Anonymous wrote:RTO is going to cause some agencies to hemorrhage decent young-ish employees. One day a week already led to us losing a few attorneys for the private sector. They can’t afford to live close in and as soon as they have kids they can’t manage a commute that’s an hour plus. I’m in a weird boat where my spouse makes a lot of money so we live close in but has garbage health insurance which doesn’t work because one of our kids is SN.
+1. Some of the posters are delusional about how much it costs to live reasonably close in with kids, where there is access to safe public schools and housing. I bought my house in 2013 and prices have since skyrocketed, and I still had nearly an hour commute downtown from within Fairfax County. Why would I want to spend nearly 1.5 - 2 hours a day commuting when I could spend that time with my family, driving kids to activities, exercising, cooking a healthy meal, etc. Life is too short to waste it in a car to spend 8 hours in the office on Teams meetings. Furthermore, I am a Federal manager and most of my younger, hard-working staff all want telework - for the exact reasons I do, so they can balance their careers and home life. I don’t want to lose them and I certainly don’t want to force them in the office more. Our work is computer based and can be completed effectively from home. I also have staff more willing to work on an issue later in the day or earlier in the morning when they’re home. Staff is flexible and more engaged in the work because they have a manager who is flexible regarding where they do the work. For computer based work, RTO is not the answer. The genie is out of the bottle and it’s not going back.
I understand but has this all changed dramatically in the last 3 years since the pandemic started? My whole office used to commute 4 days a week deal with traffic or public transportation, figure out kids activities, etc and now just doing what they used to do is intolerable? I get that we had a few years with more flexibility but we're being asked to do what everyone did for decades and suddenly that's too hard and everyone will quit?
No, it’s that in the past three years, people discovered that by working from home, we can balance work and family demands much more easily. We used to also have no child labor laws. Should we go back to that?
I don’t think people “discovered” anything. It’s more that their employers were FORCED to provide accommodations DUE TO A NATIONAL CRISIS. Now that the crisis is over, employers want you back in the office.
NP but I see it more as the government FORCED me to make my home also my office. And do that for quite a long time. It sucked at first but now I have made it work.
No. The government was forced because they need to continue their mission. An agency can't stop being an agency. Employees on the other hand, can choose to stop working at an agency. You could have quit, but you stayed. And, you learned that the new accommodations were so good you don't want to leave or give them up.
Anonymous wrote:RTO is going to cause some agencies to hemorrhage decent young-ish employees. One day a week already led to us losing a few attorneys for the private sector. They can’t afford to live close in and as soon as they have kids they can’t manage a commute that’s an hour plus. I’m in a weird boat where my spouse makes a lot of money so we live close in but has garbage health insurance which doesn’t work because one of our kids is SN.
+1. Some of the posters are delusional about how much it costs to live reasonably close in with kids, where there is access to safe public schools and housing. I bought my house in 2013 and prices have since skyrocketed, and I still had nearly an hour commute downtown from within Fairfax County. Why would I want to spend nearly 1.5 - 2 hours a day commuting when I could spend that time with my family, driving kids to activities, exercising, cooking a healthy meal, etc. Life is too short to waste it in a car to spend 8 hours in the office on Teams meetings. Furthermore, I am a Federal manager and most of my younger, hard-working staff all want telework - for the exact reasons I do, so they can balance their careers and home life. I don’t want to lose them and I certainly don’t want to force them in the office more. Our work is computer based and can be completed effectively from home. I also have staff more willing to work on an issue later in the day or earlier in the morning when they’re home. Staff is flexible and more engaged in the work because they have a manager who is flexible regarding where they do the work. For computer based work, RTO is not the answer. The genie is out of the bottle and it’s not going back.
I understand but has this all changed dramatically in the last 3 years since the pandemic started? My whole office used to commute 4 days a week deal with traffic or public transportation, figure out kids activities, etc and now just doing what they used to do is intolerable? I get that we had a few years with more flexibility but we're being asked to do what everyone did for decades and suddenly that's too hard and everyone will quit?
