HB Woodlawn HS questions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

What year is this and where did you get the estimated class size? Did you pick out top 20 and top 50 manually from the chart or is there another source where it’s summarized?

Agree, plus the class size is not a good denominator. Numbers of applications would be a better one. I calculated it for UVA and ….its exactly the same from all schools and programs. Consistently ~ over 17%-19% from each, no matter where the kid went.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

What year is this and where did you get the estimated class size? Did you pick out top 20 and top 50 manually from the chart or is there another source where it’s summarized?

This data is from 2024, look at the description link above Arlington Magazine.

Class size is from https://www.apsva.us/statistics/enrollment/

The top 20 and top 50 are from USNews and world report, where else?

You can do your own analysis of the data, I linked to the acceptances from Arlington Magazine. Its very clear that HBW has a much higher success rate for acceptance to competitive colleges, despite not having any admissions testing or magnet designation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

What year is this and where did you get the estimated class size? Did you pick out top 20 and top 50 manually from the chart or is there another source where it’s summarized?

This data is from 2024, look at the description link above Arlington Magazine.

Class size is from https://www.apsva.us/statistics/enrollment/

The top 20 and top 50 are from USNews and world report, where else?

You can do your own analysis of the data, I linked to the acceptances from Arlington Magazine. Its very clear that HBW has a much higher success rate for acceptance to competitive colleges, despite not having any admissions testing or magnet designation.

No, what's "very clear" is only that a higher percentage of HBW students is ELECTING to apply to competitive colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

What year is this and where did you get the estimated class size? Did you pick out top 20 and top 50 manually from the chart or is there another source where it’s summarized?

This data is from 2024, look at the description link above Arlington Magazine.

Class size is from https://www.apsva.us/statistics/enrollment/

The top 20 and top 50 are from USNews and world report, where else?

You can do your own analysis of the data, I linked to the acceptances from Arlington Magazine. Its very clear that HBW has a much higher success rate for acceptance to competitive colleges, despite not having any admissions testing or magnet designation.

Not sure what month you used, but your denominators are off for Yorktown and W-L https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/sites/57/2024/05/U-MEM_281-Membership-Summary-All-1.pdf

Wakefield - 526
W-L - 530
Yorktown - 483

I’m not going to pick through for top 10/top 50 data, but I’m guessing some of that is wrong too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

What year is this and where did you get the estimated class size? Did you pick out top 20 and top 50 manually from the chart or is there another source where it’s summarized?

Agree, plus the class size is not a good denominator. Numbers of applications would be a better one. I calculated it for UVA and ….its exactly the same from all schools and programs. Consistently ~ over 17%-19% from each, no matter where the kid went.

Counselors and peers at HBW push kids to take the shot at elite schools, whereas neighborhood schools counselors are focused on getting students to pass the SOL and graduate, not apply to elite schools. If you only count the kids who actually applied, you’re missing the invisible students who were guided away or never encouraged to apply to elite schools entirely. Class size is a much better measure of a school's overall ceiling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

What year is this and where did you get the estimated class size? Did you pick out top 20 and top 50 manually from the chart or is there another source where it’s summarized?

This data is from 2024, look at the description link above Arlington Magazine.

Class size is from https://www.apsva.us/statistics/enrollment/

The top 20 and top 50 are from USNews and world report, where else?

You can do your own analysis of the data, I linked to the acceptances from Arlington Magazine. Its very clear that HBW has a much higher success rate for acceptance to competitive colleges, despite not having any admissions testing or magnet designation.

Not sure what month you used, but your denominators are off for Yorktown and W-L https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/sites/57/2024/05/U-MEM_281-Membership-Summary-All-1.pdf

Wakefield - 526
W-L - 530
Yorktown - 483

I’m not going to pick through for top 10/top 50 data, but I’m guessing some of that is wrong too.

I grabbed 2023 when I scrolled down, sorry. But the percentages still work out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you combine an AP class and a non-AP class. Can someone explain how that works.

