constant chatter about Montgomery County schools being better

[Anonymous]

Kid just don't need to take more than 6 or 7 APs to crack colleges admitting in the single digits and teens as long as they're extra curriculars and/or work/internship experience knock it out of the park, their GPAs are impressive (not necessarily in the the top 1%, or even 5% at the school). However, they need 4s and 5s on the exams (mostly 5s) to pull it off, or to be on track for IB Diploma points in the high 30s-40s if they're not legacies, recruited athletes or musicians.

Many kids take one AP class/exam, then take another with overlap content without taking the class at all these schools: JR, Walls, Banneker, MoCo options.

Common overlap content choices below. Students usually just take one of the classes, but perhaps both exams after self study in one subject.

World History and US History
US Govt and Politics and Comparative Govt and Politics
World History and European History
US Govt and Politics and US History
French and Latin
English Lit and Composition and English Language and Composition
Physics 1, 2 and C
Studio Art 2-D and 3-D

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What's unclear to me, is when people speak of kids taking a high number of APs, eg, above 7... are they talking about taking just the class? Or taking the exam and getting at least a 4 or 5. My understanding is that the grade in an AP class is less important (grade inflation, hard to tell what an "A" means between different schools), and the AP score is more important, bc it is a national standards and a 4 or 5 is the same regardless of school or region.

I could imagine a kid taking 10-12-15 AP classes. Less so 10-12-15 AP tests and scoring 4 - 5 on all of them

I agree. Way too much grade inflation. The AP test scores will give you much more info.

I mean, almost 1/2 the kids at JR taking AP courses are getting 1 and 2 so that should tell you something about grade inflation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's unclear to me, is when people speak of kids taking a high number of APs, eg, above 7... are they talking about taking just the class? Or taking the exam and getting at least a 4 or 5. My understanding is that the grade in an AP class is less important (grade inflation, hard to tell what an "A" means between different schools), and the AP score is more important, bc it is a national standards and a 4 or 5 is the same regardless of school or region.

I could imagine a kid taking 10-12-15 AP classes. Less so 10-12-15 AP tests and scoring 4 - 5 on all of them

I agree. Way too much grade inflation. The AP test scores will give you much more info.

I mean, almost 1/2 the kids at JR taking AP courses are getting 1 and 2 so that should tell you something about grade inflation.

1/2 the kids everywhere are getting 1s and 2s. I believe the national average is basically a 50% pass rate.

JR requires all the kids actually take the test (since it is free). I don’t know if it is free for MCPS, but in districts where kids have to pay they often self-select and only take the test if they think they will do well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's unclear to me, is when people speak of kids taking a high number of APs, eg, above 7... are they talking about taking just the class? Or taking the exam and getting at least a 4 or 5. My understanding is that the grade in an AP class is less important (grade inflation, hard to tell what an "A" means between different schools), and the AP score is more important, bc it is a national standards and a 4 or 5 is the same regardless of school or region.

I could imagine a kid taking 10-12-15 AP classes. Less so 10-12-15 AP tests and scoring 4 - 5 on all of them

I agree. Way too much grade inflation. The AP test scores will give you much more info.

I mean, almost 1/2 the kids at JR taking AP courses are getting 1 and 2 so that should tell you something about grade inflation.

1/2 the kids everywhere are getting 1s and 2s. I believe the national average is basically a 50% pass rate.

JR requires all the kids actually take the test (since it is free). I don’t know if it is free for MCPS, but in districts where kids have to pay they often self-select and only take the test if they think they will do well.

Sort of, some of the JR kids don't bother to take the test. Others register for APs at other schools and pay to take them if JR isn't prepared to pay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's unclear to me, is when people speak of kids taking a high number of APs, eg, above 7... are they talking about taking just the class? Or taking the exam and getting at least a 4 or 5. My understanding is that the grade in an AP class is less important (grade inflation, hard to tell what an "A" means between different schools), and the AP score is more important, bc it is a national standards and a 4 or 5 is the same regardless of school or region.