No, it’s that in the past three years, people discovered that by working from home, we can balance work and family demands much more easily. We used to also have no child labor laws. Should we go back to that?
And why should govt care about that? It's your personal choice/life isn't it?
NP. Because it's like putting toothpaste back in the tube. No one who enjoys it is willingly or for long going to give up that newfound flexibility now that they know it is possible. So basically you have a critical mass of people in every white collar industry who don't want to go back to the office. Most RTO efforts have fizzled out after a few weeks or months. I think that is likely to continue, because there are just so many people who like WFH. It's just the way it's going to be. Do not stand against the wind...
Don't assume Govt will try to put it back. Getting a new one is always an option (i.e., let those who want to leave, leave).
Problem with that is the number of people who like to WFH. Sure there will be efforts to RTO, but I believe over the long term they will all fizzle. Because sooner or later people rebel, find ways to make exceptions, change policies, etc. It's human nature.
At my agency they are starting to log PIV card badge swipes when we enter and match those to when people say they were in the office, which should catch most of the fraud that happens when people don’t really RTO. Will be interesting to see what happens when the start getting really serious about this.
Anonymous wrote:RTO is going to cause some agencies to hemorrhage decent young-ish employees. One day a week already led to us losing a few attorneys for the private sector. They can’t afford to live close in and as soon as they have kids they can’t manage a commute that’s an hour plus. I’m in a weird boat where my spouse makes a lot of money so we live close in but has garbage health insurance which doesn’t work because one of our kids is SN.
+1. Some of the posters are delusional about how much it costs to live reasonably close in with kids, where there is access to safe public schools and housing. I bought my house in 2013 and prices have since skyrocketed, and I still had nearly an hour commute downtown from within Fairfax County. Why would I want to spend nearly 1.5 - 2 hours a day commuting when I could spend that time with my family, driving kids to activities, exercising, cooking a healthy meal, etc. Life is too short to waste it in a car to spend 8 hours in the office on Teams meetings. Furthermore, I am a Federal manager and most of my younger, hard-working staff all want telework - for the exact reasons I do, so they can balance their careers and home life. I don’t want to lose them and I certainly don’t want to force them in the office more. Our work is computer based and can be completed effectively from home. I also have staff more willing to work on an issue later in the day or earlier in the morning when they’re home. Staff is flexible and more engaged in the work because they have a manager who is flexible regarding where they do the work. For computer based work, RTO is not the answer. The genie is out of the bottle and it’s not going back.
I understand but has this all changed dramatically in the last 3 years since the pandemic started? My whole office used to commute 4 days a week deal with traffic or public transportation, figure out kids activities, etc and now just doing what they used to do is intolerable? I get that we had a few years with more flexibility but we're being asked to do what everyone did for decades and suddenly that's too hard and everyone will quit?
No, it’s that in the past three years, people discovered that by working from home, we can balance work and family demands much more easily. We used to also have no child labor laws. Should we go back to that?
And why should govt care about that? It's your personal choice/life isn't it?
NP. Because it's like putting toothpaste back in the tube. No one who enjoys it is willingly or for long going to give up that newfound flexibility now that they know it is possible. So basically you have a critical mass of people in every white collar industry who don't want to go back to the office. Most RTO efforts have fizzled out after a few weeks or months. I think that is likely to continue, because there are just so many people who like WFH. It's just the way it's going to be. Do not stand against the wind...
At least one poster is honest. They want WFH because they like it. Period. They like it. All the other arguments are excuses for this real one. Now, why do they like it? That’s another can of worms. Believe me, it’s not about productivity.
I'm the PP. I can tell you why I like it. Flexibility, lack of office politics, no commute, can have lunch with my kid at her school over my own lunch break, can make my own lunch at home, can take a 10 min break to walk the dog...still get all my work done with excellence, advising my clients and serving my country.
Great! Would you be willing to take a 20% paycut so that your in-office peers clear the same money you do with all that convenience and lower cost?
