Player development is a myth

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s purely Economics....Supply and Demand.

Parents strongly believe that winning is development. Hence, they look for high ranked teams with lots of wins.

Clubs/Coaches are supplying this demand by getting big, fast and athletic players to provide immediate wins and utilize kick & run tactics. Developing players takes a lot more effort and time which lots of parents comprehend so they leave.

Also, seasoned parents know that coaches don’t develop individual technical skills. Players have to learn and practice on their owner via private coaches. Team coaches works on team tactics, soccer IQ and passing.

Until parents all understand this, some coaches have not other choice then to supply immediate wins.

Totally agree with this. Especially during puberty coaches seem to like bigger players. For example, a kid in U12B was a good player and didn't have much impact on the game a year later he's the biggest kid on the field and his athleticism has taken off cause now he's bigger, stronger, faster. Though once all the kids get through puberty I imagine he'll lose that edge and return to just being a good player. Kids that hit puberty earlier definitely have an advantage in Soccer.

It's unfortunate coaches won't focus on developing technical skills. My kid's ECNL team mainly focuses on small games and passing. It's helping the team in game to move the ball and playing better as a team, but individually none of them could hang with MLS Next top talent. My kid worked out with an MLSNext team this Spring and he said all their players were very quick, athletic and had incredible technical skills where they can all dribble to get themselves out of trouble. My kid is very quick and athletic, but lacks the technical ball skills. He knows what he needs to work to get to that next level. Will probably have to get him some private coaching for him as well.

Weak coaching. Those players still probably don't know how to strike the ball correctly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“Kick and run” is played at every level. See Haaland, E.

You are nuts if you think Dortmund plays that way or he needs to do so. His vision, runs and combo passing are absolutely top of the charts. No top team plays kick and run professionally. None.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Kick and run” is played at every level. See Haaland, E.

You are nuts if you think Dortmund plays that way or he needs to do so. His vision, runs and combo passing are absolutely top of the charts. No top team plays kick and run professionally. None.

None do however I wouldn't be against it if I had the biggest strongest fastest athletes. The object is to score the most goals and a good coach wins first and develops second. Thats just common sense.

[Anonymous]

to add on always remember what beats a good defense??

A better offense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Kick and run” is played at every level. See Haaland, E.

You are nuts if you think Dortmund plays that way or he needs to do so. His vision, runs and combo passing are absolutely top of the charts. No top team plays kick and run professionally. None.

None do however I wouldn't be against it if I had the biggest strongest fastest athletes. The object is to score the most goals and a good coach wins first and develops second. Thats just common sense.

No - it's not common sense. A good coach tries to build a long-term winner and plays off short-term goals against long term ones. A youth coach on the other hand should prioritize development much higher.

The good news is that there isn't all that much of a tradeoff. Development produces winning teams fairly quickly especially with kids.

The bad news is that many coaches aren't very good at development so their teams just lose and don't develop either.

As a parent the trick is to figure out which coaches are which and stick with good ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Kick and run” is played at every level. See Haaland, E.

You are nuts if you think Dortmund plays that way or he needs to do so. His vision, runs and combo passing are absolutely top of the charts. No top team plays kick and run professionally. None.

None do however I wouldn't be against it if I had the biggest strongest fastest athletes. The object is to score the most goals and a good coach wins first and develops second. Thats just common sense.

Ah yeah, but at the pro level that doesn’t work, and at the youngest ages, these players would learn nothing. Most importantly, none of the supporting cast (read midfielders) learn how to play properly when buildout is goalie to center forward or goalie-wing-center forward. It’s garbage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Center mids are the quarterbacks of the team. They really have to be smart. It's proven their IQ is higher/faster processing speed.

Both my kids are center mids and so was I. They both have over 4.3 gpas at tough private school and barely study. I've seen some really technical kids with speed that just suck at center mid. They can't think ahead or process the field that fast

My son is a center mid, and I like to think that he's smart, but I do't think that correlates with academic GPA at all. My son has dyslexia and ADHD, and school is not his thing. He's on a high-level team, and it doesnt seem to affect him at soccer.

Its doesn't correlate. PP just needed a brag session.

[Anonymous]

Thinking fast on the sports field is not the same as being smart academically and even being smart academically has lots of variance and nuance. One thing for sure, making stark, black and white statements is not smart.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Center mids are the quarterbacks of the team. They really have to be smart. It's proven their IQ is higher/faster processing speed.

Both my kids are center mids and so was I. They both have over 4.3 gpas at tough private school and barely study. I've seen some really technical kids with speed that just suck at center mid. They can't think ahead or process the field that fast

My son is a center mid, and I like to think that he's smart, but I do't think that correlates with academic GPA at all. My son has dyslexia and ADHD, and school is not his thing. He's on a high-level team, and it doesnt seem to affect him at soccer.

Its doesn't correlate. PP just needed a brag session.

Many people with dyslexia have high visual and spatial processing abilities. Many top athletes are also dyslexic. Dyslexia has no correlation to intelligence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Kick and run” is played at every level. See Haaland, E.

