DD with PhD suddenly interested in becoming a patent attorney

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Her plan isn’t awful but to make anywhere near that money she has to do biglaw and it probably follows she will hate biglaw. It’s not really for people who think about their desires and preferences. Your kid seems to think life cares about her wants - I’d fix that first.

As a former biglaw senior associate who went in house, I know a lot of PhDs who did patent litigation. The issue is it’s really hard to get hours and most of them were pushed up and out. The only one who made partner was a Harvard PhD who got a JD simultaneously, not later.

It’s well known in biglaw PhDs can’t really hack the workload and speed.

PP here. And FAANG/other good in house jobs won’t touch her without biglaw experience. I’ve heard GCs compare kids who don’t have a biglaw background to practicing medicine without a residency.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Her plan isn’t awful but to make anywhere near that money she has to do biglaw and it probably follows she will hate biglaw. It’s not really for people who think about their desires and preferences. Your kid seems to think life cares about her wants - I’d fix that first.

As a former biglaw senior associate who went in house, I know a lot of PhDs who did patent litigation. The issue is it’s really hard to get hours and most of them were pushed up and out. The only one who made partner was a Harvard PhD who got a JD simultaneously, not later.

It’s well known in biglaw PhDs can’t really hack the workload and speed.

LOL. Sounds like you couldn’t hack it either since you were up and out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Her plan isn’t awful but to make anywhere near that money she has to do biglaw and it probably follows she will hate biglaw. It’s not really for people who think about their desires and preferences. Your kid seems to think life cares about her wants - I’d fix that first.

As a former biglaw senior associate who went in house, I know a lot of PhDs who did patent litigation. The issue is it’s really hard to get hours and most of them were pushed up and out. The only one who made partner was a Harvard PhD who got a JD simultaneously, not later.

It’s well known in biglaw PhDs can’t really hack the workload and speed.

LOL. Sounds like you couldn’t hack it either since you were up and out.

LOL no I definitely couldn’t. I’m really efficient and smart, and I don’t take shit. I left happily and make bank in one of those dream jobs people wax poetical about.

[Anonymous]

Second all the recommendations for your daughter to get a patent examiner job at the USPTO.

You say she’s shy, introverted, and wants to make more money. $500k+ is a lot of money, but it sounds like she’d be happier just making *more* money than what she’s making now. USPTO will give her that, plus a much better work/life balance than a big law attorney.

At the USPTO, she’d be allowed to WFH full time, so she wouldn’t even have to relocate to the DC area. She doesn’t even really have to interact with anyone besides her boss. She’d start at GS-7/9 and can move up to GS-14 as a primary examiner in ~3-4 years. By then, hopefully she would be really efficient at examining, and she can even “work OT” and still keep her hours at 40/week, while pulling in ~170k+.

All this to say, working as an examiner will give her exposure to this field to see if she likes it enough to pursue law school, while earning decent money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP your daughter sounds like my son, he has a CS degree but after working a couple of years he wants to pursue something else. And his new idea is not as financially lucrative, so we are encouraging him to continue to work, make good money and save until he decides on his next plan.

He is only 26, so we support him and tell him that it’s not too late to start over. but at some point it will be. DH and I think my sons issue is that he thinks he doesn’t like working this job but it is probably just that he doesn’t like working at all. We think our nerdy kid just doesn’t want to grow up.

If your son is like my DD, he might just be bored. (My DD is 28, btw.)
I think DD is bored by her job, even though she likes it, and likes her colleagues. But her PhD program was incredibly intense, and I think working at that intellectual level does something to your brain that makes the ordinary working world seem too tedious and mundane. It's a conundrum because DD was tired after working so hard on her PhD, so her current job is a bit of a break, yet she's bored (IHMO), so is starting to feel restless. I think the money is just an excuse -- she needs to feel excited about something again.

So maybe what she really needs is a serious hobby. Right now she is living to work...she needs to shift to working to live. For most of us, we enjoy our work to a certain degree, or hate it, but understand that we have to find things to make us happy outside of work. A spouse and family usually does that, but it is hard sometimes when we are first starting out and we haven't found our identity outside of the structure of school. I don't agree with other people that she's lazy and doesn't want to work, she's more lost and anxious, and doesn't want to work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP your daughter sounds like my son, he has a CS degree but after working a couple of years he wants to pursue something else. And his new idea is not as financially lucrative, so we are encouraging him to continue to work, make good money and save until he decides on his next plan.

