BASIS attrition after middle school- why?

[Anonymous]

+1. Elementary school students are not exactly in the best position to know what’s in their best interest in the long run. Elementary school seems like such a big deal while you’re in it and once you’re at the next phase, that phase will also feel like the most important. It’s short-sighted to prioritize completing 5th grade at an elementary school when the middle school options in DC are what they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The half dozen best DC public middle school don’t and never will, other than Hardy and Deal for IB families. Cope.

Exactly. It’s short sighted and foolish not to do the lottery in 5th grade for a secure HS path.

I am one of the PPs and this thread is starting to feel mean and unsympathetic. Yes it might be short sighted but when kids are thriving and love their friends and elementary school it is not just about being pragmatic. Some families are really invested in their elementary school community and it’s hard to leave. I know this is not the site for empathy but I’m sure you’ve made a ‘foolish’ decision in regards to your child because it made them happy and feel supported.

Uh.. not regarding education, when the public options are so limited.

One might argue you did just by staying in DCPS and charter schools in the city. I’d say that is a foolish educational decision when you could choose private, move to NOVA, MoCo, etc. See how they goes?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:+1. Elementary school students are not exactly in the best position to know what’s in their best interest in the long run. Elementary school seems like such a big deal while you’re in it and once you’re at the next phase, that phase will also feel like the most important. It’s short-sighted to prioritize completing 5th grade at an elementary school when the middle school options in DC are what they are.

I guess I don't believe in moving a kid to an unknown if they are learning and thriving and happy where they are. It feels like a fear-based decision. I also would be happy to get to any number of DCPS middles, beyond Hardy and Deal, and am willing to roll the dice for those.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not the PP you’re conversing with it, yea, you aren’t stuck no matter what your situation is, at least if you don’t live in public housing. You could always rent in the burbs for a fine public schools while renting out your DC place. Why complain about a BASIS, a program you’ve chosen to stick with? We made a different choice. Zero sympathy for the clueless who stay in DCPS EotP thinking they will lottery in somewhere good for 6th. Lottery stats just aren’t hard to access.

You seem so kind hearted.

PP's lack of sympathy is irrelevant. The inconvenient truth is that DCPS and DCPCS post up to date info on lottery results online year round. Ignore the info at your peril if you're relying on DC public middle schools to educate your children and aren't in-boundary for Deal, Hardy or maybe Stuart Hobson (none of which are all that great). Also unwise to ignore the reality that BASIS doesn't want academic stragglers or rebels and doesn't cater to families unwilling to seek out serious ECs elsewhere. You're simply not going to find high-powered sports, music, art, theater etc. at BASIS. The current senior class began as a cohort of 133 in 5th grade. There are 42 survivors. If you don't want your kid forced to cram four years of HS work into three with a strong emphasis on scoring high on AP science and math, don't stick around BASIS for HS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s hard to say how much the at-risk set aside will make a difference. Latin has already been offering it and it seems it’s not gaining much traction. Also, BASIS doesn’t seem to be the ideal school for at-risk students after what I’ve observed about the ideal household for BASIS students, so even if at-risk students start off at BASIS, it’s hard to know if they will fare well enough to continue. But I don’t mean for this line of discussion to derail this particular post because at this point the attrition at the school has nothing to do with having an at-risk preference.

For the PP who suggested moving to the suburbs isn’t costly, the current interest rates make it very costly and many families don’t want to move so far into the suburbs where it’s more affordable due to commutes (and the higher feeling of isolation that goes with living further away).

There isn’t a single person at BASIS who doesn’t wish for a better facility and that would really solve a lot of the shortcomings that people have identified that theirs students seek in a high school experience. But people have different tolerances for different weaknesses at a school and for some people it seems supplementing extra-curriculars outside of school is easier than supplementing academics.

For the PP who mentioned doing additional work outside of school, I haven’t gotten the impression that’s common at BASIS. Families at other schools have to make up for the lack of learning taking place during the school day and it’s hard to imagine spending free time that way. Lots of trade offs for sure. By the time high school comes around, priorities may be more obvious.

Many, many people don’t understand that the key intake year for Basis and Latin is 5th grade. You assume that this common knowledge is widely understood. Its not.

+1

The more I meet parents of upper elementary school aged kids the more of an issue I think this is. Partially because people just assume all middle schools start in 6th grade and miss the lottery, partially because kids really want to finish elementary school at their current school through fifth grade. I know three families who turned down basis for that reason.

This is real for us (though we don't like BASIS and are not applying). But my kid is so happy at their DCPS elementary school, and we have a horrible feeder middle (Cardozo). I'm really reluctant to pull him from a 5th grade where he will certainly thrive into the unknown. Really wish all middle schools started in 6th.

