No confidence in MCPS?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is declining for your kids academically or otherwise?
Lots of posts also saying classes are hard or too accelerated and lots of pressure to do well academically. Courses seem rigorous for the most part.
If your kid goes, pays attention and puts in the work to learn, they will learn and succeed.

If kids don’t go, play on their screens instead of pay attention, don’t do the homework or study at home, then they may not succeed so much. All this stuff is the parents’ responsibility and to motivate their kids.

Yes MCPS can change many things but it’s still going to come down to what you and your kid put into to it.

My problem is my kid didn’t work very hard in MCPS and still got pretty good grades. 3.8/4.5. Never learned to study efficiently or any time management skills. The first year of college was brutal for her as she simply wasn’t prepared. And she took 10 AP classes, so it’s not like there wasn’t rigor.

If she took 10 AP classes with rigor and never learned any time management or study skills I’d question the rigor of those classes or if what you’re saying is true.

You're right, but that would still be an indictment of MCPS, who is responsible for maintaining the integrity of the rigor that the AP brand is known for. Parents don't design or run the AP/IB classes at MCPS.

True. But parents should realize if their kids have learned time management and study skills. This is why folks keep trying to explain to ya’ll that the root of the problems are shared between parents and the district.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is declining for your kids academically or otherwise?
Lots of posts also saying classes are hard or too accelerated and lots of pressure to do well academically. Courses seem rigorous for the most part.
If your kid goes, pays attention and puts in the work to learn, they will learn and succeed.

If kids don’t go, play on their screens instead of pay attention, don’t do the homework or study at home, then they may not succeed so much. All this stuff is the parents’ responsibility and to motivate their kids.

Yes MCPS can change many things but it’s still going to come down to what you and your kid put into to it.

My problem is my kid didn’t work very hard in MCPS and still got pretty good grades. 3.8/4.5. Never learned to study efficiently or any time management skills. The first year of college was brutal for her as she simply wasn’t prepared. And she took 10 AP classes, so it’s not like there wasn’t rigor.

If she took 10 AP classes with rigor and never learned any time management or study skills I’d question the rigor of those classes or if what you’re saying is true.

You're right, but that would still be an indictment of MCPS, who is responsible for maintaining the integrity of the rigor that the AP brand is known for. Parents don't design or run the AP/IB classes at MCPS.

True. But parents should realize if their kids have learned time management and study skills. This is why folks keep trying to explain to ya’ll that the root of the problems are shared between parents and the district.

No, folks keep trying to blame parents and excuse MCPS. The exact phrase used at the beginning of the thread that several posters agreed with was "The problem isn't MCPS. It's society".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Btw if my child is misbehaving at school, tell me! If you tell me she is sweet, well behaved and hard working I can't punish her for her allegedly horrible behavior at school (which she must be engaging in because some random mom let her toddler hit her on the metro)

Teachers DO tell parents. Either parents don't care (this usually is the case) or they refuse to believe their angel would ever do anything wrong, surely it must be the teacher's fault. Instead of trying to play a victim on internet forums, go parent your kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw if my child is misbehaving at school, tell me! If you tell me she is sweet, well behaved and hard working I can't punish her for her allegedly horrible behavior at school (which she must be engaging in because some random mom let her toddler hit her on the metro)

Teachers DO tell parents. Either parents don't care (this usually is the case) or they refuse to believe their angel would ever do anything wrong, surely it must be the teacher's fault. Instead of trying to play a victim on internet forums, go parent your kid.

Criticizing MCPS for its horrible policies is "playing the victim"? Just stop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw if my child is misbehaving at school, tell me! If you tell me she is sweet, well behaved and hard working I can't punish her for her allegedly horrible behavior at school (which she must be engaging in because some random mom let her toddler hit her on the metro)

Teachers DO tell parents. Either parents don't care (this usually is the case) or they refuse to believe their angel would ever do anything wrong, surely it must be the teacher's fault. Instead of trying to play a victim on internet forums, go parent your kid.