Now wait a second. I am using my own computer at home, which I have to upgrade regularly and I probably wouldnt even have a computer without working from home and I certainly would not upgrade it because of wear and tear. I have to pay for virus protection and upgraded internet. I have to use my cell phone for work and its a separate app that transfers my call from my office line to my cell phone. I pay for the desk, chair, printer, papers, pens, multiple monitors, etc. There's no workers comp coverage for me if I fall or slip or X happens at work because I am not in the building and therefore a liability. There's more continuity with coverage since I dont have to take off a whole day for school or daycare being closed or late opening or early dismissal. I am not late for meetings due to traffic. I can continue working through any early closures due to rain, snow, etc. I am not drinking coffee or using the fridges or have every appliance/tablet/phone plugged in with lights on all day long. Lets not even discuss long-term insurance costs for remote vs office workers.
I am using my own computer at home, which I have to upgrade regularly and I probably wouldnt even have a computer without working from home and I certainly would not upgrade it because of wear and tear. I have to pay for virus protection and upgraded internet. I don't believe you are a fed! What agency? We are not allowed to use our own computers or our own virus protection.
I have to use my cell phone for work and its a separate app that transfers my call from my office line to my cell phone. We aren't supposed to be using cell phones. We use VOIP that work pays for.
I pay for the desk, chair, printer, papers, pens, multiple monitors, etc. Work provides a monitor. If you like to print stuff nonstop, then yes, that's on you. My entire agency has banned outside printers from connecting to agency computers, so I'm not sure how you're printing?
There's no workers comp coverage for me if I fall or slip or X happens at work because I am not in the building and therefore a liability. You're wrong. You can be eligible for workers comp. It says so in our Remote work FAQs
I'm continually surprised by the people who don't grasp that each agency does this differently. Lots of agencies have you use personal cell phones, buy your own monitor, etc. Others provide printers and chairs. There is no one approach.
OK which agency lets you use your own computer? And let's you use your own virus software?
Anonymous wrote:RTO is going to cause some agencies to hemorrhage decent young-ish employees. One day a week already led to us losing a few attorneys for the private sector. They can’t afford to live close in and as soon as they have kids they can’t manage a commute that’s an hour plus. I’m in a weird boat where my spouse makes a lot of money so we live close in but has garbage health insurance which doesn’t work because one of our kids is SN.
+1. Some of the posters are delusional about how much it costs to live reasonably close in with kids, where there is access to safe public schools and housing. I bought my house in 2013 and prices have since skyrocketed, and I still had nearly an hour commute downtown from within Fairfax County. Why would I want to spend nearly 1.5 - 2 hours a day commuting when I could spend that time with my family, driving kids to activities, exercising, cooking a healthy meal, etc. Life is too short to waste it in a car to spend 8 hours in the office on Teams meetings. Furthermore, I am a Federal manager and most of my younger, hard-working staff all want telework - for the exact reasons I do, so they can balance their careers and home life. I don’t want to lose them and I certainly don’t want to force them in the office more. Our work is computer based and can be completed effectively from home. I also have staff more willing to work on an issue later in the day or earlier in the morning when they’re home. Staff is flexible and more engaged in the work because they have a manager who is flexible regarding where they do the work. For computer based work, RTO is not the answer. The genie is out of the bottle and it’s not going back.
I understand but has this all changed dramatically in the last 3 years since the pandemic started? My whole office used to commute 4 days a week deal with traffic or public transportation, figure out kids activities, etc and now just doing what they used to do is intolerable? I get that we had a few years with more flexibility but we're being asked to do what everyone did for decades and suddenly that's too hard and everyone will quit?
No, it’s that in the past three years, people discovered that by working from home, we can balance work and family demands much more easily. We used to also have no child labor laws. Should we go back to that?
And why should govt care about that? It's your personal choice/life isn't it?
