Long-term relationship with a guy with 15 years of alimony payments

[Anonymous]

Some of you have very weird concepts of alimony. I'm a woman. When I got divorced I had to pay my ex-husband alimony because I made significantly more than he did. We did not have children. Also, he did not financially contribute (or frankly contribute in any way) to my career or otherwise affect my earning capacity. He was lazy and actually made less over the time we were together whereas I got two graduate degrees, one while working, and my income rose dramatically. He didn't even take care of the dogs while I was in school yet the court ordered me to pay him money. I did it to make the whole thing go away, but the notion that alimony is for some SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons is pretty ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would treat it like any other long-term debt, like a student loan or medical bills.

Same.

I agree it's a debt, but it is different because it's going to another woman. Life with people who are divorced with kids can be complicated, so don't kid yourself about that.

It’s a debt that he must pay. Accept it and move forward with him or move on to someone else.

If you try to get him to go to court and restructure his agreement it will cause issues with his ex AND his children. It sounds like the situation with his first family is stable, don’t underestimate how much damage you will do to his relationship with his children if you push this and you end up being successful or if you just succeed in raking up lots of legal bills. Maybe he’ll be okay with you destroying his relationship with his kids - at least at first. But eventually, the novelty will wear off and you’ll be on your way to being wife#2 and he’ll be looking for a wife #3 who doesn’t demand a pound of flesh as a condition for a relationship.

If you can’t deal with his financial obligations. Move on. It doesn’t mean you’re a bad person, it just means you shouldn’t be dating divorced men.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some of you have very weird concepts of alimony. I'm a woman. When I got divorced I had to pay my ex-husband alimony because I made significantly more than he did. We did not have children. Also, he did not financially contribute (or frankly contribute in any way) to my career or otherwise affect my earning capacity. He was lazy and actually made less over the time we were together whereas I got two graduate degrees, one while working, and my income rose dramatically. He didn't even take care of the dogs while I was in school yet the court ordered me to pay him money. I did it to make the whole thing go away, but the notion that alimony is for some SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons is pretty ridiculous.

But that’s what happened in your case. He was the SAHM in a sense. You just didn’t have kids. What happened to you happens to men all of the time.

[Anonymous]

I met DH when his kids were 2 and 5. His wife gets alimony until she remarries it engages in a marriage like relationship. She’s not stupid—she and he BF have been together for about 10yrs now but they don’t live together.

We had an open discussion about this when we started to get serious. It was part of his baggage. I decided that the person who honors his obligations and treats his children as a priority was a value I wanted in my spouse.

Child support eventually ended. His salary continued to rise and her alimony remained the same. It’s just another bill now. He has always carried insurance for both CS and Alimony in case of disability. I was upfront with him that if he lost his job, I would cover CS but not alimony.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some of you have very weird concepts of alimony. I'm a woman. When I got divorced I had to pay my ex-husband alimony because I made significantly more than he did. We did not have children. Also, he did not financially contribute (or frankly contribute in any way) to my career or otherwise affect my earning capacity. He was lazy and actually made less over the time we were together whereas I got two graduate degrees, one while working, and my income rose dramatically. He didn't even take care of the dogs while I was in school yet the court ordered me to pay him money. I did it to make the whole thing go away, but the notion that alimony is for some SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons is pretty ridiculous.

You're agreeing that it's essentially for a SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons but in your case it was a SAH Husband who did nothing. Same thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some of you have very weird concepts of alimony. I'm a woman. When I got divorced I had to pay my ex-husband alimony because I made significantly more than he did. We did not have children. Also, he did not financially contribute (or frankly contribute in any way) to my career or otherwise affect my earning capacity. He was lazy and actually made less over the time we were together whereas I got two graduate degrees, one while working, and my income rose dramatically. He didn't even take care of the dogs while I was in school yet the court ordered me to pay him money. I did it to make the whole thing go away, but the notion that alimony is for some SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons is pretty ridiculous.

There is a nationwide alimony reform underway intended to eliminate all of the above. Many states have already fixed these archaic laws, many states are still legislating it out, and there are lingering problems of idiot judges who have not kept up with the legal changes. But overall, the new mantra is that "spousal support" is always of a limited duration and intended to rehabilitate a spouse who unemployed or under employed until he/she can support themselves. This is totally fair.

