Common Core: Your preschoolers are too dumb for kindergarten

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A) op posted only opinion pieces. Nowhere in them was there a link to the actual report. The second document made it sound as if the numbers are apples to oranges (87% of preschoolers were ready last year; 40 something % of kindergarteners are ready to meet the benchmarks at this point now. So it is hard to know what the facts are.

B) the first opinion piece link takes pains to stress that kids develop at different rates and this is just biological. Sure I can grant that. What I cannot grant is that it is just a coincidence that the vast majority of the kids that "biologically" need lower standards and more time are almost all low income (special needs excepted obviously). If it is biological you would not expect to see such a high concentration of school struggles primarily with poor kids.

It is absolutely correct that kids able to go faster should not be held back and those with special needs require specific accommodations. But it is not unreasonable to set benchmarks that should be achievable for MOST (not all!!!) kids and work like heck to get the kids there to ensure that the poorer kids who can get there if supported aren't left behind.

The test changed because of Common Core. That's a stated fact. The numbers dropped. Another stated fact.

Also facts: My cat is sitting on the counter. It rained last night.

The questions are, what are people measuring, and what does the change in numbers mean? Your facts answer those questions as well as my facts, namely: they don't.

[Anonymous]

Who says we are? Who says it is?

Read the standards. Read the article. The kids are not ready. So, they will get extensive "training" in order to "catch up" to something for which they are not ready.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

The great majority of kindergarteners in all demographic and income groups are reading at kindergarten grade level by the end of kindergarten in Montgomery County. I don't feel like digging up the documentation for this, but it's easy enough to find on the Internet.

Good for Montgomery County. Studies show that early reading is not that important.

But we are not talking about whether or not early reading is important. We are talking about whether the majority of children are capable of meeting the kindergarten Common Core standard for reading level. Yes, they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Who says we are? Who says it is?

Read the standards. Read the article. The kids are not ready. So, they will get extensive "training" in order to "catch up" to something for which they are not ready.

No, you are arguing in circles. Your argument goes like this: I know that kindergarten is boot camp because I know that we are pushing the kindergarteners because I know that kindergarteners are not ready for the Common Core standards because I know that kindergarten is boot camp because...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This article in taking the fact that 47% of kids in MD public PreK (a program limited to kid who either have disabilities, don't speak English, or are considered at high risk of academic failure) did something, and extrapolating it to "PreK students in MD".

Given that it was written by adults who presumably graduated school pre-Common Core, and is being shared by people here who presumably did too, that's a pretty a compelling argument for reforming math instruction and raising standards, at least in the area of statistics.

This is really the most important comment (not mine!). If the article really is comparing apples (all kindergartners last year) to oranges (kids coming out of public preschools this year), then this whole discussion is built on a fallacy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Who says we are? Who says it is?

Read the standards. Read the article. The kids are not ready. So, they will get extensive "training" in order to "catch up" to something for which they are not ready.

No, you are arguing in circles. Your argument goes like this: I know that kindergarten is boot camp because I know that we are pushing the kindergarteners because I know that kindergarteners are not ready for the Common Core standards because I know that kindergarten is boot camp because...

This is true. Learn how to debate and discuss and not talk in circles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here's the WBAL story, and I still can't figure out what on earth they're talking about:

http://www.wbal.com/article/115161/21/study-less-than-half-of-maryland-kindergartners-are-ready-for-the-common-core-curriculum

What "Common Core statistics"? And Maryland could not have introduced the Common Core standards for pre-K three years ago, because there are no Common Core standards for pre-K. Bad journalism.

Not only that, but holy crap talk about shooting the messenger. Instead of being concerned that more than half of all Baltimore kindergartners aren't ready to learn, OP starts prattling on nonsensically about Common Core being evil. WTF.

[Anonymous]

But we are not talking about whether or not early reading is important. We are talking about whether the majority of children are capable of meeting the kindergarten Common Core standard for reading level. Yes, they are.

So mistaken. This is absolutely not true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This article in taking the fact that 47% of kids in MD public PreK (a program limited to kid who either have disabilities, don't speak English, or are considered at high risk of academic failure) did something, and extrapolating it to "PreK students in MD".