I could imagine a kid taking 10-12-15 AP classes. Less so 10-12-15 AP tests and scoring 4 - 5 on all of them

I agree. Way too much grade inflation. The AP test scores will give you much more info.

I mean, almost 1/2 the kids at JR taking AP courses are getting 1 and 2 so that should tell you something about grade inflation.

1/2 the kids everywhere are getting 1s and 2s. I believe the national average is basically a 50% pass rate.

JR requires all the kids actually take the test (since it is free). I don’t know if it is free for MCPS, but in districts where kids have to pay they often self-select and only take the test if they think they will do well.

It's not free in MCPS but there is aid to help pay for them. MCPS encourages students to take AP classes and exams, sometimes when the kid shouldn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's unclear to me, is when people speak of kids taking a high number of APs, eg, above 7... are they talking about taking just the class? Or taking the exam and getting at least a 4 or 5. My understanding is that the grade in an AP class is less important (grade inflation, hard to tell what an "A" means between different schools), and the AP score is more important, bc it is a national standards and a 4 or 5 is the same regardless of school or region.

I could imagine a kid taking 10-12-15 AP classes. Less so 10-12-15 AP tests and scoring 4 - 5 on all of them

I agree. Way too much grade inflation. The AP test scores will give you much more info.

I mean, almost 1/2 the kids at JR taking AP courses are getting 1 and 2 so that should tell you something about grade inflation.

1/2 the kids everywhere are getting 1s and 2s. I believe the national average is basically a 50% pass rate.

JR requires all the kids actually take the test (since it is free). I don’t know if it is free for MCPS, but in districts where kids have to pay they often self-select and only take the test if they think they will do well.

Sort of, some of the JR kids don't bother to take the test. Others register for APs at other schools and pay to take them if JR isn't prepared to pay.

Are you just making s**t up? All AP tests are free for DCPS. No one from JR is paying to take an AP test somewhere else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's unclear to me, is when people speak of kids taking a high number of APs, eg, above 7... are they talking about taking just the class? Or taking the exam and getting at least a 4 or 5. My understanding is that the grade in an AP class is less important (grade inflation, hard to tell what an "A" means between different schools), and the AP score is more important, bc it is a national standards and a 4 or 5 is the same regardless of school or region.

I could imagine a kid taking 10-12-15 AP classes. Less so 10-12-15 AP tests and scoring 4 - 5 on all of them

I agree. Way too much grade inflation. The AP test scores will give you much more info.

I mean, almost 1/2 the kids at JR taking AP courses are getting 1 and 2 so that should tell you something about grade inflation.

1/2 the kids everywhere are getting 1s and 2s. I believe the national average is basically a 50% pass rate.

JR requires all the kids actually take the test (since it is free). I don’t know if it is free for MCPS, but in districts where kids have to pay they often self-select and only take the test if they think they will do well.

Sort of, some of the JR kids don't bother to take the test. Others register for APs at other schools and pay to take them if JR isn't prepared to pay.

Are you just making s**t up? All AP tests are free for DCPS. No one from JR is paying to take an AP test somewhere else.

Yes there are. JR doesn't give every AP exam on the list of three dozen APs every spring.

[Anonymous]

How do you take AP exams at other schools?
What are the logistics?

Can you just register at Walls, Montgomery Co., etc?

Thank you!

[Anonymous]

Just go to the AP College Board web site, click on AP Students, then Take Exams, then Register for Exams. Site explains everything. If you want to register for an exam that's not given at your kid's school, get going early on registration, in February. https://apstudents.collegeboard.org/register-for-ap-exams

[Anonymous]

+1. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

I do agree. We are so happy to have made the switch to MCPS this year. It is not as overcrowded which means a better and more organized student/teacher ratio. Same kinds of great kids at both schools just better administration of the education. We do find the prices for housing more expensive and will continue to rent.

