what does 'flexible scheduling' for DC teachers mean?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

They are. Again, 30% of teachers in DC left their jobs last year. Some of them moved into non classroom jobs in schools or central office (both of which are easier, but not where the shortage is), and others left the field altogether.

Try again, please

[Anonymous]

Another article on 'flexible scheduling' in DC, related to a charter. It sounds like they don't have regular class time at all on Mondays ("engage in friendly athletic competitions"). The school apparently wanted one day of virtual per week (post-pandemic) but was denied by the charter board.

Also, from the article, it sounds like there's a question of funding:

"During a presentation in the latter part of February, EmpowerEd Executive Director Scott Goldstein called for a $10 million investment that would allow nearly 25 District schools to pilot flexible scheduling programs specific to needs of the school community.

Paul Kihn, D.C.’s deputy mayor of education and one of dozens who attended EmpowerEd’s presentation, didn’t specify whether D.C. Mayor Muriel Bowser (D) could fulfill EmpowerEd’s budgetary request. While he acknowledged flexible scheduling has been a part of the conversation for years, he, as well as Goldstein, highlighted possible hurdles, including how to ensure students are able to fulfill the academic requirements set by the Office of the State Superintendent of Education.

Another concern, as indicated in the D.C. chief financial officer’s revised revenue estimates, involves how to, or even whether to, pilot flexible scheduling programs with so many priorities on the table."

https://www.washingtoninformer.com/flexible-scheduling-for-teachers-emerges-as-a-budget-season-request/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

It's interesting that you bring up the deficiencies of parents here. It that's an issue, how would flexible scheduling help? Particularly if you don't ask what impact the flexible scheduling would have on the ability of parents to ...oh....be present for their children when they are not in school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Another article on 'flexible scheduling' in DC, related to a charter. It sounds like they don't have regular class time at all on Mondays ("engage in friendly athletic competitions"). The school apparently wanted one day of virtual per week (post-pandemic) but was denied by the charter board.

Also, from the article, it sounds like there's a question of funding:

"During a presentation in the latter part of February, EmpowerEd Executive Director Scott Goldstein called for a $10 million investment that would allow nearly 25 District schools to pilot flexible scheduling programs specific to needs of the school community.

Paul Kihn, D.C.’s deputy mayor of education and one of dozens who attended EmpowerEd’s presentation, didn’t specify whether D.C. Mayor Muriel Bowser (D) could fulfill EmpowerEd’s budgetary request. While he acknowledged flexible scheduling has been a part of the conversation for years, he, as well as Goldstein, highlighted possible hurdles, including how to ensure students are able to fulfill the academic requirements set by the Office of the State Superintendent of Education.

Another concern, as indicated in the D.C. chief financial officer’s revised revenue estimates, involves how to, or even whether to, pilot flexible scheduling programs with so many priorities on the table."

https://www.washingtoninformer.com/flexible-scheduling-for-teachers-emerges-as-a-budget-season-request/

JFC. NO. How is this ok? Just, no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another article on 'flexible scheduling' in DC, related to a charter. It sounds like they don't have regular class time at all on Mondays ("engage in friendly athletic competitions"). The school apparently wanted one day of virtual per week (post-pandemic) but was denied by the charter board.

Also, from the article, it sounds like there's a question of funding:

"During a presentation in the latter part of February, EmpowerEd Executive Director Scott Goldstein called for a $10 million investment that would allow nearly 25 District schools to pilot flexible scheduling programs specific to needs of the school community.

Paul Kihn, D.C.’s deputy mayor of education and one of dozens who attended EmpowerEd’s presentation, didn’t specify whether D.C. Mayor Muriel Bowser (D) could fulfill EmpowerEd’s budgetary request. While he acknowledged flexible scheduling has been a part of the conversation for years, he, as well as Goldstein, highlighted possible hurdles, including how to ensure students are able to fulfill the academic requirements set by the Office of the State Superintendent of Education.

