WVU cutting 32 majors, all foreign languages

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is not just WVU that has been dropping language programs. This has been going on since at least the great recession. My understanding is that fewer students are taking language in HS (and the vast majority of those kids are taking Spanish) and fewer are taking it at the university level. There is just not much demand. People argue that folks need to know these languages for foreign service and military intelligence, but as someone who has experience in both of these areas, the foreign service and the military have their own language training programs. There is of course a real need for spanish speakers in many parts of the country for in health, policing, education type jobs, but, there is really no demand for other languages. My guess is that universities are also having trouble finding qualified professors for these programs.

I work in the IC and find your post to be completely misleading/wrong. There is *ALWAYS* a demand for language students, particularly those that are mission-critical: Russian, Chinese, Arabic, etc. And while the federal government does indeed have their own language training programs, a candidate is far more desirable if they come in already speaking the language at some level.

https://www.dlnseo.org/NSEP
https://www.cia.gov/careers/language-opportunities/

[Anonymous]

My DD took six years of French in middle and high school. She doesn’t want to take a language anymore in college and chose a college that allowed her to take other classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not just WVU that has been dropping language programs. This has been going on since at least the great recession. My understanding is that fewer students are taking language in HS (and the vast majority of those kids are taking Spanish) and fewer are taking it at the university level. There is just not much demand. People argue that folks need to know these languages for foreign service and military intelligence, but as someone who has experience in both of these areas, the foreign service and the military have their own language training programs. There is of course a real need for spanish speakers in many parts of the country for in health, policing, education type jobs, but, there is really no demand for other languages. My guess is that universities are also having trouble finding qualified professors for these programs.

I work in the IC and find your post to be completely misleading/wrong. There is *ALWAYS* a demand for language students, particularly those that are mission-critical: Russian, Chinese, Arabic, etc. And while the federal government does indeed have their own language training programs, a candidate is far more desirable if they come in already speaking the language at some level.

https://www.dlnseo.org/NSEP
https://www.cia.gov/careers/language-opportunities/

But be honest places like these value native or heritage speakers, not language majors. They test for language ability, and it's hard to score high on the test unless you are a native or heritage speaker or have spent years in country. Four years of college language study doesn't cut it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DD took six years of French in middle and high school. She doesn’t want to take a language anymore in college and chose a college that allowed her to take other classes.

My DS took years of math in elementary, middle, and high school. He didn't want to take math anymore in college and chose a college that allowed him to take other classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not just WVU that has been dropping language programs. This has been going on since at least the great recession. My understanding is that fewer students are taking language in HS (and the vast majority of those kids are taking Spanish) and fewer are taking it at the university level. There is just not much demand. People argue that folks need to know these languages for foreign service and military intelligence, but as someone who has experience in both of these areas, the foreign service and the military have their own language training programs. There is of course a real need for spanish speakers in many parts of the country for in health, policing, education type jobs, but, there is really no demand for other languages. My guess is that universities are also having trouble finding qualified professors for these programs.

I work in the IC and find your post to be completely misleading/wrong. There is *ALWAYS* a demand for language students, particularly those that are mission-critical: Russian, Chinese, Arabic, etc. And while the federal government does indeed have their own language training programs, a candidate is far more desirable if they come in already speaking the language at some level.

https://www.dlnseo.org/NSEP
https://www.cia.gov/careers/language-opportunities/

But be honest places like these value native or heritage speakers, not language majors. They test for language ability, and it's hard to score high on the test unless you are a native or heritage speaker or have spent years in country. Four years of college language study doesn't cut it.

If you spent a year abroad studying in the language you could get fluent enough. I know because I studied abroad and there were a couple kids in my program who went on into these sorts of career paths based on the fluency they achieved.

Also with immigration limits they're not always going to find native or heritage speakers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not just WVU that has been dropping language programs. This has been going on since at least the great recession. My understanding is that fewer students are taking language in HS (and the vast majority of those kids are taking Spanish) and fewer are taking it at the university level. There is just not much demand. People argue that folks need to know these languages for foreign service and military intelligence, but as someone who has experience in both of these areas, the foreign service and the military have their own language training programs. There is of course a real need for spanish speakers in many parts of the country for in health, policing, education type jobs, but, there is really no demand for other languages. My guess is that universities are also having trouble finding qualified professors for these programs.

