Experience with CPS? Anyone know first-hand?

[Anonymous]

Good morning! So. I'm freaking out.

I am an elementary school teacher in the DMV. Six years ago, when I was pregnant with my son, I developed debilitating migraines. My neurologist and MFM and ob gyn consulted no fewer than 10 times, as they tried all sorts of different medications. I literally was blinded and unable to walk. Finally the mfm suggested a medication that included a narcotic in it. The neurologist approved as did the OB, and the perinatologist was the one who suggested it. I took it, they were gone. So it was prescribed for the remainder of my pregnancy. I took it very very very sparingly. I am a really boring person, haha, like I don't drink and have never smoked anything. I've never done any illegal drugs whatsoever. SO. Flash forward-

Go into labor early. Go to the hospital. Give them the bottle of medicine, along with the bottles of my thyroid medicine and vitamins. They noted what I was prescribed. I peed in a cup when I changed into the robe. They come examine. He is breech, and they order an emergency c section. and we went and he was born. All was good. Went back to our room, and was informed that because that narcotic had shown up in my urine, CPS had been notified and would be there shortly. My MFM was there, and said that he had prescribed it and was aware, approved of it, it is not contraindicated for pregnancy, on and on. It was not even thought to pass through the placenta. Sure enough, she was negative for it in her system. Nope, the nurse said she is a mandatory reporter and had already called. CPS showed up, and demanded my husband take them for a home visit at that moment. They made him go pick up our other son from his grandparents and meet at our house so they could interview him. He was one. He didn't talk. She still asked him all sorts of horrifying questions. She inspected our home, wandering slowly and checking outlets, closets...

So. She was entirely nasty to us. I was so sad and shaken - I just bawled for weeks. She kept doing surprise pop in visits and would frequently say things like "well, if you didn't CHOOSE to do drugs when you were pregnant, this wouldn't be happening" and talk about how anything that ever went wrong with my baby would be my fault. She demanded that we take the baby to the pediatrician every morning for 3 weeks after being released from the hospital to make sure he wasn't in withdrawal. Which he never was, because it was never in his system. The pediatrician was so kind and sympathetic, but. We still had to go. The CPS worker would make snide comments about how 'If I take your kids away, hope we can keep them together!' I tried to file a complaint or get a different worker, but was told no.

She gradually showed up less and less, and about a month and a half later my spouse and I each got a letter in the mail saying that the case was closed and had been ruled "unsubstantiated." What a relief.

I had absolutely terrifying, debilitating depression and anxiety after this. My therapist diagnosed me with PTSD.

I am finally doing SO much better. And.... just found out I'm pregnant again. I am TERRIFIED of this happening again. I will not touch any medication even if I'm dying this time, since the perinatologist who approved it being in the room wasn't enough for the hospital, so what will be? ..... But. Someone mentioned once that if you have a CPS report done on you in L&D, you are automatically flagged in that state to always show up as a red flag if you come back to give birth again. Is this true?

Should I try to give birth in a different state? Or at least a different hospital from where I went last time?

I was never explained this and literally didn't know it until today - but apparently 'unsubstantiated' doesn't mean we were cleared.

Their website says "At the completion of every CPS investigative response, a determination is made as to whether the reported abuse or neglect is “indicated” or “unsubstantiated” or “ruled out”. Anyone believed responsible for an “indicated” or unsubstantiated” finding of child abuse or neglect is entered into a central confidential state database that includes the names of all individuals who have been named as responsible in an indicted or unsubstantiated finding as well as a person in an unsubstantiated finding who, while not named as a person responsible, is associated with the finding. These individuals are eligible to seek an appeal of the finding."

What?!? So I am in confidential database?? What does this mean? I was still able to get a teaching job, in the public school in the same town as the hospital...

I'm terrified now

[Anonymous]

I have no insights but I am so sorry. What you experienced is horrific and awful.

[Anonymous]

How could the hospital demand you to pee in a cup when in delivery?
Can you do a home birth?

Definitely that or another state

[Anonymous]

I would hire a lawyer. Once it was established that the medication was prescribed to you, and you were using it as directed, they never should have set foot in your house.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would hire a lawyer. Once it was established that the medication was prescribed to you, and you were using it as directed, they never should have set foot in your house.

It might also be worth getting ahead of this by going to the local news (but talk to a lawyer first).

I know someone who had something similar happen because their child was injured during birth, it wasn't caught right away, and CPS became convinced the injury was child abuse alter on. It worked out but was horrible to go through. I'm sorry you're dealing with this.

