Why do some parents dislike the SOLs so very much?

[Anonymous]

Point being, that a test is needed to get teachers to teach a topic.

The point is that high stakes testing has caused this. Teachers who are not concerned about their students passing the test still have pressure to teach to the test. There are benchmarks that they are required to achieve throughout the year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm a teacher and a parent. I don't like SOL's for my child or for my students.


That's because you know they're a reflection on you.

Not either PP. Retired teacher here. The tests are a mess and ruining education. The teachers are teaching to the tests because that is what they are directed to do. Their jobs depend on it. Good teachers try to get around it, but there is no avoiding it. If you think these tests are a good thing, then you have no understanding of what they are or what they mean.

If you are a baker and your pay depends only on how well you bake a coconut cake--what are you going to spend your time practicing? Chocolate? Maybe a little. Pound cake? Sometimes. But, you are going to spend most of your time perfecting the coconut cake. Sure, you might even bake a batch of cookies now and then, but most of the time will be spent on coconut cake.

Education is the same way. The teachers and schools are being judged on how well their students pass a test. If something is not tested, it may be presented to the kids--but will it really be emphasized and taught? Just be sure the kids know how to fill in bubbles.

The tests reflect what is in the curriculum. So by saying they "teach the test" you mean they teach the curriculum. Which is how it should be.

You seem to forget that teacher quality had gone downhill. That's what this is all about. The notion that the "teachers know best" as a monolith is ridiculous. Yes, there are good teachers, but not ALL of them are good. What teachers fear more than anything is accountability (which is what teachers' unions were beginning to protect them from). So, spare me. I remember what brought this all on in the first place. It wasn't pretty.

Teaching to the test does not mean teaching to the curriculum. Teaching to the test means they spend crazy amount of time having the student memorize only the information the tests cover and doing practices tests so they understand the format of the test. The tests are not about interpreting and applying concepts learned throughout the year, they are about memorization.

[Anonymous]

My child's school has actually started grading SOL prep. So basically, if you don't do the SOL prep that the teacher assigns, your grade will plummet. The irony of this is, of course, the fact that the SOLs are not counted against the student's grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm a teacher and a parent. I don't like SOL's for my child or for my students.


That's because you know they're a reflection on you.

Not either PP. Retired teacher here. The tests are a mess and ruining education. The teachers are teaching to the tests because that is what they are directed to do. Their jobs depend on it. Good teachers try to get around it, but there is no avoiding it. If you think these tests are a good thing, then you have no understanding of what they are or what they mean.

If you are a baker and your pay depends only on how well you bake a coconut cake--what are you going to spend your time practicing? Chocolate? Maybe a little. Pound cake? Sometimes. But, you are going to spend most of your time perfecting the coconut cake. Sure, you might even bake a batch of cookies now and then, but most of the time will be spent on coconut cake.

Education is the same way. The teachers and schools are being judged on how well their students pass a test. If something is not tested, it may be presented to the kids--but will it really be emphasized and taught? Just be sure the kids know how to fill in bubbles.

The tests reflect what is in the curriculum. So by saying they "teach the test" you mean they teach the curriculum. Which is how it should be.

You seem to forget that teacher quality had gone downhill. That's what this is all about. The notion that the "teachers know best" as a monolith is ridiculous. Yes, there are good teachers, but not ALL of them are good. What teachers fear more than anything is accountability (which is what teachers' unions were beginning to protect them from). So, spare me. I remember what brought this all on in the first place. It wasn't pretty.

Teaching to the test does not mean teaching to the curriculum. Teaching to the test means they spend crazy amount of time having the student memorize only the information the tests cover and doing practices tests so they understand the format of the test. The tests are not about interpreting and applying concepts learned throughout the year, they are about memorization.

Then you have bad teachers.

[Anonymous]

Then you have bad teachers

If your job depends on achieving one goal over all the others--on which goal are you going to spend most of your time?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm a teacher and a parent. I don't like SOL's for my child or for my students.


That's because you know they're a reflection on you.

Not either PP. Retired teacher here. The tests are a mess and ruining education. The teachers are teaching to the tests because that is what they are directed to do. Their jobs depend on it. Good teachers try to get around it, but there is no avoiding it. If you think these tests are a good thing, then you have no understanding of what they are or what they mean.

If you are a baker and your pay depends only on how well you bake a coconut cake--what are you going to spend your time practicing? Chocolate? Maybe a little. Pound cake? Sometimes. But, you are going to spend most of your time perfecting the coconut cake. Sure, you might even bake a batch of cookies now and then, but most of the time will be spent on coconut cake.

Education is the same way. The teachers and schools are being judged on how well their students pass a test. If something is not tested, it may be presented to the kids--but will it really be emphasized and taught? Just be sure the kids know how to fill in bubbles.

The tests reflect what is in the curriculum. So by saying they "teach the test" you mean they teach the curriculum. Which is how it should be.