And btw mine hasn't, so stop pretending my child is misbehaving just to deflect from your failures.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Low income kids suffered the most from virtual. Let's get that straight. Their families had reasons for keeping them home but it wasn't because virtual was working from an educational standpoint.

It is one thing to say that we had to do virtual to protect people's lives. That is reasonable even if some might also reasonably disagree.

It is another thing to say virtual was fine and any problems resulting from it were the parents' faults. That's preposterous and false. Virtual was horrible from an educational standpoint even if you can argue it was necessary. Another thing that is horrible is schools not disciplining kids, also schools not properly teaching reading, and also schools basically eliminating any real standards. And the use of screens as "educational" tools to enrich educational software providers. All of these things were choices MCPS and many other school systems made.

Parenting these days is different than it was in the past. Among my friends many of us have had our own parents tell us we spend a ton of time with our kids, much more than they did. Parenting is much more intensive than it used to be. It's entirely possible we are all doing it horribly wrong, but it's certainly not for a lack of trying to do it right. It's hard knowing that many of us try to do the right thing, limit screen time, establish and enforce rules, and then send them into an environment where screen time is not limited at all and rules are not enforced.

Folks aren’t saying virtual was fine. Everyone knows it had issues especially considering it had to be done without any prior notice or proper planning and setup of resources. Teachers and district are willing to help make up for that. Teachers are working harder than ever, districts have provided access to tutoring, and are reaching out. Is more needed still, Yes. Should they have better discipline, Yes.

All the above said, parenting is much different. From my perspective it’s more competitive for no gain and people are trying to parent by group decree. It’s like folks need assurance from a whole host of folks to make parenting decisions. That or they are pushing kids until they are anxious so they can brag about them to others. Gentle parenting has become basically never say No and mean it parenting. Not to mention they won’t let kids fail. All this is showing up in the classroom making teaching and recovery harder and harder. Folks want discipline in the moment at school, which I can agree with, but also some of the behaviors should not be occurring with such prevalence to begin with. Parents want school to enforce kids not using their phones, yet it’s obvious that parents aren’t monitoring screen time or putting limits so it’s not accessible during school hours. Plus ya’ll are the one giving kids phones in the first place. Control of that device and discipline around such starts with you.

There are absolutely people claiming virtual was fine, blaming parents any time people talk about the failures of virtual classes. Many more refuse to acknowledge the harm that extended school closures did, and certainly won't admit it was a mistake or apologize for their role in extending the closures well beyond they were necessary.

That's a big reason why people have lost trust and confidence in MCPS and MCEA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Low income kids suffered the most from virtual. Let's get that straight. Their families had reasons for keeping them home but it wasn't because virtual was working from an educational standpoint.

It is one thing to say that we had to do virtual to protect people's lives. That is reasonable even if some might also reasonably disagree.

It is another thing to say virtual was fine and any problems resulting from it were the parents' faults. That's preposterous and false. Virtual was horrible from an educational standpoint even if you can argue it was necessary. Another thing that is horrible is schools not disciplining kids, also schools not properly teaching reading, and also schools basically eliminating any real standards. And the use of screens as "educational" tools to enrich educational software providers. All of these things were choices MCPS and many other school systems made.

Parenting these days is different than it was in the past. Among my friends many of us have had our own parents tell us we spend a ton of time with our kids, much more than they did. Parenting is much more intensive than it used to be. It's entirely possible we are all doing it horribly wrong, but it's certainly not for a lack of trying to do it right. It's hard knowing that many of us try to do the right thing, limit screen time, establish and enforce rules, and then send them into an environment where screen time is not limited at all and rules are not enforced.

Folks aren’t saying virtual was fine. Everyone knows it had issues especially considering it had to be done without any prior notice or proper planning and setup of resources. Teachers and district are willing to help make up for that. Teachers are working harder than ever, districts have provided access to tutoring, and are reaching out. Is more needed still, Yes. Should they have better discipline, Yes.

