Why I hate AAP Parents - vent

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who cares how you calculate the number? We aren't talking about flyover America. Fairfax County is in the top 5 in the nation in terms of educational attainment and in terms of income. Since SES and maternal education are the top predictors of academic success, I would hope there would be a ton of smart kids. Who cares if the AAP number is 14% or 20%?

I'm just trying to keep the facts straight. Whether having 20% of the student body designated as Level IV and 25% receiving level IV services is a good thing or a bad thing is an entirely different debate. It's also a huge distortion to act as if 20% of the student population is within the top 2% intellectually. I'll freely admit that my AAP child is a bright, motivated student, but isn't gifted under any strict definition. That child seems to be very middle of the pack in AAP. The only reason she "needs" AAP is that all of the other similarly bright, motivated, non-gifted children are also in AAP. It's not necessarily a bad thing that AAP casts a very broad net and gives expanded curriculum to so many kids, but it should be acknowledged that it is a very broad net.

People keep saying this. When so many families to DC for work, then it begins to seem as if high IQ were the norm. Broadly speaking, it may be the "norm" in DC but it's not nationwide. Why should it be surprising that 10-20% of the children in FFX would have an IQ that is in the top 2% nationwide? Most posters on this forum, the AAP forum, went to a Gifted program when they were children, and they expect that their bright children will also go to a Gifted program, and generally they do.

It might be surprising to people because IQ is not taught, there may be a hereditary aspect, but I know some really smart people with not so smart kids. You can help a kid pass a test or improve an IQ score, but an IQ Test score of 150 in that situation is not the same as a 150 by someone that did not prep for an IQ test. Also I know many Mensa members, high IQ often comes with its own set of problems, arrogance and disregard for the abilities of others (particularly if the Mensa member is inferior) are the most common I have seen. Not all Mensa members are like that but I have seen far too many (yet still a minority) that are, and they are the reason I never took the test to join. High IQ and smart are not the same thing. A Mensa friend of mine recently explained it this way.

Intelligence = ability to learn something
Smart = ability to apply what you have learned in the real world
Common Sense = Ability to solve a problem you have never encountered before using other experiences

He postulated that they become less common as you go down the list. He begrudgingly admitted that even more so for Mensa members, but he did say Mensa members are willing to learn new skills to be able to solve problems.

[Anonymous]

Most highly intelligent people wouldn't touch Mensa with a ten-foot pole, so I wouldn't use Mensa members as anything other than an odd little subset.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Most highly intelligent people wouldn't touch Mensa with a ten-foot pole, so I wouldn't use Mensa members as anything other than an odd little subset.

I know a couple of Mensa members (top 0.1 percent, the guy and gal are both brilliant) that only took the test to shut up a self described Mensa "genius" who bragged about his IQ too often, it actually worked. The guy got a job someplace else where he could be the smartest employee, at least in his own mind again. One of his new co-workers at the time (3-4 years ago) was a Linkedin contact, he asked me the guy always talked about how he was a genius when I worked with him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to those complaining about the AAP - not having it creates other issues. In MoCo (where I am; considering move to FFX which i why i am lurking here) there is nothing at all in any formal way that requires schools to seriously help target advanced ES learners beyond reading groups except for a VERY small program for the top 2 - 3% of kids. That program I hear is awesome but also only exists for 4 and 5th grades. So until 3rd grade you have nothing and for the 97% of kids in regular schools you have little formal process in place to help ensure that those needing more enrichment to target where they are at get it.

Yes, and there's so much research that shows that labeling kids as early as FFX county does is wrong. FFX county has about 20% of kids in AAP, that's crazy!

Some Fairfax County parents need the reinforcement of their kid being identified as AAP to show they are great parents with superior children. Thankfully these parents are in the minority, unfortunately it is a very vocal minority.

[Anonymous]

I'm just trying to keep the facts straight. Whether having 20% of the student body designated as Level IV and 25% receiving level IV services is a good thing or a bad thing is an entirely different debate. It's also a huge distortion to act as if 20% of the student population is within the top 2% intellectually. I'll freely admit that my AAP child is a bright, motivated student, but isn't gifted under any strict definition. That child seems to be very middle of the pack in AAP. The only reason she "needs" AAP is that all of the other similarly bright, motivated, non-gifted children are also in AAP. It's not necessarily a bad thing that AAP casts a very broad net and gives expanded curriculum to so many kids, but it should be acknowledged that it is a very broad net.