For one of the AP/regular English classes... You teach towards the bottom. Then, for example, you give an assignment, for which you can read literally a choice of comic book, a 2nd grade reading level book, a middle grade book, or one or two actual books. I'm not sure of the exact number for each assignment but I know for sure there were at least the comic book, 2nd grade, middle grade, and one famous regular book. It's sad. And the fact that everyone probably gets graded the exact same is unfair and embarrassing. Oh yeah, there was also a choice to watch a movie instead.

Not an exaggeration. And don't complain if your kid does poorly on the AP test because I don't think anyone (parent or kid) officially complains at the beginning of school or during the year, according to our kids. (They could be doing the "privacy" nonsense and trying to pretend that your kid is the only one complaining, where parents clam up because of shame. This happened pre-Covid at an APS elementary school and they got away with it for several years before more than a few parents started meeting at school events and comparing notes. Its harder for them to get away with it now.)

I think I know which class you’re talking about. It was very disappointing. They mostly watched films instead of reading. I chalked it up to a bad teacher— which we’ve had from time to time over the years in public schools. HB isn’t immune to the usual public school problems.

Which grade was this? Offering a 2nd grade book vs. a regular book for that level is horrifying, and then everyone gets graded the same, as if it was the same difficulty? Is this how they “hide” the non-achievements of kids who have certain reasons (like medical) or is this done to hide language inadequacies? Or WHY?! Why would a school do this in English AP in HS? Or did I misunderstand the PP?

You misunderstood. I have no idea if there is a different grade book. Where did you get that from? And if there is, why is that so horrifying when there are two different classes. What difference would it make?

I don’t see how this co teaching hides anything. Can you explain that? It’s a matter of resources. The school isn’t big enough to offer separate classes so they have to teach them together.

Weird that some people think this is some big conspiracy. But that’s par for the course!!! It’s definitely not an advantage but if you don’t like it don’t go to HB

Horrifying - or in other words, inexplicable and inexcusable; that a second grader book would be read in MS or HS - the PP explicitly mentioned “a comic book, a 2nd grader book and a regular book” - that’s why I asked which grade it was. Co-teaching the class (and they also mentioned teaching to the lowest denominator), especially allowing such vastly different materials for the same credit, hides the underachievement within their statistics and test scores, and it hides how kids do overall in the class, unless they break it down further, which APS usually does not do.
I’m not that PP and neither are you, so it would only be helpful if they clarified.

Yes comics and children's books are types of literature. There are college classes on children's literature.

How does teaching two classes in the same room hide the underachievement exactly? The kids are enrolled in two separate classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

You’re right PP -you’ve figured it all out. There’s no other plausible explanation. It’s definitely not explained by the fact that families select into an option school and that we see this pattern of higher outcomes in other option schools like ATS’ higher test scores.

Only a true HB conspiracist would try to spin the fact that HB offers far fewer APs with some cotaught and nearly no intensified classes as some sort of an advantage. Well done!

It's not an HB conspiracy theory. It's how college admissions work and it is an advantage. Get your head out of your arse. UVA is letting in a certain number from all the high schools in Virginia, if that's the particular example we're using. But really this is the case for any selective college. They balance their classes regionally and across schools, rural v suburban v private, gender, public v private. It is not a conspiracy theory to say that kids are not really competing against each other but competing against the kids at their own school.

As an HB parent, I've tried to patiently explain HB to you. But I can see that you don't want actual info, as you would prefer to insult me and spin your conspiracy theories. So carry on! But let me ask you this: if you are so sure of yourself, why hide anonymously PP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

What year is this and where did you get the estimated class size? Did you pick out top 20 and top 50 manually from the chart or is there another source where it’s summarized?

Agree, plus the class size is not a good denominator. Numbers of applications would be a better one. I calculated it for UVA and ….its exactly the same from all schools and programs. Consistently ~ over 17%-19% from each, no matter where the kid went.