NP. Because it's like putting toothpaste back in the tube. No one who enjoys it is willingly or for long going to give up that newfound flexibility now that they know it is possible. So basically you have a critical mass of people in every white collar industry who don't want to go back to the office. Most RTO efforts have fizzled out after a few weeks or months. I think that is likely to continue, because there are just so many people who like WFH. It's just the way it's going to be. Do not stand against the wind...
At least one poster is honest. They want WFH because they like it. Period. They like it. All the other arguments are excuses for this real one. Now, why do they like it? That’s another can of worms. Believe me, it’s not about productivity.
I'm the PP. I can tell you why I like it. Flexibility, lack of office politics, no commute, can have lunch with my kid at her school over my own lunch break, can make my own lunch at home, can take a 10 min break to walk the dog...still get all my work done with excellence, advising my clients and serving my country.
Great! Would you be willing to take a 20% paycut so that your in-office peers clear the same money you do with all that convenience and lower cost?
Now wait a second. I am using my own computer at home, which I have to upgrade regularly and I probably wouldnt even have a computer without working from home and I certainly would not upgrade it because of wear and tear. I have to pay for virus protection and upgraded internet. I have to use my cell phone for work and its a separate app that transfers my call from my office line to my cell phone. I pay for the desk, chair, printer, papers, pens, multiple monitors, etc. There's no workers comp coverage for me if I fall or slip or X happens at work because I am not in the building and therefore a liability. There's more continuity with coverage since I dont have to take off a whole day for school or daycare being closed or late opening or early dismissal. I am not late for meetings due to traffic. I can continue working through any early closures due to rain, snow, etc. I am not drinking coffee or using the fridges or have every appliance/tablet/phone plugged in with lights on all day long. Lets not even discuss long-term insurance costs for remote vs office workers.
I am using my own computer at home, which I have to upgrade regularly and I probably wouldnt even have a computer without working from home and I certainly would not upgrade it because of wear and tear. I have to pay for virus protection and upgraded internet. I don't believe you are a fed! What agency? We are not allowed to use our own computers or our own virus protection.
I have to use my cell phone for work and its a separate app that transfers my call from my office line to my cell phone. We aren't supposed to be using cell phones. We use VOIP that work pays for.
I pay for the desk, chair, printer, papers, pens, multiple monitors, etc. Work provides a monitor. If you like to print stuff nonstop, then yes, that's on you. My entire agency has banned outside printers from connecting to agency computers, so I'm not sure how you're printing?
There's no workers comp coverage for me if I fall or slip or X happens at work because I am not in the building and therefore a liability. You're wrong. You can be eligible for workers comp. It says so in our Remote work FAQs
I'm continually surprised by the people who don't grasp that each agency does this differently. Lots of agencies have you use personal cell phones, buy your own monitor, etc. Others provide printers and chairs. There is no one approach.
OK which agency lets you use your own computer? And let's you use your own virus software?
Our agency has a whole rollout of RTO planned, SES and politicals after Labor Day, then supervisors by mid October, the masses are back at least 5 days a pay period before the end of the year. It’s happening
Anonymous wrote:RTO is going to cause some agencies to hemorrhage decent young-ish employees. One day a week already led to us losing a few attorneys for the private sector. They can’t afford to live close in and as soon as they have kids they can’t manage a commute that’s an hour plus. I’m in a weird boat where my spouse makes a lot of money so we live close in but has garbage health insurance which doesn’t work because one of our kids is SN.
+1. Some of the posters are delusional about how much it costs to live reasonably close in with kids, where there is access to safe public schools and housing. I bought my house in 2013 and prices have since skyrocketed, and I still had nearly an hour commute downtown from within Fairfax County. Why would I want to spend nearly 1.5 - 2 hours a day commuting when I could spend that time with my family, driving kids to activities, exercising, cooking a healthy meal, etc. Life is too short to waste it in a car to spend 8 hours in the office on Teams meetings. Furthermore, I am a Federal manager and most of my younger, hard-working staff all want telework - for the exact reasons I do, so they can balance their careers and home life. I don’t want to lose them and I certainly don’t want to force them in the office more. Our work is computer based and can be completed effectively from home. I also have staff more willing to work on an issue later in the day or earlier in the morning when they’re home. Staff is flexible and more engaged in the work because they have a manager who is flexible regarding where they do the work. For computer based work, RTO is not the answer. The genie is out of the bottle and it’s not going back.