This has been my experience with my AAP kid, too. He's intelligent. I don't think he falls into the vague category called "gifted," though. About 80% of his AAP class is similar: intelligent but probably not in need of special services in the form of AAP.

I'm truly grateful for the expanded curriculum, additional teacher one-on-one time, and creative freedom he receives in AAP. I wish other kids who weren't in AAP received those opportunities, too, and I wish there wasn't this sad, status-seeking race every year to get our kids into the program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm just trying to keep the facts straight. Whether having 20% of the student body designated as Level IV and 25% receiving level IV services is a good thing or a bad thing is an entirely different debate. It's also a huge distortion to act as if 20% of the student population is within the top 2% intellectually. I'll freely admit that my AAP child is a bright, motivated student, but isn't gifted under any strict definition. That child seems to be very middle of the pack in AAP. The only reason she "needs" AAP is that all of the other similarly bright, motivated, non-gifted children are also in AAP. It's not necessarily a bad thing that AAP casts a very broad net and gives expanded curriculum to so many kids, but it should be acknowledged that it is a very broad net.

This has been my experience with my AAP kid, too. He's intelligent. I don't think he falls into the vague category called "gifted," though. About 80% of his AAP class is similar: intelligent but probably not in need of special services in the form of AAP.

I'm truly grateful for the expanded curriculum, additional teacher one-on-one time, and creative freedom he receives in AAP. I wish other kids who weren't in AAP received those opportunities, too, and I wish there wasn't this sad, status-seeking race every year to get our kids into the program.

What additional one on one time? If anything AAP students get less teachers helping them out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm just trying to keep the facts straight. Whether having 20% of the student body designated as Level IV and 25% receiving level IV services is a good thing or a bad thing is an entirely different debate. It's also a huge distortion to act as if 20% of the student population is within the top 2% intellectually. I'll freely admit that my AAP child is a bright, motivated student, but isn't gifted under any strict definition. That child seems to be very middle of the pack in AAP. The only reason she "needs" AAP is that all of the other similarly bright, motivated, non-gifted children are also in AAP. It's not necessarily a bad thing that AAP casts a very broad net and gives expanded curriculum to so many kids, but it should be acknowledged that it is a very broad net.

This has been my experience with my AAP kid, too. He's intelligent. I don't think he falls into the vague category called "gifted," though. About 80% of his AAP class is similar: intelligent but probably not in need of special services in the form of AAP.

I'm truly grateful for the expanded curriculum, additional teacher one-on-one time, and creative freedom he receives in AAP. I wish other kids who weren't in AAP received those opportunities, too, and I wish there wasn't this sad, status-seeking race every year to get our kids into the program.

What additional one on one time? If anything AAP students get less teachers helping them out.

I think this year we lucked out with a mellow and relatively small AAP class, and a teacher who's very energetic. But when he's needed extra help, she's been available to sit down with him for a bit, and I'm grateful for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm just trying to keep the facts straight. Whether having 20% of the student body designated as Level IV and 25% receiving level IV services is a good thing or a bad thing is an entirely different debate. It's also a huge distortion to act as if 20% of the student population is within the top 2% intellectually. I'll freely admit that my AAP child is a bright, motivated student, but isn't gifted under any strict definition. That child seems to be very middle of the pack in AAP. The only reason she "needs" AAP is that all of the other similarly bright, motivated, non-gifted children are also in AAP. It's not necessarily a bad thing that AAP casts a very broad net and gives expanded curriculum to so many kids, but it should be acknowledged that it is a very broad net.

This has been my experience with my AAP kid, too. He's intelligent. I don't think he falls into the vague category called "gifted," though. About 80% of his AAP class is similar: intelligent but probably not in need of special services in the form of AAP.

I'm truly grateful for the expanded curriculum, additional teacher one-on-one time, and creative freedom he receives in AAP. I wish other kids who weren't in AAP received those opportunities, too, and I wish there wasn't this sad, status-seeking race every year to get our kids into the program.