Counselors and peers at HBW push kids to take the shot at elite schools, whereas neighborhood schools counselors are focused on getting students to pass the SOL and graduate, not apply to elite schools. If you only count the kids who actually applied, you’re missing the invisible students who were guided away or never encouraged to apply to elite schools entirely. Class size is a much better measure of a school's overall ceiling.

Well, HB doesn't even have counselors so try again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So yet another nugget about HB is these kids are not even operating at the level of kids at the home high schools and college admission is probably easier for them as a result.

In the end, in theory people should want their kids well prepared for college but I'm sure plenty of people love that they're getting AP lang and lit on their transcript with an A and meanwhile doing nothing in class.

Hold on tiger. who said they are doing nothing in class? and who said college admissions are easier? the kids at HB are less prepared for the AP exams and get lower scores. That hurts them with college admissions, not helps them

It sounds like they are not doing nearly as much as kids at the other schools in AP classes.

It 100 percent makes college admissions easier. Kids are compared against their peers at their same school. HB kids are taking easier classes that are labeled "most rigorous" for their school. To recap, they are not working as hard and taking fewer challenging classes (since so many fewer are offered at HB to begin with) and then getting into the same schools as kids from the larger high schools. Compare a UVA admit from HB to a UVA admit from W-L IB and the W-L IB kid is a far more impressive and higher achieving student. You clearly don't know anything about the college admissions process.

Right but AP scores are AP scores and these would be compared against the applicant pool more globally. It does not seem like a strong point that AP classes are not taught as well resulting in kids getting lower schools. But you seem to disagree and this that it is, so I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise.

Proof is in the pudding: HBW dominates college admissions

https://www.scribd.com/document/757378704/Where-Arlington-s-Class-of-2024-Applied-to-College-and-Got-In

Yorktown High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~36
Top-50 accepts: ~110
Estimated class size: ~600
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~18% Top-50

Washington-Liberty High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~34
Top-50 accepts: ~95
Estimated class size: ~550
Approx. rates: ~6% Top-20, ~17% Top-50

Wakefield High School:
Top-20 accepts: ~12
Top.-50 accepts: ~45
Estimated class size: ~480
Approx. rates: ~2.5% Top-20, ~9% Top-50

H-B Woodlawn Secondary Program:
Top-20 accepts: ~10
Top-50 accepts: ~30
Estimated class size: ~120
Approx. rates: ~8% Top-20, ~25% Top-50

Arlington Career Center / Arlington Tech:
Top-20 accepts: ~3
Top-50 accepts: ~12
Estimated class size: ~100
Approx. rates: ~3% Top-20, ~12% Top-50

Districtwide estimate (≈1,850 graduates):
Top-20 acceptances: ~95–100 (~5%)
Top-50 acceptances: ~290–300 (~16%)

You’re right PP -you’ve figured it all out. There’s no other plausible explanation. It’s definitely not explained by the fact that families select into an option school and that we see this pattern of higher outcomes in other option schools like ATS’ higher test scores.

Only a true HB conspiracist would try to spin the fact that HB offers far fewer APs with some cotaught and nearly no intensified classes as some sort of an advantage. Well done!

It's not an HB conspiracy theory. It's how college admissions work and it is an advantage. Get your head out of your arse. UVA is letting in a certain number from all the high schools in Virginia, if that's the particular example we're using. But really this is the case for any selective college. They balance their classes regionally and across schools, rural v suburban v private, gender, public v private. It is not a conspiracy theory to say that kids are not really competing against each other but competing against the kids at their own school.

As an HB parent, I've tried to patiently explain HB to you. But I can see that you don't want actual info, as you would prefer to insult me and spin your conspiracy theories. So carry on! But let me ask you this: if you are so sure of yourself, why hide anonymously PP?

Huh? Should I meet you around back at 5pm? I'd say this all to anyone's face including yours but of course that's not possible so what a weird thing to say. The statements above are non-controversial and not about an "HB conspiracy". It's basic facts about college admissions that are widely known.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you combine an AP class and a non-AP class. Can someone explain how that works.