Given that it was written by adults who presumably graduated school pre-Common Core, and is being shared by people here who presumably did too, that's a pretty a compelling argument for reforming math instruction and raising standards, at least in the area of statistics.

This is really the most important comment (not mine!). If the article really is comparing apples (all kindergartners last year) to oranges (kids coming out of public preschools this year), then this whole discussion is built on a fallacy.

Grasping at straws to defend Common Core, are we?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's the WBAL story, and I still can't figure out what on earth they're talking about:

http://www.wbal.com/article/115161/21/study-less-than-half-of-maryland-kindergartners-are-ready-for-the-common-core-curriculum

What "Common Core statistics"? And Maryland could not have introduced the Common Core standards for pre-K three years ago, because there are no Common Core standards for pre-K. Bad journalism.

Not only that, but holy crap talk about shooting the messenger. Instead of being concerned that more than half of all Baltimore kindergartners aren't ready to learn, OP starts prattling on nonsensically about Common Core being evil. WTF.

Right? That sounds like the real problem here.

[Anonymous]

Not only that, but holy crap talk about shooting the messenger. Instead of being concerned that more than half of all Baltimore kindergartners aren't ready to learn, OP starts prattling on nonsensically about Common Core being evil. WTF.



Right? That sounds like the real problem here.

But, our CC apologist says that all kids can achieve CC standards in K.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Not only that, but holy crap talk about shooting the messenger. Instead of being concerned that more than half of all Baltimore kindergartners aren't ready to learn, OP starts prattling on nonsensically about Common Core being evil. WTF.



Right? That sounds like the real problem here.

But, our CC apologist says that all kids can achieve CC standards in K.

Who is "our CC apologist"? There seem to be lots of different people posting on this thread. Many of these posters are reporting that the children in their children's kindergarten classes are not having problems with the Common Core standards. If that is apologizing, what is it apologizing for?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

But we are not talking about whether or not early reading is important. We are talking about whether the majority of children are capable of meeting the kindergarten Common Core standard for reading level. Yes, they are.

So mistaken. This is absolutely not true.

It's true in Montgomery County Public Schools.

http://sharedaccountability.mcpsmd.org/reports/list.php?selection=927

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

But we are not talking about whether or not early reading is important. We are talking about whether the majority of children are capable of meeting the kindergarten Common Core standard for reading level. Yes, they are.

So mistaken. This is absolutely not true.

It's true in Montgomery County Public Schools.

http://sharedaccountability.mcpsmd.org/reports/list.php?selection=927

Wow, you're a sleuth. Thanks for posting. Very interesting - the % jumps by a lot from 2006 to 2011, by more than 10 points, across all races. I wonder what caused such a huge jump. Not much change between 2011 and 2012, which is when they implemented CC in MCPS. So by those number, in MCPS at least, implementation of CC didn't really change "readiness" for Kers as far as reading goes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This article in taking the fact that 47% of kids in MD public PreK (a program limited to kid who either have disabilities, don't speak English, or are considered at high risk of academic failure) did something, and extrapolating it to "PreK students in MD".

Given that it was written by adults who presumably graduated school pre-Common Core, and is being shared by people here who presumably did too, that's a pretty a compelling argument for reforming math instruction and raising standards, at least in the area of statistics.

This is really the most important comment (not mine!). If the article really is comparing apples (all kindergartners last year) to oranges (kids coming out of public preschools this year), then this whole discussion is built on a fallacy.

Grasping at straws to defend Common Core, are we?

I don't even like Common Core. Or rather, I don't know enough about it to have a well-informed opinion. But I do like facts, and actual comparisons between similar data sets. I'm also one of the folks who said upthread that my MCPS (high poverty, majority minority) school seems to be doing fine meeting these standards. So, basically, I don't know a lot about Common Core, certainly not enough to grasp at straws, but my lived experience is that the standards set for kindergartners seem attainable, even by kids whose first language is not English, or who came to kindergarten less prepared than their more affluent peers.