[Anonymous]

I agree about a lawyer. Many companies have legal benefits where you pay a small amount and can access lawyers with discounted fees. Might be worth seeing if you can add this with open enrollment coming up, if this is a benefit you or your spouse have access to. My DH and I used it for wills and to make sure guardianship was clear for our DD and it was free aside from the fee (versus the thousands we would have had to pay out of pocket). Also, as an aside, please do make sure you have wills and guardianship established for your child. It’s a must for all parents but particularly in the case of something like this.

[Anonymous]

I used to be a CPS investigator and have investigated positive toxicity cases. I am sorry that you were treated the way you were treated. What happened to you should not have happened.

I think that the nurse who called CPS in the first place when you tested positive was in the right. It is not the job of a mandated reporter to substantiate allegations or not. It is their job to report what they learned and let CPS investigate it. I completely understand your frustration though.

I think that once your baby tested negative, realistically, that should have been the end of it. Sometimes CPS investigates things further than they need to because it's not totally clear what is going on.

Whenever I was assigned a case like this, I was required to track down all the children of the mother in question, whether they were in her custody or not, and either confirm that they were not in her custody legally (with court documentation to verify) or interview them to assess for risk. I was also required to do a home assessment for all open investigations to determine whether the home was safe for a child.

What was NOT required was attitude. Part of being a CPS investigator is recognizing that literally none of the people you are investigating are going to be happy to see you. Most of the investigators I worked with were good people but they took a rather dim view of the families we worked with. This is largely due to burnout and the reality that in that job, you often see the worst of people and are often not supported by their agency in ways that are helpful. I saw a lot of babies who did test positive for heroin. Once I was in the NICU with a baby I was assessing whose mom had ghosted and I stayed there and held the baby because I felt like as a human being and as a mother, someone should be there holding that baby while she was going through a terrible experience at age 72 hours. When I got back to the office, my supervisor gave me crap for spending too long assessing a nonverbal child.

As for what you should do now, I think that it is really important to talk with your doctor about your experience and ask what will happen to you at the hospital given this previous experience. If this was something that just happened to you, I would say that you should contact the child welfare agency that sent the worker to you about getting the allegation itself removed from your record. Sadly I have not heard about a situation in which the mother tested positive for a narcotic where the baby also did not test positive, so I am not sure how my agency would have handled your situation. I do know that there is a fair hearing board that can be contacted after you receive a determination, but there is usually a timeframe during which you have to do that and I suspect that it is long past for you.

In any case, I am really sorry that this happened to you. Situations like these and attitudes like the one you experienced is largely why I am in a different field now.

[Anonymous]

That nurse was wrong and should never, EVER have called CPS. OP had a prescription for a narcotic and a medical indication for taking it. If the nurse had a question, the nurse should have talked to the patient's OB before calling CPS. There was absolutely no reason to suspect drug abuse other than the positive drug screen, and there was a legitimate reason for the positive drug screen.

I'm an RN, BTW.

[Anonymous]

This is absolutely farkukte. I am so sorry that this happened to you.

OP, I want to offer a counterexample to help you feel even more strongly that you were being abused by the health care/CPS system so that you will feel bolder about confronting it on the next go-around.

I have a severe anxiety disorder. For a raft of reasons I will not go into here, my MFM, psychiatrist and I decided that maintaining me on a low dose of Klonopin during my pregnancy was part of the best course. This was all in my medical records, just like in yours. I gave birth at the hospital where the MFM practiced. I was not drug-tested. If the baby was, I wasn't told about it. We all knew what withdrawal would look like (the hospital explained it to me and the baby's dad) and we were all on the same team in watching for it. There wasn't any. CPS was not called. The pediatrician visited us in the hospital, they knew the situation, and they didn't make a fuss about it once we were discharged.

What happened to you makes me so angry.

I would definitely consult with a lawyer now--someone who works in this area and can help you figure out a proactive plan to avoid this happening again.

And I would FOR SURE find a different hospital. That may add some complexity because you might be framed as running from the people who "busted you" the first time, but I would never be able to relax or sleep or trust what was going on in that first place again.

[Anonymous]

Something similar happened to my friend who has a documented, treated mental illness. She continued to take her prescribed antidepressant during her (planned) pregnancy - without it she cannot function normally. Her OB and psych were on board. Her daughter (who is now a perfectly healthy elementary schooler, by the way) had some withdrawal symptoms after she was born. The medical team (doctors and nurses) were absolutely VILE to my friend - they accused her of being a junkie, using that exact language, and called CPS. My friend showed them what she was taking, but they didn't believe her! Long story short, my friend was cleared of all wrongdoing, continued her meds, and had a second healthy baby 2 years later - at a different hospital.