You seem to forget that teacher quality had gone downhill. That's what this is all about. The notion that the "teachers know best" as a monolith is ridiculous. Yes, there are good teachers, but not ALL of them are good. What teachers fear more than anything is accountability (which is what teachers' unions were beginning to protect them from). So, spare me. I remember what brought this all on in the first place. It wasn't pretty.

Teaching to the test does not mean teaching to the curriculum. Teaching to the test means they spend crazy amount of time having the student memorize only the information the tests cover and doing practices tests so they understand the format of the test. The tests are not about interpreting and applying concepts learned throughout the year, they are about memorization.

Then you have bad teachers.

Do you understand what SOLs are? Have you taken one?

By middle/high school, a child's classroom tests should be based not only on their knowledge of the subject, but their ability to interpret the subject. It should be preparing them for college. SOLs are all about memorization. They are multiple choice tests. In elementary school, that sort of testing is fine. But in middle and high school, time needs to be spent developing a child's ability to analyze and interpret, not memorize.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you all feel about VA getting rid of the writing test in 5th grade. Now there isn't a writing test till 8th grade? Your child won't have an actual writing test for 9 years of schooling.

I'm more concerned about the fact that they teach very little writing in ES, at least at my kids' school. There is so much focus on accelerating math that I think they forget about the other stuff.

What school does your kid go to? My child has had writing tests since 1st grade - they just aren't SOLs. Her language arts work and tests have always been as time consuming - if not more so - that her math.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Then you have bad teachers

If your job depends on achieving one goal over all the others--on which goal are you going to spend most of your time?

Does it really though? If you have students who are failing school, yes I can see where this is the case. They need to have some minimal competency. However, if the majority of your class would pass the SOL whether you helped them memorize or not, why would you spend so much time teaching to this test? How is your job affected by the scores of kids who you know will pass? Do the majority of kids headed to Mclean, Langley, Oakton, Lake Braddock, Robinson, Woodson, Chantilly, Madison, and Marshall really need that much review time? Couldn't the few children who need the extra review get it as part of a pull out session?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you all feel about VA getting rid of the writing test in 5th grade. Now there isn't a writing test till 8th grade? Your child won't have an actual writing test for 9 years of schooling.

I'm more concerned about the fact that they teach very little writing in ES, at least at my kids' school. There is so much focus on accelerating math that I think they forget about the other stuff.

What school does your kid go to? My child has had writing tests since 1st grade - they just aren't SOLs. Her language arts work and tests have always been as time consuming - if not more so - that her math.

What school does your DC attend? My child has not had any writing or reading tests other than the DRA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm a teacher and a parent. I don't like SOL's for my child or for my students.


That's because you know they're a reflection on you.

Not either PP. Retired teacher here. The tests are a mess and ruining education. The teachers are teaching to the tests because that is what they are directed to do. Their jobs depend on it. Good teachers try to get around it, but there is no avoiding it. If you think these tests are a good thing, then you have no understanding of what they are or what they mean.

If you are a baker and your pay depends only on how well you bake a coconut cake--what are you going to spend your time practicing? Chocolate? Maybe a little. Pound cake? Sometimes. But, you are going to spend most of your time perfecting the coconut cake. Sure, you might even bake a batch of cookies now and then, but most of the time will be spent on coconut cake.

Education is the same way. The teachers and schools are being judged on how well their students pass a test. If something is not tested, it may be presented to the kids--but will it really be emphasized and taught? Just be sure the kids know how to fill in bubbles.

The tests reflect what is in the curriculum. So by saying they "teach the test" you mean they teach the curriculum. Which is how it should be.

You seem to forget that teacher quality had gone downhill. That's what this is all about. The notion that the "teachers know best" as a monolith is ridiculous. Yes, there are good teachers, but not ALL of them are good. What teachers fear more than anything is accountability (which is what teachers' unions were beginning to protect them from). So, spare me. I remember what brought this all on in the first place. It wasn't pretty.

Teaching to the test does not mean teaching to the curriculum. Teaching to the test means they spend crazy amount of time having the student memorize only the information the tests cover and doing practices tests so they understand the format of the test. The tests are not about interpreting and applying concepts learned throughout the year, they are about memorization.

Then you have bad teachers.

Do you understand what SOLs are? Have you taken one?

By middle/high school, a child's classroom tests should be based not only on their knowledge of the subject, but their ability to interpret the subject. It should be preparing them for college. SOLs are all about memorization. They are multiple choice tests. In elementary school, that sort of testing is fine. But in middle and high school, time needs to be spent developing a child's ability to analyze and interpret, not memorize.

Yes, analysis, interpretation, etc. are very important. But even at the HS level, AP tests have a lot of multiple choice. It's not just one or the other.

My kids spend plenty of time doing writing and analysis along with content that is covered in the multiple choice tests. SOL standards DO include writing, analysis, interpretation and these things are covered in the curriculum and assessed via projects and other assessments (for example, at our middle school there is a portfolio review at the end of 8th grade)

[Anonymous]

Teaching to the test does not mean teaching to the curriculum. Teaching to the test means they spend crazy amount of time having the student memorize only the information the tests cover and doing practices tests so they understand the format of the test. The tests are not about interpreting and applying concepts learned throughout the year, they are about memorization.


