Ever been to India? Why do people find it so depressing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is groping of women all the time in India. That is the mildest offense towards women. Indian men have a reputation for being abusive, not just to women but to others.
There is just chaos everywhere you go in India.

This. They have separate cars for women, but if you end up on a regular car, you will very likely be groped. Has happened to me many times.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I loved my trip to India. But the level of poverty is a huge culture shock, and some can't take it. Likewise with the caste system (I thought of it as something we'd been taught about in school that was a thing of the past; it certainly is not a thing of the past, and it is horrible).

It's not just that the rest of the Indians ignore it; it's more that they think the lower classes are "in their place" and they don't give it a second thought. It is horrible. It's unreconcilable within a rational human brain.

This is true. It’s just a way of life and it’s accepted as normal. The caste system is so ingrained in the culture.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The amount of poverty and classism is alarming.

You are expected just to ignore it and not make eye contact.

I don’t follow. Not make eye contact? With who?

Clearly you haven't been to India.

Hence the post, dummy

Sigh.

You can't really drive or walk through a city without being swarmed by poor people -- many of them very young children, many very physically deformed, crying and looking very said and begging. They stare until you make eye contact. Then they beg and beg. And it never stops. There are thousands of them, so you can't connect with someone even if you want to. Because it is never ending. Like an avalanche of human pain and suffering. And your only hope to get through it at all is to not make eye contact.

Is this just the case in Agra or did you experience it in Delhi too?

I have been everywhere in India. Agra really sucks. Unless you have a real passion for the Taj Mahal, it's not worth it.

Yes, I know Agra is like this, that’s why I was asking if Delhi is similar.

Delhi is best if you know someone to help show you around. I didn't. And I already had Indian city fatigue. I had come in by train from Varanasi (recommend) and then headed north to Rishikesh in the Himalayan foothills (amusing). Old Town Delhi is worth a wander - the mosque is interesting. It's an absolutely filthy city. The monkeys are annoying. And while I was there, there was political violence so it seemed tense. I didn't see any reason to stay long. I did make a long day trip to Agra, and it's probably the least interesting thing I did in India.

It takes a while to get to know an Indian city. I had the best urban experiences in Mumbai and Kolkata. So when I fly in, I choose one of those two. And I book a good hotel for the first three days to acclimatize before venturing on the trains and buses, which are an experience. I'm fond of India, but it's a tough country. I alternate between luxury and backpacker hostels. You eventually learn how to navigate the trains. It can be a horror show, but also really fascinating. It's best to believe in a god when traveling by bus. Avoid all midrange "business" hotels. And if you are a woman, don't even think about traveling alone. The south is safer and more well to do than the north. Really avoid places like Bihar.

Flying in to Delhi is useful though if you are heading to Rajasthan. Or north into the Himalayas. By land, which is not for everyone.

India a lot to experience. I couldn't imagine just going for a short trip. You'll hate it, like everyone here does. But a longer, more well researched trip with ideally a good, experienced travel companion is definitely one of the more memorable things to do on the planet.

How many times have you been? As a young woman traveling in a group, I felt very unsafe in Rajasthan. There were a few times when I was briefly separated from my group and had some close calls with a group of teen boys that started groping me, and then a man who chased and grabbed me inside of a museum. Every woman I know who has been to India has a similar story. I also found Delhi unbearable with the crowds and pollution and I mostly stayed indoors. But Rajasthani cities such as Jaipur and Jodhpur are culturally rich and probably the most interesting parts of my trip besides Varanasi. In contrast, the Punjab region and Southern India near Pudicherry and Chennai felt a bit safer and less chaotic.

DP.

I’ve been to India and I’ve never been groped. I’m sure that happened to you but to say “every woman you know” is hyperbole. I know Americans who live there and have never been groped or chased. No one I know has been.

That said, my hotel was bombed. There’s that.

Did you ever take a train or bus anywhere? Did you walk through the city?

Or did you travel by car with your own driver everywhere?

If you go with oodles of money to spend, that will help shelter you from the unpleasantness of being groped while walking around or taking public transport.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If life were so great in India, people would not immigrate as soon as they had the minimum means—and not immigrate to the West but everywhere in the world. Tanzania, Kenya, and South Africa have huge Indian populations.

Indians are 1/5 of the world population. They go to different countries around the world and succeed wildly in the richest and the poorest countries of the world. More successful than the local native population of those countries.

1/5 of the world population where 60% of the population is below 35 years old so they will obviously spread to other countries too to amass wealth and seek opportunities.

Especially if they can speak English, are young, are STEM educated, have family and community support, work harder for less money and are law abiding & tax paying.

