Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Come on people.... Here in MoCo there are tons of families who don't feel any allegiance to the United States. Their allegiance is to their home country first and foremost. They are here to work and find it disturbing that their kids have to say the pledge in school. This is the county you chose to live in so you just have to accept the fact that it's not going to change for a generation or 2.

I have no problem with this except for the fact that these people apply for their GC and become citizens. They need to be clear on what they want out of immigrating to another country.

[Anonymous]

To all against the Pledge of Allegiance - if, someday, when the children are grown, and the country falls apart - remember your blasé attitude is what you passed along to your children. The U.S. has many enemies, both foreign and domestic. Countries without a strong sense of belonging and culture eventually disintegrate. We're seeing the strains on the country now. Take it seriously. It's easy to lose what you do not defend.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To all against the Pledge of Allegiance - if, someday, when the children are grown, and the country falls apart - remember your blasé attitude is what you passed along to your children. The U.S. has many enemies, both foreign and domestic. Countries without a strong sense of belonging and culture eventually disintegrate. We're seeing the strains on the country now. Take it seriously. It's easy to lose what you do not defend.

Read this, please. West Virginia v. Barnette, 1943 (so they were plenty familiar with enemies foreign and domestic): https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/319/624

We apply the limitations of the Constitution with no fear that freedom to be intellectually and spiritually diverse or even contrary will disintegrate the social organization. To believe that patriotism will not flourish if patriotic ceremonies are voluntary and spontaneous, instead of a compulsory routine, is to make an unflattering estimate of the appeal of our institutions to free minds. We can have intellectual individualism and the rich cultural diversities that we owe to exceptional minds only at the price of occasional eccentricity and abnormal attitudes. When they are so harmless to others or to the State as those we deal with here, the price is not too great. But freedom to differ is not limited to things that do not matter much. That would be a mere shadow of freedom. The test of its substance is the right to differ as to things that touch the heart of the existing order.

If there is any fixed star in our constitutional constellation, it is that no official, high or petty, can prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion, or other matters of opinion, or force citizens to confess by word or act their faith therein. If there are any circumstances which permit an exception, they do not now occur to us.

[Anonymous]

Yes, every morning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To all against the Pledge of Allegiance - if, someday, when the children are grown, and the country falls apart - remember your blasé attitude is what you passed along to your children. The U.S. has many enemies, both foreign and domestic. Countries without a strong sense of belonging and culture eventually disintegrate. We're seeing the strains on the country now. Take it seriously. It's easy to lose what you do not defend.

How utterly arrogant. Most European countries have been around for hundreds of years longer than anyone even knew what America was. They seem to be doing fine. You know where they force children to stand at the beginning of the school day and chant slogans at the flag while holding their hands in a weird position? Cuba. North Korea. Yeah, they’ve got great social cohesion and are awesome places to live. We should be proud to be like them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Come on people.... Here in MoCo there are tons of families who don't feel any allegiance to the United States. Their allegiance is to their home country first and foremost. They are here to work and find it disturbing that their kids have to say the pledge in school. This is the county you chose to live in so you just have to accept the fact that it's not going to change for a generation or 2.

I have no problem with this except for the fact that these people apply for their GC and become citizens. They need to be clear on what they want out of immigrating to another country.

My family traces their roots in the US back to the 1700s (unruly Scots Irish indentured servants) and have fought in every US war (+ Vietnam) since the Revolutionary War. I don't say the pledge. I tell my child that it is her decision of conscience and make sure she knows that according to the Supreme Court she cannot be forced to participate or punished for not participating. I think the words of the Pledge are false and the ritual of pledging is not in keeping with the principles upon which this country was founded. Why should a recent immigrant be held to a higher standard? A key part being a US citizen is the right to express disagreement with our government.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Come on people.... Here in MoCo there are tons of families who don't feel any allegiance to the United States. Their allegiance is to their home country first and foremost. They are here to work and find it disturbing that their kids have to say the pledge in school. This is the county you chose to live in so you just have to accept the fact that it's not going to change for a generation or 2.

I have no problem with this except for the fact that these people apply for their GC and become citizens. They need to be clear on what they want out of immigrating to another country.

My family traces their roots in the US back to the 1700s (unruly Scots Irish indentured servants) and have fought in every US war (+ Vietnam) since the Revolutionary War. I don't say the pledge. I tell my child that it is her decision of conscience and make sure she knows that according to the Supreme Court she cannot be forced to participate or punished for not participating. I think the words of the Pledge are false and the ritual of pledging is not in keeping with the principles upon which this country was founded. Why should a recent immigrant be held to a higher standard? A key part being a US citizen is the right to express disagreement with our government.