All the above said, parenting is much different. From my perspective it’s more competitive for no gain and people are trying to parent by group decree. It’s like folks need assurance from a whole host of folks to make parenting decisions. That or they are pushing kids until they are anxious so they can brag about them to others. Gentle parenting has become basically never say No and mean it parenting. Not to mention they won’t let kids fail. All this is showing up in the classroom making teaching and recovery harder and harder. Folks want discipline in the moment at school, which I can agree with, but also some of the behaviors should not be occurring with such prevalence to begin with. Parents want school to enforce kids not using their phones, yet it’s obvious that parents aren’t monitoring screen time or putting limits so it’s not accessible during school hours. Plus ya’ll are the one giving kids phones in the first place. Control of that device and discipline around such starts with you.

First of all, none of the people blaming parents mentioned any of these issues, so stop with the "yes yes". ADMIT that MCPS has made horrible choices, stop pretending you already did admit it as a way of deflecting and attacking parents.

No, you DON'T know what is happening in kids' homes. Kids are SMART. They can tell when they are in a place with no limits, and adjust their behavior accordingly. You can't possibly be someone who works with children and not know this obvious fact. Kids learn this from when they are literal babies. It is not remotely sustainable for schools to not discipline kids, and this problem builds on itself when the well behaved kids see other kids behave poorly and have no consequences. When studying makes no difference because everyone gets As. Come on.

Parents give their kids phones for a wide range of reasons. Why do YOU have a phone? Why do teachers have phones? Let's be real.

My kid doesn't have a phone, she is too young, but she still gets screens in schools. Stop pretending you KNOW parents are not limiting screen time when schools REQUIRE screen time in school.

So much deflection and lies.

I sat on the metro the other day and watched a toddler stand on the seat next to his mother and repeatedly smack her in the head. The parental response was, “Please don’t do that, sweetie.” Needless to say, “sweetie” kept doing it.

And then people get on this message board and bemoan the behavior of their child’s classmates. Never their own child, that’s a given.

+1000. My kids have had known kids with lack of boundaries by their parent since preschool. You wanna know whose kids are not acting out in school regardless of those kids? Mine because again the boundary setting starts at home and is reinforced there. My kids clearly understand that their appropriate behavior is not to be adjusted to other inappropriate behavior. Does that mean they are perfect? No they are kids. But when their behavior strays from the path We as parents quickly help put them see the light. The whole dang class can be running around like fools, and mine better sit in their chair with a book quietly waiting on the teacher or escape to safety and await the next class or be showing leadership by working with others to diffuse the situation. Anything not in this vain, means that their behavior is not up to par and SMART kid will be meet SMART parent for a reckoning

MCPS is to blame for selecting a bad reading curriculum. MCPS is to blame for not making their school level standard consistent. Kids cell phone problems and habits, that is on parents. Kids disrespect, parents. Kids drunk on power, parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is declining for your kids academically or otherwise?
Lots of posts also saying classes are hard or too accelerated and lots of pressure to do well academically. Courses seem rigorous for the most part.
If your kid goes, pays attention and puts in the work to learn, they will learn and succeed.

If kids don’t go, play on their screens instead of pay attention, don’t do the homework or study at home, then they may not succeed so much. All this stuff is the parents’ responsibility and to motivate their kids.

Yes MCPS can change many things but it’s still going to come down to what you and your kid put into to it.

My problem is my kid didn’t work very hard in MCPS and still got pretty good grades. 3.8/4.5. Never learned to study efficiently or any time management skills. The first year of college was brutal for her as she simply wasn’t prepared. And she took 10 AP classes, so it’s not like there wasn’t rigor.

If she took 10 AP classes with rigor and never learned any time management or study skills I’d question the rigor of those classes or if what you’re saying is true.

You're right, but that would still be an indictment of MCPS, who is responsible for maintaining the integrity of the rigor that the AP brand is known for. Parents don't design or run the AP/IB classes at MCPS.

True. But parents should realize if their kids have learned time management and study skills. This is why folks keep trying to explain to ya’ll that the root of the problems are shared between parents and the district.