I understand but has this all changed dramatically in the last 3 years since the pandemic started? My whole office used to commute 4 days a week deal with traffic or public transportation, figure out kids activities, etc and now just doing what they used to do is intolerable? I get that we had a few years with more flexibility but we're being asked to do what everyone did for decades and suddenly that's too hard and everyone will quit?
No, it’s that in the past three years, people discovered that by working from home, we can balance work and family demands much more easily. We used to also have no child labor laws. Should we go back to that?
And why should govt care about that? It's your personal choice/life isn't it?
NP. Because it's like putting toothpaste back in the tube. No one who enjoys it is willingly or for long going to give up that newfound flexibility now that they know it is possible. So basically you have a critical mass of people in every white collar industry who don't want to go back to the office. Most RTO efforts have fizzled out after a few weeks or months. I think that is likely to continue, because there are just so many people who like WFH. It's just the way it's going to be. Do not stand against the wind...
At least one poster is honest. They want WFH because they like it. Period. They like it. All the other arguments are excuses for this real one. Now, why do they like it? That’s another can of worms. Believe me, it’s not about productivity.
I'm the PP. I can tell you why I like it. Flexibility, lack of office politics, no commute, can have lunch with my kid at her school over my own lunch break, can make my own lunch at home, can take a 10 min break to walk the dog...still get all my work done with excellence, advising my clients and serving my country.
Great! Would you be willing to take a 20% paycut so that your in-office peers clear the same money you do with all that convenience and lower cost?
Now wait a second. I am using my own computer at home, which I have to upgrade regularly and I probably wouldnt even have a computer without working from home and I certainly would not upgrade it because of wear and tear. I have to pay for virus protection and upgraded internet. I have to use my cell phone for work and its a separate app that transfers my call from my office line to my cell phone. I pay for the desk, chair, printer, papers, pens, multiple monitors, etc. There's no workers comp coverage for me if I fall or slip or X happens at work because I am not in the building and therefore a liability. There's more continuity with coverage since I dont have to take off a whole day for school or daycare being closed or late opening or early dismissal. I am not late for meetings due to traffic. I can continue working through any early closures due to rain, snow, etc. I am not drinking coffee or using the fridges or have every appliance/tablet/phone plugged in with lights on all day long. Lets not even discuss long-term insurance costs for remote vs office workers.
I am using my own computer at home, which I have to upgrade regularly and I probably wouldnt even have a computer without working from home and I certainly would not upgrade it because of wear and tear. I have to pay for virus protection and upgraded internet. I don't believe you are a fed! What agency? We are not allowed to use our own computers or our own virus protection.
I have to use my cell phone for work and its a separate app that transfers my call from my office line to my cell phone. We aren't supposed to be using cell phones. We use VOIP that work pays for.
I pay for the desk, chair, printer, papers, pens, multiple monitors, etc. Work provides a monitor. If you like to print stuff nonstop, then yes, that's on you. My entire agency has banned outside printers from connecting to agency computers, so I'm not sure how you're printing?
There's no workers comp coverage for me if I fall or slip or X happens at work because I am not in the building and therefore a liability. You're wrong. You can be eligible for workers comp. It says so in our Remote work FAQs
Contractor. Didnt realize non-feds couldnt comment on RTO considering that the fed does set the base for lots of labor issues.
Anonymous wrote:Our agency has a whole rollout of RTO planned, SES and politicals after Labor Day, then supervisors by mid October, the masses are back at least 5 days a pay period before the end of the year. It’s happening
5 days per pay period isn’t terrible. We were only allowed WFH once a week before the pandemic.