Another concern, as indicated in the D.C. chief financial officer’s revised revenue estimates, involves how to, or even whether to, pilot flexible scheduling programs with so many priorities on the table."

https://www.washingtoninformer.com/flexible-scheduling-for-teachers-emerges-as-a-budget-season-request/

JFC. NO. How is this ok? Just, no.

Absolutely not. I've liked Robert White in the past (until he decided to run for mayor). This is just a trash, trash bill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

It's interesting that you bring up the deficiencies of parents here. It that's an issue, how would flexible scheduling help? Particularly if you don't ask what impact the flexible scheduling would have on the ability of parents to ...oh....be present for their children when they are not in school.

It doesn't you obtuse moose.

It addresses #1 and #2. Pay is more flexible for most people if their schedule is flexible. Rigidity and increased hours correlate to increased pay. When I worked overnight and weekends for organ donation I was paid accordingly. When people bring up nurses, you realize they have 1) the ability to request coverage and 2) different shifts which are both concepts of flexibility. Nurses hate to call out on shifts because they know that without appropriate coverage, the nurses on the floor have to cover their patient load or a nursing supervisor has to get on the floor. Luckily, there are 3 shifts per day so again, more options that with teaching.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

Sounds like she … didn’t want to teach. Which is fine. What is NOT fine is pretending that virtual school is school. We need to stamp out that notion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

Your best friend is an idiot. $15K more per year doesn't cover the delta in her retirement and health insurance benefits. Not even the retirement benefits alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

It's interesting that you bring up the deficiencies of parents here. It that's an issue, how would flexible scheduling help? Particularly if you don't ask what impact the flexible scheduling would have on the ability of parents to ...oh....be present for their children when they are not in school.

It doesn't you obtuse moose.

It addresses #1 and #2. Pay is more flexible for most people if their schedule is flexible. Rigidity and increased hours correlate to increased pay. When I worked overnight and weekends for organ donation I was paid accordingly. When people bring up nurses, you realize they have 1) the ability to request coverage and 2) different shifts which are both concepts of flexibility. Nurses hate to call out on shifts because they know that without appropriate coverage, the nurses on the floor have to cover their patient load or a nursing supervisor has to get on the floor. Luckily, there are 3 shifts per day so again, more options that with teaching.

Great. Ask more more pay - I can support you on that. I cannot support taking away in-person instructional hours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

Your best friend is an idiot. $15K more per year doesn't cover the delta in her retirement and health insurance benefits. Not even the retirement benefits alone.

You should introduce your best friend to an annuity calculator. An annuity paying $100k per year for 20 years costs about two million dollars to buy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

Your best friend is an idiot. $15K more per year doesn't cover the delta in her retirement and health insurance benefits. Not even the retirement benefits alone.

Keep beating this retirement drum. It's not as effective as you think

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

It's interesting that you bring up the deficiencies of parents here. It that's an issue, how would flexible scheduling help? Particularly if you don't ask what impact the flexible scheduling would have on the ability of parents to ...oh....be present for their children when they are not in school.

It doesn't you obtuse moose.

It addresses #1 and #2. Pay is more flexible for most people if their schedule is flexible. Rigidity and increased hours correlate to increased pay. When I worked overnight and weekends for organ donation I was paid accordingly. When people bring up nurses, you realize they have 1) the ability to request coverage and 2) different shifts which are both concepts of flexibility. Nurses hate to call out on shifts because they know that without appropriate coverage, the nurses on the floor have to cover their patient load or a nursing supervisor has to get on the floor. Luckily, there are 3 shifts per day so again, more options that with teaching.

No need to be an entire cow about it. You note that the thing being discussed here -- flexible scheduling -- doesn't address one of the major issues facing teachers. And that apparently the effort doesn't even begin to ponder how it might exacerbate one of the main problems for teachers (bad parents).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

Your best friend is an idiot. $15K more per year doesn't cover the delta in her retirement and health insurance benefits. Not even the retirement benefits alone.

She will have a pension and health benefits at retirement for teaching after x number of years. And the new job has another pension and health insurance, including at retirement, which will be at least 20 years of service as well. She also will make a LOT more each year compared to teaching. She would be topped out (currently) at 107 after 25 years. She will be making 112 her first year at a new job.