Ok, but clearly MCPS bears the burden of the responsibility here. And if the classroom grades, which most parents use to indicate whether their child has subject-matter mastery and grade-level appropriate work-study habits, indicates everything is fine, why would you expect parents to think otherwise?

In fact, teachers HAVE the ability to provide parents with feedback on work-study habits, but MOST TEACHERS DON'T. They leave that blank on the progress report or report card.

So again, you're blaming parents for something that is squarely the responsibility of MCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw if my child is misbehaving at school, tell me! If you tell me she is sweet, well behaved and hard working I can't punish her for her allegedly horrible behavior at school (which she must be engaging in because some random mom let her toddler hit her on the metro)

Teachers DO tell parents. Either parents don't care (this usually is the case) or they refuse to believe their angel would ever do anything wrong, surely it must be the teacher's fault. Instead of trying to play a victim on internet forums, go parent your kid.

Criticizing MCPS for its horrible policies is "playing the victim"? Just stop.

There's no end to the justification and excuse making they'll make for MCPS. It's pathetic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is declining for your kids academically or otherwise?
Lots of posts also saying classes are hard or too accelerated and lots of pressure to do well academically. Courses seem rigorous for the most part.
If your kid goes, pays attention and puts in the work to learn, they will learn and succeed.

If kids don’t go, play on their screens instead of pay attention, don’t do the homework or study at home, then they may not succeed so much. All this stuff is the parents’ responsibility and to motivate their kids.

Yes MCPS can change many things but it’s still going to come down to what you and your kid put into to it.

My problem is my kid didn’t work very hard in MCPS and still got pretty good grades. 3.8/4.5. Never learned to study efficiently or any time management skills. The first year of college was brutal for her as she simply wasn’t prepared. And she took 10 AP classes, so it’s not like there wasn’t rigor.

If she took 10 AP classes with rigor and never learned any time management or study skills I’d question the rigor of those classes or if what you’re saying is true.

You're right, but that would still be an indictment of MCPS, who is responsible for maintaining the integrity of the rigor that the AP brand is known for. Parents don't design or run the AP/IB classes at MCPS.

True. But parents should realize if their kids have learned time management and study skills. This is why folks keep trying to explain to ya’ll that the root of the problems are shared between parents and the district.

Ok, but clearly MCPS bears the burden of the responsibility here. And if the classroom grades, which most parents use to indicate whether their child has subject-matter mastery and grade-level appropriate work-study habits, indicates everything is fine, why would you expect parents to think otherwise?

In fact, teachers HAVE the ability to provide parents with feedback on work-study habits, but MOST TEACHERS DON'T. They leave that blank on the progress report or report card.

So again, you're blaming parents for something that is squarely the responsibility of MCPS.

+1 apparently a lot of people believe MCPS can't be held accountable for educational outcomes, and that's preposterous.

[Anonymous]

So glad I left MCPS for a different district. We don't have the cesspool of toxic parents like MCPS. I feel so bad for MCPS teachers that have to deal with this insufferable group on a daily basis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Low income kids suffered the most from virtual. Let's get that straight. Their families had reasons for keeping them home but it wasn't because virtual was working from an educational standpoint.

It is one thing to say that we had to do virtual to protect people's lives. That is reasonable even if some might also reasonably disagree.

It is another thing to say virtual was fine and any problems resulting from it were the parents' faults. That's preposterous and false. Virtual was horrible from an educational standpoint even if you can argue it was necessary. Another thing that is horrible is schools not disciplining kids, also schools not properly teaching reading, and also schools basically eliminating any real standards. And the use of screens as "educational" tools to enrich educational software providers. All of these things were choices MCPS and many other school systems made.

Parenting these days is different than it was in the past. Among my friends many of us have had our own parents tell us we spend a ton of time with our kids, much more than they did. Parenting is much more intensive than it used to be. It's entirely possible we are all doing it horribly wrong, but it's certainly not for a lack of trying to do it right. It's hard knowing that many of us try to do the right thing, limit screen time, establish and enforce rules, and then send them into an environment where screen time is not limited at all and rules are not enforced.