[Anonymous]

Wow, OP. I sadly have no advice for you but just want to say how sorry I am that this happened to you. That must have been very traumatic for you. I would hire a lawyer.

[Anonymous]

OP here. I have consulted with a lawyer. Given my trauma from this whole thing, we decided not to pursue anything. We debated for a while, but for now, I am past the timeframe for being able to appeal the decision. I don't think mentally it would be wise or healthy for me to attempt a civil suit, and the emotional trauma of bringing it all up again.

I cannot thank y'all enough. Thank you for being kind. I was so afraid DCUM would call be a junkie, berate me, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I used to be a CPS investigator and have investigated positive toxicity cases. I am sorry that you were treated the way you were treated. What happened to you should not have happened.

I think that the nurse who called CPS in the first place when you tested positive was in the right. It is not the job of a mandated reporter to substantiate allegations or not. It is their job to report what they learned and let CPS investigate it. I completely understand your frustration though.

I think that once your baby tested negative, realistically, that should have been the end of it. Sometimes CPS investigates things further than they need to because it's not totally clear what is going on.

Whenever I was assigned a case like this, I was required to track down all the children of the mother in question, whether they were in her custody or not, and either confirm that they were not in her custody legally (with court documentation to verify) or interview them to assess for risk. I was also required to do a home assessment for all open investigations to determine whether the home was safe for a child.

What was NOT required was attitude. Part of being a CPS investigator is recognizing that literally none of the people you are investigating are going to be happy to see you. Most of the investigators I worked with were good people but they took a rather dim view of the families we worked with. This is largely due to burnout and the reality that in that job, you often see the worst of people and are often not supported by their agency in ways that are helpful. I saw a lot of babies who did test positive for heroin. Once I was in the NICU with a baby I was assessing whose mom had ghosted and I stayed there and held the baby because I felt like as a human being and as a mother, someone should be there holding that baby while she was going through a terrible experience at age 72 hours. When I got back to the office, my supervisor gave me crap for spending too long assessing a nonverbal child.

As for what you should do now, I think that it is really important to talk with your doctor about your experience and ask what will happen to you at the hospital given this previous experience. If this was something that just happened to you, I would say that you should contact the child welfare agency that sent the worker to you about getting the allegation itself removed from your record. Sadly I have not heard about a situation in which the mother tested positive for a narcotic where the baby also did not test positive, so I am not sure how my agency would have handled your situation. I do know that there is a fair hearing board that can be contacted after you receive a determination, but there is usually a timeframe during which you have to do that and I suspect that it is long past for you.

In any case, I am really sorry that this happened to you. Situations like these and attitudes like the one you experienced is largely why I am in a different field now.

No, the nurse who reported her was NOT in the right. This was a prescribed medication, taken under supervision of an MFM and OB, who were still active in this woman's care. There was ZERO reason to suspect abuse. The call never should have been placed, and the hospital should put safeguards in place to ensure that something like this never happens again. I mean, narcotics are administered IN LABOR - are you going to call CPS for that as well?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I have consulted with a lawyer. Given my trauma from this whole thing, we decided not to pursue anything. We debated for a while, but for now, I am past the timeframe for being able to appeal the decision. I don't think mentally it would be wise or healthy for me to attempt a civil suit, and the emotional trauma of bringing it all up again.

I cannot thank y'all enough. Thank you for being kind. I was so afraid DCUM would call be a junkie, berate me, etc.

Former CPS worker here.

OP, I don't think that suing would do any good for you. It might be worth inquiring about what the policy would be for an automatic report based on your history. Do you trust your OB enough to ask them? In your case, I absolutely would.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I have consulted with a lawyer. Given my trauma from this whole thing, we decided not to pursue anything. We debated for a while, but for now, I am past the timeframe for being able to appeal the decision. I don't think mentally it would be wise or healthy for me to attempt a civil suit, and the emotional trauma of bringing it all up again.

I cannot thank y'all enough. Thank you for being kind. I was so afraid DCUM would call be a junkie, berate me, etc.

It will all be ok! I suggested the lawyer not for a suit against CPS and the prior hospital, but about your current rights. And you might feel better if you have someone on call in case any of this gets dredged up again.