Sidwell College Admissions This Year

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m lost as to what the CCO has to do with your child not getting into college.
I assume Sidwell parents are highly educated and capable of researching college admissions.

Did you feel out the common app with your child and honestly believe some magic was happening that you weren’t involved in that guaranteed their admission to every college they applied for?
Because, I’m thinking if you didn’t have the power to wil your child into Brown, the CCO sure didn’t either.

The role of a good CCO is to provide real advice and counseling, based on their knowledge of the student and also their knowledge and perspective as an inside expert at the school who has insight into all aspects of Sidwell's college placement process--an insight that parents, by definition, cannot and do not have on their own. Sidwell's CCO does not provide any of that meaningful advice and counseling.

Of course they're not going to will anyone's kid into a particular school. But there is a huge chasm between that absurd strawman you have created, and a CCO that is just pushing paper and making sure that deadlines are met (which is about all that Sidwell's office actually does).

They do this. It's just that many parents apparently don't want to or aren't willing to listen to what they are trying to tell you. and then fast forward a few months an you get a thread like this

No, they did not and do not do this. At least, our counselor did not. And it has already been discussed that there is a huge variance among the four counselors as to what they do. Also, I don’t know what you are talking about when you say “fast forward a few months.” Lots of parents have been consistently pointing out for months that the CCO is terrible and does not provide any advice or counseling. And before you accuse me of some sort of sour grapes complaining, let me tell you that my kid got in to their #1 choice. That was no thanks to the CCO though.

Last point: if the CCO is so great, why is the conventional wisdom among upper school parents that you need to hire a private counselor? I can’t even count how many 9th-11th grade parents there are who have told me that they have been advised this by parents of older kids or recent graduates.

I'm going to need an example of what you expected. As in, Larla goes into the office with you and hubby. She has a 3.7 at the end of the last trimester of her junior year. She's looking at the admissions process ahead. You and your hubby explain she wants to study chemistry in college and both you and hubby graduated from MIT.

What are your expectations of this CCO? Someone educate the parents of lesser private schools who don't have someone in this role.

I am the PP you are responding to. I’ll answer your question as best I can without outing myself/my kid, but first a couple points: as I stated, my kid got into their #1 choice and so this is not sour grapes about the result, which our kid and we are very happy about. We don’t attribute this result to any efforts or help at counseling or advising from the CCO as in our experience there was not any provided. I am commenting here because I feel the school has let down its students and I am hoping that, given our kid’s own results, some might see my views as more of an objective observation and less personal venting and expressing disappointment.

So, what are my expectations of the CCO? I believe that the CCO should provide individualized advice and counseling to each student, based on (1) the school’s knowledge of the kid, and (2) the CCO’s institutional insight, knowledge and experience with specific colleges as far as both prospects of admission and fit for a particular kid. This should include realistic handicapping and advice of admission chances at particular schools. Also, to be clear, I’m not just focused on reaches and the most elite colleges in this context, as in my view the individualized counseling can and should include advice and counseling about how to identify safeties that are good fits, and admission strategies for them as well. I also believe that the CCO should get to know a kid sufficiently well that the counselor can write a good and meaningful school letter. Obviously we never see the letter as parents, but it is pretty easy to tell from the meetings whether the counselor knows and “gets” your kid, or not.

In my experience with my kid, we got none of this from Sidwell. I can’t give you more specifics without potentially identify us/our kid, but I would summarize that among other things our kid’s counselor obviously never read/remembered the detailed questionnaires that our kid and we completed, would never give any assessment of how kids from Sidwell with records similar to our kid have fared historically in admissions at particular schools our kid was considering (even with the obvious qualifier that there are no sure things in this admissions climate), and suggested considering specific safeties that were fundamentally incompatible with our kid’s specified preferences and priorities as if they were just pulled from the CCO’s boilerplate list.