Folks aren’t saying virtual was fine. Everyone knows it had issues especially considering it had to be done without any prior notice or proper planning and setup of resources. Teachers and district are willing to help make up for that. Teachers are working harder than ever, districts have provided access to tutoring, and are reaching out. Is more needed still, Yes. Should they have better discipline, Yes.

All the above said, parenting is much different. From my perspective it’s more competitive for no gain and people are trying to parent by group decree. It’s like folks need assurance from a whole host of folks to make parenting decisions. That or they are pushing kids until they are anxious so they can brag about them to others. Gentle parenting has become basically never say No and mean it parenting. Not to mention they won’t let kids fail. All this is showing up in the classroom making teaching and recovery harder and harder. Folks want discipline in the moment at school, which I can agree with, but also some of the behaviors should not be occurring with such prevalence to begin with. Parents want school to enforce kids not using their phones, yet it’s obvious that parents aren’t monitoring screen time or putting limits so it’s not accessible during school hours. Plus ya’ll are the one giving kids phones in the first place. Control of that device and discipline around such starts with you.

There are absolutely people claiming virtual was fine, blaming parents any time people talk about the failures of virtual classes. Many more refuse to acknowledge the harm that extended school closures did, and certainly won't admit it was a mistake or apologize for their role in extending the closures well beyond they were necessary.

That's a big reason why people have lost trust and confidence in MCPS and MCEA.

MCEA is a union. Your obsession with then is bizzare. It caused you harm as you are not used to parenting and expect the school to be it all. My kids were in virtual for several years. It was the best education they got in Mcps.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is declining for your kids academically or otherwise?
Lots of posts also saying classes are hard or too accelerated and lots of pressure to do well academically. Courses seem rigorous for the most part.
If your kid goes, pays attention and puts in the work to learn, they will learn and succeed.

If kids don’t go, play on their screens instead of pay attention, don’t do the homework or study at home, then they may not succeed so much. All this stuff is the parents’ responsibility and to motivate their kids.

Yes MCPS can change many things but it’s still going to come down to what you and your kid put into to it.

My problem is my kid didn’t work very hard in MCPS and still got pretty good grades. 3.8/4.5. Never learned to study efficiently or any time management skills. The first year of college was brutal for her as she simply wasn’t prepared. And she took 10 AP classes, so it’s not like there wasn’t rigor.

If she took 10 AP classes with rigor and never learned any time management or study skills I’d question the rigor of those classes or if what you’re saying is true.

You're right, but that would still be an indictment of MCPS, who is responsible for maintaining the integrity of the rigor that the AP brand is known for. Parents don't design or run the AP/IB classes at MCPS.

True. But parents should realize if their kids have learned time management and study skills. This is why folks keep trying to explain to ya’ll that the root of the problems are shared between parents and the district.

Ok, but clearly MCPS bears the burden of the responsibility here. And if the classroom grades, which most parents use to indicate whether their child has subject-matter mastery and grade-level appropriate work-study habits, indicates everything is fine, why would you expect parents to think otherwise?

In fact, teachers HAVE the ability to provide parents with feedback on work-study habits, but MOST TEACHERS DON'T. They leave that blank on the progress report or report card.

So again, you're blaming parents for something that is squarely the responsibility of MCPS.

They don’t teach grammar, spelling, math facts, study skills and the lack of homework makes it hard. No books and textbooks makes it impossible. Very few teachers respond to emails. Very few teachers teach a full class fixe days a week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is declining for your kids academically or otherwise?
Lots of posts also saying classes are hard or too accelerated and lots of pressure to do well academically. Courses seem rigorous for the most part.
If your kid goes, pays attention and puts in the work to learn, they will learn and succeed.

If kids don’t go, play on their screens instead of pay attention, don’t do the homework or study at home, then they may not succeed so much. All this stuff is the parents’ responsibility and to motivate their kids.

Yes MCPS can change many things but it’s still going to come down to what you and your kid put into to it.

My problem is my kid didn’t work very hard in MCPS and still got pretty good grades. 3.8/4.5. Never learned to study efficiently or any time management skills. The first year of college was brutal for her as she simply wasn’t prepared. And she took 10 AP classes, so it’s not like there wasn’t rigor.

