How did Harvard become the most powerful US university brand in the world?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are we debating law schools?
Yale is perceived as the #1 law school.
Whether it deserves that status or not is questionable

To be fair, why does Yale always perform the same or worse than Harvard in peer surveys if it is axiomatic that it is perceived that way?

Yale is second tier along with Stanford.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Harvard's reputation has definitely suffered in the past couple of years but it's still popular. But if it has some more high profile controversies, it will go downhill fast. PP is right in that they have been letting in a large crop of unimpressive TO students.

Why are their students not impressive? Some people seem to think that Harvard has lost prestige because they have some students and faculty that have been critical of Israel.

That's merely a blip. But it is part of a larger pattern. Harvard admits for undergrad these days are generally not regarded as the best and brightest. And there's a large activist contingent - protesting for the sake of protesting something.

Grad programs are different though. Outside of a few mediocre programs like Kennedy, it's the reason Harvard maintains its academic prestige.

I used to think that the business school was Harvard's power center, but now I think it's the law school. The sheer amount of global power in the alumni of that one part of the institution is just absurd: foreign and domestic heads of state, legislators, SC justices, fortune 500 CEO, entertainment execs, billionaire investors and their billionaire children, authors, national security agents, intellectuals, etc. This doesn't even include their absolutely rock star faculty. I think that one part of the university is responsible for a large part of the Harvard reputation, and my hunch is that once they realize it the law school administration is going to start demanding a lot more in terms of resources from the rest of the university. No more crumbling buildings that look like an inner city slum.

Graduate school is not undergrad — and is program specific. Yale Law is more prestigious than Harvard Law. Which you should know…

Not in global rankings, and not in any meaningful way (i.e., other than US News and various internet weirdos that fixate on their weird methodology.) The depth and reach of Harvard law is frankly unmatched.

Yeah, no; this is not even debatable. Nobody cares about global rankings and what you internationals think…everyone in the U.S. legal community knows Yale is the top (bull)dog.

Very NPC take.

It’s not really a “take”; you are just showing your ignorance.

THe peer reputation subscores in US news rankings have always been the same or higher for Harvard. Not that rankings matter, but I hardly think it's "not even debatable"

“Not even debatable” refers to a certain subset of individuals to which you clearly do not belong.

On another note, if you are the “cart before the horse” poster who deems Harvard’s esteem as being driven by its law school, I can assure you that it is “not even debatable” that Harvard’s esteem derives — and has always derived — from “Harvard College.” The same is true for all elite American schools. Conflating graduate school with undergraduate school prestige is an international thing for those unfamiliar with the U.S. educational system.

I am not the poster you are referring to, and I'm definitely not international, but I think s/he has a point. A lot of the famous alumni people point to (the are actually law school, not college graduates.

I am not a graduate of either, but I have been a biglaw partner, and I definitely think it's debatable which law school is better. Harvard, if I recall correctly, often beats Yale in various peer academic and judge ratings. At least the faculty at HLS seems more impressive, but I think that may actually be because YLS' faculty has fallen over the years. For what it's worth, which may not be much, I know if I was a student being presented with the choice today, I would prefer HLS.

Just trying to follow your logic: it is debatable which law school is better, but Harvard’s unparalleled prestige over any other university is derived from the status of this same law school? I think I got it now.

When did I say that "Harvard's unparalleled prestige over any other university is derived form the status of this same law school?" You must have been a Yalie...lol.

Come now, it’s your mantra!

[Anonymous]

How? Plagiarism? Hairy armpits? GTFOH...

[Anonymous]

I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

I mean, I'm sure Harvard Law has a lot of Rhodes Scholars too. But what kind of field are you in where that's completely unrelated to law but puts you into contact with so many people who have attended H/Y law schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

I mean, I'm sure Harvard Law has a lot of Rhodes Scholars too. But what kind of field are you in where that's completely unrelated to law but puts you into contact with so many people who have attended H/Y law schools?

I'm assuming their line of work is internet troll.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

I mean, I'm sure Harvard Law has a lot of Rhodes Scholars too. But what kind of field are you in where that's completely unrelated to law but puts you into contact with so many people who have attended H/Y law schools?

+1. More than 200. Every year HLS announces the number of Rhodes in its student profile. For the class of 2026 it was two Rhodes. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/. Most law firms prefer HLS grads over Yale (and many judges too) because the Yales are too left, too professorial and too much in the clouds. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/

[Anonymous]

HLS is nearly three times the size as YLS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

I mean, I'm sure Harvard Law has a lot of Rhodes Scholars too. But what kind of field are you in where that's completely unrelated to law but puts you into contact with so many people who have attended H/Y law schools?

+1. More than 200. Every year HLS announces the number of Rhodes in its student profile. For the class of 2026 it was two Rhodes. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/. Most law firms prefer HLS grads over Yale (and many judges too) because the Yales are too left, too professorial and too much in the clouds. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/

Honestly though, HLS' curriculum is every bit as theoretical and professorial as YLS. It's always rated higher than YLS by practitioners/judges though, for some reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

I mean, I'm sure Harvard Law has a lot of Rhodes Scholars too. But what kind of field are you in where that's completely unrelated to law but puts you into contact with so many people who have attended H/Y law schools?