For one of the AP/regular English classes... You teach towards the bottom. Then, for example, you give an assignment, for which you can read literally a choice of comic book, a 2nd grade reading level book, a middle grade book, or one or two actual books. I'm not sure of the exact number for each assignment but I know for sure there were at least the comic book, 2nd grade, middle grade, and one famous regular book. It's sad. And the fact that everyone probably gets graded the exact same is unfair and embarrassing. Oh yeah, there was also a choice to watch a movie instead.

Not an exaggeration. And don't complain if your kid does poorly on the AP test because I don't think anyone (parent or kid) officially complains at the beginning of school or during the year, according to our kids. (They could be doing the "privacy" nonsense and trying to pretend that your kid is the only one complaining, where parents clam up because of shame. This happened pre-Covid at an APS elementary school and they got away with it for several years before more than a few parents started meeting at school events and comparing notes. Its harder for them to get away with it now.)

I think I know which class you’re talking about. It was very disappointing. They mostly watched films instead of reading. I chalked it up to a bad teacher— which we’ve had from time to time over the years in public schools. HB isn’t immune to the usual public school problems.

Which grade was this? Offering a 2nd grade book vs. a regular book for that level is horrifying, and then everyone gets graded the same, as if it was the same difficulty? Is this how they “hide” the non-achievements of kids who have certain reasons (like medical) or is this done to hide language inadequacies? Or WHY?! Why would a school do this in English AP in HS? Or did I misunderstand the PP?

You misunderstood. I have no idea if there is a different grade book. Where did you get that from? And if there is, why is that so horrifying when there are two different classes. What difference would it make?

I don’t see how this co teaching hides anything. Can you explain that? It’s a matter of resources. The school isn’t big enough to offer separate classes so they have to teach them together.

Weird that some people think this is some big conspiracy. But that’s par for the course!!! It’s definitely not an advantage but if you don’t like it don’t go to HB

Horrifying - or in other words, inexplicable and inexcusable; that a second grader book would be read in MS or HS - the PP explicitly mentioned “a comic book, a 2nd grader book and a regular book” - that’s why I asked which grade it was. Co-teaching the class (and they also mentioned teaching to the lowest denominator), especially allowing such vastly different materials for the same credit, hides the underachievement within their statistics and test scores, and it hides how kids do overall in the class, unless they break it down further, which APS usually does not do.
I’m not that PP and neither are you, so it would only be helpful if they clarified.

Yes comics and children's books are types of literature. There are college classes on children's literature.

How does teaching two classes in the same room hide the underachievement exactly? The kids are enrolled in two separate classes.

The way it would hide the underachievement is the teacher is forced to teach to the lowest common denominator at least some of the time and likely spend more time with the non-AP students, which is what any teacher has to do in that situation in any classroom at any grade level. Therefore the kids enrolled in the AP class are a) getting lower level instruction and work than what should be provided in an AP class and b) probably getting a good grade for doing said lower level work, which others on this thread have said leads to lower AP scores.

This is not even complicated. It's baffling people are not getting it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you combine an AP class and a non-AP class. Can someone explain how that works.

For one of the AP/regular English classes... You teach towards the bottom. Then, for example, you give an assignment, for which you can read literally a choice of comic book, a 2nd grade reading level book, a middle grade book, or one or two actual books. I'm not sure of the exact number for each assignment but I know for sure there were at least the comic book, 2nd grade, middle grade, and one famous regular book. It's sad. And the fact that everyone probably gets graded the exact same is unfair and embarrassing. Oh yeah, there was also a choice to watch a movie instead.

Not an exaggeration. And don't complain if your kid does poorly on the AP test because I don't think anyone (parent or kid) officially complains at the beginning of school or during the year, according to our kids. (They could be doing the "privacy" nonsense and trying to pretend that your kid is the only one complaining, where parents clam up because of shame. This happened pre-Covid at an APS elementary school and they got away with it for several years before more than a few parents started meeting at school events and comparing notes. Its harder for them to get away with it now.)