PP and I get it. I wish charters started at 6th grade for middle school. It seems like a more natural break and would provide more equity in student applications to charters for middle school.

Typical person who claims to want equity yet fails to realize that a 5th grade start is necessary due to the lack of equity at DC elementary schools across the board.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. Elementary school students are not exactly in the best position to know what’s in their best interest in the long run. Elementary school seems like such a big deal while you’re in it and once you’re at the next phase, that phase will also feel like the most important. It’s short-sighted to prioritize completing 5th grade at an elementary school when the middle school options in DC are what they are.

I guess I don't believe in moving a kid to an unknown if they are learning and thriving and happy where they are. It feels like a fear-based decision. I also would be happy to get to any number of DCPS middles, beyond Hardy and Deal, and am willing to roll the dice for those.

+1. Didn’t this thread start by noting all the people who go to BASIS for a year and then leave because they hated it? You end up taking chances, and hope you’re making the best choice.

If you’re so risk averse, the best place to be is in the suburbs, because you could get shut out of the lottery no matter how well you prepare and plan. If you’re willing to just take it day by day, you’ll be open to more ways to making it work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The half dozen best DC public middle school don’t and never will, other than Hardy and Deal for IB families. Cope.

Exactly. It’s short sighted and foolish not to do the lottery in 5th grade for a secure HS path.

I am one of the PPs and this thread is starting to feel mean and unsympathetic. Yes it might be short sighted but when kids are thriving and love their friends and elementary school it is not just about being pragmatic. Some families are really invested in their elementary school community and it’s hard to leave. I know this is not the site for empathy but I’m sure you’ve made a ‘foolish’ decision in regards to your child because it made them happy and feel supported.

Do you really live in such a bubble that anyone who dares tell you a hard truth you don't want to hear is being "mean and unsympathetic"? It is empirically short sighted and foolish to choose one last year of ES at the risk of failing to secure a MS or HS path. Unless you have private school money at your disposal that is a foolish choice. Facts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. Elementary school students are not exactly in the best position to know what’s in their best interest in the long run. Elementary school seems like such a big deal while you’re in it and once you’re at the next phase, that phase will also feel like the most important. It’s short-sighted to prioritize completing 5th grade at an elementary school when the middle school options in DC are what they are.

I guess I don't believe in moving a kid to an unknown if they are learning and thriving and happy where they are. It feels like a fear-based decision. I also would be happy to get to any number of DCPS middles, beyond Hardy and Deal, and am willing to roll the dice for those.

It’s a logic based decision. Sounds like your IB middle school is a nonstarter so you’ll be relying on the lottery. Most DCPS middle schools are a dead end. There are two that are arguably not - Deal and Hardy - and you’re unlikely to get into either. So you lottery for decent middle/high schools in 5th. Maybe you get into BASIS. Then you give your kid a chance to try it out - and maybe they thrive there. If they don’t, you can still lottery for those same crappy DCPS middle schools in 6th.

Getting your kid a decent education in DC requires strategic thinking and some sacrifices. Would I have preferred my kid to have another year of elementary school? Yes. Was I going to risk her not having a path through high school? Hell no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s hard to say how much the at-risk set aside will make a difference. Latin has already been offering it and it seems it’s not gaining much traction. Also, BASIS doesn’t seem to be the ideal school for at-risk students after what I’ve observed about the ideal household for BASIS students, so even if at-risk students start off at BASIS, it’s hard to know if they will fare well enough to continue. But I don’t mean for this line of discussion to derail this particular post because at this point the attrition at the school has nothing to do with having an at-risk preference.

For the PP who suggested moving to the suburbs isn’t costly, the current interest rates make it very costly and many families don’t want to move so far into the suburbs where it’s more affordable due to commutes (and the higher feeling of isolation that goes with living further away).

There isn’t a single person at BASIS who doesn’t wish for a better facility and that would really solve a lot of the shortcomings that people have identified that theirs students seek in a high school experience. But people have different tolerances for different weaknesses at a school and for some people it seems supplementing extra-curriculars outside of school is easier than supplementing academics.

For the PP who mentioned doing additional work outside of school, I haven’t gotten the impression that’s common at BASIS. Families at other schools have to make up for the lack of learning taking place during the school day and it’s hard to imagine spending free time that way. Lots of trade offs for sure. By the time high school comes around, priorities may be more obvious.

Many, many people don’t understand that the key intake year for Basis and Latin is 5th grade. You assume that this common knowledge is widely understood. Its not.

+1

The more I meet parents of upper elementary school aged kids the more of an issue I think this is. Partially because people just assume all middle schools start in 6th grade and miss the lottery, partially because kids really want to finish elementary school at their current school through fifth grade. I know three families who turned down basis for that reason.