+1. More than 200. Every year HLS announces the number of Rhodes in its student profile. For the class of 2026 it was two Rhodes. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/. Most law firms prefer HLS grads over Yale (and many judges too) because the Yales are too left, too professorial and too much in the clouds. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/

Honestly though, HLS' curriculum is every bit as theoretical and professorial as YLS. It's always rated higher than YLS by practitioners/judges though, for some reason.

HLS classes are notorious for focusing on political and economic theory and ignoring any kind of black-letter law. Their students, together with Yale students, have truly the worst legal preparation of probably any law school in America. I mean it's really that bad. I suspect that this is by design.

[Anonymous]

I like Harvard's Supreme Court justices much better than Yale's.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

I mean, I'm sure Harvard Law has a lot of Rhodes Scholars too. But what kind of field are you in where that's completely unrelated to law but puts you into contact with so many people who have attended H/Y law schools?

+1. More than 200. Every year HLS announces the number of Rhodes in its student profile. For the class of 2026 it was two Rhodes. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/. Most law firms prefer HLS grads over Yale (and many judges too) because the Yales are too left, too professorial and too much in the clouds. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/

Honestly though, HLS' curriculum is every bit as theoretical and professorial as YLS. It's always rated higher than YLS by practitioners/judges though, for some reason.

HLS classes are notorious for focusing on political and economic theory and ignoring any kind of black-letter law. Their students, together with Yale students, have truly the worst legal preparation of probably any law school in America. I mean it's really that bad. I suspect that this is by design.

Makes sense in my non-legal brain. Supreme Court justices are kind of like appointed legal theorists with certain ideologies, so might as well cater to that kind of thinking when your alum are in that position or on the court of appeals or become politicians or business leaders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I like Harvard's Supreme Court justices much better than Yale's.

Seriously, even the only conservative on the court I can tolerate (Gorsuch) went to Harvard. What are they doing at that crackpot Yale Law school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

I mean, I'm sure Harvard Law has a lot of Rhodes Scholars too. But what kind of field are you in where that's completely unrelated to law but puts you into contact with so many people who have attended H/Y law schools?

+1. More than 200. Every year HLS announces the number of Rhodes in its student profile. For the class of 2026 it was two Rhodes. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/. Most law firms prefer HLS grads over Yale (and many judges too) because the Yales are too left, too professorial and too much in the clouds. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/

Honestly though, HLS' curriculum is every bit as theoretical and professorial as YLS. It's always rated higher than YLS by practitioners/judges though, for some reason.

HLS classes are notorious for focusing on political and economic theory and ignoring any kind of black-letter law. Their students, together with Yale students, have truly the worst legal preparation of probably any law school in America. I mean it's really that bad. I suspect that this is by design.

Makes sense in my non-legal brain. Supreme Court justices are kind of like appointed legal theorists with certain ideologies, so might as well cater to that kind of thinking when your alum are in that position or on the court of appeals or become politicians or business leaders.

Totally agree. A lot of HLS alums seem to do everything except for practicing law in the long run. Why would you create a curriculum designed to educate them in a way that is useless for them? Better to skip nuts-and-bolts caselaw and go straight to the big-picture theory that really drives institutional power. The ones that do practice law in the long run are quite prominent and are clearly not being harmed by this approach, so why bother? There was an article a while back in which the author was mocking Harvard law for teaching everything except law. The author clearly didn't understand the actual purpose of the institution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m in a field completely unrelated to law but everyone knows Yale is better than Harvard for law school. YLS is incredibly prestigious. Not to say Harvard isn’t prestigious, but I know many people who have attended, but only know one YLS grad and he was a Rhodes Scholar.

I mean, I'm sure Harvard Law has a lot of Rhodes Scholars too. But what kind of field are you in where that's completely unrelated to law but puts you into contact with so many people who have attended H/Y law schools?

+1. More than 200. Every year HLS announces the number of Rhodes in its student profile. For the class of 2026 it was two Rhodes. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/. Most law firms prefer HLS grads over Yale (and many judges too) because the Yales are too left, too professorial and too much in the clouds. https://hls.harvard.edu/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/jdapplicants/hls-profile-and-facts/

Honestly though, HLS' curriculum is every bit as theoretical and professorial as YLS. It's always rated higher than YLS by practitioners/judges though, for some reason.

HLS classes are notorious for focusing on political and economic theory and ignoring any kind of black-letter law. Their students, together with Yale students, have truly the worst legal preparation of probably any law school in America. I mean it's really that bad. I suspect that this is by design.

NO, that's Yale. That's where you get "space torts", not torts. everyone knows this. That's why Yalies tend to go into academia after clerking. HLS students can and do do that but most go into practice