Anonymous wrote:RTO is going to cause some agencies to hemorrhage decent young-ish employees. One day a week already led to us losing a few attorneys for the private sector. They can’t afford to live close in and as soon as they have kids they can’t manage a commute that’s an hour plus. I’m in a weird boat where my spouse makes a lot of money so we live close in but has garbage health insurance which doesn’t work because one of our kids is SN.
+1. Some of the posters are delusional about how much it costs to live reasonably close in with kids, where there is access to safe public schools and housing. I bought my house in 2013 and prices have since skyrocketed, and I still had nearly an hour commute downtown from within Fairfax County. Why would I want to spend nearly 1.5 - 2 hours a day commuting when I could spend that time with my family, driving kids to activities, exercising, cooking a healthy meal, etc. Life is too short to waste it in a car to spend 8 hours in the office on Teams meetings. Furthermore, I am a Federal manager and most of my younger, hard-working staff all want telework - for the exact reasons I do, so they can balance their careers and home life. I don’t want to lose them and I certainly don’t want to force them in the office more. Our work is computer based and can be completed effectively from home. I also have staff more willing to work on an issue later in the day or earlier in the morning when they’re home. Staff is flexible and more engaged in the work because they have a manager who is flexible regarding where they do the work. For computer based work, RTO is not the answer. The genie is out of the bottle and it’s not going back.
I understand but has this all changed dramatically in the last 3 years since the pandemic started? My whole office used to commute 4 days a week deal with traffic or public transportation, figure out kids activities, etc and now just doing what they used to do is intolerable? I get that we had a few years with more flexibility but we're being asked to do what everyone did for decades and suddenly that's too hard and everyone will quit?
No, it’s that in the past three years, people discovered that by working from home, we can balance work and family demands much more easily. We used to also have no child labor laws. Should we go back to that?
And why should govt care about that? It's your personal choice/life isn't it?
NP. Because it's like putting toothpaste back in the tube. No one who enjoys it is willingly or for long going to give up that newfound flexibility now that they know it is possible. So basically you have a critical mass of people in every white collar industry who don't want to go back to the office. Most RTO efforts have fizzled out after a few weeks or months. I think that is likely to continue, because there are just so many people who like WFH. It's just the way it's going to be. Do not stand against the wind...
Don't assume Govt will try to put it back. Getting a new one is always an option (i.e., let those who want to leave, leave).
Problem with that is the number of people who like to WFH. Sure there will be efforts to RTO, but I believe over the long term they will all fizzle. Because sooner or later people rebel, find ways to make exceptions, change policies, etc. It's human nature.
At my agency they are starting to log PIV card badge swipes when we enter and match those to when people say they were in the office, which should catch most of the fraud that happens when people don’t really RTO. Will be interesting to see what happens when the start getting really serious about this.
Our whole office comes in on the same day and we have staff meeting so people can’t wiggle out of coming in.
Anonymous wrote:Our agency has a whole rollout of RTO planned, SES and politicals after Labor Day, then supervisors by mid October, the masses are back at least 5 days a pay period before the end of the year. It’s happening
For the vast vast majority of us masses 2 days/pp is most likely. In other words, “Not gonna happen.”
Anonymous wrote:RTO is going to cause some agencies to hemorrhage decent young-ish employees. One day a week already led to us losing a few attorneys for the private sector. They can’t afford to live close in and as soon as they have kids they can’t manage a commute that’s an hour plus. I’m in a weird boat where my spouse makes a lot of money so we live close in but has garbage health insurance which doesn’t work because one of our kids is SN.
+1. Some of the posters are delusional about how much it costs to live reasonably close in with kids, where there is access to safe public schools and housing. I bought my house in 2013 and prices have since skyrocketed, and I still had nearly an hour commute downtown from within Fairfax County. Why would I want to spend nearly 1.5 - 2 hours a day commuting when I could spend that time with my family, driving kids to activities, exercising, cooking a healthy meal, etc. Life is too short to waste it in a car to spend 8 hours in the office on Teams meetings. Furthermore, I am a Federal manager and most of my younger, hard-working staff all want telework - for the exact reasons I do, so they can balance their careers and home life. I don’t want to lose them and I certainly don’t want to force them in the office more. Our work is computer based and can be completed effectively from home. I also have staff more willing to work on an issue later in the day or earlier in the morning when they’re home. Staff is flexible and more engaged in the work because they have a manager who is flexible regarding where they do the work. For computer based work, RTO is not the answer. The genie is out of the bottle and it’s not going back.