I think I know which class you’re talking about. It was very disappointing. They mostly watched films instead of reading. I chalked it up to a bad teacher— which we’ve had from time to time over the years in public schools. HB isn’t immune to the usual public school problems.

Which grade was this? Offering a 2nd grade book vs. a regular book for that level is horrifying, and then everyone gets graded the same, as if it was the same difficulty? Is this how they “hide” the non-achievements of kids who have certain reasons (like medical) or is this done to hide language inadequacies? Or WHY?! Why would a school do this in English AP in HS? Or did I misunderstand the PP?

You misunderstood. I have no idea if there is a different grade book. Where did you get that from? And if there is, why is that so horrifying when there are two different classes. What difference would it make?

I don’t see how this co teaching hides anything. Can you explain that? It’s a matter of resources. The school isn’t big enough to offer separate classes so they have to teach them together.

Weird that some people think this is some big conspiracy. But that’s par for the course!!! It’s definitely not an advantage but if you don’t like it don’t go to HB

Horrifying - or in other words, inexplicable and inexcusable; that a second grader book would be read in MS or HS - the PP explicitly mentioned “a comic book, a 2nd grader book and a regular book” - that’s why I asked which grade it was. Co-teaching the class (and they also mentioned teaching to the lowest denominator), especially allowing such vastly different materials for the same credit, hides the underachievement within their statistics and test scores, and it hides how kids do overall in the class, unless they break it down further, which APS usually does not do.
I’m not that PP and neither are you, so it would only be helpful if they clarified.

Yes comics and children's books are types of literature. There are college classes on children's literature.

How does teaching two classes in the same room hide the underachievement exactly? The kids are enrolled in two separate classes.

The way it would hide the underachievement is the teacher is forced to teach to the lowest common denominator at least some of the time and likely spend more time with the non-AP students, which is what any teacher has to do in that situation in any classroom at any grade level. Therefore the kids enrolled in the AP class are a) getting lower level instruction and work than what should be provided in an AP class and b) probably getting a good grade for doing said lower level work, which others on this thread have said leads to lower AP scores.

This is not even complicated. It's baffling people are not getting it.

Except there an AP exam at the end of the course, so any underachievement would be obvious via AP scores. Also kids submit their AP scores to colleges for admissions purposes. So not having the same opportunity of getting higher AP scores to submit to colleges is a significant downside for HB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you combine an AP class and a non-AP class. Can someone explain how that works.

For one of the AP/regular English classes... You teach towards the bottom. Then, for example, you give an assignment, for which you can read literally a choice of comic book, a 2nd grade reading level book, a middle grade book, or one or two actual books. I'm not sure of the exact number for each assignment but I know for sure there were at least the comic book, 2nd grade, middle grade, and one famous regular book. It's sad. And the fact that everyone probably gets graded the exact same is unfair and embarrassing. Oh yeah, there was also a choice to watch a movie instead.

Not an exaggeration. And don't complain if your kid does poorly on the AP test because I don't think anyone (parent or kid) officially complains at the beginning of school or during the year, according to our kids. (They could be doing the "privacy" nonsense and trying to pretend that your kid is the only one complaining, where parents clam up because of shame. This happened pre-Covid at an APS elementary school and they got away with it for several years before more than a few parents started meeting at school events and comparing notes. Its harder for them to get away with it now.)

I think I know which class you’re talking about. It was very disappointing. They mostly watched films instead of reading. I chalked it up to a bad teacher— which we’ve had from time to time over the years in public schools. HB isn’t immune to the usual public school problems.

Which grade was this? Offering a 2nd grade book vs. a regular book for that level is horrifying, and then everyone gets graded the same, as if it was the same difficulty? Is this how they “hide” the non-achievements of kids who have certain reasons (like medical) or is this done to hide language inadequacies? Or WHY?! Why would a school do this in English AP in HS? Or did I misunderstand the PP?

You misunderstood. I have no idea if there is a different grade book. Where did you get that from? And if there is, why is that so horrifying when there are two different classes. What difference would it make?