I work in the IC and find your post to be completely misleading/wrong. There is *ALWAYS* a demand for language students, particularly those that are mission-critical: Russian, Chinese, Arabic, etc. And while the federal government does indeed have their own language training programs, a candidate is far more desirable if they come in already speaking the language at some level.

https://www.dlnseo.org/NSEP
https://www.cia.gov/careers/language-opportunities/

But be honest places like these value native or heritage speakers, not language majors. They test for language ability, and it's hard to score high on the test unless you are a native or heritage speaker or have spent years in country. Four years of college language study doesn't cut it.

Many have had four years of high school AND four years of college language. Sure, they definitely value native speakers, but many aren't citizens and will not be hired/cleared because of that. What they value are US citizens who are either native speakers (rare) or who have prior language training. They can always be trained further once hired. It's incredibly inaccurate to say there's "really no demand for (other) languages". There certainly is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not just WVU that has been dropping language programs. This has been going on since at least the great recession. My understanding is that fewer students are taking language in HS (and the vast majority of those kids are taking Spanish) and fewer are taking it at the university level. There is just not much demand. People argue that folks need to know these languages for foreign service and military intelligence, but as someone who has experience in both of these areas, the foreign service and the military have their own language training programs. There is of course a real need for spanish speakers in many parts of the country for in health, policing, education type jobs, but, there is really no demand for other languages. My guess is that universities are also having trouble finding qualified professors for these programs.

I work in the IC and find your post to be completely misleading/wrong. There is *ALWAYS* a demand for language students, particularly those that are mission-critical: Russian, Chinese, Arabic, etc. And while the federal government does indeed have their own language training programs, a candidate is far more desirable if they come in already speaking the language at some level.

https://www.dlnseo.org/NSEP
https://www.cia.gov/careers/language-opportunities/

But be honest places like these value native or heritage speakers, not language majors. They test for language ability, and it's hard to score high on the test unless you are a native or heritage speaker or have spent years in country. Four years of college language study doesn't cut it.

If you spent a year abroad studying in the language you could get fluent enough. I know because I studied abroad and there were a couple kids in my program who went on into these sorts of career paths based on the fluency they achieved.

Also with immigration limits they're not always going to find native or heritage speakers.

They will only hire US citizens for clearance jobs, so any non-citizen will not be considered. As it should be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:32 majors are under review. They won’t all get cut.

As another post stated, some will be merged, some will remain the same but with less faculty, some will remain the same and be re-evaluated in the future, and some will be cut.

Many other universities have been doing the same for budget reasons and due to less interest in some majors. It is what it is, they need to keep up with the times. I think it’s a good thing, WV is a poor state. Students should not be going into debt majoring in areas that will not make them enough to pay back.

Yeah, poor kids don't deserve a rich array of classes, that's true. Limit them, because they don't need any of that fancy stuff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not just WVU that has been dropping language programs. This has been going on since at least the great recession. My understanding is that fewer students are taking language in HS (and the vast majority of those kids are taking Spanish) and fewer are taking it at the university level. There is just not much demand. People argue that folks need to know these languages for foreign service and military intelligence, but as someone who has experience in both of these areas, the foreign service and the military have their own language training programs. There is of course a real need for spanish speakers in many parts of the country for in health, policing, education type jobs, but, there is really no demand for other languages. My guess is that universities are also having trouble finding qualified professors for these programs.

I work in the IC and find your post to be completely misleading/wrong. There is *ALWAYS* a demand for language students, particularly those that are mission-critical: Russian, Chinese, Arabic, etc. And while the federal government does indeed have their own language training programs, a candidate is far more desirable if they come in already speaking the language at some level.

https://www.dlnseo.org/NSEP
https://www.cia.gov/careers/language-opportunities/

But be honest places like these value native or heritage speakers, not language majors. They test for language ability, and it's hard to score high on the test unless you are a native or heritage speaker or have spent years in country. Four years of college language study doesn't cut it.

If you spent a year abroad studying in the language you could get fluent enough. I know because I studied abroad and there were a couple kids in my program who went on into these sorts of career paths based on the fluency they achieved.

Also with immigration limits they're not always going to find native or heritage speakers.

They will only hire US citizens for clearance jobs, so any non-citizen will not be considered. As it should be.

With immigration limits that means there will not be as many bilingual citizen-children growing up as native or heritage speakers available, so PP's implication that those agencies would only be hiring native or heritage speakers is flawed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:32 majors are under review. They won’t all get cut.

As another post stated, some will be merged, some will remain the same but with less faculty, some will remain the same and be re-evaluated in the future, and some will be cut.

Many other universities have been doing the same for budget reasons and due to less interest in some majors. It is what it is, they need to keep up with the times. I think it’s a good thing, WV is a poor state. Students should not be going into debt majoring in areas that will not make them enough to pay back.