He is only 26, so we support him and tell him that it’s not too late to start over. but at some point it will be. DH and I think my sons issue is that he thinks he doesn’t like working this job but it is probably just that he doesn’t like working at all. We think our nerdy kid just doesn’t want to grow up.

If your son is like my DD, he might just be bored. (My DD is 28, btw.)
I think DD is bored by her job, even though she likes it, and likes her colleagues. But her PhD program was incredibly intense, and I think working at that intellectual level does something to your brain that makes the ordinary working world seem too tedious and mundane. It's a conundrum because DD was tired after working so hard on her PhD, so her current job is a bit of a break, yet she's bored (IHMO), so is starting to feel restless. I think the money is just an excuse -- she needs to feel excited about something again.

So maybe what she really needs is a serious hobby. Right now she is living to work...she needs to shift to working to live. For most of us, we enjoy our work to a certain degree, or hate it, but understand that we have to find things to make us happy outside of work. A spouse and family usually does that, but it is hard sometimes when we are first starting out and we haven't found our identity outside of the structure of school. I don't agree with other people that she's lazy and doesn't want to work, she's more lost and anxious, and doesn't want to work.

PP, meant to add that school is probably a safe place where she knows what to do and knows she's good at it.

[Anonymous]

She's an adult and can make her own decisions but I will tell you that my friend went EXACTLY this route. Degree from MIT, research, decided she wanted to be a patent attorney, Georgetown, firm. She's in-house now since she decided she also wanted a family. Point is, totally doable.

[Anonymous]

Many of us are lawyers here OP. Your DD should prep for the LSAT + take it. If she does well enough, she will get merit aid at many places. YOLO-- tell her to do it for the least tuition possible and only go if she gets into a top 20.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Why does she have a PhD in CS? That's totally unnecessary. Does she work in academia? If so, she needs to jump to private industry to make more.

Law degree is a waste of time and money. Attorneys that make 500K hate their lives. My friends in patent law were making less than me starting out in pharma sales.

I don't understand this comment. She went to one of the best universities in the world and got a PhD in an area she's interested in.

She didn't go into academia because she said she didn't want to publish all the time. I think she should go into academia, but now she's got this patent law idea planted in her head.

Respectfully, she ought to go to therapy or a career coach and figure out what she actually wants to do. 3 years of law school and the cost associated with it when she can't afford to buy a house now doesn't seem like a wise investment. Law is a business. You're either making money for other people or bringing in enough business to support yourself (partner) and others (associates).

Therapy?! For some career indecision? lol

Yes, please let me talk to a therapist about whether I should go to law school.

She has a PhD, which took a lot of time and effort to get, and she doesn't like what she's doing after all of that. I don't think three more years of law school is going to help.

Well, I know plenty of IP litigators and FDA regulatory attorneys with hard science PhDs. They're very happy and successful with their legal careers. As someone who also came into law as a second career, I'm quite happy I did and I'm damn glad that no one suggested I get therapy because I wanted to change careers. There's nothing wrong with changing career paths.

Maybe take your therapy suggestions and shove them somewhere the sun doesn't shine.

Oh yeah - you seem really happy and completely well adjusted. /s

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why does she have a PhD in CS? That's totally unnecessary. Does she work in academia? If so, she needs to jump to private industry to make more.

Law degree is a waste of time and money. Attorneys that make 500K hate their lives. My friends in patent law were making less than me starting out in pharma sales.

I don't understand this comment. She went to one of the best universities in the world and got a PhD in an area she's interested in.

She didn't go into academia because she said she didn't want to publish all the time. I think she should go into academia, but now she's got this patent law idea planted in her head.

Respectfully, she ought to go to therapy or a career coach and figure out what she actually wants to do. 3 years of law school and the cost associated with it when she can't afford to buy a house now doesn't seem like a wise investment. Law is a business. You're either making money for other people or bringing in enough business to support yourself (partner) and others (associates).

Therapy?! For some career indecision? lol

Yes, please let me talk to a therapist about whether I should go to law school.

She has a PhD, which took a lot of time and effort to get, and she doesn't like what she's doing after all of that. I don't think three more years of law school is going to help.

Well, I know plenty of IP litigators and FDA regulatory attorneys with hard science PhDs. They're very happy and successful with their legal careers. As someone who also came into law as a second career, I'm quite happy I did and I'm damn glad that no one suggested I get therapy because I wanted to change careers. There's nothing wrong with changing career paths.

Maybe take your therapy suggestions and shove them somewhere the sun doesn't shine.

Oh yeah - you seem really happy and completely well adjusted. /s

It's offensive to say that someone who wants to change careers just needs therapy.