Then you have bad teachers.

But the "bad teachers" will have good test scores due to these "bad practices".

[Anonymous]

And "good teachers" may have bad test scores due to "good practices".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm a teacher and a parent. I don't like SOL's for my child or for my students.


That's because you know they're a reflection on you.

Not either PP. Retired teacher here. The tests are a mess and ruining education. The teachers are teaching to the tests because that is what they are directed to do. Their jobs depend on it. Good teachers try to get around it, but there is no avoiding it. If you think these tests are a good thing, then you have no understanding of what they are or what they mean.

If you are a baker and your pay depends only on how well you bake a coconut cake--what are you going to spend your time practicing? Chocolate? Maybe a little. Pound cake? Sometimes. But, you are going to spend most of your time perfecting the coconut cake. Sure, you might even bake a batch of cookies now and then, but most of the time will be spent on coconut cake.

Education is the same way. The teachers and schools are being judged on how well their students pass a test. If something is not tested, it may be presented to the kids--but will it really be emphasized and taught? Just be sure the kids know how to fill in bubbles.

The tests reflect what is in the curriculum. So by saying they "teach the test" you mean they teach the curriculum. Which is how it should be.

You seem to forget that teacher quality had gone downhill. That's what this is all about. The notion that the "teachers know best" as a monolith is ridiculous. Yes, there are good teachers, but not ALL of them are good. What teachers fear more than anything is accountability (which is what teachers' unions were beginning to protect them from). So, spare me. I remember what brought this all on in the first place. It wasn't pretty.

Teaching to the test does not mean teaching to the curriculum. Teaching to the test means they spend crazy amount of time having the student memorize only the information the tests cover and doing practices tests so they understand the format of the test. The tests are not about interpreting and applying concepts learned throughout the year, they are about memorization.

Then you have bad teachers.

By the same vein, can't bad teachers keep chugging along if they spend the year teaching only to the test for all their students pass?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm a teacher and a parent. I don't like SOL's for my child or for my students.


That's because you know they're a reflection on you.

Not either PP. Retired teacher here. The tests are a mess and ruining education. The teachers are teaching to the tests because that is what they are directed to do. Their jobs depend on it. Good teachers try to get around it, but there is no avoiding it. If you think these tests are a good thing, then you have no understanding of what they are or what they mean.

If you are a baker and your pay depends only on how well you bake a coconut cake--what are you going to spend your time practicing? Chocolate? Maybe a little. Pound cake? Sometimes. But, you are going to spend most of your time perfecting the coconut cake. Sure, you might even bake a batch of cookies now and then, but most of the time will be spent on coconut cake.

Education is the same way. The teachers and schools are being judged on how well their students pass a test. If something is not tested, it may be presented to the kids--but will it really be emphasized and taught? Just be sure the kids know how to fill in bubbles.

The tests reflect what is in the curriculum. So by saying they "teach the test" you mean they teach the curriculum. Which is how it should be.

You seem to forget that teacher quality had gone downhill. That's what this is all about. The notion that the "teachers know best" as a monolith is ridiculous. Yes, there are good teachers, but not ALL of them are good. What teachers fear more than anything is accountability (which is what teachers' unions were beginning to protect them from). So, spare me. I remember what brought this all on in the first place. It wasn't pretty.

Teaching to the test does not mean teaching to the curriculum. Teaching to the test means they spend crazy amount of time having the student memorize only the information the tests cover and doing practices tests so they understand the format of the test. The tests are not about interpreting and applying concepts learned throughout the year, they are about memorization.

Then you have bad teachers.

By the same vein, can't bad teachers keep chugging along if they spend the year teaching only to the test for all their students pass?

Only if SOL's is the only criteria they are measured by. There are other tests the students take. Are you saying the principals do nothing except look at the SOL data? What about ecart tests? essays, report cards, AP tests?

[Anonymous]

I haven't read through all the replies, but here's my thoughts: the kids are taking too many tests. Especially at such a young age. My third grader has tests nearly every day it seems lately. He had sols yesterday and Tuesday, and also pals this week. He had to take practice tests to prepare for the real tests and then studying for tests at home that his teacher is having him take. It's too much. It's overboard. Especially with all of the piling on I've noticed that is happening right at the end of the year. My child is stressed out. I keep telling him to relax because he is fine, but it doesn't help. Every morning he tells me he's so sick of school and wishes he could stay home and relax. At night he tells me he has a headache and maybe he should stay home tomorrow. He's 9. It's too early to be this stressed out over testing. And he's not getting it from me or his dad at home, because we only talk about it when he brings it up, and we just listen and try to encourage him and tell him we are proud of him for his hard work. If it were just sols and not all of the other stuff, I don't think people would be upset about it. Or if it were just all the other stuff and not the sols, it would be fine. But with all of it being what it is, it's too much.