Vote FOR alimony reform. Vote out old judges who still make outrageous awards to a lazy spouse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of you have very weird concepts of alimony. I'm a woman. When I got divorced I had to pay my ex-husband alimony because I made significantly more than he did. We did not have children. Also, he did not financially contribute (or frankly contribute in any way) to my career or otherwise affect my earning capacity. He was lazy and actually made less over the time we were together whereas I got two graduate degrees, one while working, and my income rose dramatically. He didn't even take care of the dogs while I was in school yet the court ordered me to pay him money. I did it to make the whole thing go away, but the notion that alimony is for some SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons is pretty ridiculous.

There is a nationwide alimony reform underway intended to eliminate all of the above. Many states have already fixed these archaic laws, many states are still legislating it out, and there are lingering problems of idiot judges who have not kept up with the legal changes. But overall, the new mantra is that "spousal support" is always of a limited duration and intended to rehabilitate a spouse who unemployed or under employed until he/she can support themselves. This is totally fair.

Vote FOR alimony reform. Vote out old judges who still make outrageous awards to a lazy spouse.

There are situations where long term alimony is reasonable, though. Sometimes one spouse makes way more than the other (think attorney vs. teacher), and the lower earning spouse has made a family life based on the higher joint income (multiple kids, etc.). Then higher earning spouse cheats or is otherwise abusive/breaks terms of marriage. This is not a case of a “lazy spouse,” it’s a case of breaking commitment to a family and having to own up to that responsibility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would not date any man who was stupid enough to allow his wife to be a long term SAHM who has zero skills and is unemployable. That’s the only way alimony is awarded these days.

LOL...so much for empowering feminism that brings us CHOICE. Didn't realize it was my husband who was "allowing" me to be a SAHM.

+1

PP is bitter because her DH doesn’t allow her the choice to stay home. Hence her vitriol and anger towards all SAHMs.

Not that poster but I get it. While “allow” might not be the right word, unless the SAHP is independently wealthy, the person bringing in the income has to agree that they are comfortable being the only one bringing in the income for the other person to stay at home. You can’t live off love alone and need a way to pay for food and shelter.

And there may be some truth to the bitterness but more so in imagining the future situation. Because if your are the SAHM, that may not have been an option financially if your DH was previously married and paying a lot of alimony to his ex. How would you feel going to work everyday and preferring to SAH with your children knowing that you can’t financially afford to do so as a household because your DH will be paying alimony until your joint kids are almost in high school to support his ex when his kids with her are already out of high school?

To OP, in terms of discussing details, what is your motivation in discussing the details? Are you worried that you will indirectly be taking on this amount? At a certain point, it’s similar to someone that has huge student loan payments, you accept that a financial decision they made prior to you means they have salary minus x available to contribute to the household now. Either you can accept it or you don’t. Then you have to look at adverse changes, like if he loses his job (he still has those obligations) or if you get divorced or something changes with the alimony (like she breaks the terms of the agreement or somehow lawyers need to get involved again) - can you be with this person and still somehow financially protect yourself? No everyone is a fan or a prenup or separate finances.

Thanks for your thoughts. OP here. Realistically speaking, if he lost his job and were still due the alimony payments, we would need to think about this. The same with an illness that incapacitated him. I expect that we would go back to court to reduce the payments. The payments are such that a person in the DC area could live comfortably on them; especially since she does not have a mortgage payment. She is very well educated too. Everyone in the situation is. Since she doesn't need to rely on additional personal income, she is not aggressive in moving her career along. The ex is in her mid-50s.

Why does an educated mid 50s woman need 15 years of alimony to get herself back into the workforce and be self supporting? She sounds like a lazy abuser of ancient alimony laws. It's crazy this can still happen in 2018, thank god for alimony reform laws.

He should go back to court and have her fair market value income imputed against his payments, and the term greatly reduced based on a reasonable career trajectory.

Why can’t men contribute at home and take time off following the birth of a child? Why must they put the entire burden of having children on their wife? It’s crazy that this is still happening in 2018.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I met DH when his kids were 2 and 5. His wife gets alimony until she remarries it engages in a marriage like relationship. She’s not stupid—she and he BF have been together for about 10yrs now but they don’t live together.

We had an open discussion about this when we started to get serious. It was part of his baggage. I decided that the person who honors his obligations and treats his children as a priority was a value I wanted in my spouse.

Child support eventually ended. His salary continued to rise and her alimony remained the same. It’s just another bill now. He has always carried insurance for both CS and Alimony in case of disability. I was upfront with him that if he lost his job, I would cover CS but not alimony.