And her DH works for the same system she is leaving so health benefits will stay.

I think shes fine

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like a nightmare for schools. How are they going to cover teachers regularly being out for half a day? My kid has an IEP and the teachers are legally required to be present for the meetings, and it's hard enough to coordinate coverage for that.

No
Ma’am. They are required to give input.
Schools had better start offering work settings that mirror the work from home perks.

Teaching is by its nature not a flexible job. And teachers are usually free by 3:15 and all summer … not to mention three weeks of break during the school year.

Teaching is a very flexible job. Summer off, tons of school holidays, nice winter and spring breaks. They finish the day early enough to run errands and do appointments after work. Plus the planning periods during the work day to catch up. Lots of flexibility and perks.

There are a lot of perks to teaching (and tons if hard work) but it is not flexible. It is one of the few jobs where you cannot take off without doing a ton of work to prepare for that absence (or deal with the consequences of your kids not learning and bring a mess for the sub). The summer off is great but I feel lucky my husband has a more flexible programming job. He winds up taking care of covering all sick kid days and random couple of hours off to meet plumber or similar things. It is really stressful to be absent as a teacher. We do have the school breaks but no flexibility in taking off. So yes- teachers get more days off than most but the job is not flexible.

What are you talking about? This is true of every white-collar job.

Really? When my programmer friends take off a day sick they are not expected to provide detailed plans for another unrelated person to continue writing their code. They just pick up where they left off when they returned. When my friends in HR take off they don’t need to leave detailed plans for a random person to read applications for them for the day. When my dentist is out sick my appointment is rescheduled. When I held a non-teaching admin job at my school I could take off and pick everything up the day I returned. I’m not saying there is no pressure not to take off in other jobs. I’m not saying you might not face scrutiny if you take off too much. I’m not saying it might not be hard to take off if you have a deadline looming. But what job do you need to put together detailed plans for someone you’ve never met to do your actual job for the day if you need to take a day off? And yes I know many teachers leave nothing or super crappy plans for the sub but let’s assume we are talking about a teacher trying to set up a decent day for their students.

So it sounds like teaching is a job that is less flexible (from 8-3) than some other jobs. So you need to accept that, or find flexibility in other ways compatible with the job duties.

I think the point made at the beginning of this thread, is that its not the teachers that need to accept this or continue to be flexible. Teachers are making it pretty clear this is unsustainable from a QoL and all of the "My job is also hard" or "but you have summers off" or "retirement benefits" aren't going to sway them, regardless of your personal opinion.

They should take another job. Just to show I'm not a jerk, I'll support an 18-month hire-back guarantee. Clocks starts when the decide to take me up on it. They're first lesson will be "jesus christ, it's hard to find a job nowadays."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH my best friend with almost 20 years of teaching experience who runs a specialized program for students in a highly desired school system is leaving. And will be making 15k more with WAH capability.

3 main reasons she is leaving
1. pay
2. lack of time with her own children and flexibility
3. parents who decide that HS means they no longer have to parent their children

It's interesting that you bring up the deficiencies of parents here. It that's an issue, how would flexible scheduling help? Particularly if you don't ask what impact the flexible scheduling would have on the ability of parents to ...oh....be present for their children when they are not in school.

It doesn't you obtuse moose.

It addresses #1 and #2. Pay is more flexible for most people if their schedule is flexible. Rigidity and increased hours correlate to increased pay. When I worked overnight and weekends for organ donation I was paid accordingly. When people bring up nurses, you realize they have 1) the ability to request coverage and 2) different shifts which are both concepts of flexibility. Nurses hate to call out on shifts because they know that without appropriate coverage, the nurses on the floor have to cover their patient load or a nursing supervisor has to get on the floor. Luckily, there are 3 shifts per day so again, more options that with teaching.

No need to be an entire cow about it. You note that the thing being discussed here -- flexible scheduling -- doesn't address one of the major issues facing teachers. And that apparently the effort doesn't even begin to ponder how it might exacerbate one of the main problems for teachers (bad parents).

You cant address that as a school system. Thats not on teachers to address.