The education miracle in Finland

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

To the other poster comparing blacks affected by Jim Crow to immigrants - That is mixing situations. A key effect of the racist past in America is that many blacks learned that the normal relationship between working hard and benefiting did not apply to them. Most immigrants come to the US expecting that here they will find a relationship between hard work and positive benefits. If I come here as a refugee suffering brutality and death of relatives I have come from a situation harder than some poor blacks (ignoring the violence in many inner city communities). However, that hard situation doesn't strip my cultural expectations. Which I believe is the case for many poorer blacks.

This bears repeating. The expectations of all parties involved--student, parent, teacher, administrator, community--are all essential. If one or two hold low expectations it's hard enoug, but if all are struggling under no hope, then there really is no hope. Complete failure. And as I recall, that was the state of DCPS in most (not all) of the city back in the 80s and 90s. That's the DCPS that produced many of the uninvolved parents of today's DCPS. One hell of a vicious cycle.

I would blame the crack epidemic in the 80s before I'd blame dcps

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The very below proficient learners in DCPS don't want my goody-two-shoes advanced learner "helping" them get caught up. They subscribe to the unfortunate culture of ridiculing the good student who obeys adults and wallowing in popular consumerism. No one wins in this situation.

Being smarter doesn't make a person morally superior

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Yet, people everywhere seem able to improve generation after generation...except, for some reason, AAs?

...and Latinos from Mexico and central America.

American Indians not doing so hot, either.

Latinos are doing much better than AAs. As are Vietnamese, Indians, Arabs, and any other group you can think of. Regarding Native Americans you have a point. Perhaps both share a similar self- destructive culture?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Yet, people everywhere seem able to improve generation after generation...except, for some reason, AAs?

...and Latinos from Mexico and central America.

American Indians not doing so hot, either.

Latinos are doing much better than AAs. As are Vietnamese, Indians, Arabs, and any other group you can think of. Regarding Native Americans you have a point. Perhaps both share a similar self- destructive culture?

The obvious common denominator of the AAs and the Native Americans is the obvious. Devastating proportions of oppression on our own soil by white America.

Not self-destructive cultures. Cultures maliciously destructed.

[Anonymous]

Most of the limitations today are self-imposed and cultural and have little to do with skin color, as opposed to being a function of externally-imposed limitations, such as racism or discrimination, as can be seen in the difference between Africans who came here as immigrants who were able to succeed, or high-SES African Americans who were able to succeed, as opposed to low-SES African Americans who didn't succeed, in large part because they don't share the same value system and/or didn't even try.

[Anonymous]

To those who fall back on the deep rooted psychological issues as an excuse for not performing well in school, how do you explain why girls do better than boys in school, graduate in grater numbers from high school, and number more than 50 percent on grad schools? And women were historically undereducated in most societies around the world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Yet, people everywhere seem able to improve generation after generation...except, for some reason, AAs?

...and Latinos from Mexico and central America.

American Indians not doing so hot, either.

Latinos are doing much better than AAs. As are Vietnamese, Indians, Arabs, and any other group you can think of. Regarding Native Americans you have a point. Perhaps both share a similar self- destructive culture?

The obvious common denominator of the AAs and the Native Americans is the obvious. Devastating proportions of oppression on our own soil by white America.

Not self-destructive cultures. Cultures maliciously destructed.

+1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Yet, people everywhere seem able to improve generation after generation...except, for some reason, AAs?

...and Latinos from Mexico and central America.

American Indians not doing so hot, either.

Latinos are doing much better than AAs. As are Vietnamese, Indians, Arabs, and any other group you can think of. Regarding Native Americans you have a point. Perhaps both share a similar self- destructive culture?

The obvious common denominator of the AAs and the Native Americans is the obvious. Devastating proportions of oppression on our own soil by white America.

Not self-destructive cultures. Cultures maliciously destructed.

+1000

That was once true but is no longer the case. For the last several decades and for generations such as my own and my children's, the only people holding anyone back are themselves. Nobody is holding a gun to anyone's head and forcing them to drop out of school. Nobody is standing in front of the library not letting people of color inside. Nobody is barring entrance to the art or science museum. Go to any office or business in the city and you will find it chock-full of people of every race and ethnicity in every position and role. Go to any university in the area and you will find it full of people of all races and ethnicities. The only barriers today are the your own perceived ones - the barriers you put in front of yourself.

Blaming people and holding grudges isn't going to solve anything - in fact, it's only going to continue to cause problems - and frankly, with so many of us being from such diverse backgrounds ourselves, there's hardly even anyone left to hold directly accountable anymore. My family for example never held slaves or engaged in Jim Crow or segregation, they were immigrants, recent arrivals - as is the case with millions of others, judging and blaming anyone just because they are "white" is deeply misguided and misplaced. Assuming people in our generation had any special privilege or advantage just because of their skin color is also misguided. It's pointless to dwell on the past, other than for historic remembrance, learning and avoidance of future problems. This is 2014, not 1854 or 1954. It's time to move on.