So to your hypothetical about the MIT alum parents, what I would hope for from the CCO in that kind of circumstance is that first of all the counselor knows before the meeting (from reading the questionnaires that we and Larla filled out) that we are MIT alums and that Larla wants to study chemistry and has a very strong but not off-the-charts academic record (3.7 is really good at Sidwell). And that the counselor is prepared to explain that Larla has essentially no chance at admission to MIT based on her record and Sidwell’s track record there, and here are some schools to consider that are considered to have strong chemistry programs, along with an assessment of how Sidwell kids with a 3.7 and in the advanced math and science tracks (I am making an assumption here) have fared in admissions at these colleges over the past few years, with the qualifier that the post-COVID admissions climate is very unpredictable and there are no sure things. Based on our experience, the CCO would not have done any of that.

My kid got all of that from the Sidwell CCO.

Your kid got into their ED, so there was little to no reason for your familiy to have have contact with the CCO after November 1, or whenever your kid got their application in. For the rest of us, they did exactly what you outlined.

I honestly have no idea what you are arguing or complaining about.

It has been pretty clearly established that there is a wide variance among the four counselors’ practices. You don’t know what conversations we and our kid had with our counselor, but I can tell you definitively that our kid’s counselor never did any of the things that I outlined. I have had discussions with several other parents of seniors who had the same experience as us. And none of this has anything to do with whether my kid got in to their #1 choice (I never said that my kid got in ED).

then the solution is to calibrate what the staff is telling the students and families across the board so that everyone is getting the same message. But clearly some families got it loud and clear and others didn't. That DOES fall on the CCO to fix.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parent of a high stats kid from another private school...our college counselors made it very, very clear that all bets are off for ANY college with acceptance rates <20%. Those schools cannot be counted on for any kid. They insisted that kids have at least 3 schools with acceptance rates over 50% and at least one had to have an acceptance rate over 60%. Other than that, kids were strongly encouraged to find at least 5-6 schools in the 20-50 percent range that they could really be happy at.

This seemed to work well when the advice was followed...the ones that ended up unhappy are those who disregarded the advice and just put in a couple of safeties and shotgun 20 plus applications for schools with <15% acceptance rates. These kids and their parents are now blaming the counselor for not doing more.

I'm not saying that is what is going on at Sidwell but it is certainly the case that people are upset that the process/outcomes were different that what they were 4-5 years ago and they didn't want to hear it.

This post should be pinned and mandatory reading for every current junior and sophomore high school family. Thank you.

I think this approach is a great one on paper. However, the schools that accept over 50% of applicants are not the schools that these kids or their parents are excited to attend. Not many of these parents want their kid going to Auburn. Oh wait, Auburn isn’t a good example since their admission rate dropped to 24% this year! What is a school with a 50% admit rate that these high achieving, 34 ACT kids are excited to attend? It is really hard to find one.

University of Vermont (if they like small cities), Pitt (if they want larger cities), Penn State (if they want football), Muhlenberg (if they prefer SLACs)...there are thousands of colleges in this country. The point is that people need to think beyond the 50 that USNews has deemed "best" to what is acceptable.

It is not fair to expect folks to be happy to go to Vermont and such after an elite education like at Sidwell.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parent of a high stats kid from another private school...our college counselors made it very, very clear that all bets are off for ANY college with acceptance rates <20%. Those schools cannot be counted on for any kid. They insisted that kids have at least 3 schools with acceptance rates over 50% and at least one had to have an acceptance rate over 60%. Other than that, kids were strongly encouraged to find at least 5-6 schools in the 20-50 percent range that they could really be happy at.

This seemed to work well when the advice was followed...the ones that ended up unhappy are those who disregarded the advice and just put in a couple of safeties and shotgun 20 plus applications for schools with <15% acceptance rates. These kids and their parents are now blaming the counselor for not doing more.

I'm not saying that is what is going on at Sidwell but it is certainly the case that people are upset that the process/outcomes were different that what they were 4-5 years ago and they didn't want to hear it.

This post should be pinned and mandatory reading for every current junior and sophomore high school family. Thank you.

I think this approach is a great one on paper. However, the schools that accept over 50% of applicants are not the schools that these kids or their parents are excited to attend. Not many of these parents want their kid going to Auburn. Oh wait, Auburn isn’t a good example since their admission rate dropped to 24% this year! What is a school with a 50% admit rate that these high achieving, 34 ACT kids are excited to attend? It is really hard to find one.