This is real for us (though we don't like BASIS and are not applying). But my kid is so happy at their DCPS elementary school, and we have a horrible feeder middle (Cardozo). I'm really reluctant to pull him from a 5th grade where he will certainly thrive into the unknown. Really wish all middle schools started in 6th.

PP and I get it. I wish charters started at 6th grade for middle school. It seems like a more natural break and would provide more equity in student applications to charters for middle school.

More equity in applications - perhaps. But also likely that there will be less equitable outcomes. The additional year in the new middle helps academically. Perhaps all middle schools should start at 5th?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. Elementary school students are not exactly in the best position to know what’s in their best interest in the long run. Elementary school seems like such a big deal while you’re in it and once you’re at the next phase, that phase will also feel like the most important. It’s short-sighted to prioritize completing 5th grade at an elementary school when the middle school options in DC are what they are.

I guess I don't believe in moving a kid to an unknown if they are learning and thriving and happy where they are. It feels like a fear-based decision. I also would be happy to get to any number of DCPS middles, beyond Hardy and Deal, and am willing to roll the dice for those.

It’s a logic based decision. Sounds like your IB middle school is a nonstarter so you’ll be relying on the lottery. Most DCPS middle schools are a dead end. There are two that are arguably not - Deal and Hardy - and you’re unlikely to get into either. So you lottery for decent middle/high schools in 5th. Maybe you get into BASIS. Then you give your kid a chance to try it out - and maybe they thrive there. If they don’t, you can still lottery for those same crappy DCPS middle schools in 6th.

Getting your kid a decent education in DC requires strategic thinking and some sacrifices. Would I have preferred my kid to have another year of elementary school? Yes. Was I going to risk her not having a path through high school? Hell no.

Very much this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The half dozen best DC public middle school don’t and never will, other than Hardy and Deal for IB families. Cope.

Exactly. It’s short sighted and foolish not to do the lottery in 5th grade for a secure HS path.

I am one of the PPs and this thread is starting to feel mean and unsympathetic. Yes it might be short sighted but when kids are thriving and love their friends and elementary school it is not just about being pragmatic. Some families are really invested in their elementary school community and it’s hard to leave. I know this is not the site for empathy but I’m sure you’ve made a ‘foolish’ decision in regards to your child because it made them happy and feel supported.

Do you really live in such a bubble that anyone who dares tell you a hard truth you don't want to hear is being "mean and unsympathetic"? It is empirically short sighted and foolish to choose one last year of ES at the risk of failing to secure a MS or HS path. Unless you have private school money at your disposal that is a foolish choice. Facts.

I don’t live in a bubble. I live in a neighborhood that most people on this board would never live in or probably step foot in. Your condescension is noted and unappreciated. As an aside I don’t think staying for fifth grade means you can’t secure a good HS. The city has plenty of seats for students who have good grades at the application HSs. And lots of people leave Basis in 6th grade or 7th grade anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The half dozen best DC public middle school don’t and never will, other than Hardy and Deal for IB families. Cope.

Exactly. It’s short sighted and foolish not to do the lottery in 5th grade for a secure HS path.

I am one of the PPs and this thread is starting to feel mean and unsympathetic. Yes it might be short sighted but when kids are thriving and love their friends and elementary school it is not just about being pragmatic. Some families are really invested in their elementary school community and it’s hard to leave. I know this is not the site for empathy but I’m sure you’ve made a ‘foolish’ decision in regards to your child because it made them happy and feel supported.

Do you really live in such a bubble that anyone who dares tell you a hard truth you don't want to hear is being "mean and unsympathetic"? It is empirically short sighted and foolish to choose one last year of ES at the risk of failing to secure a MS or HS path. Unless you have private school money at your disposal that is a foolish choice. Facts.

I don’t live in a bubble. I live in a neighborhood that most people on this board would never live in or probably step foot in. Your condescension is noted and unappreciated. As an aside I don’t think staying for fifth grade means you can’t secure a good HS. The city has plenty of seats for students who have good grades at the application HSs. And lots of people leave Basis in 6th grade or 7th grade anyway.

Yup, I'm with you. Also knowing my kids, and seeing that they can get 5s on PARCCs at a Title 1 DCPS elementary with a small cohort of high achievers and excellent teachers makes me much more open to going to what some people consider a "mediocre" DCPS middle school. because I have faith that my kid will continue to do well, as long as they have a small cohort and excellent teachers, which I know exist in places like Stuart Hobson, SWWFS, Macfarland (and definitely Hardy and Deal), and have a very good shot at getting into an application high school. I far prefer that path to BASIS, which has too many inexperienced teachers to offer a consistent educational experience IMO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The half dozen best DC public middle school don’t and never will, other than Hardy and Deal for IB families. Cope.

