Stop including your spouse’s net worth as part of your own!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m just wondering in what scenario adult women talk about net worth in any kind of setting. I am in my mid forties. I have childless and moms of college student friends and we have not once discussed net worth. When I was very young, we may have discussed starting salaries but that was decades ago. It is in very poor taste to discuss money. I would never tell anyone how much Dh earns or how much we have saved and yes, it is our joint finances.

The only place I write HHI and net worth is on dcum.

+1 Only complete blowhards talk about this stuff in real life.

This. I have never had a net worth conversation with anyone in my life. The only time I even think about it is in the context of retirement planning and then it's really not net worth (I exclude home equity and emergency cash and focus on invested assets, because that is what will provide the income we need in retirement). I have no idea what OP is suggesting - should I only consider have of our combined net worth for retirement? Should I only plan for my own retirement, with half our assets, and tell my wife to plan hers, with the other half? Should I plan on purchasing a retirement home that is suitable for a single person? It's nonsense.

Yes, $2m in retirement means something different for a single person than a couple. But that doesn't mean that married couples shoudl presume they will retire on half their assets.

It's apparent that OP just feeling a little bitter (despite her protests to the contrary) about her single status.

I feel bad for OP. She doesn’t have someone who she shares a life with. I have 3 kids. We have saved for college. Dh and I discuss where we should retire. We want to be near our future grandchildren. We think about paying for college, grad school and weddings. It isn’t some your money and my money divide. Our house is our family home that we live in. If anything, we are thinking about how to avoid taxes when we die.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:When I’m reading the threads about how much is needed to retire, etc. I do find myself looking to see if someone is talking about the amount for themselves or a couple. So in that sense, it kind of does make a difference when referring to net worth.

No, it doesn’t. Again, it’s not like being a couple is twice the cost of being single. It’s not even close.

I know many couples with expenses far more than double those of a single person. Usually marriage is entered into with the intention of having kids, and that drastically raises expenses - daycare, college, food, braces, and on and on. A single person, or one who divorced before kids, will be able to stretch a $1 million or $2 million net worth much farther.

And lastly, one of the main things that eats up net worth is medical expenses later in life. With two people, the risk of encountering that situation is exactly double than for a single person.

See, you’re mixing apples and oranges. Everybody agrees that families with children are more expensive than couples without kids. That’s a complete no-brainer. We’re talking about something different entirely.

As a general rule, being married has financial advantages over being single. Anyone who has ever had to pay a “single supplement” for an all-inclusive trip knows this very well. It’s annoying, but it’s true.

Our system is set up to favor marriage. The tax system, the benefits system, all of it. To give just one of many examples, my spouse has never worked outside the home, but because we are married we will collect 50 percent more in social security benefits than the OP would. Why? The spousal benefit.

No one can credibly argue that from a financial standpoint is better to be single in this country than married.

If you don't make much money, it's understandable that you want to include your husbands assets in your net worth. But it's not the same thing as a single person with the same assets, as their expenses are quite a bit less. I can see how it's slightly more economical for couples because you are sharing housing, but your situation is likely temporary, as you will most likely get divorced and probably split assets 50/50.

This is all so nutty. Married people will not "most likely get divorced."

Seriously. What a strange world view. DH and I have been married 22 years. We're not getting divorced. My parents were married 51 years, ILs 48, my BIL/SIL been married 35. Most of my friends are in 20+ year marriages. In the couples in my world divorce is definitely a rarity.

Your anecdotal stories have nothing to do with actual statistics and the future. That is the opposite of "world view." It's basically a toss up whether you will get divorced or not. This is a huge risk if you have big assets going into a marriage.

It’s not a toss up though. If you control for age, income and education level, divorce rates are much much lower than 50% for educated wealthy people.

What are the rates? The problem with your premise is that you aren't accounting for all of the people who got divorced earlier in life and lost their ass. And a lot of the educated and wealthy people don't get divorced because they have too much to lose. Even if the rate is 25%, that is in no way a good bet. Marriage is a license issued by the state. You can have the same relationship without the unnecessary risk.

The premise of your last sentence is incorrect. While you can approximate by contract some aspects of marriage, you absolutely cannot replicate all the legal consequences, protections, and benefits. Overall, marriage is far less risky than trying to replicate it by contract.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m just wondering in what scenario adult women talk about net worth in any kind of setting. I am in my mid forties. I have childless and moms of college student friends and we have not once discussed net worth. When I was very young, we may have discussed starting salaries but that was decades ago. It is in very poor taste to discuss money. I would never tell anyone how much Dh earns or how much we have saved and yes, it is our joint finances.

The only place I write HHI and net worth is on dcum.