If she took 10 AP classes with rigor and never learned any time management or study skills I’d question the rigor of those classes or if what you’re saying is true.

You're right, but that would still be an indictment of MCPS, who is responsible for maintaining the integrity of the rigor that the AP brand is known for. Parents don't design or run the AP/IB classes at MCPS.

True. But parents should realize if their kids have learned time management and study skills. This is why folks keep trying to explain to ya’ll that the root of the problems are shared between parents and the district.

Ok, but clearly MCPS bears the burden of the responsibility here. And if the classroom grades, which most parents use to indicate whether their child has subject-matter mastery and grade-level appropriate work-study habits, indicates everything is fine, why would you expect parents to think otherwise?

In fact, teachers HAVE the ability to provide parents with feedback on work-study habits, but MOST TEACHERS DON'T. They leave that blank on the progress report or report card.

So again, you're blaming parents for something that is squarely the responsibility of MCPS.

+1 apparently a lot of people believe MCPS can't be held accountable for educational outcomes, and that's preposterous.

Clearly some folks believe Parents can’t be held accountable for behavior that is disrupt education. Even after folks lay blame with MCPS for educational outcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Low income kids suffered the most from virtual. Let's get that straight. Their families had reasons for keeping them home but it wasn't because virtual was working from an educational standpoint.

It is one thing to say that we had to do virtual to protect people's lives. That is reasonable even if some might also reasonably disagree.

It is another thing to say virtual was fine and any problems resulting from it were the parents' faults. That's preposterous and false. Virtual was horrible from an educational standpoint even if you can argue it was necessary. Another thing that is horrible is schools not disciplining kids, also schools not properly teaching reading, and also schools basically eliminating any real standards. And the use of screens as "educational" tools to enrich educational software providers. All of these things were choices MCPS and many other school systems made.

Parenting these days is different than it was in the past. Among my friends many of us have had our own parents tell us we spend a ton of time with our kids, much more than they did. Parenting is much more intensive than it used to be. It's entirely possible we are all doing it horribly wrong, but it's certainly not for a lack of trying to do it right. It's hard knowing that many of us try to do the right thing, limit screen time, establish and enforce rules, and then send them into an environment where screen time is not limited at all and rules are not enforced.

Folks aren’t saying virtual was fine. Everyone knows it had issues especially considering it had to be done without any prior notice or proper planning and setup of resources. Teachers and district are willing to help make up for that. Teachers are working harder than ever, districts have provided access to tutoring, and are reaching out. Is more needed still, Yes. Should they have better discipline, Yes.

All the above said, parenting is much different. From my perspective it’s more competitive for no gain and people are trying to parent by group decree. It’s like folks need assurance from a whole host of folks to make parenting decisions. That or they are pushing kids until they are anxious so they can brag about them to others. Gentle parenting has become basically never say No and mean it parenting. Not to mention they won’t let kids fail. All this is showing up in the classroom making teaching and recovery harder and harder. Folks want discipline in the moment at school, which I can agree with, but also some of the behaviors should not be occurring with such prevalence to begin with. Parents want school to enforce kids not using their phones, yet it’s obvious that parents aren’t monitoring screen time or putting limits so it’s not accessible during school hours. Plus ya’ll are the one giving kids phones in the first place. Control of that device and discipline around such starts with you.

There are absolutely people claiming virtual was fine, blaming parents any time people talk about the failures of virtual classes. Many more refuse to acknowledge the harm that extended school closures did, and certainly won't admit it was a mistake or apologize for their role in extending the closures well beyond they were necessary.

That's a big reason why people have lost trust and confidence in MCPS and MCEA.

MCEA is a union. Your obsession with then is bizzare. It caused you harm as you are not used to parenting and expect the school to be it all. My kids were in virtual for several years. It was the best education they got in Mcps.

See. This is exactly what I mean. Some people refuse to acknowledge the failures of virtual classes, even after the disastrous consequences we experienced.