Yeah, poor kids don't deserve a rich array of classes, that's true. Limit them, because they don't need any of that fancy stuff.

I am from WV and went to a non-flagship state college.

I think they do a huge disservice pushing History and Lit majors, and I am both. I was valedictorian of my college and it worked out for me. But for most of my colleagues, it didn’t.

One works at the Greenbriar, so that is OK. A few others went to grad school and do well. A few are dead of opioid ODs. The others work in the same mines, factories, or Walmarts they would have anyway.

It’s not wrong to limit the availability of posh majors for non-posh people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not just WVU that has been dropping language programs. This has been going on since at least the great recession. My understanding is that fewer students are taking language in HS (and the vast majority of those kids are taking Spanish) and fewer are taking it at the university level. There is just not much demand. People argue that folks need to know these languages for foreign service and military intelligence, but as someone who has experience in both of these areas, the foreign service and the military have their own language training programs. There is of course a real need for spanish speakers in many parts of the country for in health, policing, education type jobs, but, there is really no demand for other languages. My guess is that universities are also having trouble finding qualified professors for these programs.

I work in the IC and find your post to be completely misleading/wrong. There is *ALWAYS* a demand for language students, particularly those that are mission-critical: Russian, Chinese, Arabic, etc. And while the federal government does indeed have their own language training programs, a candidate is far more desirable if they come in already speaking the language at some level.

https://www.dlnseo.org/NSEP
https://www.cia.gov/careers/language-opportunities/

But be honest places like these value native or heritage speakers, not language majors. They test for language ability, and it's hard to score high on the test unless you are a native or heritage speaker or have spent years in country. Four years of college language study doesn't cut it.

If you spent a year abroad studying in the language you could get fluent enough. I know because I studied abroad and there were a couple kids in my program who went on into these sorts of career paths based on the fluency they achieved.

Also with immigration limits they're not always going to find native or heritage speakers.

They will only hire US citizens for clearance jobs, so any non-citizen will not be considered. As it should be.

With immigration limits that means there will not be as many bilingual citizen-children growing up as native or heritage speakers available, so PP's implication that those agencies would only be hiring native or heritage speakers is flawed.

This.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:32 majors are under review. They won’t all get cut.

As another post stated, some will be merged, some will remain the same but with less faculty, some will remain the same and be re-evaluated in the future, and some will be cut.

Many other universities have been doing the same for budget reasons and due to less interest in some majors. It is what it is, they need to keep up with the times. I think it’s a good thing, WV is a poor state. Students should not be going into debt majoring in areas that will not make them enough to pay back.

Yeah, poor kids don't deserve a rich array of classes, that's true. Limit them, because they don't need any of that fancy stuff.

I am from WV and went to a non-flagship state college.

I think they do a huge disservice pushing History and Lit majors, and I am both. I was valedictorian of my college and it worked out for me. But for most of my colleagues, it didn’t.

One works at the Greenbriar, so that is OK. A few others went to grad school and do well. A few are dead of opioid ODs. The others work in the same mines, factories, or Walmarts they would have anyway.

It’s not wrong to limit the availability of posh majors for non-posh people.

Yes because a life of a mind is only something for rich people. And those history and lit classes definitely lead to opioid addiction if you are poor and don't know how to handle them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:32 majors are under review. They won’t all get cut.

As another post stated, some will be merged, some will remain the same but with less faculty, some will remain the same and be re-evaluated in the future, and some will be cut.

Many other universities have been doing the same for budget reasons and due to less interest in some majors. It is what it is, they need to keep up with the times. I think it’s a good thing, WV is a poor state. Students should not be going into debt majoring in areas that will not make them enough to pay back.

Yeah, poor kids don't deserve a rich array of classes, that's true. Limit them, because they don't need any of that fancy stuff.

I am from WV and went to a non-flagship state college.

I think they do a huge disservice pushing History and Lit majors, and I am both. I was valedictorian of my college and it worked out for me. But for most of my colleagues, it didn’t.

One works at the Greenbriar, so that is OK. A few others went to grad school and do well. A few are dead of opioid ODs. The others work in the same mines, factories, or Walmarts they would have anyway.

It’s not wrong to limit the availability of posh majors for non-posh people.

Yes because a life of a mind is only something for rich people. And those history and lit classes definitely lead to opioid addiction if you are poor and don't know how to handle them.

PP here. Your privilege is showing. College is expensive and people need it to lead to opportunities. History and Lit majors need to go to grad school to do much of anything. A poor person who is a B student at a state school is taking debt for no advantage.

