in the world won't help with that.

I’m a litigator who majored I history and taught myself to read a P&L and use Excel. If those are the skills employers are hiring for instead of writing skills, that explains a lot. A LOT.

And thinking skills and small group communications skills, etc. Some things can be taught a lot easier than others.