I don’t see how this co teaching hides anything. Can you explain that? It’s a matter of resources. The school isn’t big enough to offer separate classes so they have to teach them together.

Weird that some people think this is some big conspiracy. But that’s par for the course!!! It’s definitely not an advantage but if you don’t like it don’t go to HB

Horrifying - or in other words, inexplicable and inexcusable; that a second grader book would be read in MS or HS - the PP explicitly mentioned “a comic book, a 2nd grader book and a regular book” - that’s why I asked which grade it was. Co-teaching the class (and they also mentioned teaching to the lowest denominator), especially allowing such vastly different materials for the same credit, hides the underachievement within their statistics and test scores, and it hides how kids do overall in the class, unless they break it down further, which APS usually does not do.
I’m not that PP and neither are you, so it would only be helpful if they clarified.

Yes comics and children's books are types of literature. There are college classes on children's literature.

How does teaching two classes in the same room hide the underachievement exactly? The kids are enrolled in two separate classes.

So your argument is that it is appropriate for high school students taking AP English Literature and Composition to read comics and children's books as the assignments for the class. I want to be sure I'm understanding. Or are you saying these should be options for students taking regular English 12 and it's okay for them?

I agree that comics and children's books are types of literature. No disagreement there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you combine an AP class and a non-AP class. Can someone explain how that works.

For one of the AP/regular English classes... You teach towards the bottom. Then, for example, you give an assignment, for which you can read literally a choice of comic book, a 2nd grade reading level book, a middle grade book, or one or two actual books. I'm not sure of the exact number for each assignment but I know for sure there were at least the comic book, 2nd grade, middle grade, and one famous regular book. It's sad. And the fact that everyone probably gets graded the exact same is unfair and embarrassing. Oh yeah, there was also a choice to watch a movie instead.

Not an exaggeration. And don't complain if your kid does poorly on the AP test because I don't think anyone (parent or kid) officially complains at the beginning of school or during the year, according to our kids. (They could be doing the "privacy" nonsense and trying to pretend that your kid is the only one complaining, where parents clam up because of shame. This happened pre-Covid at an APS elementary school and they got away with it for several years before more than a few parents started meeting at school events and comparing notes. Its harder for them to get away with it now.)

I think I know which class you’re talking about. It was very disappointing. They mostly watched films instead of reading. I chalked it up to a bad teacher— which we’ve had from time to time over the years in public schools. HB isn’t immune to the usual public school problems.

Which grade was this? Offering a 2nd grade book vs. a regular book for that level is horrifying, and then everyone gets graded the same, as if it was the same difficulty? Is this how they “hide” the non-achievements of kids who have certain reasons (like medical) or is this done to hide language inadequacies? Or WHY?! Why would a school do this in English AP in HS? Or did I misunderstand the PP?

You misunderstood. I have no idea if there is a different grade book. Where did you get that from? And if there is, why is that so horrifying when there are two different classes. What difference would it make?

I don’t see how this co teaching hides anything. Can you explain that? It’s a matter of resources. The school isn’t big enough to offer separate classes so they have to teach them together.

Weird that some people think this is some big conspiracy. But that’s par for the course!!! It’s definitely not an advantage but if you don’t like it don’t go to HB

Horrifying - or in other words, inexplicable and inexcusable; that a second grader book would be read in MS or HS - the PP explicitly mentioned “a comic book, a 2nd grader book and a regular book” - that’s why I asked which grade it was. Co-teaching the class (and they also mentioned teaching to the lowest denominator), especially allowing such vastly different materials for the same credit, hides the underachievement within their statistics and test scores, and it hides how kids do overall in the class, unless they break it down further, which APS usually does not do.
I’m not that PP and neither are you, so it would only be helpful if they clarified.

Yes comics and children's books are types of literature. There are college classes on children's literature.

How does teaching two classes in the same room hide the underachievement exactly? The kids are enrolled in two separate classes.