You are nuts if you think Dortmund plays that way or he needs to do so. His vision, runs and combo passing are absolutely top of the charts. No top team plays kick and run professionally. None.

None do however I wouldn't be against it if I had the biggest strongest fastest athletes. The object is to score the most goals and a good coach wins first and develops second. Thats just common sense.

Ah yeah, but at the pro level that doesn’t work, and at the youngest ages, these players would learn nothing. Most importantly, none of the supporting cast (read midfielders) learn how to play properly when buildout is goalie to center forward or goalie-wing-center forward. It’s garbage.

All it takes is a once in a lifetime or generational type player to dominate at a certain position. If that happens everyone else follows trying to replicate that dominance and the trend of that position changes. Its all cycles and everyone is always chasing there trend. To say the system predicted the players you select isn't always true. There isn't a single coach in the world who would take Messi in his prime because he didn't fit the system The system is tweaked to make the talent you have successful. The most true statement in sports is told to coaches who complain. they are told "Coach what you have not what you want".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Player development =/= winning games (not necessarily, anyways). In an ideal world, a coach who does a great job of player development will send the best/most talented/most dedicated players on to bigger/better teams, so they're not doing it to win stupid EDP games. A youth coach who discourages players from moving to bigger and better teams when they have the opportunity in order to produce a good win-loss record is a poor coach. A harmful coach. No shortage of these little cults of personality centered on individual coaches. Also, player development occurs by playing against people who are bigger/faster/better. If you have a team of 15-year-old all-stars who smoke everyone else in a tournament, get them into a higher bracket, or a higher year, or a different tournament. Move the more advanced players to a higher level team. Force other players to step up and take a larger role.

2) Technical skills are a part of player development, but can't be the responsibility of the team's coach. Players have to do this on their own, and they have to do it A LOT. If you're gucci enough to hire a personal trainer, well, wow. I'm not gonna hate, but just remember that there are plenty of kids out there kicking a ball against a wall with no one looking over their shoulder.

3) Play, Play, Play. This is the best form of player development. I love how Alexandria has built futsal courts all over the place. Pickup. Play with older people and learn their techniques. Play with younger people and help teach them.

4) The goal of player development matters. It matters a lot. If the goal is to use football as an application point to a good college or even a scholarship--a perfectly valid goal--then building athleticism (the foundation of the college game), stability in teams (for a recommendation from a youth coach), and getting into more competitive leagues and tournaments (for exposure to college scouts) matter a lot. If a kid wants to be a pro, there's a whole different skill set. They need to be a self-motivator, able to play different positions, accept different coaching styles, and be ok with being the worst player on a team (hopefully temporarily).
To live by yourself, play on crappy fields, maybe not be able to communicate well with teammates, and stay motivated for ~$300/month + room & board is a lifestyle that DMV teams (and most US teams, to be fair) don't prepare kids for.

Great post, especially 1 and 2. Best mentors and coaches always encourage their protégés and players to go to better opportunities if appropriate.

+1. It’s not about ego. It’s not about the club or the coach or meaningless trophies. It’s about the kid.

+2. Great post, especially the emphasis on the fact that kids need to play to get better. Coaches need to fine ways to get all kids playing time in some way. Personally, I wish we could flip the system to eliminate the focus on teams and focus on individual development. That's part of the difference between Europe and here. In Europe, there is financial incentive to develop players, whereas here, many clubs focus on building strong teams, primarily as a way to recruit more players.

Most of the kids in the DMV are looking for a positive soccer experience where they can improve and see results, not for every team be treated like the top team of a professional club.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) Player development =/= winning games (not necessarily, anyways). In an ideal world, a coach who does a great job of player development will send the best/most talented/most dedicated players on to bigger/better teams, so they're not doing it to win stupid EDP games. A youth coach who discourages players from moving to bigger and better teams when they have the opportunity in order to produce a good win-loss record is a poor coach. A harmful coach. No shortage of these little cults of personality centered on individual coaches. Also, player development occurs by playing against people who are bigger/faster/better. If you have a team of 15-year-old all-stars who smoke everyone else in a tournament, get them into a higher bracket, or a higher year, or a different tournament. Move the more advanced players to a higher level team. Force other players to step up and take a larger role.

2) Technical skills are a part of player development, but can't be the responsibility of the team's coach. Players have to do this on their own, and they have to do it A LOT. If you're gucci enough to hire a personal trainer, well, wow. I'm not gonna hate, but just remember that there are plenty of kids out there kicking a ball against a wall with no one looking over their shoulder.

3) Play, Play, Play. This is the best form of player development. I love how Alexandria has built futsal courts all over the place. Pickup. Play with older people and learn their techniques. Play with younger people and help teach them.

4) The goal of player development matters. It matters a lot. If the goal is to use football as an application point to a good college or even a scholarship--a perfectly valid goal--then building athleticism (the foundation of the college game), stability in teams (for a recommendation from a youth coach), and getting into more competitive leagues and tournaments (for exposure to college scouts) matter a lot. If a kid wants to be a pro, there's a whole different skill set. They need to be a self-motivator, able to play different positions, accept different coaching styles, and be ok with being the worst player on a team (hopefully temporarily).
To live by yourself, play on crappy fields, maybe not be able to communicate well with teammates, and stay motivated for ~$300/month + room & board is a lifestyle that DMV teams (and most US teams, to be fair) don't prepare kids for.