I was in a "Gifted and Talented" program in elementary school, there were a grand total of 8 of us in the program for all of the grades eligible to participate 3rd-6th grades. We did not have special classes, we were doing computer programming on a bunch of Apple IIe computers 2 hours a week. None of the 8 of us were being challenged academically in our school, we were not challenged in High School either and i know for a couple of us at least College was not very challenging either. One of the things I really like about the program was that the teacher never treated us like we were better than others, she pointed out that things were easier for us so she wanted to try to challenge us in other ways. We were also encouraged to be a resource (not what she called it at the time) for our fellow students when they were struggling. Not surprising to me, while we all finished in the top 10 percent of our graduating classes not a single one of was in the top 5, none of us cared about grades we only wanted to learn the material. As a parent of a rather bright child who sees it from a different perspective now, that must have driven our teachers crazy.

[Anonymous]

again who cares about AAP

everybody gets put back together again after it ends in Middle School

It does absolutely nothing long term for anyone

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:again who cares about AAP

everybody gets put back together again after it ends in Middle School

It does absolutely nothing long term for anyone

They don't all get put back together, the AAP kids take all honors classes, are in higher level HS classes at earlier ages. They are in PE with the other kids, and maybe band or another elective, but the rest of the classes are the more challenging versions of the classes. If the AAP kids are not arrogant they can be very helpful for the rest of the class, my DD helps other kids with their math and science, as a result she learns the material even more thoroughly as well. We know a sophomore that is taking 3 IB classes, he may be in the normal classes but he is taking them with Juniors and Seniors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:again who cares about AAP

everybody gets put back together again after it ends in Middle School

It does absolutely nothing long term for anyone

tons of people.
Do you know where we should go to get our WISC?
How much supplemental info should I sub,it for our appeal?

As far as all going back together for high school, grades 3-8 are super important academically.

[Anonymous]

DC went to a private for HS.
I expressed some caution that this might be challenging academically.
Kid said "c'mon, I was in AAP for 5 years."
confidence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes because all AAP parents are the same, just like all black people eat watermelon and chicken wings, all Asians are bad at driving, all Hispanics are illegals and all white people hate those that aren't white.

(eye roll) x infinity

She said it was a vent. Get off your soapbox, jerk!

hello, OP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What makes a student "gifted"? This study says we're getting it wrong.

http://www.vox.com/2014/9/24/6835643/gifted-education-classrooms-nber-study

Unfortunately, the people who most want to keep AAP are the parents of these students. It's a way for them to feel their bright children are something special academically even if they're not gifted. I had a gifted child (and all the challenges that entailed), but had the GT program he was in disappeared, I wouldn't have fought for it. It was nice to have, but he would still have been off the charts smart and special without it and not had his intelligence diminished without it.

any parent who doesn't feel that AAP should be relabeled special ed, doesn't really have that bright of a kid. I love my AAP off the charts kid, but really it's difficult to be an outlier no matter what tail you are on.

We are wrong to assume that kids not in AAP are dumb. My son is not in AAP and I know why he is not (if I push him hard he will make it). He likes to be him playing enjoying life as opposed to my daughter who is a geek, each one is different and one day both my kids are going to make us proud in their own way and that is all that matters to us. This AAP madness in here in fairfax rest of the country is pretty sane we moved from a different state BTW.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What makes a student "gifted"? This study says we're getting it wrong.

http://www.vox.com/2014/9/24/6835643/gifted-education-classrooms-nber-study

Unfortunately, the people who most want to keep AAP are the parents of these students. It's a way for them to feel their bright children are something special academically even if they're not gifted. I had a gifted child (and all the challenges that entailed), but had the GT program he was in disappeared, I wouldn't have fought for it. It was nice to have, but he would still have been off the charts smart and special without it and not had his intelligence diminished without it.

any parent who doesn't feel that AAP should be relabeled special ed, doesn't really have that bright of a kid. I love my AAP off the charts kid, but really it's difficult to be an outlier no matter what tail you are on.

We are wrong to assume that kids not in AAP are dumb. My son is not in AAP and I know why he is not (if I push him hard he will make it). He likes to be him playing enjoying life as opposed to my daughter who is a geek, each one is different and one day both my kids are going to make us proud in their own way and that is all that matters to us. This AAP madness in here in fairfax rest of the country is pretty sane we moved from a different state BTW.

goodbye!