I can trace my roots back to 1947 when my family came over from Europe. My dad was in WW2 (as a new US citizen). They would disagree with you. Jingoism aside, some form of dedication to one's country is important in ensuring there's progress.

What flaws can you find in that one sentence? one nation? indivisible? with liberty and justice for all? Or has identify politics spoiled the sentiment behind the pledge?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, every morning.

same in our area

ES, MS and HS

[Anonymous]

I’m just reading though this thread and feel genuinely worried that so many people here are advocating doing away with pledge of allegiance. I’m in CA, and our kids say it every morning at school. Americans having always been deeply proud of their country, (yes, maybe too much, lol), but the answer isn’t to remove the pledge. Your child is allowed not to participate, and that is sufficient.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m just reading though this thread and feel genuinely worried that so many people here are advocating doing away with pledge of allegiance. I’m in CA, and our kids say it every morning at school. Americans having always been deeply proud of their country, (yes, maybe too much, lol), but the answer isn’t to remove the pledge. Your child is allowed not to participate, and that is sufficient.

+1. I'm an immigrant and a US citizen, moved here as a kid from a 3rd world country. I go back to my birth country from time to time and every time, I feel lucky to call this country my home. I think we should all feel a bit lucky to be here. Saying the pledge of allegiance for less than a minute a day during the school week isn't going to harm our kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m just reading though this thread and feel genuinely worried that so many people here are advocating doing away with pledge of allegiance. I’m in CA, and our kids say it every morning at school. Americans having always been deeply proud of their country, (yes, maybe too much, lol), but the answer isn’t to remove the pledge. Your child is allowed not to participate, and that is sufficient.

Removing the pledge? Not all schools do the pledge of allegiance in the first place. Some do, some don't. If you think your schools in wherever-you-are in California should keep doing it, then advocate for that to your local school governing board. And people here in Maryland will advocate for whatever they think best, to our local school governing boards.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m just reading though this thread and feel genuinely worried that so many people here are advocating doing away with pledge of allegiance. I’m in CA, and our kids say it every morning at school. Americans having always been deeply proud of their country, (yes, maybe too much, lol), but the answer isn’t to remove the pledge. Your child is allowed not to participate, and that is sufficient.

+1. I'm an immigrant and a US citizen, moved here as a kid from a 3rd world country. I go back to my birth country from time to time and every time, I feel lucky to call this country my home. I think we should all feel a bit lucky to be here. Saying the pledge of allegiance for less than a minute a day during the school week isn't going to harm our kids.

This. Plus the point of saying it daily isn’t to pledge daily. It’s to learn it and to have it ingrained. What Awmrican above 7 cant say the pledge?

It’s worth carrying on.

And, while we learn the preamble or parts of the Gettysburg address 1-2x each, and while some of us can brush up and fully recite parts.... it’s not as deeply ingrained.

The daily practice is worth it. It’s as close as we can get to a unifying statement, and nothing else could do the same thing.

[Anonymous]

I would have not problem with it being recited but for the "under God" part. I don't think anyone should have to recite pledges (or abstain, thus singling them out) that include religious references.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would have not problem with it being recited but for the "under God" part. I don't think anyone should have to recite pledges (or abstain, thus singling them out) that include religious references.

So let's stop doing something we've done forever so the few who don't agree with it won't feel left out? Can we pls teach kids to not be afraid to show their beliefs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all against the Pledge of Allegiance - if, someday, when the children are grown, and the country falls apart - remember your blasé attitude is what you passed along to your children. The U.S. has many enemies, both foreign and domestic. Countries without a strong sense of belonging and culture eventually disintegrate. We're seeing the strains on the country now. Take it seriously. It's easy to lose what you do not defend.

How utterly arrogant. Most European countries have been around for hundreds of years longer than anyone even knew what America was. They seem to be doing fine. You know where they force children to stand at the beginning of the school day and chant slogans at the flag while holding their hands in a weird position? Cuba. North Korea. Yeah, they’ve got great social cohesion and are awesome places to live. We should be proud to be like them.

No, you don't know European history if you say this. Most of the current regimes either did not exist until recently (Germany/Italy) or had regimes overthrown (either by violence or gradually like the UK) since the United States was created.