As an Indian, I am just fine if you don’t go to India. India has such a huge population that they are not starved for tourists. In fact Indian tourists are propping up the economies of other nations.

300 years ago, India was the richest nation in the world. Our poverty is the result of 45 billions dollars looted from us by the White man. So your attempt to shame India does not work because we know our history and who are parents are. And we are getting that money back from the world - one outsourced IT job at a time, one medical doctor at a time, one pharma pill at a time, one military weapon at a time, one Bollywood movie at a time!

We are such a huge market, such a powerful juggernaut (or Jagannath) that Netflix to Disney, Amazon to Tesla want to woo us.


We have the capacity to work hard, pool resources, study hard, be frugal and build wealth. Indians expats send enough foreign exchange back to India from around the world that India can remain non-aligned in our foreign policy.

Indian housewives own 11% of the world’s gold reserves. We are the largest democracy, the most diverse country, the oldest civilization and have originated Hinduism, budhhism, Jainism and Sikhism from our religious philosophies.

Yes, India is still a poor country but we have the audacity of hope, grit, courage and inventiveness (jugaad). So we are a nuclear power, a space power and the 5th largest economy!

Haters can fuzkkk off and get a bikini wax!!

Oh, and we are so non-aligned that you would not even know if we are Democrats or Republicans. Our genes produce both Usha Vance and Kamala Harris!! Both Goddesses!!

Correction- 45 trillions dollars was looted from India by British!!

Don’t you think current day corruption in India, by Indians, contributes to the country’s poverty?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:The amount of poverty and classism is alarming.

You are expected just to ignore it and not make eye contact.

I don’t follow. Not make eye contact? With who?

Clearly you haven't been to India.

Hence the post, dummy

Sigh.

You can't really drive or walk through a city without being swarmed by poor people -- many of them very young children, many very physically deformed, crying and looking very said and begging. They stare until you make eye contact. Then they beg and beg. And it never stops. There are thousands of them, so you can't connect with someone even if you want to. Because it is never ending. Like an avalanche of human pain and suffering. And your only hope to get through it at all is to not make eye contact.

Is this just the case in Agra or did you experience it in Delhi too?

I have been everywhere in India. Agra really sucks. Unless you have a real passion for the Taj Mahal, it's not worth it.

Yes, I know Agra is like this, that’s why I was asking if Delhi is similar.

Delhi is best if you know someone to help show you around. I didn't. And I already had Indian city fatigue. I had come in by train from Varanasi (recommend) and then headed north to Rishikesh in the Himalayan foothills (amusing). Old Town Delhi is worth a wander - the mosque is interesting. It's an absolutely filthy city. The monkeys are annoying. And while I was there, there was political violence so it seemed tense. I didn't see any reason to stay long. I did make a long day trip to Agra, and it's probably the least interesting thing I did in India.

It takes a while to get to know an Indian city. I had the best urban experiences in Mumbai and Kolkata. So when I fly in, I choose one of those two. And I book a good hotel for the first three days to acclimatize before venturing on the trains and buses, which are an experience. I'm fond of India, but it's a tough country. I alternate between luxury and backpacker hostels. You eventually learn how to navigate the trains. It can be a horror show, but also really fascinating. It's best to believe in a god when traveling by bus. Avoid all midrange "business" hotels. And if you are a woman, don't even think about traveling alone. The south is safer and more well to do than the north. Really avoid places like Bihar.

Flying in to Delhi is useful though if you are heading to Rajasthan. Or north into the Himalayas. By land, which is not for everyone.

India a lot to experience. I couldn't imagine just going for a short trip. You'll hate it, like everyone here does. But a longer, more well researched trip with ideally a good, experienced travel companion is definitely one of the more memorable things to do on the planet.

How many times have you been? As a young woman traveling in a group, I felt very unsafe in Rajasthan. There were a few times when I was briefly separated from my group and had some close calls with a group of teen boys that started groping me, and then a man who chased and grabbed me inside of a museum. Every woman I know who has been to India has a similar story. I also found Delhi unbearable with the crowds and pollution and I mostly stayed indoors. But Rajasthani cities such as Jaipur and Jodhpur are culturally rich and probably the most interesting parts of my trip besides Varanasi. In contrast, the Punjab region and Southern India near Pudicherry and Chennai felt a bit safer and less chaotic.

DP.

I’ve been to India and I’ve never been groped. I’m sure that happened to you but to say “every woman you know” is hyperbole. I know Americans who live there and have never been groped or chased. No one I know has been.

That said, my hotel was bombed. There’s that.