The mid-low end of my majors aren’t living a “life of the mind.” They are working at gas stations and Walmart, with nothing to show for it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:32 majors are under review. They won’t all get cut.

As another post stated, some will be merged, some will remain the same but with less faculty, some will remain the same and be re-evaluated in the future, and some will be cut.

Many other universities have been doing the same for budget reasons and due to less interest in some majors. It is what it is, they need to keep up with the times. I think it’s a good thing, WV is a poor state. Students should not be going into debt majoring in areas that will not make them enough to pay back.

Yeah, poor kids don't deserve a rich array of classes, that's true. Limit them, because they don't need any of that fancy stuff.

I am from WV and went to a non-flagship state college.

I think they do a huge disservice pushing History and Lit majors, and I am both. I was valedictorian of my college and it worked out for me. But for most of my colleagues, it didn’t.

One works at the Greenbriar, so that is OK. A few others went to grad school and do well. A few are dead of opioid ODs. The others work in the same mines, factories, or Walmarts they would have anyway.

It’s not wrong to limit the availability of posh majors for non-posh people.

Yes because a life of a mind is only something for rich people. And those history and lit classes definitely lead to opioid addiction if you are poor and don't know how to handle them.

PP here. Your privilege is showing. College is expensive and people need it to lead to opportunities. History and Lit majors need to go to grad school to do much of anything. A poor person who is a B student at a state school is taking debt for no advantage.

The mid-low end of my majors aren’t living a “life of the mind.” They are working at gas stations and Walmart, with nothing to show for it.

My grandad never got a high school diploma, worked his entire career as a clerk. Yet he always had a book to read. He did have a life of the mind, despite having what you'd consider a dead-end job. What a classist, elitist thing to say that only the rich and hoity toity can care about ideas and like to think and read and enjoy culture.

A poor person should be getting a free ride to college anyway. You know how I know? Because I went to college for almost free. My parents paid nothing because they had no money to pay for it, so I relied on financial aid for all 4 years. I did one of those majors you sneer at. And I am grateful for what it taught me.

People who major in subjects you sneer at can become a teacher in those subjects, an honorable and important profession (which I'm sure you think is a dumb choice because it doesn't make enough money to impress you). But no one even has to pursue a career in their major - only someone without critical thinking skills believes you can only pursue a job in the field of your major. How many lawyers studied philosophy or history as undergrads? Some of my most capable colleagues studied the humanities, and even though their current jobs have nothing to do with their majors, they still rely on skills honed in college, such as how to write and craft arguments, how to think critically and analyze.

It seems you think poor kids should only go to trade school. What a snob. I knew people like you when I was applying to colleges and they told me to be practical and go for the local state schools, that the big name schools I was interested in were beyond my reach. So glad I didn't listen to them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not just WVU that has been dropping language programs. This has been going on since at least the great recession. My understanding is that fewer students are taking language in HS (and the vast majority of those kids are taking Spanish) and fewer are taking it at the university level. There is just not much demand. People argue that folks need to know these languages for foreign service and military intelligence, but as someone who has experience in both of these areas, the foreign service and the military have their own language training programs. There is of course a real need for spanish speakers in many parts of the country for in health, policing, education type jobs, but, there is really no demand for other languages. My guess is that universities are also having trouble finding qualified professors for these programs.

I work in the IC and find your post to be completely misleading/wrong. There is *ALWAYS* a demand for language students, particularly those that are mission-critical: Russian, Chinese, Arabic, etc. And while the federal government does indeed have their own language training programs, a candidate is far more desirable if they come in already speaking the language at some level.

https://www.dlnseo.org/NSEP
https://www.cia.gov/careers/language-opportunities/

But be honest places like these value native or heritage speakers, not language majors. They test for language ability, and it's hard to score high on the test unless you are a native or heritage speaker or have spent years in country. Four years of college language study doesn't cut it.

If you spent a year abroad studying in the language you could get fluent enough. I know because I studied abroad and there were a couple kids in my program who went on into these sorts of career paths based on the fluency they achieved.

Also with immigration limits they're not always going to find native or heritage speakers.

They will only hire US citizens for clearance jobs, so any non-citizen will not be considered. As it should be.

With immigration limits that means there will not be as many bilingual citizen-children growing up as native or heritage speakers available, so PP's implication that those agencies would only be hiring native or heritage speakers is flawed.

This.

Immigration is being limited that much that this will become a problem, Immigration will not go down to three digit levels ha ha