I understand but has this all changed dramatically in the last 3 years since the pandemic started? My whole office used to commute 4 days a week deal with traffic or public transportation, figure out kids activities, etc and now just doing what they used to do is intolerable? I get that we had a few years with more flexibility but we're being asked to do what everyone did for decades and suddenly that's too hard and everyone will quit?
No, it’s that in the past three years, people discovered that by working from home, we can balance work and family demands much more easily. We used to also have no child labor laws. Should we go back to that?
And why should govt care about that? It's your personal choice/life isn't it?
NP. Because it's like putting toothpaste back in the tube. No one who enjoys it is willingly or for long going to give up that newfound flexibility now that they know it is possible. So basically you have a critical mass of people in every white collar industry who don't want to go back to the office. Most RTO efforts have fizzled out after a few weeks or months. I think that is likely to continue, because there are just so many people who like WFH. It's just the way it's going to be. Do not stand against the wind...
At least one poster is honest. They want WFH because they like it. Period. They like it. All the other arguments are excuses for this real one. Now, why do they like it? That’s another can of worms. Believe me, it’s not about productivity.
I'm the PP. I can tell you why I like it. Flexibility, lack of office politics, no commute, can have lunch with my kid at her school over my own lunch break, can make my own lunch at home, can take a 10 min break to walk the dog...still get all my work done with excellence, advising my clients and serving my country.
Great! Would you be willing to take a 20% paycut so that your in-office peers clear the same money you do with all that convenience and lower cost?
Now wait a second. I am using my own computer at home, which I have to upgrade regularly and I probably wouldnt even have a computer without working from home and I certainly would not upgrade it because of wear and tear. I have to pay for virus protection and upgraded internet. I have to use my cell phone for work and its a separate app that transfers my call from my office line to my cell phone. I pay for the desk, chair, printer, papers, pens, multiple monitors, etc. There's no workers comp coverage for me if I fall or slip or X happens at work because I am not in the building and therefore a liability. There's more continuity with coverage since I dont have to take off a whole day for school or daycare being closed or late opening or early dismissal. I am not late for meetings due to traffic. I can continue working through any early closures due to rain, snow, etc. I am not drinking coffee or using the fridges or have every appliance/tablet/phone plugged in with lights on all day long. Lets not even discuss long-term insurance costs for remote vs office workers.
I am using my own computer at home, which I have to upgrade regularly and I probably wouldnt even have a computer without working from home and I certainly would not upgrade it because of wear and tear. I have to pay for virus protection and upgraded internet. I don't believe you are a fed! What agency? We are not allowed to use our own computers or our own virus protection.
I have to use my cell phone for work and its a separate app that transfers my call from my office line to my cell phone. We aren't supposed to be using cell phones. We use VOIP that work pays for.
I pay for the desk, chair, printer, papers, pens, multiple monitors, etc. Work provides a monitor. If you like to print stuff nonstop, then yes, that's on you. My entire agency has banned outside printers from connecting to agency computers, so I'm not sure how you're printing?
There's no workers comp coverage for me if I fall or slip or X happens at work because I am not in the building and therefore a liability. You're wrong. You can be eligible for workers comp. It says so in our Remote work FAQs
I'm continually surprised by the people who don't grasp that each agency does this differently. Lots of agencies have you use personal cell phones, buy your own monitor, etc. Others provide printers and chairs. There is no one approach.
OK which agency lets you use your own computer? And let's you use your own virus software?