[Anonymous]

I really don't know why this is even a debate. Facts are facts. If you look at the bigger picture -- The W's are some of the best in the country. JR is mediocre/in the middle with a less than stellar graduation rate. Can your upper middle-class kid, with their upper middle-class friends do great there -- absolutely, but would they get more out of a better run school --- probably?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kid just don't need to take more than 6 or 7 APs to crack colleges admitting in the single digits and teens as long as they're extra curriculars and/or work/internship experience knock it out of the park, their GPAs are impressive (not necessarily in the the top 1%, or even 5% at the school). However, they need 4s and 5s on the exams (mostly 5s) to pull it off, or to be on track for IB Diploma points in the high 30s-40s if they're not legacies, recruited athletes or musicians.

Many kids take one AP class/exam, then take another with overlap content without taking the class at all these schools: JR, Walls, Banneker, MoCo options.

Common overlap content choices below. Students usually just take one of the classes, but perhaps both exams after self study in one subject.

World History and US History
US Govt and Politics and Comparative Govt and Politics
World History and European History
US Govt and Politics and US History
French and Latin
English Lit and Composition and English Language and Composition
Physics 1, 2 and C
Studio Art 2-D and 3-D

This is a very odd post. If all you need to do is take 6 or 7 APs and have scores to show colleges (i.e., take them by end of 11th grade), you take 2 APs in 10th and 4-5 in 11th and I guess you are done.

In the same breath, PP is saying that a bunch of kids self-study and take all these other tests. Why would they do that if they already took their 6-7 APs?

First, to say "many" do is nuts...maybe a couple do this from all DCPS schools, and even then in very specific subjects. US Govt and Comparative Govt overlap only in that Govt is in the name. Comparative Govt compares govt systems and economic structures across 5 countries, none of which is the US. French and Latin? Maybe if you are a native French speaker who studies Latin... no one is studying French and then self-studying for the Latin AP test, and there is no point to doing that. Physics 1 is Algebra-based, while Physics C is calculus-based...if you are taking Physics C, there is no point in taking the Physics 1 AP test because it is an earlier course in the progression. If you are taking Physics I, you are not self-studying for Physics C...you would have taken Physics C from the start...you get caught in a circular loop.

Sure, you may take English Lit and then also take the English Language AP at the same time...but why would you do that? You are not going to take grade level English in 12th grade, so you take English Lang in 11th and English Lit in 12th.

Colleges look at your HS transcript first, and your AP Scores 2nd. You will not be given any acceptance weight to taking an AP test without taking the AP course. Your AP test score is only relevant for getting college credit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kid just don't need to take more than 6 or 7 APs to crack colleges admitting in the single digits and teens as long as they're extra curriculars and/or work/internship experience knock it out of the park, their GPAs are impressive (not necessarily in the the top 1%, or even 5% at the school). However, they need 4s and 5s on the exams (mostly 5s) to pull it off, or to be on track for IB Diploma points in the high 30s-40s if they're not legacies, recruited athletes or musicians.

Many kids take one AP class/exam, then take another with overlap content without taking the class at all these schools: JR, Walls, Banneker, MoCo options.

Common overlap content choices below. Students usually just take one of the classes, but perhaps both exams after self study in one subject.

World History and US History
US Govt and Politics and Comparative Govt and Politics
World History and European History
US Govt and Politics and US History
French and Latin
English Lit and Composition and English Language and Composition
Physics 1, 2 and C
Studio Art 2-D and 3-D

This is a very odd post. If all you need to do is take 6 or 7 APs and have scores to show colleges (i.e., take them by end of 11th grade), you take 2 APs in 10th and 4-5 in 11th and I guess you are done.

In the same breath, PP is saying that a bunch of kids self-study and take all these other tests. Why would they do that if they already took their 6-7 APs?