University of Vermont (if they like small cities), Pitt (if they want larger cities), Penn State (if they want football), Muhlenberg (if they prefer SLACs)...there are thousands of colleges in this country. The point is that people need to think beyond the 50 that USNews has deemed "best" to what is acceptable.

It is not fair to expect folks to be happy to go to Vermont and such after an elite education like at Sidwell.

Too bad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parent of a high stats kid from another private school...our college counselors made it very, very clear that all bets are off for ANY college with acceptance rates <20%. Those schools cannot be counted on for any kid. They insisted that kids have at least 3 schools with acceptance rates over 50% and at least one had to have an acceptance rate over 60%. Other than that, kids were strongly encouraged to find at least 5-6 schools in the 20-50 percent range that they could really be happy at.

This seemed to work well when the advice was followed...the ones that ended up unhappy are those who disregarded the advice and just put in a couple of safeties and shotgun 20 plus applications for schools with <15% acceptance rates. These kids and their parents are now blaming the counselor for not doing more.

I'm not saying that is what is going on at Sidwell but it is certainly the case that people are upset that the process/outcomes were different that what they were 4-5 years ago and they didn't want to hear it.

This post should be pinned and mandatory reading for every current junior and sophomore high school family. Thank you.

I think this approach is a great one on paper. However, the schools that accept over 50% of applicants are not the schools that these kids or their parents are excited to attend. Not many of these parents want their kid going to Auburn. Oh wait, Auburn isn’t a good example since their admission rate dropped to 24% this year! What is a school with a 50% admit rate that these high achieving, 34 ACT kids are excited to attend? It is really hard to find one.

University of Vermont (if they like small cities), Pitt (if they want larger cities), Penn State (if they want football), Muhlenberg (if they prefer SLACs)...there are thousands of colleges in this country. The point is that people need to think beyond the 50 that USNews has deemed "best" to what is acceptable.

It is not fair to expect folks to be happy to go to Vermont and such after an elite education like at Sidwell.

Talk about first world problems. The kid at Sidwell will probably graduate with no student loan debt, will have extended family who can guide them to professional jobs, and will be able to go on study abroad and the like.

Frankly, kids from elite private high schools don’t need what elite universities offer. They will not benefit from it as much as a poorer kid will.

[Anonymous]

No excuses for the CCO, but many kids had expensive private counselors who also expected the Sidwell reputation for excellence and rigor to deliver better outcomes for students.

The CCO repeatedly made it clear there is no "Sidwell bump" in admissions, but the apparent "Sidwell drag" has surprised many of us.

This didn't happen to similarly situatied kids at GDS, STA or Maret. What happened here?

[Anonymous]

This is a hard message to deliver and I apologize in advance. A 3.7 just isn’t all that compelling and neither is a 34 ACT relatively speaking for top 15 universities even coming from a great school like Sidwell. If your kid isn’t a NMF and/or Presidential Scholar candidate and done some substantive internships or academic research outside of school, and hit > 3.9 overall GPA having taken the Math I — Math IV sequence plus all the accelerated 1A sciences plus four years of language, plus a >1560 SAT or 35/36 ACT, you really don’t get on the radar screen of the top 15 schools. Exception is the hooked kids — namely athletes, legacies and URM, but a couple of those hooked kids have the former qualifications, too, making them spectacularly attractive applicants. These schools really know Sidwell and for example understand that a solid A from Math III is a pretty powerful academic signal. I just cannot sit by and continue to watch the Sidwell CCO get trashed the way it is by some folks on this forum. In the aggregate, they are doing a good job in a very challenging and competitive environment. The reality is, putting aside the “branding” element, the top 30 - 50 schools offer a great education. Sidwell parent of senior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a hard message to deliver and I apologize in advance. A 3.7 just isn’t all that compelling and neither is a 34 ACT relatively speaking for top 15 universities even coming from a great school like Sidwell. If your kid isn’t a NMF and/or Presidential Scholar candidate and done some substantive internships or academic research outside of school, and hit > 3.9 overall GPA having taken the Math I — Math IV sequence plus all the accelerated 1A sciences plus four years of language, plus a >1560 SAT or 35/36 ACT, you really don’t get on the radar screen of the top 15 schools. Exception is the hooked kids — namely athletes, legacies and URM, but a couple of those hooked kids have the former qualifications, too, making them spectacularly attractive applicants. These schools really know Sidwell and for example understand that a solid A from Math III is a pretty powerful academic signal. I just cannot sit by and continue to watch the Sidwell CCO get trashed the way it is by some folks on this forum. In the aggregate, they are doing a good job in a very challenging and competitive environment. The reality is, putting aside the “branding” element, the top 30 - 50 schools offer a great education. Sidwell parent of senior.