The way it would hide the underachievement is the teacher is forced to teach to the lowest common denominator at least some of the time and likely spend more time with the non-AP students, which is what any teacher has to do in that situation in any classroom at any grade level. Therefore the kids enrolled in the AP class are a) getting lower level instruction and work than what should be provided in an AP class and b) probably getting a good grade for doing said lower level work, which others on this thread have said leads to lower AP scores.

This is not even complicated. It's baffling people are not getting it.

Except there an AP exam at the end of the course, so any underachievement would be obvious via AP scores. Also kids submit their AP scores to colleges for admissions purposes. So not having the same opportunity of getting higher AP scores to submit to colleges is a significant downside for HB.

It is not a requirement to submit AP scores to colleges. It's not even really an expectation. Lots of kids don't report them. I bet the kids from HB sure as hell don't!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you combine an AP class and a non-AP class. Can someone explain how that works.

For one of the AP/regular English classes... You teach towards the bottom. Then, for example, you give an assignment, for which you can read literally a choice of comic book, a 2nd grade reading level book, a middle grade book, or one or two actual books. I'm not sure of the exact number for each assignment but I know for sure there were at least the comic book, 2nd grade, middle grade, and one famous regular book. It's sad. And the fact that everyone probably gets graded the exact same is unfair and embarrassing. Oh yeah, there was also a choice to watch a movie instead.

Not an exaggeration. And don't complain if your kid does poorly on the AP test because I don't think anyone (parent or kid) officially complains at the beginning of school or during the year, according to our kids. (They could be doing the "privacy" nonsense and trying to pretend that your kid is the only one complaining, where parents clam up because of shame. This happened pre-Covid at an APS elementary school and they got away with it for several years before more than a few parents started meeting at school events and comparing notes. Its harder for them to get away with it now.)

I think I know which class you’re talking about. It was very disappointing. They mostly watched films instead of reading. I chalked it up to a bad teacher— which we’ve had from time to time over the years in public schools. HB isn’t immune to the usual public school problems.

Which grade was this? Offering a 2nd grade book vs. a regular book for that level is horrifying, and then everyone gets graded the same, as if it was the same difficulty? Is this how they “hide” the non-achievements of kids who have certain reasons (like medical) or is this done to hide language inadequacies? Or WHY?! Why would a school do this in English AP in HS? Or did I misunderstand the PP?

You misunderstood. I have no idea if there is a different grade book. Where did you get that from? And if there is, why is that so horrifying when there are two different classes. What difference would it make?

I don’t see how this co teaching hides anything. Can you explain that? It’s a matter of resources. The school isn’t big enough to offer separate classes so they have to teach them together.

Weird that some people think this is some big conspiracy. But that’s par for the course!!! It’s definitely not an advantage but if you don’t like it don’t go to HB

Horrifying - or in other words, inexplicable and inexcusable; that a second grader book would be read in MS or HS - the PP explicitly mentioned “a comic book, a 2nd grader book and a regular book” - that’s why I asked which grade it was. Co-teaching the class (and they also mentioned teaching to the lowest denominator), especially allowing such vastly different materials for the same credit, hides the underachievement within their statistics and test scores, and it hides how kids do overall in the class, unless they break it down further, which APS usually does not do.
I’m not that PP and neither are you, so it would only be helpful if they clarified.

Yes comics and children's books are types of literature. There are college classes on children's literature.

How does teaching two classes in the same room hide the underachievement exactly? The kids are enrolled in two separate classes.

So your argument is that it is appropriate for high school students taking AP English Literature and Composition to read comics and children's books as the assignments for the class. I want to be sure I'm understanding. Or are you saying these should be options for students taking regular English 12 and it's okay for them?

I agree that comics and children's books are types of literature. No disagreement there.

I'm not an English teacher nor am I a lit professor, so I'm not qualified to answer your question. And no I'm not making any argument. I thought it was odd at first too but then I did a little research and realized these are both considered literature. For example, there are entire college classes taught on children's lit. So analyzing it one time in AP Lit didn't seem that off to me. You seem to disagree, so I think you should go discuss this with the AP English teacher or with the admin. I don't think I can help you further with this.