+1 Only complete blowhards talk about this stuff in real life.

This. I have never had a net worth conversation with anyone in my life. The only time I even think about it is in the context of retirement planning and then it's really not net worth (I exclude home equity and emergency cash and focus on invested assets, because that is what will provide the income we need in retirement). I have no idea what OP is suggesting - should I only consider have of our combined net worth for retirement? Should I only plan for my own retirement, with half our assets, and tell my wife to plan hers, with the other half? Should I plan on purchasing a retirement home that is suitable for a single person? It's nonsense.

Yes, $2m in retirement means something different for a single person than a couple. But that doesn't mean that married couples shoudl presume they will retire on half their assets.

It's apparent that OP just feeling a little bitter (despite her protests to the contrary) about her single status.

I've had the NW conversation multiple times, but it has always been with my spouse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m just wondering in what scenario adult women talk about net worth in any kind of setting. I am in my mid forties. I have childless and moms of college student friends and we have not once discussed net worth. When I was very young, we may have discussed starting salaries but that was decades ago. It is in very poor taste to discuss money. I would never tell anyone how much Dh earns or how much we have saved and yes, it is our joint finances.

The only place I write HHI and net worth is on dcum.

+1 Only complete blowhards talk about this stuff in real life.

This. I have never had a net worth conversation with anyone in my life. The only time I even think about it is in the context of retirement planning and then it's really not net worth (I exclude home equity and emergency cash and focus on invested assets, because that is what will provide the income we need in retirement). I have no idea what OP is suggesting - should I only consider have of our combined net worth for retirement? Should I only plan for my own retirement, with half our assets, and tell my wife to plan hers, with the other half? Should I plan on purchasing a retirement home that is suitable for a single person? It's nonsense.

Yes, $2m in retirement means something different for a single person than a couple. But that doesn't mean that married couples shoudl presume they will retire on half their assets.

It's apparent that OP just feeling a little bitter (despite her protests to the contrary) about her single status.

I've had the NW conversation multiple times, but it has always been with my spouse.

Exactly. Who else would you talk to this about?

I do sometimes talk to friends about elder care. It is less about money but just having a shoulder to lean on. Nursing care is expensive.

Op, do you have children? How old are you?

We mostly focus on the cost of kids and college, not retirement. I am in my forties.

[Anonymous]

Apparently OP struck a nerve..

OP doesn't have anyone to share her life with? WTF
OP is bitter and single? WTH

Lots of hateful people posting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Apparently OP struck a nerve..

OP doesn't have anyone to share her life with? WTF
OP is bitter and single? WTH

Lots of hateful people posting

I don't think anyone was hating her, just reacting in shock that she doesn't understand joint assets and household net worth in a marriage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I never understood why people do this. While it’s not quite as dumb as my saying, “Elon Musk and I together are billionaires!“, it’s pretty close.

Just head on over to the relationship forum if you don’t believe that marriages end. And even if you do stay together, marriage requires a lot of compromise and sacrifice. If you consider net worth as a measure of financial freedom, the drawbacks of marriage really eliminate a lot of that “freedom.“

Moreover, if two 35-year-olds each have $500,000 saved, why do they suddenly become millionaires when they get married?? But it makes people feel better to say that they have a net worth of $1 million instead of $500,000, so I guess we’ll keep using this silly standard.

Because they can add? And use logic, unlike you?

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure why OP seems to care how assets are measured. I think it's a standard because a majority of people used to be married.

For several reasons, it just doesn't matter. For example, most of those stats don't take into account having a pension. A 60k/yr pension is worth 1.5 mil, so kind of a big deal. And if you are single, your bills are significantly less than a couple.

TBH, OP is getting push back because combining assets allows the poor person in the relationship to take credit for the accomplishments of someone else. They should be happy they found someone willing to marry them who makes a lot of money. It's a slam dunk!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Apparently OP struck a nerve..

OP doesn't have anyone to share her life with? WTF
OP is bitter and single? WTH

Lots of hateful people posting

I’m not hateful. I feel bad for OP. I actually am very happy and have a lovely family and solid marriage. Our net worth is combined even though DH contributed 90%.

[Anonymous]

I mean, you can do that, but if you do get divorced the #s won't really work out like that most likely, unless you make the exact same amount and always have.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I mean, you can do that, but if you do get divorced the #s won't really work out like that most likely, unless you make the exact same amount and always have.

I have roughly $1m to my name. We have about 6-7m of home equity on $10m worth of real estate. DH has probably 3-4m in his retirement and brokerage accounts. Would I get exactly half if we divorced? Maybe or maybe not. If he dies, I would get all. Either way, I should be fine.

[Anonymous]

This posting should go in relationships, not money!