This is a bizarre expectation of any high school student, regardless of what high school they attend. My college student hasn’t had either of those yet, and not for lack of trying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a hard message to deliver and I apologize in advance. A 3.7 just isn’t all that compelling and neither is a 34 ACT relatively speaking for top 15 universities even coming from a great school like Sidwell. If your kid isn’t a NMF and/or Presidential Scholar candidate and done some substantive internships or academic research outside of school, and hit > 3.9 overall GPA having taken the Math I — Math IV sequence plus all the accelerated 1A sciences plus four years of language, plus a >1560 SAT or 35/36 ACT, you really don’t get on the radar screen of the top 15 schools. Exception is the hooked kids — namely athletes, legacies and URM, but a couple of those hooked kids have the former qualifications, too, making them spectacularly attractive applicants. These schools really know Sidwell and for example understand that a solid A from Math III is a pretty powerful academic signal. I just cannot sit by and continue to watch the Sidwell CCO get trashed the way it is by some folks on this forum. In the aggregate, they are doing a good job in a very challenging and competitive environment. The reality is, putting aside the “branding” element, the top 30 - 50 schools offer a great education. Sidwell parent of senior.

Ah yes! Let's all remember and support the Sidwell CCO and the Sidwell parents! They suffer!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m lost as to what the CCO has to do with your child not getting into college.
I assume Sidwell parents are highly educated and capable of researching college admissions.

Did you feel out the common app with your child and honestly believe some magic was happening that you weren’t involved in that guaranteed their admission to every college they applied for?
Because, I’m thinking if you didn’t have the power to wil your child into Brown, the CCO sure didn’t either.

The role of a good CCO is to provide real advice and counseling, based on their knowledge of the student and also their knowledge and perspective as an inside expert at the school who has insight into all aspects of Sidwell's college placement process--an insight that parents, by definition, cannot and do not have on their own. Sidwell's CCO does not provide any of that meaningful advice and counseling.

Of course they're not going to will anyone's kid into a particular school. But there is a huge chasm between that absurd strawman you have created, and a CCO that is just pushing paper and making sure that deadlines are met (which is about all that Sidwell's office actually does).

They do this. It's just that many parents apparently don't want to or aren't willing to listen to what they are trying to tell you. and then fast forward a few months an you get a thread like this

No, they did not and do not do this. At least, our counselor did not. And it has already been discussed that there is a huge variance among the four counselors as to what they do. Also, I don’t know what you are talking about when you say “fast forward a few months.” Lots of parents have been consistently pointing out for months that the CCO is terrible and does not provide any advice or counseling. And before you accuse me of some sort of sour grapes complaining, let me tell you that my kid got in to their #1 choice. That was no thanks to the CCO though.

Last point: if the CCO is so great, why is the conventional wisdom among upper school parents that you need to hire a private counselor? I can’t even count how many 9th-11th grade parents there are who have told me that they have been advised this by parents of older kids or recent graduates.

Because they are extremely misguided in believing that these private counselors will "do something" to get their kids into the top schools, over and above what the CCO can and will do. And I'm here to tell you: You might as well start a bonfire with the money going to this private counselor, if that is your reason for hiring one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m lost as to what the CCO has to do with your child not getting into college.
I assume Sidwell parents are highly educated and capable of researching college admissions.

Did you feel out the common app with your child and honestly believe some magic was happening that you weren’t involved in that guaranteed their admission to every college they applied for?
Because, I’m thinking if you didn’t have the power to wil your child into Brown, the CCO sure didn’t either.

The role of a good CCO is to provide real advice and counseling, based on their knowledge of the student and also their knowledge and perspective as an inside expert at the school who has insight into all aspects of Sidwell's college placement process--an insight that parents, by definition, cannot and do not have on their own. Sidwell's CCO does not provide any of that meaningful advice and counseling.