Exactly. It’s short sighted and foolish not to do the lottery in 5th grade for a secure HS path.

I am one of the PPs and this thread is starting to feel mean and unsympathetic. Yes it might be short sighted but when kids are thriving and love their friends and elementary school it is not just about being pragmatic. Some families are really invested in their elementary school community and it’s hard to leave. I know this is not the site for empathy but I’m sure you’ve made a ‘foolish’ decision in regards to your child because it made them happy and feel supported.

Do you really live in such a bubble that anyone who dares tell you a hard truth you don't want to hear is being "mean and unsympathetic"? It is empirically short sighted and foolish to choose one last year of ES at the risk of failing to secure a MS or HS path. Unless you have private school money at your disposal that is a foolish choice. Facts.

I don’t live in a bubble. I live in a neighborhood that most people on this board would never live in or probably step foot in. Your condescension is noted and unappreciated. As an aside I don’t think staying for fifth grade means you can’t secure a good HS. The city has plenty of seats for students who have good grades at the application HSs. And lots of people leave Basis in 6th grade or 7th grade anyway.

Are you white? Because there are not plenty of seats in application high schools for white kids - and that number is getting reduced every year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s hard to say how much the at-risk set aside will make a difference. Latin has already been offering it and it seems it’s not gaining much traction. Also, BASIS doesn’t seem to be the ideal school for at-risk students after what I’ve observed about the ideal household for BASIS students, so even if at-risk students start off at BASIS, it’s hard to know if they will fare well enough to continue. But I don’t mean for this line of discussion to derail this particular post because at this point the attrition at the school has nothing to do with having an at-risk preference.

For the PP who suggested moving to the suburbs isn’t costly, the current interest rates make it very costly and many families don’t want to move so far into the suburbs where it’s more affordable due to commutes (and the higher feeling of isolation that goes with living further away).

There isn’t a single person at BASIS who doesn’t wish for a better facility and that would really solve a lot of the shortcomings that people have identified that theirs students seek in a high school experience. But people have different tolerances for different weaknesses at a school and for some people it seems supplementing extra-curriculars outside of school is easier than supplementing academics.

For the PP who mentioned doing additional work outside of school, I haven’t gotten the impression that’s common at BASIS. Families at other schools have to make up for the lack of learning taking place during the school day and it’s hard to imagine spending free time that way. Lots of trade offs for sure. By the time high school comes around, priorities may be more obvious.

Many, many people don’t understand that the key intake year for Basis and Latin is 5th grade. You assume that this common knowledge is widely understood. Its not.

+1

The more I meet parents of upper elementary school aged kids the more of an issue I think this is. Partially because people just assume all middle schools start in 6th grade and miss the lottery, partially because kids really want to finish elementary school at their current school through fifth grade. I know three families who turned down basis for that reason.

This is real for us (though we don't like BASIS and are not applying). But my kid is so happy at their DCPS elementary school, and we have a horrible feeder middle (Cardozo). I'm really reluctant to pull him from a 5th grade where he will certainly thrive into the unknown. Really wish all middle schools started in 6th.

PP and I get it. I wish charters started at 6th grade for middle school. It seems like a more natural break and would provide more equity in student applications to charters for middle school.

More equity in applications - perhaps. But also likely that there will be less equitable outcomes. The additional year in the new middle helps academically. Perhaps all middle schools should start at 5th?

This is the plan to achieve equity. Drag the top performers down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The half dozen best DC public middle school don’t and never will, other than Hardy and Deal for IB families. Cope.

Exactly. It’s short sighted and foolish not to do the lottery in 5th grade for a secure HS path.

I am one of the PPs and this thread is starting to feel mean and unsympathetic. Yes it might be short sighted but when kids are thriving and love their friends and elementary school it is not just about being pragmatic. Some families are really invested in their elementary school community and it’s hard to leave. I know this is not the site for empathy but I’m sure you’ve made a ‘foolish’ decision in regards to your child because it made them happy and feel supported.

Do you really live in such a bubble that anyone who dares tell you a hard truth you don't want to hear is being "mean and unsympathetic"? It is empirically short sighted and foolish to choose one last year of ES at the risk of failing to secure a MS or HS path. Unless you have private school money at your disposal that is a foolish choice. Facts.

I don’t live in a bubble. I live in a neighborhood that most people on this board would never live in or probably step foot in. Your condescension is noted and unappreciated. As an aside I don’t think staying for fifth grade means you can’t secure a good HS. The city has plenty of seats for students who have good grades at the application HSs. And lots of people leave Basis in 6th grade or 7th grade anyway.

Are you white? Because there are not plenty of seats in application high schools for white kids - and that number is getting reduced every year.

Can you please show me where DCPS publishes their race quotas for application HSs? I wasn’t aware of that. Thanks.