Did you ever take a train or bus anywhere? Did you walk through the city?

Or did you travel by car with your own driver everywhere?

If you go with oodles of money to spend, that will help shelter you from the unpleasantness of being groped while walking around or taking public transport.

Even today, in the city, it does not require “oodles of money” to hire a car/driver in India. Even less for an auto rickshaw.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The amount of poverty and classism is alarming.

You are expected just to ignore it and not make eye contact.

I don’t follow. Not make eye contact? With who?

Clearly you haven't been to India.

Hence the post, dummy

Sigh.

You can't really drive or walk through a city without being swarmed by poor people -- many of them very young children, many very physically deformed, crying and looking very said and begging. They stare until you make eye contact. Then they beg and beg. And it never stops. There are thousands of them, so you can't connect with someone even if you want to. Because it is never ending. Like an avalanche of human pain and suffering. And your only hope to get through it at all is to not make eye contact.

Is this just the case in Agra or did you experience it in Delhi too?

I have been everywhere in India. Agra really sucks. Unless you have a real passion for the Taj Mahal, it's not worth it.

Yes, I know Agra is like this, that’s why I was asking if Delhi is similar.

Delhi is best if you know someone to help show you around. I didn't. And I already had Indian city fatigue. I had come in by train from Varanasi (recommend) and then headed north to Rishikesh in the Himalayan foothills (amusing). Old Town Delhi is worth a wander - the mosque is interesting. It's an absolutely filthy city. The monkeys are annoying. And while I was there, there was political violence so it seemed tense. I didn't see any reason to stay long. I did make a long day trip to Agra, and it's probably the least interesting thing I did in India.

It takes a while to get to know an Indian city. I had the best urban experiences in Mumbai and Kolkata. So when I fly in, I choose one of those two. And I book a good hotel for the first three days to acclimatize before venturing on the trains and buses, which are an experience. I'm fond of India, but it's a tough country. I alternate between luxury and backpacker hostels. You eventually learn how to navigate the trains. It can be a horror show, but also really fascinating. It's best to believe in a god when traveling by bus. Avoid all midrange "business" hotels. And if you are a woman, don't even think about traveling alone. The south is safer and more well to do than the north. Really avoid places like Bihar.

Flying in to Delhi is useful though if you are heading to Rajasthan. Or north into the Himalayas. By land, which is not for everyone.

India a lot to experience. I couldn't imagine just going for a short trip. You'll hate it, like everyone here does. But a longer, more well researched trip with ideally a good, experienced travel companion is definitely one of the more memorable things to do on the planet.

How many times have you been? As a young woman traveling in a group, I felt very unsafe in Rajasthan. There were a few times when I was briefly separated from my group and had some close calls with a group of teen boys that started groping me, and then a man who chased and grabbed me inside of a museum. Every woman I know who has been to India has a similar story. I also found Delhi unbearable with the crowds and pollution and I mostly stayed indoors. But Rajasthani cities such as Jaipur and Jodhpur are culturally rich and probably the most interesting parts of my trip besides Varanasi. In contrast, the Punjab region and Southern India near Pudicherry and Chennai felt a bit safer and less chaotic.

I'm a fairly tall western man who was traveling solely. So I do not experience that kind of harassment. It's better to travel with a man. The women travelers I met all had complaints. And none traveled solo. Most had experience with certain ashrams and yoga retreats that were known to them. And they kept coming back for those retreats which were familiar spaces for them. None were winging it around the country like I was.

The south is safer. From Kochi and the Kerala backwaters overland with a couple of days in Periyar National Park (hiking amidst elephants amongst the hills), stopping among the temples in Madurai, and onward to Puducherry and the coast is interesting and I think more likely to be fairly low-key for women. In Rajasthan, I liked the area around Bikaner. It's off the beaten track of Jaipur and Jodphur. It's really in the desert. There's the rat temple. There's good camping and tours with the camels in the desert.

In any event, I highly recommend not traveling around India unless you are with a male companion who is an experienced traveler. My conflicts were mainly with drivers, and eventually you learn that if you are going to make a scene, you do it in a crowd. The mob will side with the passenger - at least the larger male foreigner - and that scares the driver. You learn not to have tea with a carpet seller. You learn to avoid the unofficial guides. India is always a full on experience for a visitor with the half billion people who are trying to extract rupees from foreigners.

But my favorite hotels are also in India. I love the Himalayas too. That's another world. India is just a lot. The cities in particular can really grind you down.

It's not a place for a solo woman though. Just don't. There are a lot of illiterate men with retrograde attitudes towards women, particularly western women who are completely unprotected by family and caste. It's the great shame of India