I feel sorry for you for being so dumb.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would treat it like any other long-term debt, like a student loan or medical bills.

Same.

I agree it's a debt, but it is different because it's going to another woman. Life with people who are divorced with kids can be complicated, so don't kid yourself about that.

It’s a debt that he must pay. Accept it and move forward with him or move on to someone else.

If you try to get him to go to court and restructure his agreement it will cause issues with his ex AND his children. It sounds like the situation with his first family is stable, don’t underestimate how much damage you will do to his relationship with his children if you push this and you end up being successful or if you just succeed in raking up lots of legal bills. Maybe he’ll be okay with you destroying his relationship with his kids - at least at first. But eventually, the novelty will wear off and you’ll be on your way to being wife#2 and he’ll be looking for a wife #3 who doesn’t demand a pound of flesh as a condition for a relationship.

If you can’t deal with his financial obligations. Move on. It doesn’t mean you’re a bad person, it just means you shouldn’t be dating divorced men.

OP here. Where did I say that I would do anything like this? I don't think anyone responded in the way that you are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of you have very weird concepts of alimony. I'm a woman. When I got divorced I had to pay my ex-husband alimony because I made significantly more than he did. We did not have children. Also, he did not financially contribute (or frankly contribute in any way) to my career or otherwise affect my earning capacity. He was lazy and actually made less over the time we were together whereas I got two graduate degrees, one while working, and my income rose dramatically. He didn't even take care of the dogs while I was in school yet the court ordered me to pay him money. I did it to make the whole thing go away, but the notion that alimony is for some SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons is pretty ridiculous.

You're agreeing that it's essentially for a SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons but in your case it was a SAH Husband who did nothing. Same thing.

What? I never said it was ok for a SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons. Nor a SAHD for that matter. But all these people are slamming the ex-wife in this case and assuming that alimony always means a husband is stuck supporting his wife because she's always been too lazy to get a job and I was merely pointing out that that is not true.

[Anonymous]

The casual acceptance of blatant misandry in this thread is eye-opening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of you have very weird concepts of alimony. I'm a woman. When I got divorced I had to pay my ex-husband alimony because I made significantly more than he did. We did not have children. Also, he did not financially contribute (or frankly contribute in any way) to my career or otherwise affect my earning capacity. He was lazy and actually made less over the time we were together whereas I got two graduate degrees, one while working, and my income rose dramatically. He didn't even take care of the dogs while I was in school yet the court ordered me to pay him money. I did it to make the whole thing go away, but the notion that alimony is for some SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons is pretty ridiculous.

You're agreeing that it's essentially for a SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons but in your case it was a SAH Husband who did nothing. Same thing.

What? I never said it was ok for a SAHM to sit on the couch and eat bon bons. Nor a SAHD for that matter. But all these people are slamming the ex-wife in this case and assuming that alimony always means a husband is stuck supporting his wife because she's always been too lazy to get a job and I was merely pointing out that that is not true.

Well that's pretty much exactly what you said. You are mad that you had to pay alimony to a SAH spouse who didn't do anything to earn any money. YOU are the one who had to go out and work for it. 99.9% of the time, the sexes are just reversed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I met DH when his kids were 2 and 5. His wife gets alimony until she remarries it engages in a marriage like relationship. She’s not stupid—she and he BF have been together for about 10yrs now but they don’t live together.

We had an open discussion about this when we started to get serious. It was part of his baggage. I decided that the person who honors his obligations and treats his children as a priority was a value I wanted in my spouse.

Child support eventually ended. His salary continued to rise and her alimony remained the same. It’s just another bill now. He has always carried insurance for both CS and Alimony in case of disability. I was upfront with him that if he lost his job, I would cover CS but not alimony.

My husband's ex got alimony for many years. Somehow she managed to get it even after it was over. He only got it stopped because she took him to court for more money based off my income when we got married (judge took her off alimony, removed two kids from child support and she only got it for a few more years for one). But, she got part of his military pension for the rest of her life regardless of marital status. They were married less than 10 years, she cheated on him and has been living with the same many for many years (she should actually marry that guy for his benefits but that's a different issue). It sucks, but not much you can do. If it was supposed to be time limited, like my husband's, then yes, sometimes it can be removed but it was in a garnishment for a while through the employer and the employer misread the order and refused to fix it and cost wise it wasn't worth fighting in court.

[Anonymous]

sounds problematic
don't do it
you're eventually will have to come out of the pocket to supplement his financial loss