First, to say "many" do is nuts...maybe a couple do this from all DCPS schools, and even then in very specific subjects. US Govt and Comparative Govt overlap only in that Govt is in the name. Comparative Govt compares govt systems and economic structures across 5 countries, none of which is the US. French and Latin? Maybe if you are a native French speaker who studies Latin... no one is studying French and then self-studying for the Latin AP test, and there is no point to doing that. Physics 1 is Algebra-based, while Physics C is calculus-based...if you are taking Physics C, there is no point in taking the Physics 1 AP test because it is an earlier course in the progression. If you are taking Physics I, you are not self-studying for Physics C...you would have taken Physics C from the start...you get caught in a circular loop.

Sure, you may take English Lit and then also take the English Language AP at the same time...but why would you do that? You are not going to take grade level English in 12th grade, so you take English Lang in 11th and English Lit in 12th.

Colleges look at your HS transcript first, and your AP Scores 2nd. You will not be given any acceptance weight to taking an AP test without taking the AP course. Your AP test score is only relevant for getting college credit.

Acceptance weight is pretty subjective—why wouldn’t colleges give you additional weight if you take some AP tests without taking the underlying courses?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kid just don't need to take more than 6 or 7 APs to crack colleges admitting in the single digits and teens as long as they're extra curriculars and/or work/internship experience knock it out of the park, their GPAs are impressive (not necessarily in the the top 1%, or even 5% at the school). However, they need 4s and 5s on the exams (mostly 5s) to pull it off, or to be on track for IB Diploma points in the high 30s-40s if they're not legacies, recruited athletes or musicians.

Many kids take one AP class/exam, then take another with overlap content without taking the class at all these schools: JR, Walls, Banneker, MoCo options.

Common overlap content choices below. Students usually just take one of the classes, but perhaps both exams after self study in one subject.

World History and US History
US Govt and Politics and Comparative Govt and Politics
World History and European History
US Govt and Politics and US History
French and Latin
English Lit and Composition and English Language and Composition
Physics 1, 2 and C
Studio Art 2-D and 3-D

This is a very odd post. If all you need to do is take 6 or 7 APs and have scores to show colleges (i.e., take them by end of 11th grade), you take 2 APs in 10th and 4-5 in 11th and I guess you are done.

In the same breath, PP is saying that a bunch of kids self-study and take all these other tests. Why would they do that if they already took their 6-7 APs?

First, to say "many" do is nuts...maybe a couple do this from all DCPS schools, and even then in very specific subjects. US Govt and Comparative Govt overlap only in that Govt is in the name. Comparative Govt compares govt systems and economic structures across 5 countries, none of which is the US. French and Latin? Maybe if you are a native French speaker who studies Latin... no one is studying French and then self-studying for the Latin AP test, and there is no point to doing that. Physics 1 is Algebra-based, while Physics C is calculus-based...if you are taking Physics C, there is no point in taking the Physics 1 AP test because it is an earlier course in the progression. If you are taking Physics I, you are not self-studying for Physics C...you would have taken Physics C from the start...you get caught in a circular loop.

Sure, you may take English Lit and then also take the English Language AP at the same time...but why would you do that? You are not going to take grade level English in 12th grade, so you take English Lang in 11th and English Lit in 12th.

Colleges look at your HS transcript first, and your AP Scores 2nd. You will not be given any acceptance weight to taking an AP test without taking the AP course. Your AP test score is only relevant for getting college credit.

Acceptance weight is pretty subjective—why wouldn’t colleges give you additional weight if you take some AP tests without taking the underlying courses?

You can either believe colleges or not...this is just repeating what they tell kids at HS visit days and what they tell college counselors. They mainly care about AP Test scores for placement in classes, but taking the AP course and doing well is how they evaluate for acceptance.

Is it possible they are lying and in fact will give bonus points to a kid that doesn't take the course but does well on the test...anything is possible.

The issue is that you have to take core classes in HS and a language (though you can finish a language by like 10th grade if you accelerate), and they care most about AP grades and scores in core classes plus language. If you are not taking the AP class...then what are you taking? Honors is not considered as rigorous and JR only offers grade level or AP.