Of course they're not going to will anyone's kid into a particular school. But there is a huge chasm between that absurd strawman you have created, and a CCO that is just pushing paper and making sure that deadlines are met (which is about all that Sidwell's office actually does).

They do this. It's just that many parents apparently don't want to or aren't willing to listen to what they are trying to tell you. and then fast forward a few months an you get a thread like this

No, they did not and do not do this. At least, our counselor did not. And it has already been discussed that there is a huge variance among the four counselors as to what they do. Also, I don’t know what you are talking about when you say “fast forward a few months.” Lots of parents have been consistently pointing out for months that the CCO is terrible and does not provide any advice or counseling. And before you accuse me of some sort of sour grapes complaining, let me tell you that my kid got in to their #1 choice. That was no thanks to the CCO though.

Last point: if the CCO is so great, why is the conventional wisdom among upper school parents that you need to hire a private counselor? I can’t even count how many 9th-11th grade parents there are who have told me that they have been advised this by parents of older kids or recent graduates.

I'm going to need an example of what you expected. As in, Larla goes into the office with you and hubby. She has a 3.7 at the end of the last trimester of her junior year. She's looking at the admissions process ahead. You and your hubby explain she wants to study chemistry in college and both you and hubby graduated from MIT.

What are your expectations of this CCO? Someone educate the parents of lesser private schools who don't have someone in this role.

CCO needs to explain that MIT is a reach+ that there is a 98 percent rejection rate, so even if it is a dream school, there is a hugh probability of not being accepted. And then, work through what it is about MIT the student likes. Is it Boston? Then there are 10 other schools in Boston to consider. is it Tech? Then there are scores of other Tech schools. Is it urban? Then look at other urban schools. Find the common thread and build a list from there. Rochester, GT, VT, Rensealler, Michigan, Illinois - there are a lot of fantastic places where you can get similar.

They. Do. This.

That you and your DC did not listen is no one's fault but your own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a hard message to deliver and I apologize in advance. A 3.7 just isn’t all that compelling and neither is a 34 ACT relatively speaking for top 15 universities even coming from a great school like Sidwell. If your kid isn’t a NMF and/or Presidential Scholar candidate and done some substantive internships or academic research outside of school, and hit > 3.9 overall GPA having taken the Math I — Math IV sequence plus all the accelerated 1A sciences plus four years of language, plus a >1560 SAT or 35/36 ACT, you really don’t get on the radar screen of the top 15 schools. Exception is the hooked kids — namely athletes, legacies and URM, but a couple of those hooked kids have the former qualifications, too, making them spectacularly attractive applicants. These schools really know Sidwell and for example understand that a solid A from Math III is a pretty powerful academic signal. I just cannot sit by and continue to watch the Sidwell CCO get trashed the way it is by some folks on this forum. In the aggregate, they are doing a good job in a very challenging and competitive environment. The reality is, putting aside the “branding” element, the top 30 - 50 schools offer a great education. Sidwell parent of senior.

Completely agree with you. Another Sidwell parent of a senior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No excuses for the CCO, but many kids had expensive private counselors who also expected the Sidwell reputation for excellence and rigor to deliver better outcomes for students.

The CCO repeatedly made it clear there is no "Sidwell bump" in admissions, but the apparent "Sidwell drag" has surprised many of us.

This didn't happen to similarly situatied kids at GDS, STA or Maret. What happened here?

Oh, yes it did. I know for a fact that this year was particularly and unusually difficult for both GDS and STA. Not sure about Maret.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No excuses for the CCO, but many kids had expensive private counselors who also expected the Sidwell reputation for excellence and rigor to deliver better outcomes for students.

The CCO repeatedly made it clear there is no "Sidwell bump" in admissions, but the apparent "Sidwell drag" has surprised many of us.

This didn't happen to similarly situatied kids at GDS, STA or Maret. What happened here?