HUD
Big difference between using agency computer (with software/security/etc) and using agency's computer attached to your monitor/keyboard of choice. At my pretty security=conscious agency, we can attach any peripheral that doesn't have memory.
Anonymous wrote:Our agency has a whole rollout of RTO planned, SES and politicals after Labor Day, then supervisors by mid October, the masses are back at least 5 days a pay period before the end of the year. It’s happening
Anonymous wrote:Our agency has a whole rollout of RTO planned, SES and politicals after Labor Day, then supervisors by mid October, the masses are back at least 5 days a pay period before the end of the year. It’s happening
For the vast vast majority of us masses 2 days/pp is most likely. In other words, “Not gonna happen.”
We have been back 2 days/pp since last year. Are folks that are not remote still WFH 100%?
Anonymous wrote:RTO is going to cause some agencies to hemorrhage decent young-ish employees. One day a week already led to us losing a few attorneys for the private sector. They can’t afford to live close in and as soon as they have kids they can’t manage a commute that’s an hour plus. I’m in a weird boat where my spouse makes a lot of money so we live close in but has garbage health insurance which doesn’t work because one of our kids is SN.
+1. Some of the posters are delusional about how much it costs to live reasonably close in with kids, where there is access to safe public schools and housing. I bought my house in 2013 and prices have since skyrocketed, and I still had nearly an hour commute downtown from within Fairfax County. Why would I want to spend nearly 1.5 - 2 hours a day commuting when I could spend that time with my family, driving kids to activities, exercising, cooking a healthy meal, etc. Life is too short to waste it in a car to spend 8 hours in the office on Teams meetings. Furthermore, I am a Federal manager and most of my younger, hard-working staff all want telework - for the exact reasons I do, so they can balance their careers and home life. I don’t want to lose them and I certainly don’t want to force them in the office more. Our work is computer based and can be completed effectively from home. I also have staff more willing to work on an issue later in the day or earlier in the morning when they’re home. Staff is flexible and more engaged in the work because they have a manager who is flexible regarding where they do the work. For computer based work, RTO is not the answer. The genie is out of the bottle and it’s not going back.
I understand but has this all changed dramatically in the last 3 years since the pandemic started? My whole office used to commute 4 days a week deal with traffic or public transportation, figure out kids activities, etc and now just doing what they used to do is intolerable? I get that we had a few years with more flexibility but we're being asked to do what everyone did for decades and suddenly that's too hard and everyone will quit?
Houses I was looking at for 400k three years ago are now going for 700k. Federal employee pay has not increased 75%.
Most people don’t pay cash for a house. The relevant difference is the monthly payment on a 30-year mortgage of $400k vs. $700k. And, look at dollar, not percent, increase. If a stick of gum goes from 5 cents to 10, that’s a 100% increase, but it doesn’t mean your salary needs to double to afford gum.
Good thing interest rates haven't gone up! This is the dumbest post. Honestly. Going from a payment on 400k at 2.5% to 700k at 7% is way more than a 75% increase, and far far more in dollars than any fed salary increase in that time. Do the math. Don't be lazy.
That's the reason you don't want to go back in the office? Why not find another job??
My point is that it's not all people who worked in the same offices before covid not wanting to come back. I am trying to hire right now. We get more and better applications for remote jobs already. Our salaries are not sustainable for people to live a reasonable distance from work. Telework helps us attract well qualified people who can't move their families, whose partners have jobs in Richmond or Baltimore, etc. Why do you think this isn't a barrier?
Richmond and Baltimore? Sounds like you're a Fed Board manager trying to get staff from Fed Richmond branches. Fed Board salaries, bonuses, and benefits are definitely high enough to live in the DC area. What you're really saying is that if your recruits can get a DC salary and remain in Baltimore and Richmond, that's a coup. Of course it is! This has always been an issue at the Board because there is no locality pay difference. Some Fed managers are narrowly focused on hiring from the Reserve Banks, but there are plenty of qualified people in other places.
This myopic view makes me chuckle. You assume that because somebody references spouses in the two closest metro areas they must work for the Board?
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