[Anonymous]

Hunh. Two days ago some were arguing that the schools problem in DC has absolutely nothing to do with race. Now it's a self-actualized victimhood suffered ony by AAs.

I read "time to move on" and get a flashback to people stranded on their rooftops in New Orleans.

Good inside perspective at the link below from a (white) former Ward 3 resident who left his profitable tutoring business and moved to Anacostia to be closer to kids with higher needs If you make it past the story about the girl at the top of her class living in a homeless shelter, you might catch all of his various references to evidence that "the system" has indeed moved on. In fact, every institution that would be rushing to help in other parts of the city, has moved right on to "don't give a shit" in Anacostia. He's not whining, or shouting, or stamping a righteous foot. Just talking matter-of-factly about the general lack of concern for daily dire circumstances right here in this city.

http://innercityvisions.blogspot.com

For those interested in the way federal housing policy from less than 100 years ago (1930s) still impacts quality of life factors like education and health disparities today, check out This American Life episode 512: "House Rules" at http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/512/house-rules

Or read the transcript: http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/512/transcript

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hunh. Two days ago some were arguing that the schools problem in DC has absolutely nothing to do with race. Now it's a self-actualized victimhood suffered ony by AAs.

I read "time to move on" and get a flashback to people stranded on their rooftops in New Orleans.

Good inside perspective at the link below from a (white) former Ward 3 resident who left his profitable tutoring business and moved to Anacostia to be closer to kids with higher needs If you make it past the story about the girl at the top of her class living in a homeless shelter, you might catch all of his various references to evidence that "the system" has indeed moved on. In fact, every institution that would be rushing to help in other parts of the city, has moved right on to "don't give a shit" in Anacostia. He's not whining, or shouting, or stamping a righteous foot. Just talking matter-of-factly about the general lack of concern for daily dire circumstances right here in this city.

http://innercityvisions.blogspot.com

For those interested in the way federal housing policy from less than 100 years ago (1930s) still impacts quality of life factors like education and health disparities today, check out This American Life episode 512: "House Rules" at http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/512/house-rules

Or read the transcript: http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/512/transcript

Oh, come on. "Lack of concern" as though somewhere else were getting all the concern. "Yes, let's do all this stuff for this neighborhood and go out of our way to screw this other neighborhood." It's fine to do the retrospective on housing policy and recognize that it left scars, but that really isn't how it works these days. The way it works is back to the most basic principles, like people looking out for themselves and their own environs. Altruism and lofty ideals on a grander level have never really been the most effective way that things have ever worked anywhere. How well does planned development on a grand scale work in China? Massive disaster. So it falls back to economics. Nobody's rushing to help in my neighborhood - other than folks who figure they can make a buck at it. Oldest game in town. If there's some way to make a buck at helping Anacostia, it'd be the same there. (And, psst... some developers have already started figuring that out, but to hear you talk you'd evidently not be aware...)

[Anonymous]

Haven't seen much Finland on this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Haven't seen much Finland on this thread.

Thread took a left turn with realization of how little DC has in common with Finland.

[Anonymous]

Mostly snow, it seems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hunh. Two days ago some were arguing that the schools problem in DC has absolutely nothing to do with race. Now it's a self-actualized victimhood suffered ony by AAs.

I read "time to move on" and get a flashback to people stranded on their rooftops in New Orleans.

Good inside perspective at the link below from a (white) former Ward 3 resident who left his profitable tutoring business and moved to Anacostia to be closer to kids with higher needs If you make it past the story about the girl at the top of her class living in a homeless shelter, you might catch all of his various references to evidence that "the system" has indeed moved on. In fact, every institution that would be rushing to help in other parts of the city, has moved right on to "don't give a shit" in Anacostia. He's not whining, or shouting, or stamping a righteous foot. Just talking matter-of-factly about the general lack of concern for daily dire circumstances right here in this city.

http://innercityvisions.blogspot.com

For those interested in the way federal housing policy from less than 100 years ago (1930s) still impacts quality of life factors like education and health disparities today, check out This American Life episode 512: "House Rules" at http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/512/house-rules

Or read the transcript: http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/512/transcript

Thanks for these articles and your perspective. The following comments echo the "I don't give a ****" attitude that the blog refers to. It's very disheartening that people can be so selfish. It's not my problem - unless it affects me (or my kids) directly. Even then, it's "how can we separate." Regardless of the circumstance, their is a deep rooted "entitlement" that prevents folks from seeing how ****ed up this is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Mostly snow, it seems.

Kids have 2 eyes and a nose too.