What drag? The reports from my kid so far indicate pretty normal results. Maybe not as many kids at the ivies, but if one considers other less than 20% admission rate schools to be acceptable then things are generally per usual. Maybe let's wait until all of the kids have made their decisions and people can check the instagram link and see how "woeful" it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a hard message to deliver and I apologize in advance. A 3.7 just isn’t all that compelling and neither is a 34 ACT relatively speaking for top 15 universities even coming from a great school like Sidwell. If your kid isn’t a NMF and/or Presidential Scholar candidate and done some substantive internships or academic research outside of school, and hit > 3.9 overall GPA having taken the Math I — Math IV sequence plus all the accelerated 1A sciences plus four years of language, plus a >1560 SAT or 35/36 ACT, you really don’t get on the radar screen of the top 15 schools. Exception is the hooked kids — namely athletes, legacies and URM, but a couple of those hooked kids have the former qualifications, too, making them spectacularly attractive applicants. These schools really know Sidwell and for example understand that a solid A from Math III is a pretty powerful academic signal. I just cannot sit by and continue to watch the Sidwell CCO get trashed the way it is by some folks on this forum. In the aggregate, they are doing a good job in a very challenging and competitive environment. The reality is, putting aside the “branding” element, the top 30 - 50 schools offer a great education. Sidwell parent of senior.

This is a bizarre expectation of any high school student, regardless of what high school they attend. My college student hasn’t had either of those yet, and not for lack of trying.

It is very hard for a regular kid to get those opportunities. But you have a contingent of kids whose parents are academics, doctors, researchers or C suite in Universities, who are able to access these ECs and stand out in college applications.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m lost as to what the CCO has to do with your child not getting into college.
I assume Sidwell parents are highly educated and capable of researching college admissions.

Did you feel out the common app with your child and honestly believe some magic was happening that you weren’t involved in that guaranteed their admission to every college they applied for?
Because, I’m thinking if you didn’t have the power to wil your child into Brown, the CCO sure didn’t either.

The role of a good CCO is to provide real advice and counseling, based on their knowledge of the student and also their knowledge and perspective as an inside expert at the school who has insight into all aspects of Sidwell's college placement process--an insight that parents, by definition, cannot and do not have on their own. Sidwell's CCO does not provide any of that meaningful advice and counseling.

Of course they're not going to will anyone's kid into a particular school. But there is a huge chasm between that absurd strawman you have created, and a CCO that is just pushing paper and making sure that deadlines are met (which is about all that Sidwell's office actually does).

They do this. It's just that many parents apparently don't want to or aren't willing to listen to what they are trying to tell you. and then fast forward a few months an you get a thread like this

No, they did not and do not do this. At least, our counselor did not. And it has already been discussed that there is a huge variance among the four counselors as to what they do. Also, I don’t know what you are talking about when you say “fast forward a few months.” Lots of parents have been consistently pointing out for months that the CCO is terrible and does not provide any advice or counseling. And before you accuse me of some sort of sour grapes complaining, let me tell you that my kid got in to their #1 choice. That was no thanks to the CCO though.

Last point: if the CCO is so great, why is the conventional wisdom among upper school parents that you need to hire a private counselor? I can’t even count how many 9th-11th grade parents there are who have told me that they have been advised this by parents of older kids or recent graduates.

I'm going to need an example of what you expected. As in, Larla goes into the office with you and hubby. She has a 3.7 at the end of the last trimester of her junior year. She's looking at the admissions process ahead. You and your hubby explain she wants to study chemistry in college and both you and hubby graduated from MIT.

What are your expectations of this CCO? Someone educate the parents of lesser private schools who don't have someone in this role.

CCO needs to explain that MIT is a reach+ that there is a 98 percent rejection rate, so even if it is a dream school, there is a hugh probability of not being accepted. And then, work through what it is about MIT the student likes. Is it Boston? Then there are 10 other schools in Boston to consider. is it Tech? Then there are scores of other Tech schools. Is it urban? Then look at other urban schools. Find the common thread and build a list from there. Rochester, GT, VT, Rensealler, Michigan, Illinois - there are a lot of fantastic places where you can get similar.

They. Do. This.

That you and your DC did not listen is no one's fault but your own.

DP. It has been established pretty persuasively that, at minimum, not all the counselors do this. Not sure why you are talking about fault....

If you would like to share actual facts about your DC’s experience with their particular counselor, rather than just make conclusory assertions, by all means have at it. I think many of us would love to hear how your experience differed from ours, and could be the basis for some feedback to the CCO.