Great post, especially 1 and 2. Best mentors and coaches always encourage their protégés and players to go to better opportunities if appropriate.

+1. It’s not about ego. It’s not about the club or the coach or meaningless trophies. It’s about the kid.

+2. Great post, especially the emphasis on the fact that kids need to play to get better. Coaches need to fine ways to get all kids playing time in some way. Personally, I wish we could flip the system to eliminate the focus on teams and focus on individual development. That's part of the difference between Europe and here. In Europe, there is financial incentive to develop players, whereas here, many clubs focus on building strong teams, primarily as a way to recruit more players.

Most of the kids in the DMV are looking for a positive soccer experience where they can improve and see results, not for every team be treated like the top team of a professional club.

+1 great post it has valuable content/message.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Kick and run” is played at every level. See Haaland, E.

You are nuts if you think Dortmund plays that way or he needs to do so. His vision, runs and combo passing are absolutely top of the charts. No top team plays kick and run professionally. None.

None do however I wouldn't be against it if I had the biggest strongest fastest athletes. The object is to score the most goals and a good coach wins first and develops second. Thats just common sense.

Ah yeah, but at the pro level that doesn’t work, and at the youngest ages, these players would learn nothing. Most importantly, none of the supporting cast (read midfielders) learn how to play properly when buildout is goalie to center forward or goalie-wing-center forward. It’s garbage.

All it takes is a once in a lifetime or generational type player to dominate at a certain position. If that happens everyone else follows trying to replicate that dominance and the trend of that position changes. Its all cycles and everyone is always chasing there trend. To say the system predicted the players you select isn't always true. There isn't a single coach in the world who would take Messi in his prime because he didn't fit the system The system is tweaked to make the talent you have successful. The most true statement in sports is told to coaches who complain. they are told "Coach what you have not what you want".

Look travel soccer does not coach what they have. They try to replace what they have. This is considered development. If you win that is the only thing the current parents remember. Most of the clubs have a style of play and select kids based on that style. They do not select for good soccer players but for players who fit the system. If your club is a K&R type midfield is not a priority. You do not need a classic midfield(great touch, great ball handling skills, great vision, high soccer iq, etc). You need a someone to play defense and win balls. It’s prescriptive-ball to the wings, not in the center of the field, no back passing and not a lot of touches in midfield. Messi would be a waste in that system.

I have seen “star” strikers leave a team with a good midfield to play for K&R type teams. Guess what? The player struggles because they are no longer getting the good ball to his/her feet. The good passes are replaced by hard waist high balls in the general area of the striker who now has to win the ball. I have seen non starters leave one club and become stars at another club because of style of play. If your player is technical they need other technical players around them.

Bottom line do not depend on the coach to make a place for your good player on their team. The only positions that this does not apply to are defensive backs and goalies. The other positions are style dependent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Kick and run” is played at every level. See Haaland, E.

You are nuts if you think Dortmund plays that way or he needs to do so. His vision, runs and combo passing are absolutely top of the charts. No top team plays kick and run professionally. None.

None do however I wouldn't be against it if I had the biggest strongest fastest athletes. The object is to score the most goals and a good coach wins first and develops second. Thats just common sense.

Haaland can do it all. What he does best is finish. He scores when others would not. Put him on City, PSG or any team with a great midfield and I watch him go crazy. Dortmund or any of the top professional clubs do not play a kick and run style. They will use a long ball if it is open. So will Barca. They use long ball because the ball is actually a pass and the target player can one touch control the ball.

Kick and run is just dumping the ball into the opponents side and hoping it works out. Most of the time the ball is kicked to the opponent and it’s a turn over. You can not turn the ball over in high level soccer. You will get killed. The players are just too good. It works in travel and college because its not a high level soccer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Kick and run” is played at every level. See Haaland, E.

You are nuts if you think Dortmund plays that way or he needs to do so. His vision, runs and combo passing are absolutely top of the charts. No top team plays kick and run professionally. None.

None do however I wouldn't be against it if I had the biggest strongest fastest athletes. The object is to score the most goals and a good coach wins first and develops second. Thats just common sense.

Haaland can do it all. What he does best is finish. He scores when others would not. Put him on City, PSG or any team with a great midfield and I watch him go crazy. Dortmund or any of the top professional clubs do not play a kick and run style. They will use a long ball if it is open. So will Barca. They use long ball because the ball is actually a pass and the target player can one touch control the ball.

Kick and run is just dumping the ball into the opponents side and hoping it works out. Most of the time the ball is kicked to the opponent and it’s a turn over. You can not turn the ball over in high level soccer. You will get killed. The players are just too good. It works in travel and college because its not a high level soccer.

I don’t think it works against good travel teams either, nor does it work in college.